The Never Ending List of Toon's AT's and Tricks / The Data Dump / Song of Brainstorms

[Bomber7]

Got a quick question concerning dropped bombs.

I was on Pirate Ship and at the part where the ship runs into the rock and the stern(i think I got my term correctly) of the ship goes into the water, I pulled out a bomb and went into the water. Because I went deep enough into the water, my bomb was dropped. A few seconds later I noticed that it exploded. apparently it was still on the ship when I dropped it.

Even though this is situational because you have to first of all be in that particular form of the stage and also in that part of the stage, in your opinion, do you think it has any use at all as far as a surprise C4 attack? In my opinion it's too situational to work but could serve as a once in a long time surprise bombing. It's hidden under water so your opponent won't be able to see it. Thoughts?

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Hmm... Yeah I did this a while ago, but I decided it wasn't really worth it. Like you said, you have to be on that one level in that one place and pretty much, it might work once if they happen to be near the bomb when it explodes, but it won't work again. And even then, it's what, 3%?
I also see why you brought this up because it's like, the water covers the Bomb and that's pretty cool. So you're in no fault by bringing this to my attention and I thank you for that.

But it all boils down to the fact that, I have to draw the line somewhere. And I like to think that I am very lenient when it comes to adding new stuff because I want this thread to have Everything. The question is, does this random and situational trick make it across the 'line' just because of the possible slight benefit?
I have to say, unfortunately no.

Don't be discouraged however. I was sort of changing my mind back and forth throughout writing this. So I spose it's good for me to know where the 'line' has been drawn. Again, thanks for letting me know. Keep trying mate.

 

[StealthyGunnar]

Nice, this helped me a lot with my Toon Link.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Ok, I've had my work cut out for me ever since DTL made that great thread, but the point is I finally updated this thread with most of the stuff from that thread. Yes?

So, it's all there, all explained, all done, including the vids, some new techs and some new info added to older techs. I haven't gone over it yet to find mistakes so if you're luckly, you might just see a grammar/spelling error. Don't bother reporting them, but I would appreciate you letting me know if you find any actual flaws, like if I'm completely wrong about something or if I wrote how to do something but I left out crucial info.
The usual.

I'm done for now. I still gotta fix the colour problems at some point, but not now.

Enjoy!

Edit: As it turns out, I had some time to check out that colour website (Thanks again TWiNK) and I've made a few possible changes. I've coloured the first tech of the Bombs, Boomerang, Arrows and Swordplay sections in the way that Corpsecreate suggested so you guys can tell me if you like it before I go and colour the entire thread. So check it out, give me some feedback and we might be able to make the thread easier to read.

 

[Disfunkshunal]

i think you should color the whole thread.

 

[WindMajor]

No problem Fox. The colors are nice. Oh, and nice 2nd post.....

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

@Toondiddy and TWiNK: Ok cool, I'll start colouring it all in then. Thanks for the Feedback! It'll take me a while though, so I'll just do it a bit at a time every now and then.
(Goes off to delete second post ramblings XD, it didn't take you long to notice, I'm impressed!)

 

[Sosuke]

I would just do a section at a time (coloring, I mean).
That way you're not too overwhelmed, and you don't feel like you're slacking off when you finish.

That's how I handle things. =)





Edit!:

On Jungle Japes, you can jump underneath the left or right platform, jump, pull out a bomb, and grab the other edge in one fluid motion. It's kinda cool.

 

[Veggieburger_802]

This post has been removed because the user was in high school when he wrote it and he wants to start using this website again without people being able to see the stupid stuff he said ten years ago.

 

[Sosuke]

That isn't new.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Woah!! what the, just, ok....... First of all, Veggie whatever, you're wrong. Now just hear me out. (This is so cool!!) I figured out how you did that! And you're wrong, it isn't the Dair wind push effect! It's something so much cooler! I noticed that Link recieved 5% when you pushed him off the edge, I tested this and found out that the Dair has a really strange hitbox when Toon lands on plaforms. But pretty much, the reason why Link went as far as he did, was because he was on such a high percent.

