Don't use Lucas (or Ness) in tournaments

[Banjodorf]

M2K already said that the Back room is not going to ban it.

Well, ya never do know, they can change their mind.

 

[thesage]

Doesn't matter what the backroom says. It's the opinion of tournament hosts that decide. Backroom can only suggest rules. Considering how my area treated wobbling, I'm not that worried about it, but still... I mean the tier list will be so different. This is like the first time I can think of a single technique that makes 2 characters completely unplayable. It's impossible to main Ness now as you'll always have to switch characters if you win the first match cuz they can just pick Marth and win.

 

[NESSBOUNDER]

Well I think the tiers concerning Ness and Lucas are odd. If the chain grab is banned, they'll remain low tier, but they aren't REALLY low tier because of how well they perform without the chain grab to worry about.

 

[hoopspr226]

My post from another thread: come someone confirm/debunk this? It could be groundbreaking. My apologies if this has been discussed already, just trying to contribute lol.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ran Iji View Post
Lucas can DI back and do a Jab to get out at around ~50%. Ness has yet to gain a strategy to get out aside from perfectly inputing the escape command to do a hop out of the grab, rather than a slide.
If this is true (I'm guessing it's not or else a big deal would have been made about this already) then this is incredible news for Lucas mains.

If Lucas can always DI backwards into a jab at 50%, that means he can DI backwards into a spotdodge as well. As far as I know, any time you can jab you can spot dodge.

Therefore, if the first statement is true, the chaingrab won't work on Lucas past 50% and is not that big a handicap at all.

 

[Tyr_03]

^^^
Test at 1/4 speed to be sure. I have a sinking feeling this information is due to human error.

 

[thesage]

Yeah it's definitely human error lol. I just tested it >_>;

 

[C.S. Dinah]

My thoughts on being good w/ Lucus were killed just now!

Lucus mainers It seems that your just going to have to make it work!

 

[NESSBOUNDER]

I wish more people would look at my updated chain grab list. Seriously guys, LUCAS ISN'T DONE FOR JUST YET!!

 

[Shibby]

LUCAS ISN'T DONE FOR JUST YET!!

*follows NessBounder to the Lucario forums*

 

[PrivateRolf]

Remember, remember, PK Fire Wavebouncing and PK Thunder are your best friends.

Why?
Because then it makes you harder to be grabbed.

While Lucas (haven't played Ness a whole lot) has a lot of decent close range attacks, the best thing IMO is to rack up a bit of damage, then go in with your close attacks. Avoid attacking opponents with full shields. Try fakeouts to try and wear down their shields before going in with close range attacks.

 

[Hax]

ugh.. such few good posts in this thread i swear lol. honestly this technique is ret@rded, but i've never believed in banning techniques from games. i thought wobbling in melee was stupid and really irritating but i figured banning it would only lead to more fights so i figured games should be left the way they were made (even if it means stupid **** like this exists). honestly if this game gets patched so ness and lucas don't have such bigass heads the whole cast can grab from a mile away... great - then 2 characters wouldn't be ****ing obsolete. but honestly this is just stupid and knowing nintendo this game will be left the way it is.

oh yeah and what really pisses me off is that everyone who knows me knows that i miss melee and loved how much tech skill was involved in that game which is why i actually was really interested in maining lucas (esp. cuz maining snake can get boring when everyone else is doing the same **** lol) but now that him and ness are the worst characters in the game... **** that. it makes me wonder if nintendo actually tests their games before they put them on the market.

EDIT: oh yeah guys and before you go doubting this technique.. this is cort you are talking to lol. but considering smashboards is 99% noobs nowadays cort probably isn't well-known anymore. in conclusion.. cort knows his ****

 

[Levitas]

um, Hax, that was a surprisingly uninformed post. We know Cort, we know how devastating this technique is, but it's really only match determining for marth. Ness has it far worse off, where marth doesn't even need to dashgrab. Lucas is still undoubtedly only useful as a counterpick in competitive play (if you're picking intelligently), but this doesn't make Lucas and Ness the worst in the game.

Is bowser the worst because Dedede has an infinite on him? Furthermore, the infinite starts the same way and is even easier to pull off.

Oh, and there are 9 pages of noobs and non noobs NOT doubting this technique. Please don't go around making generalizations about the people trying to independently research the limits of this crap technique.

And you should know how unlikely it is that a new version would patch this particular technique. lol @ taking out flame cancelling in melee, it was obviously a broken techique.

