To Those Who Favor Brawl, Let's Finally Admit It...

[Proud_Smash_N00b]

Kind of like Melee or any fighting game, trading blows until one person loses.

And camping is a legit strategy, even if I don't enforce the idea of using it in combat.

In Melee, you have to make the other person make a mistake and punish them accordingly. In Brawl, you just hit until they die. Trading combos is much better than trading one blow at a time.

 

[Jack Kieser]

In Melee, you have to make the other person make a mistake and punish them accordingly. In Brawl, you just hit until they die. Trading combos is much better than trading one blow at a time.

Now, be honest... that's still an opinion. We've been trained over time to think that trading combos is inherently better than trading blows... but we all know that this is ultimately opinion.

 

[Iron Thorn]

*sigh* I can't stand this thread. It makes me feel like the scum of the earth for preferring Brawl, especially when my only good argument for it - I have more fun playing it and I have fun for longer - is not only subjective, but also apparently only the opinion of semisentient, halfwitted suck-at-lifes who think beating level 9 CPUs on Hyrule Temple with items on high means they're good at Smash, and all intelligent people pissed on their Brawl disc thirty minutes after they bought it, then sold it on eBay to fellow intelligent people and gave the money to the animal shelter. Unfortunately, the fact that so far my fingers have proven physically incapable of doing any ATs other than B-Reversal...okay, I'm just ranting now.

I'm this close to starting a pseudo-official Melee vs. Brawl thread in which to imprison the sad combination of stupidity, contempt, and narrowmindedness on both sides.

 

[PsychopathicEmus]

hey! those of you who favor brawl, here's a thought:


why not play both?


is melee THAT bad a game? come on, you know you loved that game and that's why you looked forward to brawl.

 

[HoChiMinhTrail]

Once again.. before we see another long brawl rant...

Brawl is the watered down version of melee... this new horizen alot of you see as the game of brawl.. us melee players have already seen. You take out all the advanced aspects of melee and what u get us brawl. Thats why i can still play the game and be good without practicing much. To me the problem is more that there is nothing inherently new about the gameplay, it is simply a slowed down and less technical version of melee.... that is what bores most of the pros of melee who have switched or have tried to switch over. Since we are dominating in all the regions of the brawl scene i feel like our opinion should be understood for what it is worth. Yes, we have seen the tops of both competitive fields and great ... and i do mean GREATLY miss the peak of competitive melee play. Play on with brawl... it is alot easier to pick up and play and hey... that should be good because it attracts all sorts of people.... but don't even try to compare the game to melee...

I am willing to give brawl a few years to possibly hope to aspire to what melee was... but if it doesnt then... melee stands as the best in the series and Sakurai can be happy in killing one of the truely greatest fighting games to exist. Because no matter how good a game is... eventually without newer versions it will fade away forever..... This will happen to even starcraft if sc2 is terrible. .

I dont want to see anymore melee vs brawl debates because melee is already established as truely one of the greatest fighting games to exist. Brawl is kinda.... the creation spawned form borrowed ideas and the watered down gameplay of melee. If it becomes something ... great.. if not ... w/e its nintendo... lol. But all and all... dont evne think to compare brawl to melee... its not even close to being on the same level. You say melee took years and years to become the great game it was.... dont even think to say brawl is already on that level... its not even certain that it ever will be on that level so just keep trekkiing on and perhaps one day you will prove to us ... "elitists" that you were right... tho us meleee "elitists" will still be dominating all of you in brawl anywase.... so we will probobly agree at that point. Somehow i doubt that day is ever going to come... and really ... that makes me sad. Smash was and is a great hobby .

 

[illboyzeus]

What's wrong with getting destroyed by a much better player, that's how it's been in most every fighter in history...

The more skilled player will win and dominate convincely through sheer skill and technical ability. In brawl when you get destroyed I find it more depressing since you basically got outplayed, tricked, out mindgamed, made 50 mistakes. You and it is a slow grind of a loss, in melee at least it was "tick tick boom" your dead. Plus it is easier to examine what you did wrong, in brawl it's "wow I took of a stock this time, what did I do different?"

and yes I do play brawl and have went to tournies, and have placed well. My first brawl tourney I got 17th out of like 50 something people, and I had touched the game two times, for about an hour a piece. I shifted my character like five times, and ended up with snake cuz he was interesting(also Zjinn's inspired that tourney lol). I beat many people who actually had the game, and played it a lot. That should not happen.