So I found during my tests that:
It does 5%
The knockback increases as their damage increases
It doesn't stun them or anything just like Fox's laser, so whatever move they were doing doesn't get interupted or they can do a move straight after during the slide.

Now I've done some really wierd things with it so far, like I made Fox use his grounded Up-B below one of the platforms on Battle field and I dair'd the above platform just as Fox started to shoot upwards and get this, I made him Up-B all the way up, off, and out of screen, like way up there (no he didn't die, Fox can't die XD).

So I'm thinking that this can be used in teams on levels with platforms like Battlefield. Like if you've got DK on your team, you can easily make him slide from one side of Battle field to the other while charging or unleashing his neutral B. I dunno, like anything, any move that any character can do, you can make them side really far Backwards or Forwards when they do it. I mean there are tones of unbelievable things you can do with this thing. You really have to try it for yourself. Simply go into training mode, verse a character like Fox (Just because Fox seems to be the perfect height), get his percent up to anything over 50% (depending on how awesome you want the effect to be) and Dair the Platform directly above him. If you're using larger characters, you might need to Dair slightly to the left or right of them because if you do it directly above them, they will be hit upwards like normal.

Just, I dunno if this is all known, and if it is, it obviously wasn't looked into deeply enough because this hitbox of the Dair when landing on platforms is absolutely riddled with wierd.

I gotta go, just check it out. (Just for Lols, put the computer on 999% then do it, XD, classic)

 

[Sosuke]

That's really odd.

So Dair has a "wind push" hitbox AND a "5% wind push" hitbox?
Too weird. I don't really know what to make of that tbh, but it seems interesting. It might have to do with the uhh.... the animation of when TL lands with his Dair? When the smoke thing is visual?
That's just my guess.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Yeah I've been doing more testing. I swear everytime I try stuff, something else wierd happens. But anyway, remember I said that I made Fox's Up-B go like three times higher then normal? Well I did it again and I did it with Mario's Up-B.

Also, it seems to be just a little character specific when it comes to the distance that you can make the character slide. Like Kirby slides three times further then Ganondorf, but on average, the rest of the cast seem to be in between.

Now from what I could make out, I think that the actual hit box is just below the sword when Toon lands. Either that or on the very tip, but I'm pretty sure it has a larger reach then that.

That's all for now. I'll post more if I figure anything else out, but just for now, does anyone else think that we should utilise this strange new push hit box?

 

[MJG]

Woah!! what the, just, ok....... First of all, Veggie whatever, you're wrong. Now just hear me out. (This is so cool!!) I figured out how you did that! And you're wrong, it isn't the Dair wind push effect! It's something so much cooler! I noticed that Link recieved 5% when you pushed him off the edge, I tested this and found out that the Dair has a really strange hitbox when Toon lands on plaforms. But pretty much, the reason why Link went as far as he did, was because he was on such a high percent.

So I found during my tests that:
It does 5%
The knockback increases as their damage increases
It doesn't stun them or anything just like Fox's laser, so whatever move they were doing doesn't get interupted or they can do a move straight after during the slide.

Now I've done some really wierd things with it so far, like I made Fox use his grounded Up-B below one of the platforms on Battle field and I dair'd the above platform just as Fox started to shoot upwards and get this, I made him Up-B all the way up, off, and out of screen, like way up there (no he didn't die, Fox can't die XD).

So I'm thinking that this can be used in teams on levels with platforms like Battlefield. Like if you've got DK on your team, you can easily make him slide from one side of Battle field to the other while charging or unleashing his neutral B. I dunno, like anything, any move that any character can do, you can make them side really far Backwards or Forwards when they do it. I mean there are tones of unbelievable things you can do with this thing. You really have to try it for yourself. Simply go into training mode, verse a character like Fox (Just because Fox seems to be the perfect height), get his percent up to anything over 50% (depending on how awesome you want the effect to be) and Dair the Platform directly above him. If you're using larger characters, you might need to Dair slightly to the left or right of them because if you do it directly above them, they will be hit upwards like normal.

