Project Mewtwo

[colored blind]

It'd be possible. They made Roy's slashes red instead of Marth's blue.

 

[Seikishidan Soru]

It's just wrong that you can just heal instantaneously, no matter the risks. Direct healing should ONLY be possible with items on. It's broken because no other character can just heal themselves on the spot like that.

Healing never broke Yoshimitsu in any iteration of Tekken or SoulCalibur as far as I know.

Though it works for him because no matter which game, Yoshimitsu's strength lies in close range combat, and healing is a kind of last resort option to force the opponent into closing in. Mewtwo isn't exactly that kind of character.

That said, even recovering up to something like 9 or 10% after a KO or 2 to 3% here and there after sending an opponent off stage/far enough doesn't seem broken to me, as it comes at the expense of positioning/edgeguarding/follow-ups. The key is the healing rate here really.

15 is like a smash attack...

i say it should heal very slowly, have at least 1-2 sec of end lag, and you take extra damage if you get hit when you're using it

I agree with this. Heh... if you ask me, counter hits should apply in general, not just in that particular case... which makes me wonder if the issue has been discussed before, but I guess that's for another thread.

 

[jalued]

Healing never broke Yoshimitsu in any iteration of Tekken or SoulCalibur as far as I know.

Though it works for him because no matter which game, Yoshimitsu's strength lies in close range combat, and healing is a kind of last resort option to force the opponent into closing in. Mewtwo isn't exactly that kind of character.

That said, even recovering up to something like 9 or 10% after a KO or 2 to 3% here and there after sending an opponent off stage/far enough doesn't seem broken to me, as it comes at the expense of positioning/edgeguarding/follow-ups. The key is the healing rate here really.



I agree with this. Heh... if you ask me, counter hits should apply in general, not just in that particular case... which makes me wonder if the issue has been discussed before, but I guess that's for another thread.

hmm i prefer the reflector idea i guess, but could make it so that a FEW moves have healing properties, say heals 1% if it hits the opponent. would just be nice to get recovery in there since its one of his main moves in pokemon

maybe give shadowclaw (just casue its the coolest move ever), his B move, his fsmash and something else healing ability (not things like nair as that would just be spamable). the move would HAVE to hit to inflict damage though

 

[stingers]

i saw some bad ideas while I was gone

1. Mewtwo having a reflector isn't that great of an idea, tbqh. It'd be nice, but his character really doesn't need a reflector. The "reflector" he had in Melee was just there for mindgames...and to be quite honest it usually worked, no matter how good my opponent was. It's instinct to shield if you see your own projectile coming back at you, I guess. At any rate, Mewtwo wasn't designed to be such a defensive character that he'd have a reflector. He was designed to be disorienting, so that fighting Mewtwo would be a different experience from fighting any other character. It's the reason that his Up-b and Airdodge go invisible so you can't tell where he'll end up, his side B doesn't ACTUALLY reflect projectiles, his fully charged Shadow Ball wobbles up and down after you shoot it, etc. He's supposed to psyche you out, get inside your head. That's the reason he's a psychic type . To that end...

2. Healing damage sounds like a ****ing awesome ide. Something like that could really differentiate him from the rest of the cast, and I can think of a few ways that something like that could be done.

- Make it a charge move, like DK's Punch or Samus' Charge Shot. Each Charge heals 1%, and you can hold 10 charges and unleash it whenever you want. I wouldn't really give it too much ending lag, but make it like the other charge moves (besides Lucarios) so that you can't charge it in the air. Otherwise, people would run offstage, charge it, and go back to the stage with Mewtwo's awesome recovery. Yay even more camping in Brawl :x

- Make it heal 1% every 30 frames (aka 2% a second) and it's only activated while you're holding down the button. Give this a fair amount of startup time, but not too much ending lag. This would be a nice move to force ppl to approach =) Mewtwo's approach game will probably be pretty weak without wavedashing so this would be nice too.

 

[jalued]

i saw some bad ideas while I was gone

1. Mewtwo having a reflector isn't that great of an idea, tbqh. It'd be nice, but his character really doesn't need a reflector. The "reflector" he had in Melee was just there for mindgames...and to be quite honest it usually worked, no matter how good my opponent was. It's instinct to shield if you see your own projectile coming back at you, I guess. At any rate, Mewtwo wasn't designed to be such a defensive character that he'd have a reflector. He was designed to be disorienting, so that fighting Mewtwo would be a different experience from fighting any other character. It's the reason that his Up-b and Airdodge go invisible so you can't tell where he'll end up, his side B doesn't ACTUALLY reflect projectiles, his fully charged Shadow Ball wobbles up and down after you shoot it, etc. He's supposed to psyche you out, get inside your head. That's the reason he's a psychic type . To that end...

