The Never Ending List of Toon's AT's and Tricks / The Data Dump / Song of Brainstorms

[TheJerm]

I have up tap off and thats it. But I want to turn it back on.. I just got so used to having it off =/

 

[UncleSam]

lol my controls are so complicated compared to you guys >.<
R is grab
Z is attack
X is sheild
Tap jump off
and Up on the D-pad... just for SHDA I can JC just fine with Y

 

[fezzmaster]

wow thats pretty crazy!
what does your D-pad do? and i can JC to but i like doing it with the L button.

(off topic) UncleSam did you sign up for that teaching thing on here?

 

[Lobos]

I have a hacks controller >_> I think some of you have seen it?!

 

[fezzmaster]

i have to C-sticks on mine i feel it gives better control then the normal movement stick.

 

[UncleSam]

wow thats pretty crazy!
what does your D-pad do? and i can JC to but i like doing it with the L button.

(off topic) UncleSam did you sign up for that teaching thing on here?

Smash school right? yes, but straked doesn't update the OP so I don't show up there... yet, I'll annoy him more

i have to C-sticks on mine i feel it gives better control then the normal movement stick.

lolwut? I want to see this
EDIT: y have I not subscribed to this yet?
*subscribes*

 

[fezzmaster]

i just signed up to do that to, because i was hoping to get more ppl to play as toon link.

and ull post pictures of my controller so you can see it. its really easy to do. it helped my game alot. i hate the normal movement stick.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Thank you so much for this guide!
I'm just starting to learn more about Tink, and this thread is pretty much all I need :D

One question, tho. Are all of you guys playing with the standard setting for the controls?
Because, I recently turned off the jump with the control stick so that I can up-A easier;
but now I'm not sure if this hinders some of the techniques... I think it does... :/

Well I take it everyone else answered your question. But to be more specific, having Tap Jump off won't stop you from doing any of the techs on the list. Some characters play better with it on, but with Toon, it doesn't seem to matter. So it's up to you. Me personally, I have it off, but I use the nunchuck so that's a bit different. Thanks for your feedback.

 

[TLMSheikant]

I got tap jump off. R to attack. And Y to grab.

 

[WindMajor]

Mine's the same as Sheikant's, but I have R set to Jump instead. It's easier to SHDA like that.

 

[oh_dr_where_art_thou]

Thanks everyone =D

I set my Y button to grab, so now it's super easy to zair.


...oh and; with the nunchuck? I never even tried using anything but my GC controller.

 

[Radori Nighthawk]

Full hop Boomerang Bomb throw Quickdraw
How to Perform: Pull out a Bomb, Full hop, Throw the Boomerang, throw the Bomb, quickdraw.
Effect: Toon will Full hop, Throw a Boomerang, throw a Bomb then quickdraw.
Note: Yet another useful Full hop technique. Throw the Boomerang at your opponent depending on where they are.
Stages: All

LIES. Someone send me a video where this is done. Other than that it is NOT possible to do this. >_> I've tried for AT LEAST an hour.

 

[UncleSam]

Full hop Boomerang Bomb throw Quickdraw
How to Perform: Pull out a Bomb, Full hop, Throw the Boomerang, throw the Bomb, quickdraw.
Effect: Toon will Full hop, Throw a Boomerang, throw a Bomb then quickdraw.
Note: Yet another useful Full hop technique. Throw the Boomerang at your opponent depending on where they are.
Stages: All

LIES. Someone send me a video where this is done. Other than that it is NOT possible to do this. >_> I've tried for AT LEAST an hour.

then you must be doing it wrong, you have to throw the boomerang as you are rising

B-sticking helps if you are lazy
EDIT: another thing, if you are having trouble throw the bomb first... *hinthint*

 

[fezzmaster]

why do we use full hop things anyway? i pretty much never full hop.

 

[UncleSam]

why do we use full hop things anyway? i pretty much never full hop.

they are mainly used for mix-ups as to not get too predictable, plus you can use more projectiles in one FH than one SH

 

[Radori Nighthawk]

why do we use full hop things anyway? i pretty much never full hop.

Well if you do some full hops it makes you also more deadly. Giving you more options from aerials AND projectiles. I look fast falling a zair from a full hop Fair nair or Bair to a FF'd Zair. (The NinjaLink as I call it) xD

And you know, the unleashing of projectiles.

 

[Radori Nighthawk]

then you must be doing it wrong, you have to throw the boomerang as you are rising

B-sticking helps if you are lazy
EDIT: another thing, if you are having trouble throw the bomb first... *hinthint*

I will go back and try it. Thanks for the help. I'll let you know how it goes.

 

[UncleSam]

I will go back and try it. Thanks for the help. I'll let you know how it goes.

I should do it right now too, just to test it...
I've neglected FH's a bit...

EDIT: it's totally possible it's just really hard to land the QD
EDIT2: aw yea, just did it you have to throw the rang while you rise, this is easy when you have tap jump on, I had to claw the controller since I have tap jump off

 

[Radori Nighthawk]

Awesome it works while rising. Since I have my R button set to special. It wasn't that hard.