Brawl is like melee with no tech's and less hit stun, it's basically the same game, yet it is watered down version. So any melee player will have an instant advantage, so no there is no valiant newcomer showing up and beating someone like M2K. And M2K hates this game(called it ****ty, and said it's only for money and playing with items) Now if the best player at the game admits it's nothing more than a party game, how come brawl supporters can't.
I'm done with this discussion though, EVERYONE admits melee is the better competitive game, yet they turn around and play brawl. Either you find the watered down melee more fun than the actually thing(strange I know) or you just didn't have the drive or incentive to improve to get at a competent level at melee, which most admit is the better competitive game.

 

[HoChiMinhTrail]

Once again.. before we see another long brawl rant...

Brawl is the watered down version of melee... this new horizen alot of you see as the game of brawl.. us melee players have already seen. You take out all the advanced aspects of melee and what u get us brawl. Thats why i can still play the game and be good without practicing much. To me the problem is more that there is nothing inherently new about the gameplay, it is simply a slowed down and less technical version of melee.... that is what bores most of the pros of melee who have switched or have tried to switch over. Since we are dominating in all the regions of the brawl scene i feel like our opinion should be understood for what it is worth. Yes, we have seen the tops of both competitive fields and great ... and i do mean GREATLY miss the peak of competitive melee play. Play on with brawl... it is alot easier to pick up and play and hey... that should be good because it attracts all sorts of people.... but don't even try to compare the game to melee......

I am willing to give brawl a few years to possibly hope to aspire to what melee was... but if it doesnt then... melee stands as the best in the series and Sakurai can be happy in killing one of the truely greatest fighting games to exist. Because no matter how good a game is... eventually without newer versions it will fade away forever..... This will happen to even starcraft if sc2 is terrible. .

I dont want to see anymore melee vs brawl debates because melee is already established as truely one of the greatest fighting games to exist. Brawl is kinda.... the creation spawned form borrowed ideas and the watered down gameplay of melee. If it becomes something ... great.. if not ... w/e its nintendo... lol. But all and all... dont evne think to compare brawl to melee... its not even close to being on the same level. You say melee took years and years to become the great game it was.... dont even think to say brawl is already on that level... its not even certain that it ever will be on that level so just keep trekkiing on and perhaps one day you will prove to us ... "elitists" that you were right... tho us meleee "elitists" will still be dominating all of you in brawl anywase.... so we will probobly agree at that point. Somehow i doubt that day is ever going to come... and really ... that makes me sad. Smash was and is a great hobby .

 

[Jack Kieser]

*sigh* I can't stand this thread. It makes me feel like the scum of the earth for preferring Brawl, especially when my only good argument for it - I have more fun playing it and I have fun for longer - is not only subjective, but also apparently only the opinion of semisentient, halfwitted suck-at-lifes who think beating level 9 CPUs on Hyrule Temple with items on high means they're good at Smash, and all intelligent people pissed on their Brawl disc thirty minutes after they bought it, then sold it on eBay to fellow intelligent people and gave the money to the animal shelter. Unfortunately, the fact that so far my fingers have proven physically incapable of doing any ATs other than B-Reversal...okay, I'm just ranting now.

I'm this close to starting a pseudo-official Melee vs. Brawl thread in which to imprison the sad combination of stupidity, contempt, and narrowmindedness on both sides.

I think this is what saddens me the most about SWF now. I like both games; I really do. I defend Brawl because the Melee doesn't need defending, basically (I'm always Devil's Advocate), but if Melee did need defending from anything, I'd defend it in a heartbeat, too.

But, that makes me an idiot and a no-talent.

HoChiMinhTrail's post above is a textbook example of a guy who thinks saying a douchy thing in a more moderate way makes it less douchy. I'm sure he's a great dude offline, but when it comes down to it, that post means 'listen, Brawl sucks compared to Melee, and if you play Brawl and not Melee, you have something wrong with you.' Personal taste never figures into the equation. What if your personal taste allows you to sacrifice Wavedashing to have a slower game? Well, simply put, if you enjoy that, you must be either a casual or an idiot. Or you at least don't know anything about competitive play and must read Sirlin moar, because if you knew anything, you'd never ever like Brawl.

It's ridiculous that people who genuinely want to play Brawl competitively (AND WHO ENJOY IT) are badmouthed so much just because Melee isn't their thing. It shouldn't matter, but it does, and it makes me doubt our community because it seems like this is going to be one of those problems that creates a schism: one group is going to take the other out not because it needs to be done, but because both sides are too narrow-minded to allow the other to exist.

 

[Yukiwarashi]

Amen to that, Jack and Iron. I completely agree with what you've said. It's really sad.