2. Healing damage sounds like a ****ing awesome ide. Something like that could really differentiate him from the rest of the cast, and I can think of a few ways that something like that could be done.

- Make it a charge move, like DK's Punch or Samus' Charge Shot. Each Charge heals 1%, and you can hold 10 charges and unleash it whenever you want. I wouldn't really give it too much ending lag, but make it like the other charge moves (besides Lucarios) so that you can't charge it in the air. Otherwise, people would run offstage, charge it, and go back to the stage with Mewtwo's awesome recovery. Yay even more camping in Brawl :x

- Make it heal 1% every 30 frames (aka 2% a second) and it's only activated while you're holding down the button. Give this a fair amount of startup time, but not too much ending lag. This would be a nice move to force ppl to approach =) Mewtwo's approach game will probably be pretty weak without wavedashing so this would be nice too.

not sure, sounds like a bit of a waste of a move though. and i guess ur right about mew2 not needing a shield. but i feel that alot of mew2 is about thinking outside the box (since in melee he was such a strange and diverse character). so we have swift for his fthrow, and disable is possible... what else???

what about some form of amnesia?? say that it takes a time to charge it and it increases his damage output by 50% or something, but also increases damage taken from opponenets by 50%. make it last about a minute or so. would be very interersting to try

the other way wouldnt work as then he would be able to do stupid combos such as uptilt uptilt (yeah i know amnesia raises special def, im sorry - double edge would fit though kinda )

 

[stingers]

swift for fthrow? wont that be the same thing as shadowballs except...star shaped?

unless you plan on programming it somehow that it chases down the opponent like the real swift does (IIRC, it never misses in the games), i dont know what the purpose of that is

 

[bobson]

unless you plan on programming it somehow that it chases down the opponent like the real swift does (IIRC, it never misses in the games), i dont know what the purpose of that is

We could theoretically borrow scripts from Samus' homing missiles to do that.
And it would be pretty awesome.

 

[stingers]

you'd have to make sure it like...CHASES. homing missiles are just like..."hey...i'll go in the general direction of that dude over there...very slowly..."

 

[jalued]

swift for fthrow? wont that be the same thing as shadowballs except...star shaped?

unless you plan on programming it somehow that it chases down the opponent like the real swift does (IIRC, it never misses in the games), i dont know what the purpose of that is

no no lol, i meant as it has the swift animation, but the 3 stars do 4-5% damage each but have no KB, so u cant DI out of them lol. imagine fox's back and upthrow but with stars. maybe make it so each one does something like 6-7% each, but go at different angles, so its hard to dodge them all with DI. would just be a nice visual thing for mew2 lol

 

[stingers]

just because they don't have KB doesn't mean you can't DI them...unless you plan on making them have no stun as well, like fox's lasers. that seems pretty silly though...

 

[jalued]

just because they don't have KB doesn't mean you can't DI them...unless you plan on making them have no stun as well, like fox's lasers. that seems pretty silly though...

why? not all moves have to be amazingly good lol, look at marios dtilt or jiggz sing. It would suit the character perfectly, and i do think u should be able to DI then i guess lol, but maybe make all the stars come out a few frames apart, so if u DI badly, u take like 20% damage lol

 

[stingers]

every move should have a use...just ask sirlin...lol. a competitive game should never limit the options of its characters by making moves useless. thats why we have brawl+ =). (but jiggs' sing does have a use. ledgecanceled sing is legit.)

if you really want to put swift in fthrow, make it like homing missile so it's true to the games, make it do like 3% a star and give it 3 stars. make normal fthrow do like 8 damage, so if all stars hit it'll do 17% which isn't that big a deal.

 

[jalued]

every move should have a use...just ask sirlin...lol. a competitive game should never limit the options of its characters by making moves useless. thats why we have brawl+ =). (but jiggs' sing does have a use. ledgecanceled sing is legit.)

if you really want to put swift in fthrow, make it like homing missile so it's true to the games, make it do like 3% a star and give it 3 stars. make normal fthrow do like 8 damage, so if all stars hit it'll do 17% which isn't that big a deal.

yeah ok, that'll work lol make the normal fthrow do 5% though, seems like alot to do 17%

 

[stingers]

the 17% isn't guaranteed, is the thing

 

[SymphonicSage12]

lovin' the swift fthrow idea.