Just, I dunno if this is all known, and if it is, it obviously wasn't looked into deeply enough because this hitbox of the Dair when landing on platforms is absolutely riddled with wierd.

I gotta go, just check it out. (Just for Lols, put the computer on 999% then do it, XD, classic)

WOW

So wait..if you were doing teams, could you have an Olimar charge his Down Smash while we do the Dair to send him across part of Battle field? And i have done this before to where it does do 5% damage but they didn't bounce up and I was wondering why it happen.

 

[demonictoonlink]

I have a few replays of this. Ike is on the ledge, I dair, it misses, he takes five damage.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

@~mjg~: Yes, you definitely could use this strange hit box to to make Olimar do that. Only one problem, Olimar is too small for this to work on Battlefield. No worries, you can do it on Yoshi's Island Brawl, Pokemon Stadium, Pictochat and many more.

@DTL: I've also done this before but I never knew why it happend or how to do it. I'm glad I finally figured it out. So now the only thing I still don't understand is Hyro's Broke Shot. XD


Anyway, I was thinking that I would add this strange Dair thing into the thread somewhere as a random trick or something. I'll do more testing before I do of course, but does everyone agree that this needs to be in this thread somehow?

Edit: I found something else cool. Ok if you have two Toon's on a team on say Battlefield, you can Safe Spike at any percent. Say What?!? To be honest, it's better then a safe spike. Simply get Toon 1 to stand underneath one of the side platforms, get Toon 2 to stand on top, then Toon 2 does a Dair on the platform, Toon 1 SH's so he gets hit by the 5% randomness then Toon 1 hits Dair. Instant Safe Spike. And for all you people who think this would be too hard to pull off, I swear to you, it's insanely easy, it just takes a little team work. As I said, this can be done at any percent, from 0% all the way to 999% (you'd better make it up to 200% cause any more and you'll go flying off screen).
I love this move!

 

[ASF1nk]

yea.. I've done that too on BF to a Bowser, dair on platform while he was doing up special underneath me and he takes 5% and gets pushed off the stage immobilized.

Also I did something cool with BFO!
BFO momentum canceling, well it looked like it idk xD

 

[MJG]

@~mjg~: Yes, you definitely could use this strange hit box to to make Olimar do that. Only one problem, Olimar is too small for this to work on Battlefield. No worries, you can do it on Yoshi's Island Brawl, Pokemon Stadium, Pictochat and many more.

@DTL: I've also done this before but I never knew why it happend or how to do it. I'm glad I finally figured it out. So now the only thing I still don't understand is Hyro's Broke Shot. XD


Anyway, I was thinking that I would add this strange Dair thing into the thread somewhere as a random trick or something. I'll do more testing before I do of course, but does everyone agree that this needs to be in this thread somehow?

Edit: I found something else cool. Ok if you have two Toon's on a team on say Battlefield, you can Safe Spike at any percent. Say What?!? To be honest, it's better then a safe spike. Simply get Toon 1 to stand underneath one of the side platforms, get Toon 2 to stand on top, then Toon 2 does a Dair on the platform, Toon 1 SH's so he gets hit by the 5% randomness then Toon 1 hits Dair. Instant Safe Spike. And for all you people who think this would be too hard to pull off, I swear to you, it's insanely easy, it just takes a little team work. As I said, this can be done at any percent, from 0% all the way to 999% (you'd better make it up to 200% cause any more and you'll go flying off screen).
I love this move!

SOunds pretty good. Seems more situational than anything since you wont really be trying to set it up. It just happens if the players are in the appropriate spots and they click/connect with each other.

And yea...my friend fino and i tried to do it with olimar and he was too small D:

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

(btw, I finished all the colouring of the thread.)

@ASF1nk: BFO momentum canceling? That sounds awesome. How did you do it? I mean obviously you had a Bomb, you got hit and the backwards momentum of the hit made the BFO possible, but was there anything else to it? Did you jump or anything at any point?