 

[-Big_-Blue 9]

What's sad is idiots still can't get Competitive melee>Competitive brawl

 

[Stroupes]

What's sad is idiots still can't get Competitive melee>Competitive brawl

What's sad is that you're a douche.
If you hate Brawl so much, stay off the Brawl boards, go back to Melee.
Pro-Melee people say that Brawl noobs' opinions don't matter, so why do you encourage us?
It's that simple.

 

[Corigames]

I would like to say that I like both games, but that's simply not true. I don't like Brawl. I hate Brawl. I can't see why someone who has even held a Melee disc, let alone played it, can even be slightly satisfied by the gameplay in Brawl! I don't get it at all. I just feels completely different. It's slow, floaty, annoying, not exciting, etc. It's so boring. Even when I play on custom maps with crazy items, random characters, and more, it's just not nearly as fun as an all Falcon match on Temple in Melee.

I also hate Brawl for what it has done to my community. There isn't one now. There is no AZ community for Melee. Everyone went to Brawl because nobody is supporting Melee now except for people like me who can't provide prize support aside from the pot. Plus, everyone wants to smash n00bs into the ground and n00bs don't play Melee because... BRAWL'S OUT! So everything I like about competitive Melee has been wrecked by Brawl's release. Another reason to hate it.

Also, I spent $50 on this game. FIFTY DOLLARS! You know what you could do with that money? I could have bought a different game. I could have paid my cell phone bill for a month. I could have had food for the month. I could have see 7 movies. I could have bought some stuff for my apartment. There is a bunch I could have done with that 50, but now it's all for not. If I try to return it, I'll get 25 or less out of it. It's a big hassle to sell it to someone.

I hate Brawl. I really wish it could have been indefinitely pushed back in production. I was waiting on the successor to my competitive game. I was waiting for the next big thing to get into, and I was extremely let down. I know developers can't please everyone, but that can at least try to make a game better than the last one they did.

 

[Jack Kieser]

...and we, as people who like Brawl, respect your opinion. Well, as long as you don't try to force it on anyone else. Honestly coreygames, the only parts of your post I don't support is where you say that Brawl is 'annoying, not exciting, etc' (basically, any part where you state opinion as if it is fact). I agree with how it is slow and floaty because that is quantifiable (especially in terms of comparisons to Melee), but Brawl being annoying, unexciting, and generally bad is an opinion, one that I don't personally agree with.

Of course, I'll fight for your right to your opinion any day... as long as it doesn't infringe on anyone else's opinion.

 

[Cirno]

By the way anyone, not just scar or pro-melee debaters.
Feel free to answer this question that keeps getting avoided. I want to see what logical answers you get.

Why is the question "Which is more competitive, Brawl or Melee?" matter to us as a community?​

The answer I think, will kill these type of threads forever.
And pro-Brawl please stop saying stuff like "GO BACK TO MELEE RAWR!! D: <<"

If anything, if you haven't played it, you should because it's easily up there with incredible games like Chrono Trigger.

By this logic, every single fighting game sequel is more competitive than it's predecessor.

Obviously, this isn't true.

But by definition if there is more will to compete there is more competition.
I could understand if no one was playing or wanted to play. But pro-melee and pro-brawl are all playing it. There was a transfer that everyone understood. Same with Halo>>Halo 2.

Old Crowd+ New crowd.

The only reason why predecessors are not always more competitive than it's predecessors, is because there is no new crowd it appeals to. So instead there are vets leaving or people who thought the first was also bad.

This didn't apply to Brawl thanks to it being on the Wii.

I would like to say that I like both games, but that's simply not true. I don't like Brawl. I hate Brawl. I can't see why someone who has even held a Melee disc, let alone played it, can even be slightly satisfied by the gameplay in Brawl!

xDDDDDD
I love this statement. Because that's what my older brother said about Melee. Seriously.

Other than that though, I have no comment on preference.

I don't get it at all. I just feels completely different.

New games shouldn't be like that right?
2.0 for the win. It's not like we mastered the last one or anything.
Oh wait.

Sorry for the bit of douchebaggery there but the sarcasm played nicer than just saying what I have been saying over and over.

It's slow,
floaty,
annoying,
not exciting,
etc.
It's so boring.

Let's see...
The first two can now be fixed with gravity and speed option. More choice for the type of fight you have= bad?

4 after are opinion, which is too bad seeing as you can't enjoy it like other people can.

Even when I play on custom maps with crazy items, random characters, and more, it's just not nearly as fun as an all Falcon match on Temple in Melee.