Thanks much. <3

 

[Radori Nighthawk]

I should do it right now too, just to test it...
I've neglected FH's a bit...

EDIT: it's totally possible it's just really hard to land the QD
EDIT2: aw yea, just did it you have to throw the rang while you rise, this is easy when you have tap jump on, I had to claw the controller since I have tap jump off

Hmmm I should try it without tap jump.

Thanks for you help, Unc. :D

 

[UncleSam]

Hmmm I should try it without tap jump.

Thanks for you help, Unc. :D

you're welcome, learn to edit your posts though

 

[TLMSheikant]

U all know that this thread is not for asking such questions right? Use the stickied inquiry thread!

 

[UncleSam]

Full hop Boomerang Bomb throw Quickdraw
How to Perform: Pull out a Bomb, Full hop, Throw the Boomerang, throw the Bomb, quickdraw.
Effect: Toon will Full hop, Throw a Boomerang, throw a Bomb then quickdraw.
Note: Yet another useful Full hop technique. Throw the Boomerang at your opponent depending on where they are.
Stages: All

LIES. Someone send me a video where this is done. Other than that it is NOT possible to do this. >_> I've tried for AT LEAST an hour.

It all started with this, I don't think this counts as a question

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Well I'm glad that's all sorted out. Thanks for helping out UncleSam. I don't mind asnwering questions like this, so you can either post them here on in the inquiry thread. So yeah, as UncleSam said, you have to throw the Boomerang on the way up (Then tilt it down towards your opponent presuming they are on the ground. You shouldn't need the Tap Jump on to pull this off consistently). It's just another mix up among countless of others that I should write down at some point.

Full hops can be heaps useful when you do a retreating full hop, Bomb pull. It's a pretty safe way to get a Bomb out and there are tones of things you can do after it. For example, you can Full hop, Bomb Pull, Bomb Throw Quickdraw or if they are trying to get in your face and you have enough room to retreat, what I've been doing recently is Retreating Full hop, Bomb Pull, Bomb throw, Retreating Double Jump, Bomb Pull, Bomb throw, quickdraw. It's heaps easy if you use the C-stick to throw the Bombs at your opponent so you can continue to DI away from them. Also things like Full hop, Boomerang, Zair are pretty cool. But it's just to mix things up.

 

[demonictoonlink]

Hmm...It's like someone should've made a full hop thread.... lol

BTW I just wanna say this thread kicks ***. The list is borderline complete (only cause you know...we might find more...) and people actually help each other in posts. Although not its purpose, it works great for inquires.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

XD
Hmm, now if only we had a Full hop thread.....

 

[UncleSam]

Hmm...It's like someone should've made a full hop thread.... lol

BTW I just wanna say this thread kicks ***. The list is borderline complete (only cause you know...we might find more...) and people actually help each other in posts. Although not its purpose, it works great for inquires.

grabbing w/ a bomb

 

[Radori Nighthawk]

you're welcome, learn to edit your posts though

I knew you'd say something about that. =P

LOL @ full hop thread idea. It wouldn't hurt though. :3

I've noticed that full hopping against Rise's Marth. (Rise is my brother xD) Comes in handy.

Well it did at first......then he caught on. Some Marth's expect shorthopping freaks from us TL's. It's nice when we slam that door in their face. :D

 

[UncleSam]

I knew you'd say something about that. =P

LOL @ full hop thread idea. It wouldn't hurt though. :3

I've noticed that full hopping against Rise's Marth. (Rise is my brother xD) Comes in handy.

Well it did at first......then he caught on. Some Marth's expect shorthopping freaks from us TL's. It's nice when we slam that door in their face. :D

... DTL had a short FH thread for a while, maybe it died, and it all went on here,
yeah alot of ppl expect us to SH everything and punish it, so we work around that

 

[WindMajor]

Fox, I think I found a fifth Safe Spike. I dunno, you tell me. Anyways, here's how you do it.

Take out a bomb
When it's about to blow up, Z-air with the bomb in hand.
Have the bomb blow up mid Z-air.
D-air with good timing.

I think it's new, and it's a lot easier to perform, since you can be anywhere to do it, and you don't have to toss the bomb anywhere.

Edit: You don't even need to Z-Air actually.
Edit again: You can also try to perfom an impossible Safe Spike while holding a bomb.

Take out bomb
Throw it in the air.
Take out a second bomb.
Get hit by the first bomb, and fly upward.
At around peak knockback, Z drop the bomb in your hand.
Catch it with a safe Dair.

Usefulness: -1/10

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Yeah, it's cool that your working on the Safe Spike and all, but I left using the timed explosion behind with the Safe Spike 2.0.

With the first one, you're using the explosion of the timed bomb to hit you upwards so you can slowly fall the dair? If so, this wouldn't work because the timed explosion has minimal knockback which means this would only work at around 100% and over. And again, it's a timed explosion which means you don't have much control over when you can Spike.