And for Confusion, I think the best solution would to make it trip on the ground, and make it a very weak meteor smash (a'la pitfall) effect in the air.

 

[jalued]

the 17% isn't guaranteed, is the thing

why not? im they all home, then surely u cant DI away

 

[Lucina Clash]

I just discovered what Mewtwo's side + B does is put the character into his or her spinning animation (the animation in which one can tech once the ground is struck). It is first sped up and after it is done the character can do whatever to get out of the spinning.

Here is my idea:

Have that happen, but have it be like the Flame Choke and force them o be on the groudn so Mewtwo can do a forward tilt or something of that like.

As for the forward throw, take the one that Fox and Falco have and, if possible, replace the lasers with Aura Spheres and have the animation slow

 

[SymphonicSage12]

Or you can just run away from the stars lol


But yeah, two solutions here:

1.Make the stars home in, but lower the damage of the throw itself

2.Don't make the stars home in, but make the basic grab do more damage.

I would prefer option number one here.

 

[jalued]

I just discovered what Mewtwo's side + B does is put the character into his or her spinning animation (the animation in which one can tech once the ground is struck). It is first sped up and after it is done the character can do whatever to get out of the spinning.

Here is my idea:

Have that happen, but have it be like the Flame Choke and force them o be on the groudn so Mewtwo can do a forward tilt or something of that like.

As for the forward throw, take the one that Fox and Falco have and, if possible, replace the lasers with Aura Spheres and have the animation slow

u cant use fox or falcons bthrow for the animation surely? cause then they turn round. plus the swift idea is cooler lol

Or you can just run away from the stars lol


But yeah, two solutions here:

1.Make the stars home in, but lower the damage of the throw itself

2.Don't make the stars home in, but make the basic grab do more damage.

I would prefer option number one here.

yeah i like the first idea more too, fits to the swift move perfectly.

 

[Trillion]

I know very very little about the home brew channel, modding, and programming in general so excuse me if this sounds stupid, but I had a though that I wanted to share. Mewtwo's dimensions and character frame and colors could be based off of the Mewtwo trophy. That way you know that his arms and legs and stuff will be proportional to what they should be. That is, if you aren't restricted to just using a character frame that already exists.

 

[SymphonicSage12]

I don't know how that would work, but it's worth a shot. hehe. :D

 

[stingers]

i think we already considered using his model from the trophy earlier but we never really got into it

i don't know much about model hacking either, someone like pharrox would be good to have for that info

 

[SymphonicSage12]

Well couldn't you get into it, then? I mean it's worth a shot.

 

[MaxThunder]

the trophy does have a model... so it might be possible to animate it... maybe change a little on it in case the throphy stand come whith him... that would look really stupid... but then someone would have to animate him...

 

[Dillo64]

I just want to say that I'm glad someone is taking the initiative for this project. Mewtwo was my main since Melee came out and his absence in Brawl was a good part of the reason I stopped playing(couldn't find a character I really liked). So I'm really looking forward to this.

I don't know much about hackin's, but I'll offer some of my input.


For his Down+B, I know its possible to add fire/lightning/darkness affects to moves that don't normally have them, but is it possible to add status effects like flower and stun? If so, you could just use a short-ranged attack like Lucas' down+B and give it the stun effect, and speed up the animation to replicate the Disable. Maybe make the hitbox bigger to give it more range.

Another idea would be to have Mario's Cape as a side+B, but just make the cape invisible, or maybe make it transparent(Light Screen!). On contact with another player and it would send them into the "tumble" animation and spike them(as its been discussed) and on projectiles it would reflect them. Though that's probably asking to much, but one thing that really disappointed me about Mewtwo in Melee was that he couldn't actually reflect projectiles, just deflect. If and when Confusion is implemented, it should be able to fully reflect shots like it should've.

Also, I don't think he should be buffed in many areas, though I think having a game-changer would be neat. If you want something that will make him better/give more strategies: no lag/paralysis after Teleporting. Who knows what kind of combos can be had.