Preference again. I think a mine battle with Fox on Mushroom Kingdom tops Falcon kneeing all over the Temple, but it's always the player's fault for not making something they want to be fun ,fun.

I also hate Brawl for what it has done to my community. There isn't one now. There is no AZ community for Melee. Everyone went to Brawl because nobody is supporting Melee now except for people like me who can't provide prize support aside from the pot.

Melee did that to 64 though. I can only really play on Kaileria now. Is Melee to blame or is it me for not getting together with my friends while I had the chance and fighting to keep it alive at tourneys and what not?

Plus, everyone wants to smash n00bs into the ground and n00bs don't play Melee because... BRAWL'S OUT! So everything I like about competitive Melee has been wrecked by Brawl's release. Another reason to hate it.

Or hate yourself for not having enough will power to inspire people to play Melee.
I can't get my girlfriend's brother to play Melee with me because he's seen my Falco.
BUT, he did play it, despite being a Soul Calibur junkie, and doesn't think it's a crap game like he did anymore. He even bought a copy for friendlies at work.

Also, I spent $50 on this game. FIFTY DOLLARS! You know what you could do with that money? I could have bought a different game. I could have paid my cell phone bill for a month. I could have had food for the month. I could have see 7 movies. I could have bought some stuff for my apartment. There is a bunch I could have done with that 50, but now it's all for not. If I try to return it, I'll get 25 or less out of it. It's a big hassle to sell it to someone.

xD
When it comes to adults and money there are SO many more things we waste money on than games we can at least get refunds on. Also wow, I'm pretty envious 50 bucks can last you a month on food. Seriously, I end up kicking out about 100-250 monthly.
@_@

The 7 movies too. Tickets are 11 here. 9 at night.

The only thing I can really to say to this is try the demo first next time.

I hate Brawl. I really wish it could have been indefinitely pushed back in production.

But then you wouldn't know how much you dislike it and would have been waiting for something that would never come. I've heard this situation be compared to Hell before so I don't wish that on anyone. Now you know. It's no big deal, this is a game we're talking about after all. Life goes on.

I was waiting on the successor to my competitive game. I was waiting for the next big thing to get into, and I was extremely let down. I know developers can't please everyone, but that can at least try to make a game better than the last one they did.

The successor came, the community didn't. The nest big thing is created by the next big idea having people who create it, by a lot of standards Melee was never in that category. To us however it was, and for us it falls again to or to not make Brawl the same. Better is opinion, and by Nintendo's sales already, I'm pretty sure they think it is. I like the new fighting system, prefer the old speed, but pro's outweigh the cons.

When they made Melee, no one said " Oh fux yeah!! Let's add this,that, and the third to make it better competitively!!" They've even admitted wavedashing was never thought to be used like that.

We have several new aspects to play with in Brawl the same way. The Buffer system and Sliding are noteworthy points. If we want this game to be great, we are going to have to make it that way. The same way we did with Melee.

Or are we suddenly powerless and idiotic; Unable to even pick up the controller...?

What's wrong with getting destroyed by a much better player, that's how it's been in most every fighter in history...

Brawl is no different. If you are better you have a higher chance at winning. The only thing that Brawl differs from in this aspect is the ****. I guess the reason I prefer an opponent that can constant fight back is because I like boxing and play boxing games. In this sense you have to trade blows and move accordingly and strategically because trying to do some amazing combo against someone who isn't an idiot will end in you getting your head ripped off taking equal or more damage.

In Melee we pushed gameplay speed to the point it was more like a rush to knock over dominoes. This wasn't a bad thing. Especially considering how much work we put into learning our characters and the standard techs we needed to survive. But, this does not change the fact that as a Falco, I knew if I got grabbed by Marth before I could SHL him into a pillar, the only way I wasn't losing a stock was going to be a mistake on his part. The hit stun wouldn't allow me to retaliate nor him if I caught him first.

I like that in Brawl I can get Faired and phantasm before going off the edge. I like that I can Bair a Bowser with Luigi and then suddenly get Bowsercided. Not knowing what will happen due to less hitstun keeps me on edge and makes me want to play harder and have more fun.

If trading blows a whole fight as many of you keep putting it i so slow and boring, why is boxing still around? I sure don't remember Jeff Lacey doing any 18 hit combos.

The more skilled player will win and dominate convincely through sheer skill and technical ability. In brawl when you get destroyed I find it more depressing since you basically got outplayed, tricked, out mindgamed, made 50 mistakes.