The second one is basically a normal Safe Spike except you have to wait for the Bomb to come back down so this wouldn't work because you'd have to get lucky with the timing. And then I don't really see much point in having the second bomb with you. Also, by Z-dropping the Bomb just before the Dair, it means that you will be using Dair later then usual which means that you'd have to be on a higher percent then usual if you still want the slowly falling Dair.

But you know, keep working on it. I know I had fun trying to figure out new ways to do this. Also, have a look at the four ways to do it that are there already and you'll see that they all have a few things in common. They can all be done on relatively low percents (two of them 40% and over and the other two 55% and over.), they can all be done relatively quickly (so presuming you're already holding a Bomb, they can all be done pretty much instantly which helps with timing it just right so the spike connects with the opponent) and they all involve smash throwing the Bomb in your own face. So try to sort of work within these guidelines and if you find another one that has all these ticked, then I would definitely be interested. Either that, or you could be the one to invent the Safe Spike 4.0, but it would have to be safer, faster, used on lower (or all) percents and maybe even not involve damaging ourselves. Actually, I've already thought of it before, remember the one involving two Toon Links and the Dair Shockwave? It can be used on any percent, it's definitely faster, we recieve less damage (only 5%) but it needs two Toons to perform it. Oh well.

 

[WindMajor]

Yeah, I didn't think any of it would be very useful, hence, "Usefulness: -1". Toons never really use the normal Safes Spikes, and this is more of a downgrade. I was aiming for more of a "it's only good to learn when you're bored", like what it says in your Usefulness summary.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Well thanks for trying anyway. But I have to draw the line somewhere if you know what I mean. I didn't say it's only good to learn when your bored, I said "If you see Usefulness: 1/10, this means that even under the best stage situation and so on, this isn't useful at all, so there isn't much point learning it (unless you're bored)." So I'm really trying to keep as many of these kinds of things out of the list as possible. So I would need a decent reason to add it in, like it has potential and it's possible that we might find a use for this later on so I may as well write it down, or it's unique or something. So far, in that entire list, there are only 3 things that have a 1/10 rating and they all have their reasons for being there as useless as they are.

 

[UncleSam]

is 4/10 situational? *puppy dog look*

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Yeah, the ratings system revolves around how useful a tech is in a real game situation. So I can't necessarily judge how situational something is by it's usefulness rating. Do you know what I mean? Situational just means you wouldn't get the chance to use it very often if at all because the situation would hardly ever arise, but just because something is situational, it doesn't always mean it isn't useful. But yeah, if you wanted a more straight forward answer, you'd have to ask if a particular tech is situational.

 

[ASF1nk]

BFO safe/mindgame spike anyone?

 

[UncleSam]

Yeah, the ratings system revolves around how useful a tech is in a real game situation. So I can't necessarily judge how situational something is by it's usefulness rating. Do you know what I mean? Situational just means you wouldn't get the chance to use it very often if at all because the situation would hardly ever arise, but just because something is situational, it doesn't always mean it isn't useful. But yeah, if you wanted a more straight forward answer, you'd have to ask if a particular tech is situational.

you should write up a chart to fill things out 1-10/10 gives us a guesstimate on how good it is

Spoiler

wow apparently guesstimate is a real word, it's spelled correctly

but no details, your choice.

BFO safe/mindgame spike anyone?

it could happen, I see it as your opponent is recovering low and you BFO towards the stage to set up the safe spike

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

you should write up a chart to fill things out 1-10/10 gives us a guesstimate on how good it is

Spoiler

wow apparently guesstimate is a real word, it's spelled correctly

but no details, your choice.

I'm not sure that I follow. Do you mean, have a general 1-10 rating with no specific information or reason why they're rated how they are? Just an overal guess on how good it is compared to the rest? If so, then I'm not so sure about this. I put a lot of time into thinking about what would be the best way to rate them, and I came to the conclusion that it would be best for everyone if they were rated the way they are now. After all, the only thing that matters as far as implementing techs into your game, is how useful they are in a real game situation.

 

[UncleSam]

I'm not sure that I follow. Do you mean, have a general 1-10 rating with no specific information or reason why they're rated how they are? Just an overal guess on how good it is compared to the rest? If so, then I'm not so sure about this. I put a lot of time into thinking about what would be the best way to rate them, and I came to the conclusion that it would be best for everyone if they were rated the way they are now. After all, the only thing that matters as far as implementing techs into your game, is how useful they are in a real game situation.

no like put up a chart where it's like 1- not so useful, 2- very situational, and so on.
I can see what you mean though. you rated BCAT 8/10 but I find it more useful than that, I was just making a suggestion

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Ok I think I know what you mean. Cause, I've only written up the 1/10 and the 10/10, so why not write up everything in between? That's fair enough. It'd be pretty hard to sum them all up, but I could definitely try. Even if I just write up every second or something. In any case thanks for the suggestion, I'll seriously consider it.