@~mjg~: Yeah I thought Olimar would be too small. You should try making Olimar SH at the right time so you can push him in midair. I'm not sure, but I think that getting hit in midair has a greater effect then sliding along the ground. I'll check when I write it up. Actually I might write up a bit now, then add on to it as I do more testing. There's just too much to remember.

 

[MJG]

(btw, I finished all the colouring of the thread.)

@ASF1nk: BFO momentum canceling? That sounds awesome. How did you do it? I mean obviously you had a Bomb, you got hit and the backwards momentum of the hit made the BFO possible, but was there anything else to it? Did you jump or anything at any point?

@~mjg~: Yeah I thought Olimar would be too small. You should try making Olimar SH at the right time so you can push him in midair. I'm not sure, but I think that getting hit in midair has a greater effect then sliding along the ground. I'll check when I write it up. Actually I might write up a bit now, then add on to it as I do more testing. There's just too much to remember.

Ok cool thanks.

Im currently in texas otherwise i would try to test it out myself since i am probably going to Oh Snap 5 and any thing to help Fino and I in teams would be awesome

 

[Richard7]

Rofl.

TL is too OP.

 

[MJG]

Rofl.

TL is too OP.

uh...thanks? @.@

Definitely not true and very irrelevant

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

@~mjg~: I finished the level specifics for the shorter characters like Olimar, so hopefully it will help you. Just keep in mind that Olimar is slightly taller then Pikachu (which is who I tested the smaller characters with) so you might need to compensate for that. But other then that, it should be pretty accurate.
I'll finish the rest of it tomorrow.


(What is with all the pointless posts lately.....)

 

[ASF1nk]

@ASF1nk: BFO momentum canceling? That sounds awesome. How did you do it? I mean obviously you had a Bomb, you got hit and the backwards momentum of the hit made the BFO possible, but was there anything else to it? Did you jump or anything at any point?

Err.. well I did BFO with Fair no jump.

Here's the video of when it happened, you can't really see it, but you can hear it.

0:20
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mve3QlQiIP8

Also can you post video of the dair push? I wana see the safe spike

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Err.. well I did BFO with Fair no jump.

Here's the video of when it happened, you can't really see it, but you can hear it.

0:20
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mve3QlQiIP8

Also can you post video of the dair push? I wana see the safe spike

I see what you mean. It's hard to tell. I'll have a look into it maybe tomorrow. You should also test this yourself just incase I miss something.
What did you use to DI and what did you use to throw and catch the Bomb?

Also, I can't make videos. So unless someone else does, you'll just have to do it yourself if you want to see the strange Safe Spike.

 

[ASF1nk]

I see what you mean. It's hard to tell. I'll have a look into it maybe tomorrow. You should also test this yourself just incase I miss something.
What did you use to DI and what did you use to throw and catch the Bomb?

Also, I can't make videos. So unless someone else does, you'll just have to do it yourself if you want to see the strange Safe Spike.

I used c-stick most likely and DI, also idk how to test it, I tried testing it with other bombs on practice mode, but they explode the bomb, and I don't have anyone to test it with, any suggestions?

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Well what I do when my bro isn't around is I get two controlers, go into training mode, P1 chooses like DK or Ganon or whatever and get the computer to choose Toon. Then I go onto a largish stage so I can see what I'm doing, I put the computer (Toon) on to control and I get two computers. I put the the new computer on the opposite side of the stage so I can see what I'm doing, I set the computer percentage to 150ish% then it's simply a matter of holding P2's controler (Toon) and making P1 hit me from the exact same spot on the exact same percent to the other side of the stage and in this case, do the BFO and see if it works better then normal DI.

Yes?

I'm sure you'll be right.

 

[ASF1nk]

So I have to grab a bomb with TL, and smash with P1 (DK) and I need to get P2's controller fast enough to DI and BFO. >.< wow I can try it but I think someone with a partner should test it too. I also have the feeling this is situational or just for specific smashes or killing moves not sure yet.

 

[MJG]

@~mjg~: I finished the level specifics for the shorter characters like Olimar, so hopefully it will help you. Just keep in mind that Olimar is slightly taller then Pikachu (which is who I tested the smaller characters with) so you might need to compensate for that. But other then that, it should be pretty accurate.
I'll finish the rest of it tomorrow.