If the first point doesn't also fall true for Brawl then Melee Vets should not be winning as much as everyone claims they still are. And the second point happened in Melee as far as I know. Why should Shiek ever get caught by Peach who is much slower? Mind Games. Why should Fox catch a Jiggly Puff Rest? Tricked into a tech by ducking his grab and throwing him (Mango pwns) on a platform. Why does one Fox beat another? He was simply outplayed. And the only reason any of this ever happens is because the victim player made a mistake. Humans do that so it's nothing we could really do but shake hands and call gg.

The only real difference is perhaps the speed, which should decrease the mistakes as we have more time to react.(Not a good or bad thing I would have preferred Melee's speed though.)

Tripping is the only aspect of 'mistakes' we can't really control, and even then it can easily be dealt with or even help (getting up attacks, IC desynch, mind games)

You and it is a slow grind of a loss, in melee at least it was "tick tick boom" your dead. Plus it is easier to examine what you did wrong, in brawl it's "wow I took of a stock this time, what did I do different?"

The thing about Smash is that there is never really a grind of anything. No matter the damage you always have a chance to turn the match around. More so in Brawl than Melee because of the lack of hitstun and floaty physics which allow for more instantaneous decisions as one follows for strings or counters.

and yes I do play brawl and have went to tournies, and have placed well. My first brawl tourney I got 17th out of like 50 something people, and I had touched the game two times, for about an hour a piece. I shifted my character like five times, and ended up with snake cuz he was interesting(also Zjinn's inspired that tourney lol). I beat many people who actually had the game, and played it a lot. That should not happen.

Why not?
You played Melee so you know the best aspects that Smash has to offer you. A lot of people are still playing Brawl like Melee and don't realize just how many options they have in a fight.

And out of those 50 I'm sure they were not all pre-Melee either, many of them had to have been Brawl only and would automatically be at a disadvantage.

A while back I used to play Melty Blood pretty heavy, I friend of mine recently got AC and he has been playing for quite a while. I beat him more often than he does me and I only play when I am there every week or so. Why is that ? Is it so strange that I win a game I barely play when I played it's predecessor? Not really.

Same goes for SF Alpha 3. Never played it. Only turbo and the original. Otakon 4th place?

What?​

And 17th place for a 'watered down version' of a game you were good at is nothing good at all. 2 hours or no.

Brawl is like melee with no tech's and less hit stun, it's basically the same game, yet it is watered down version.

Less hitstun is not watered down.
It's a different feature in a new game.

If by techs you meant AT's there's an entire thread in the tactical section for picking.

If you meant hitting l as you land and what not, that's the player's fault, not Brawl.

So any melee player will have an instant advantage, so no there is no valiant newcomer showing up and beating someone like M2K.

There was nothing happening like that in Melee either.
Why are there complaints now?

And M2K hates this game(called it ****ty, and said it's only for money and playing with items) Now if the best player at the game admits it's nothing more than a party game, how come brawl supporters can't.

Because his opinion does not mean more than anyone elses. I don't one on one someone in Mario Party to see who is better because I know the random factors in it are to large for me to contain when they occur. The game doesn't allow it.

Brawl does for the small random factors it does.

And I don't recall there being a unanimous decision that M2K was the best. Hell there are still arguments over whether Ken or Isai is the best. I've even heard Gimpy would be top if he used a higher tier.

I'm done with this discussion though, EVERYONE admits melee is the better competitive game, yet they turn around and play brawl.

Blatant lie.

If there's even one person (which there hardly is) who disagrees you can say everyone.
And that's illogical. Why would people say a game is less competitive than another and then turn around and play it. I think the only way to get sense out of this is to assume people want to go against each other more in the game they call "less competitive" which is strange, seeing as the very definition for competitiveness is the desire to compete;go against one another in hopes of victory.

I'm sad to see you're done with this though. I like intelligent thoughts. The main reason I debate is because I want either our community to come back together and focus on making Brawl tourney's even more fun than Melee's or help me see why this game is just pure garbage and why I should change my mind and go back to playing Melee more.(I still play it. Roy's our boy you know.64 too cause Ness's Dair only got more and more nerfed.)

Either you find the watered down melee more fun than the actually thing(strange I know)

Yeah, looking at a new game and calling it watered down because it is not 2.0 of the first is strange. But humans often disagree with things that are not what they expected so it's not too surprising.

[/quote]
or you just didn't have the drive or incentive to improve to get at a competent level at melee, which most admit is the better competitive game.[/QUOTE]


Some but not all.

It was fun wasn't it?

