Why did everyone drop Greninja

[David Galanos]

Literally half the Greninja mains vanished the day he got nerfed, and he actually needed the usmash nerf. Some of it was unnecessary but he is still an amazing character. He can still combo really well and he can still kill early. His up air still kills, all his smash attacks, and F-air does too. I don't see why everyone stopped using him, seriously. If you kept using him for more than 30 minutes you would get used to the changes and start doing well again. To anyone who didn't use Greninja enough and dropped him I encourage you to start using him again, and then decide whether you wanna drop him or not. He isn't mid tier, he is still top 10 imo.

 

[Orngeblu]

I don't really visit the Greninja boards, so I didn't know about this. I still play him, though. He is and always will be my main.

Yeah, his Usmash had a really stupid amount of priority. I actually have to be more wary of using it from now it.

 

[Shack]

I want to main him, but he already struggled to get kills. It just makes no sense, he is one of the fastest in the game, yet all his smashes, fair and nair have start up lag/wind ups that make them easy to see coming. Shurikens were a good set up because you could chase behind a fully charged one. He was already hovering around mid-top tier compared to other characters and these nerfs kind of solidified him to mid. It just feels like everything that made him unique and fun got dropped. Hydro Pump, Fast Fall SS, WS follow ups, etc.

I would love to play him more and still am trying to make him work, but it's just no where near as fun or effective as before. If you have any strategies or ideas please share them because right now I am struggling to continue using him over Sheik.

 

[David Galanos]

I want to main him, but he already struggled to get kills. It just makes no sense, he is one of the fastest in the game, yet all his smashes, fair and nair have start up lag/wind ups that make them easy to see coming. Shurikens were a good set up because you could chase behind a fully charged one. He was already hovering around mid-top tier compared to other characters and these nerfs kind of solidified him to mid. It just feels like everything that made him unique and fun got dropped. Hydro Pump, Fast Fall SS, WS follow ups, etc.

I would love to play him more and still am trying to make him work, but it's just no where near as fun or effective as before. If you have any strategies or ideas please share them because right now I am struggling to continue using him over Sheik.

It kinda just takes time to get used to. I still use shuriken to go into a grab a lot, and I follow up a fully charged one with a F-air all the time. Greninja isn't as good as Sheik, but I have way more fun using him (I mained Sheik in past games). He still has great combos like, Down tilt to Dash attack to F-air to Usmash to possible up air. Just fun stuff like that. He still has really fast smash attacks, just down smash is a little slow. Try setting up your smash attacks, like down tilt to a quick running up smash, or dash attack to running upsmash, or jab, jab to f-smash, stuff like that. Idk I just like his little combos and stuff, like dash attack to F-air, down air to back air or F-air, I just find him really fun to use still, I've also spent a crap ton of time on this character tho.

 

[Shack]

It kinda just takes time to get used to. I still use shuriken to go into a grab a lot, and I follow up a fully charged one with a F-air all the time. Greninja isn't as good as Sheik, but I have way more fun using him (I mained Sheik in past games). He still has great combos like, Down tilt to Dash attack to F-air to Usmash to possible up air. Just fun stuff like that. He still has really fast smash attacks, just down smash is a little slow. Try setting up your smash attacks, like down tilt to a quick running up smash, or dash attack to running upsmash, or jab, jab to f-smash, stuff like that. Idk I just like his little combos and stuff, like dash attack to F-air, down air to back air or F-air, I just find him really fun to use still, I've also spent a crap ton of time on this character tho.

Yeah maybe I will play around in training mode to explore more of the new changes. It is just frustrating because when compared to Fox, Metaknight, Sheik and Sonic, he just doesn't keep up. He is fast, but can't dominate the same way they do. He is almost more reaction based because of the start up on his moves and lack of a good nair (multihit/ long lasting hit box). His nair is useful and has good set ups, but it has low priority and only active for a few frames. With no doubt there will be good players with him, I think he just needs to excel in something because right now it feels like he only plays the speedy role half as good as others. I do like his bair though.

 

[momochuu]

how is his fsmash slow when you can punish jabs on reaction with it lol

also you're ****ing insane if you thought prepatch Greninja was mid tier

 

[momochuu]

Fox, Metaknight.

Yeah you're insane. Sorry.

 

[Meek Moths]

to be honest,i never met a :good: greninja player online. most of them are really predictable so i always rek them

but once i did meet a good one, i could tell he was experienced with the game and not some newbie, he won and then immediately left, no second match. tbh most of the time he just spammed up smash

 

[Shack]

Ah yes @ momochuu , very good point you made there. I never considered my sanity when stating my opinion. Please feel free to elaborate or offer some actual feedback other than attempted insults.

First, I did not only say FSmash. I said his NAir, FAir and Smashes (plural) all feel laggy compared to others.

Second, I said pre patch was mid-top (not mid). How is he not? Please tell me how he can dominate the same way that Rosalina, Yoshi, Sonic, Sheik etc can?

Third, you didn't say anything, just quoted Fox and Metaknight with no context... I am comparing Greninja to the other speedy characters in the game (I forgot to add Pikachu). All of them are fast and can stay on you while racking up damage and threatening to get you off the stage, Greninja does not do this as well as them and struggles even more with the recent nerfs.

So please feel free to provide some information I want Greninja to be better, he just feels weaker than the other speedy characters at this point. Please show some high level Greninja play from pre patch other than HP gimps and USmash spam.

 

[Gunla]

@ David Galanos
This discussion should go to the Patch Changes thread or the Social (as that's where most Greninja mains that frequent this board go to). I know some Greninja players in addition to myself; it's not that the Greninja mains have just all got up and disappeared, but some will move to other characters because they lose touch with a character.