(What is with all the pointless posts lately.....)

Alright cool. Thanks man. The tl boards seems really dead lately

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

@ASF1nk: I tested it and it doesn't seem to make any difference. You might find something different, but from what I could see, it has no brake properties. Also like you said, even if this did work, it would only work for some smashes because you have to be hit more horizontally in order to re-catch the bomb. Also, there's no guarantee that you won't drop the Bomb as soon as you're hit. But no matter, thanks for letting me know. I can see why you thought something may have happened in that vid, so thanks for bringing it to my attention.

 

[ASF1nk]

@ASF1nk: I tested it and it doesn't seem to make any difference. You might find something different, but from what I could see, it has no brake properties. Also like you said, even if this did work, it would only work for some smashes because you have to be hit more horizontally in order to re-catch the bomb. Also, there's no guarantee that you won't drop the Bomb as soon as you're hit. But no matter, thanks for letting me know. I can see why you thought something may have happened in that vid, so thanks for bringing it to my attention.

OK so I noticed I didn't rly use the c-sitck I caught it with zair then I did fair, but anyways I tested it and it is difficult to pull off, basically u have to wait to slow down to do it, if done sooner the hookshot comes out, and yes the bomb explodes if you're too close, but I did found it to have some stopping properties, but useless, you have a better chance just DIing and using an arial, even though I couldn't duplicate what I did in the video I guess I just got lucky.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Well that changes things. So you didn't use the C-stick at all? I'll try again. This time I'll try different methods for throwing and catching and I'll see if I can make it work. Even if you don't think it's worth looking into, we might as well find out how to do it. And you never know, it just might be useful.

 

[Richard7]

Definitely not true and very irrelevant

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AU99xfDRhS8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5M0kP8hPfk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAfKhdUQwSc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qKbLRmParw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHtHcjKNWXo

 

[ASF1nk]

Well that changes things. So you didn't use the C-stick at all? I'll try again. This time I'll try different methods for throwing and catching and I'll see if I can make it work. Even if you don't think it's worth looking into, we might as well find out how to do it. And you never know, it just might be useful.

Well by looking at the replay I noticed that after the fair I was facing the stage, so if I had done BFO with fair I would of been facing away from the stage, so what I did was threw the bomb, caught it with zair and immediately did and fair, no jump.

 

[demonictoonlink]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AU99xfDRhS8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5M0kP8hPfk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAfKhdUQwSc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qKbLRmParw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHtHcjKNWXo

Fail troll is fail

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Thank you so much DTL! I was hoping I wouldn't have to say something like that myself.

@ASF1nk: I'll try that hopefully tomorrow and I'll tell you if I find anything.

 

[MJG]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AU99xfDRhS8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5M0kP8hPfk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAfKhdUQwSc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qKbLRmParw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHtHcjKNWXo

Wow...gtfo >.>

 

[oh_dr_where_art_thou]

Thank you so much for this guide!
I'm just starting to learn more about Tink, and this thread is pretty much all I need :D

One question, tho. Are all of you guys playing with the standard setting for the controls?
Because, I recently turned off the jump with the control stick so that I can up-A easier;
but now I'm not sure if this hinders some of the techniques... I think it does... :/

 

[MJG]

Thank you so much for this guide!
I'm just starting to learn more about Tink, and this thread is pretty much all I need :D

One question, tho. Are all of you guys playing with the standard setting for the controls?
Because, I recently turned off the jump with the control stick so that I can up-A easier;
but now I'm not sure if this hinders some of the techniques... I think it does... :/

My tap jump is off as well and my "R" button is set to jump for when i need to DI out of a multi hitting move.

Other than that, all of my other settings are the same.

I have a tag set just for B sticking when using snake/lucas.

 

[fezzmaster]

my tap jump is off my L button is jump my X button is grab.

L button for jump makes JC and SHDA way easier for me and X as grab makes Zair-ing way easier to.