Getting wavedashing down. L canceling. Short hops. Edge techs (saved Roy from the dreaded Marth Fsmash tip sooooooooo many times.) Learning the timing of B moves, the lag on this, how much hitstun comes after this, top tier this, combo video that. Even though everyone else said the way we were playing wasn't fun because we didn't have items, and there were more Fox only final destination matches than Kirby v Mewtwo Fountain of Dreams.

Is there really no way to bring this spirit with us into Brawl?

Because if that's true it isn't really Brawl that's become a watered down version, but our community itself.

 

[HoChiMinhTrail]

no.. its brawl that hs become the watered down version... don't take yourself so seriously lol.
the community itself hasnt... the game has... stop trying to get all phyilosophical.

 

[HoChiMinhTrail]

Brawl is the watered down version of melee... this new horizen alot of you see as the game of brawl.. us melee players have already seen. You take out all the advanced aspects of melee and what u get us brawl. Thats why i can still play the game and be good without practicing much. To me the problem is more that there is nothing inherently new about the gameplay, it is simply a slowed down and less technical version of melee.... that is what bores most of the pros of melee who have switched or have tried to switch over. Since we are dominating in all the regions of the brawl scene i feel like our opinion should be understood for what it is worth. Yes, we have seen the tops of both competitive fields and great ... and i do mean GREATLY miss the peak of competitive melee play. Play on with brawl... it is alot easier to pick up and play and hey... that should be good because it attracts all sorts of people.... but don't even try to compare the game to melee......

I am willing to give brawl a few years to possibly hope to aspire to what melee was... but if it doesnt then... melee stands as the best in the series and Sakurai can be happy in killing one of the truely greatest fighting games to exist. Because no matter how good a game is... eventually without newer versions it will fade away forever..... This will happen to even starcraft if sc2 is terrible. .

I dont want to see anymore melee vs brawl debates because melee is already established as truely one of the greatest fighting games to exist. Brawl is kinda.... the creation spawned form borrowed ideas and the watered down gameplay of melee. If it becomes something ... great.. if not ... w/e its nintendo... lol. But all and all... dont evne think to compare brawl to melee... its not even close to being on the same level. You say melee took years and years to become the great game it was.... dont even think to say brawl is already on that level... its not even certain that it ever will be on that level so just keep trekkiing on and perhaps one day you will prove to us ... "elitists" that you were right... tho us meleee "elitists" will still be dominating all of you in brawl anywase.... so we will probobly agree at that point. Somehow i doubt that day is ever going to come... and really ... that makes me sad. Smash was and is a great hobby .

 

[Corigames]

Honestly coreygames, the only parts of your post I don't support is where you say that Brawl is 'annoying, not exciting, etc' (basically, any part where you state opinion as if it is fact).

Oh, don't tell me that bull ****. I don't say, "AS A FACT, BRAWL SUCKS BECAUSE IT BLOWS. LOLOLOL. I DON'T LIKE IT BECAUSE IT IS TEH SLOWNESS." No, I said I didn't like it for those reasons. If I was stating it as a fact, then you would know. I would get a direct link from the Harvard Institution of Gaming Failures to back me up on why Brawl sucks so much donkey ****. But did I? now. I said I don't like it. Don't try to libel me by saying I make opinions facts. I don't.

I respect you, but don't make such fleeting remarks please.

 

[Cirno]

no.. its brawl that hs become the watered down version... don't take yourself so seriously lol.
the community itself hasnt... the game has... stop trying to get all phyilosophical.

Please leave pro-melee debating to those that can refute and bring up points.

I'm not saying you can't but you haven't shown me anything but double posting and reposting the same thing over and over again.

Melee being the great game it is can stand up full well on it's own without you trying to stop me from 'getting philosophical'.

I only say this in hopes you won't get flamed or embarrassed.

 

[Jack Kieser]

Oh, don't tell me that bull ****. I don't say, "AS A FACT, BRAWL SUCKS BECAUSE IT BLOWS. LOLOLOL. I DON'T LIKE IT BECAUSE IT IS TEH SLOWNESS." No, I said I didn't like it for those reasons. If I was stating it as a fact, then you would know. I would get a direct link from the Harvard Institution of Gaming Failures to back me up on why Brawl sucks so much donkey ****. But did I? now. I said I don't like it. Don't try to libel me by saying I make opinions facts. I don't.

I respect you, but don't make such fleeting remarks please.

It's my opinion that children should be taught that any opinion not prefaced by the words 'in my opinion', 'I think', etc. is incorrect grammar. That would stop like 85% of all SWF misunderstandings right there. Well, if anyone on the internet used correct grammar, anyways.