 

[robosteven]

I'm probably completely wrong in this, but with Ness at least, when playing against Marth, if they have the idea of trying to pull off the infinite grab against me, that means they won't throw, right?

Has anybody tried just bashing x and y to kinda..."float" out of the jump?

Have no idea if it works with Lucas as well, but it SEEMS pretty freaking easy to "jump" out of it, at least for me. Like I said. x and y buttons.

 

[BacklashMarth]

lol. This infinite is good stuff. The controversy it brings up is interesting to watch, and be a part of. On one hand, i sorta wish i could know what my opponent would try to do against me (Marths are always gonna try to get a grab in with his pitiful grab range). That way, i beat their only advantage and they're done for. On the other hand, its gotta suck to lose a tornament just because you made a miniscule error. Marth makes a mistake, he loses a stock. Ness or lucas makes a mistake, they lose the match.

 

[Tyr_03]

This thread should die or be locked. It's doing nothing but killing the Lucas board and sparking idiotic arguments, many of which involve a good amount of misinformation. We know what it is now, we know it's here to stay, it's time to move on. Thank you to Cort for bringing it to our attention. The thread is now outdated. We'll include the information in one of the many stickies as something to watch out for. Motion for lock.

 

[Levitas]

Third that.

 

[Hax]

um, Hax, that was a surprisingly uninformed post. We know Cort, we know how devastating this technique is, but it's really only match determining for marth. Ness has it far worse off, where marth doesn't even need to dashgrab. Lucas is still undoubtedly only useful as a counterpick in competitive play (if you're picking intelligently), but this doesn't make Lucas and Ness the worst in the game.

Is bowser the worst because Dedede has an infinite on him? Furthermore, the infinite starts the same way and is even easier to pull off.

Oh, and there are 9 pages of noobs and non noobs NOT doubting this technique. Please don't go around making generalizations about the people trying to independently research the limits of this crap technique.

And you should know how unlikely it is that a new version would patch this particular technique. lol @ taking out flame cancelling in melee, it was obviously a broken techique.

i have read some of the pages in this thread and i've watched a vid of you play from the lucas video thread and it's pretty obvious that you aren't one of the noobs lol, i'm just saying smashboards has gone down since brawl

but anyway, if you guys want something informative.. here:
the ONLY ONLY ONLY way i can think of 'getting out' of this would be to sorta trick your opponent by delaying yourself from breaking out of their grab. yes, you will take more damage, but if you don't try to wiggle out of their grab immediately it can mess up their timing - especially since they only have a few frames to regrab you.

alright so that's it. IMO it's pretty obvious but who knows.. maybe i could help some people out there.

 

[bceagles]

I'm sorry for bumping... but Cort is a ******. I sub-main Lucas... I've gotten far in all Eastern Tourneys in which i have played (14 in fact). When people do that... you can still excape. Just use the advice above...

Ugh... this is why I left smashboards.com... the only reason I'm here is because a link on another website (name not disclosed...) saying that "This ****** Should Be Banned" and showed this link. Hence the fact I called you a ******. I also left here cuz some loser kept saying I sucked because I liked Brawl more than Melee (i was teh awesomez in melee), and that I couldn't beat the person to save my life. I challenged him - of couse I won.

 

[Tyr_03]

Great story...good job bumping the thread that we killed a long time ago. Oh and you provoked the OP so he'll probably come back and start it all over again...Great job. Last post. Let it die again. We've already addressed this numerous times and you can find information on it in the stickies.

Thank you again for not posting on this thread.

 

[Cort]

I'm sorry for bumping... but Cort is a ******. I sub-main Lucas... I've gotten far in all Eastern Tourneys in which i have played (14 in fact). When people do that... you can still excape. Just use the advice above...

Ugh... this is why I left smashboards.com... the only reason I'm here is because a link on another website (name not disclosed...) saying that "This ****** Should Be Banned" and showed this link. Hence the fact I called you a ******. I also left here cuz some loser kept saying I sucked because I liked Brawl more than Melee (i was teh awesomez in melee), and that I couldn't beat the person to save my life. I challenged him - of couse I won.

This quote speaks for itself.

I love dash regrabbing Lucas across the stage with Wario because with each grab attack, he nails Lucas' nads, and the look on his face is priceless when you pause it.

Then when you get to the end of the stage you fsmash.

And he can't do anything about it.

 

[Morrigan]

lol. your sig is gay

 

[Youko]

If it's dead, then I'll just close it so people don't bump MONTH-OLD THREADS.