Whats the deal!?

[Betrayed]

My hardest matchup with Marth is against Doc and Mario, are they supposed to be so hard to beat? ;_;

 

[ArcNatural]

Why do you have trouble against them?

 

[Rune]

All you need is good spacing, and these stubbies are doomed.

 

[lillight3]

you need to learn to sweet spot so you dont get caped

 

[Betrayed]

I rarely get caped actually...

I try to keep them away with double fairs and simple combos but when they get close it hurts... a lot...

 

[Klowne]

Do they Dsmash and spot dodge constantly?

 

[Cactuar]

you need to learn to sweet spot so you dont get caped

Cape can turn around a perfectly sweetspotted upb. The hitbox for both Mario and Doc's capes reach far below the edge of the stage.

 

[Betrayed]

Yeah...

He spot dodges a lot, and Marios is pretty quick, so they get in and grab me and it's not hard for Mario to combo Marth w/ proper DI (I'm bad at short-term DI)

Sometimes he'll approach me with shffl'd fair (which I usually don't get hit by, but either way) it leads to a down smash... and it's just a hassle to get back to the stage with him edgeguarding me.

Another problem, I have so much trouble KOing him unless I edgeguard really well, ken combo it or get a tipper at decent damage. He's getting too good at surviving ever since he started to practice DI after he saw how much it helped me.

Marios recovery seems so godlike sometimes. Tornado, Capes, Jump and I always underestimate that up-b, not to mention the fireball to try to stop me when I'm trying to knock him back out.

I've tried climbing back on stage from the edge to stop up-b but I usually still get hit and he still makes it. I dunno if my timing is just bad or I can't do that against Mario...

Most of his kills against me come from bairs while I'm trying to recover and not from actual smashes... which makes sense, as I recall Mario was a very combo-orentiated character with weak KO ability against most people.

 

[einthesuperdog]

Are you saving your jump when recovering? It'll help you to avoid him when he goes to bair you. You can also fair him as he approaches in that situation. I'm not a marth main, but I think you should be able to take care of his recovery with down tilts and dropping off the ledge into to a bair.

edit:
are you grabbing him much?

 

[jamminjohn]

It's very possible to climb up while Mario up Bs. It's actually pretty annoying for me since I'm a Doc player.

Try to limit your Fsmashes and you'll be fine. A missed smash triggers your opponent to attack.

Don't worry about being caped but it is possible since Marth's sword goes through the stage and the cape reaches below.

The best advice I can give you is to stay at tip range. Always be ready to wavedash backwards. Marth is a pain in the *** for Doc/Mario and even though I don't want to have another Marth kick my ***, it's always good to know the metagame.

 

[cmin]

dash dance through their spotdodge and grab them, then attempt a ken combo and if that fails, just wap them like m2k, and if that fails, just fmash them like drephen, and if that fails... it shouldnt, drephens fsmash are too good

 

[Betrayed]

I recently changed my recovery style to >b's before my jump, I never had before.

I grab when I can, I can't lead into combos out of them very easily though.

 

[Dreadlord Santa]

Nobody can. Except against Fox and Falco, there really aren't any guaranteed Marth combos out of a grab. They all rely on DI and tech flubbing, which is why I think people really overreact to his grab range. Sure, the grab has great range, but his throws all do sucky damage and have little combo ability. Still, I don't find the Marios to be too big a problem. Your sword goes through their projectiles like they're nothing, and they're relatively easy to kill thanks to their combination of being fairly light and having sucky recoveries. They can combo pretty well, yes, but they really have trouble getting the KOs. Just save your jump until you get close to the stage to have your best chance of thwarting their edgeguard attempts, and you should be fine; remember, that bair has barely any range, so it's easy enough to avoid with your side-B stalls and your second jump.

 

[Betrayed]

I'll play him Marth v Mario some more tomorrow and see how things go =P