 

[Ban3]

Yeah this is me. I came into the competitive scene about um a year before brawl, and I...was pretty bad

 

[Corigames]

I think that people with a reading comprehension greater than their controller port number should have understood the context of those points I listed. When they are surrounded by the opinion that Brawl sucks, then you should assume that the other points to follow will be too if they aren't listed with a reference to a reputable source or have some other form of backing.

Just don't try to strip my reputation by sinking so low as to say that I try to be jesus and turn water to wine, i.e. opinion to fact.

 

[fsdfsdgsgdf]

Suspect for president

 

[Stroupes]

You know you are a smash n00b when _____ .

you play Brawl

See, this is the type of thing that agitates the pro-Brawlers.
THAT hit against Brawl was unprovoked, and the Melee players say that the only reason they try to prove Melee's superiority is because a Brawler first attacked Melee.
Yet what do we have here?
A Melee attack on Brawl.
So really, you can't take anyone's arguement seriously.

 

[HoChiMinhTrail]

Please leave pro-melee debating to those that can refute and bring up points.

I'm not saying you can't but you haven't shown me anything but double posting and reposting the same thing over and over again.

Melee being the great game it is can stand up full well on it's own without you trying to stop me from 'getting philosophical'.

I only say this in hopes you won't get flamed or embarrassed.

Flamed or embarrased? By who? LOL yea right... none of these nubs know how to do that.

Frankly, im done making points. These points when made for pro-melee are taken by brawl people and returned with all sorts of theoretical non-sense. Seriously most of the statements made show that most of the pro brawlers in this thread aren't even good at brawl. This key component with having the credentials to debate, leaves their posts full of various scenarios and theories that have no real basis in this debate.

The only real debate should be between those who are actually good at the games. Like i stated before, if you dont have this you get a bunch of theoretical bs on "wat cOMpetiTIVe meANs" and "iTS a DIff GAMe AND u Need MIndGAMES." I mean honestly, everytime someone brings that up i dismiss them as "aNOthrER nuB" because it holds no bearing on how the game is actually played. You can make a post as intelligently as you want, but it doesnt increase your knowledge of the game. Most of the time i know a lot of these people's points are wrong (including marko, clai, you... etc). I know they are wrong because i am pro-level at melee and pretty ****in good at brawl and know that its wrong lol. Yet, when i make a post about the actuaities of the game i get more theoretical bs that when you sit down and actually play.. none of it comes into play.

Once again i want you guys to take the hands on learning approach.
Find me or any other anti-brawl/pro-melee player.
Come on over and let us dominate you in brawl(even tho we dont play the game) then let us show u how much deeper melee is.
Hands on learning right there.

We can go on posting forever, if we could just play all would be expressed that needs to be expressed.

So do that. Find a player. And lEARN!Z!

As for the depth of the game... why i call it watered down..?

Compare each character in melee and each one in brawl individually. And judge which one has more options available to them and what they can do.

I'll post "intelligently" from now on. Then we will get the same theoretical non-sense and "OMG IF U REALLY LOOK AT IT THERE AR MoRE CHARS AND moRE dEPTH" "MorE PEOPLE AND MORE COMPETITION= more coMPetITIve and deeper" ... its just ridiculous.

This is why such a debate should only be between pros. We understand what you dont... its just that simple. Start whooping *** in both games then we can have a debate.

 

[Stryks]

Wow, thats ur reason why we like brawl over melee?
I was a beast with ganon in melee...

Seriously thats a stupid reason why we prefer brawl over melee, Brawl has its techniques like melee, theres wingdash, perfect shield, The running attack cancel into up smash (dont know the correct term) and such...

All games have their ups and downs, and IMO most of the people that prefer melee over brawl played with a high-top tier character in melee, and since theyre no longer in that position in brawl, they dont want to start over... that what I think at least, may not be fact, but that how I see them...

 

[LUVTOY77-ROGUE WIREFRAME]

Let me try to get a grip on what is being argued. Correct me if I'm wrong (which i might be by a lot)...

This is about melee having more depth (technical play) than Brawl?


My opinion: I don't really see THAT big of a difference between the two. Yea, Brawl does seem a bit floaty, characters have differed a bit, but really it seems mostly similar. I understand Brawl doesn't have wavedashing and L-cancelling and what not... But I'm sure those tricks weren't discovered in Melee right away. Give the game time, and eventually stuff will start popping up.

I, personally, feel that both games are completely fantastic, and enjoy playing both. however, I'm not as competitive as some, so I may not exactly have all the information necessary to understand what's being said, mainly because I don't have the experience to relate it to. I'll try and keep up though.