 

[jalued]

I just want to say that I'm glad someone is taking the initiative for this project. Mewtwo was my main since Melee came out and his absence in Brawl was a good part of the reason I stopped playing(couldn't find a character I really liked). So I'm really looking forward to this.

I don't know much about hackin's, but I'll offer some of my input.


For his Down+B, I know its possible to add fire/lightning/darkness affects to moves that don't normally have them, but is it possible to add status effects like flower and stun? If so, you could just use a short-ranged attack like Lucas' down+B and give it the stun effect, and speed up the animation to replicate the Disable. Maybe make the hitbox bigger to give it more range.

Another idea would be to have Mario's Cape as a side+B, but just make the cape invisible, or maybe make it transparent(Light Screen!). On contact with another player and it would send them into the "tumble" animation and spike them(as its been discussed) and on projectiles it would reflect them. Though that's probably asking to much, but one thing that really disappointed me about Mewtwo in Melee was that he couldn't actually reflect projectiles, just deflect. If and when Confusion is implemented, it should be able to fully reflect shots like it should've.

Also, I don't think he should be buffed in many areas, though I think having a game-changer would be neat. If you want something that will make him better/give more strategies: no lag/paralysis after Teleporting. Who knows what kind of combos can be had.

i think the general idea for disable is that it will use the stun animation from ZSS and the effect of the deku nut which stuns

 

[colored blind]

Also, I don't think he should be buffed in many areas, though I think having a game-changer would be neat. If you want something that will make him better/give more strategies: no lag/paralysis after Teleporting. Who knows what kind of combos can be had.

I had this idea earlier, but kept forgetting about it when I posted...It'd be crazy awesome to have someone who has teleporting as a significant portion of their gameplay, like Bison/Dictator from Street Fighter. No freefall after teleport, like Lucario's Extremespeed would radically shift his gameplay while keeping in Mewtwo's unorthodox style.

 

[Shadowmaster9000]

When Mewtwo performs his final smash, make the background sparkly multi-coloured rapid water ripple.

Now THAT would be disorienting... >______>

Or if you wanted to be really evil, give Mewtwo an attack that turns the stage upside down like Palkia.

 

[Boo Mansion]

Everyone is in agreement to having Mewtwo not go into freefall after using his up+b, yes? Just like how Lucario doesn't in Brawl+. I think it would help make Teleport even more useful for mindgames.

 

[MaxThunder]

and he should also be able to up-b twice if starting from the ground... also like lucario...

 

[SymphonicSage12]

lol. But I like the idea of no freefall-teleport. Lol Imagine no free-fall teleport+ airdodge (assuming melee airddodge is on, that would be like RIDICULOUS recovery. O_O)

 

[Boo Mansion]

and he should also be able to up-b twice if starting from the ground... also like lucario...

I agree with that too.

 

[MaxThunder]

...for his airdodge... he should just get invisible(like his melee melee airdodge...but whith a brawl airdidge...)... he's kinda not the type to havea dodging animation... and it would be really cool and continuing his style=)

 

[Starphoenix]

A very ambitious endeavor, I really hope you all can succeed in accomplishing this.

 

[SymphonicSage12]

<3 mewtwo. If this is not appropriate to post here, I don't know what is.

 

[The Immortal Sir NZ]

...for his airdodge... he should just get invisible(like his melee melee airdodge...but whith a brawl airdidge...)... he's kinda not the type to havea dodging animation... and it would be really cool and continuing his style=)

In Melee, you could direct the airdodge to go anyway you want correct?
This gave his air dodge a bit of unpredictablility.

In Brawl, the airdodge goes the way you were falling/DIing correct?
Being Invisible really wouldn't help because you still know where he's going to end up.
Sure it'll help a little bit, but it just won't have the mindgamey effect like it did in Melee.

And as for the Teleporting ideas, these sound great, it could easily become his go-to approach.

 

[SymphonicSage12]

Yeah but he should still disappear for a bit just to keep it like melee (aka keep him unique)


and has anyone noticed in melee, when you had a fully charged shadow ball and you airdodged, the purple glow is still there? So when he airdodges it's like a purpley ghostly glow. :D

 

[MaxThunder]

it'd be really cool if we could do that...

 

[bleyva]

mewtwo's final smash should be a purple landmaster :3

 

[BG3]

This has to be one of the greatest projects to ever take on and start. Many people have wanted this to happen. Kudos to you.