 

[fsdfsdgsgdf]

Suspect.....for President!

 

[Corigames]

I had a very-well written response here, however, my roommate decided to jump on and erase it, leaving that remark behind. I will attempt to re-write what I had:

@ Stroupes

God forbid I try to be funny on the internet. No, I'm just not allowed to make fun of sacred Brawl and all of its splendor. For, we all know, that if I do the heavens will chasm open and flood the Earth with the tears of thousands of newbs who can't bear the thought of someone making a joke about a pathetic game they like. This torrent of a wave will crash over the people and its power would only be comparable to the rage I feel about those very people who can't see past their own noses as far as personal beliefs go.

Why don't you go masturbate to a picture of yourself, since that's all you seem to be doing in this thread.

 

[illboyzeus]

If M2K isn't the best smasher in the world then who is. And Isai, he doesn't even really play nor take melee seriously so I really see you don't understand the scene too much.

Besides the biggest problem with brawl is that it has no push-pull mechanic. What is the incentive to be aggresive, other than thinking your cool and being different. You are already at a disadvantage. Okay you land a hit, now what, the game is reset. Combos(hitstun) add to a fighter since it makes the mistakes made more apparent and more punishable, so playing an aggresive playstyle is feasible since the reward is high. this is not true in brawl where there is no hit stun to promote aggresive play.

 

[fsdfsdgsgdf]

If M2K isn't the best smasher in the world then who is. And Isai, he doesn't even really play nor take melee seriously so I really see you don't understand the scene too much.

Besides the biggest problem with brawl is that it has no push-pull mechanic. What is the incentive to be aggresive, other than thinking your cool and being different. You are already at a disadvantage. Okay you land a hit, now what, the game is reset. Combos(hitstun) add to a fighter since it makes the mistakes made more apparent and more punishable, so playing an aggresive playstyle is feasible since the reward is high. this is not true in brawl where there is no hit stun to promote aggresive play.

No one knows, we can just all have opinion. I favor Amsah

 

[Stroupes]

Why don't you go masturbate to a picture of yourself, since that's all you seem to be doing in this thread.

That's a good idea. It's certainly more entertaining than putting up with this discussion.

 

[illboyzeus]

That's a good idea. It's certainly more entertaining than putting up with this discussion.

no homo lol

 

[fsdfsdgsgdf]

no homo lol

was up camron

 

[ADHD]

Here's a thought.

Why, us, the competitive community, are playing a game we in fact know is casually based by words of its father, when a game with proof over many years is proven to be the competitive choice.

Why not just let the casual players (that happen to be dominating us and trying to affect the tourney scene even though they have most likely never attended a tourney or ever will) play brawl, and the competitive players play melee. Why is this so difficult? If you are a competitive player and like brawl, well you're out of luck, its just that way by the game's brith.

 

[Corigames]

I Say we have Melee tournaments and Let Brawl friendlies go on in the background. That way you can get hyper serious for your matches and then blow some steam off in "fun" Brawl matches.

 

[ADHD]

I Say we have Melee tournaments and Let Brawl friendlies go on in the background. That way you can get hyper serious for your matches and then blow some steam off in "fun" Brawl matches.

Good idea but um, apparantly people want to think that brawl is competitive.

Lets make it competitive then.

Lets scrap out all of the cast except for metaknight, snake, falco, rob, and dedede. There, dedede is bottom tier, rob is low tier, falco is middle tier, snake is high tier, and metaknight is top tier.

Agreed? Maybe we should stick the ice climbers somewhere in there, they have potential.

 

[LUVTOY77-ROGUE WIREFRAME]

Here's a thought.

Why, us, the competitive community, are playing a game we in fact know is casually based by words of its father, when a game with proof over many years is proven to be the competitive choice.

Why not just let the casual players (that happen to be dominating us and trying to affect the tourney scene even though they have most likely never attended a tourney or ever will) play brawl, and the competitive players play melee. Why is this so difficult? If you are a competitive player and like brawl, well you're out of luck, its just that way by the game's brith.

Or you could be competitive in Brawl and play to it's strengths just as you would to melee's (ex/ wavedashing, l-canceing, what-not).... why is this so difficult? If people want 2 play competitively in Brawl then let them! Yea it has a slightly different playstyle, but that doesn't mean you can't take it seriously and play it competitively... right?

 

[fredymartinez1]

melee<> brawl

 

[fsdfsdgsgdf]

M2K<>Amsah

 

[LUVTOY77-ROGUE WIREFRAME]

I'm to dumb to figure out what <> is... :/ can someone exlpain... i it equal? Lol :/