What kind of pools format do you want at Apex?

[Han Solo]

http://smashboards.com/threads/a-question-to-all-you-melee-and-brawl-players-regarding-64.341546/

 

[The Star King]

Didn't Alex Strife say he won't do round robin pools?

 

[Han Solo]

Alex Strife said at Zenith that he felt it wouldn't be fair to Melee and Brawl players if we got RR pools and they got bracket pools.

 

[clubbadubba]

I said bracket pools, though I'm not opposed to either. I think it would be cool to win 1st in a bracket though, which is only possible in a bracket pool for nubs like me (and even then...). The big swing factor for me though was that as ballin pointed out, in round robin pools people can easily drop games to manipulate the pool. Bracket pool you can't afford to throw games nearly as much (possibilities, but not nearly as many).

At zenith, I brought a friend to the tournament, and if knitephox had beaten skyfire (lol infinite diablo), he would've made it out of pools over skyfire. Obviously not saying knitephox threw the game, but just an example of how easy it is to do. In bracket pools, the only way to be eliminated is to lose, not to watch someone else win.

 

[Vale]

As someone who has no idea how the event runs and won't be there, I think round robin pools is the best option. Bracket pools make sense for large tournaments with time constraints, but 64 should be comparatively short to Melee and Brawl. If the space for 64 is dedicated for 64, meaning that there won't be any need for them to switch them for gamecubes to speed things up, I don't see the problem. If it has to do with viewers on stream not wanting to watch 64, they could still do it and just not stream pools (if they even do that in the first place).

 

[Karajan]

If the bracket pools are double elimination its not much different than just having one big bracket.

 

[EggSelent]

I think we should do 9-ball but I'd be willing to play straight pool as well.

 

[Fireblaster]

If the bracket pools are double elimination its not much different than just having one big bracket.

This. I don't see how bracket pools allow weaker players to "get more matches in" when all it does is reseed the players at a certain point.

 

[SheerMadness]

Don't get your hopes up guys. There will probably be a big majority for round robin pools, BUT...

Nintendude is gonna do what he wants. Not what we want.

 

[Nintendude]

Don't get your hopes up guys. There will probably be a big majority for round robin pools, BUT...

Nintendude is gonna do what he wants. Not what we want.

I'm not going to do what I want either. If it were my tournament and my tournament alone I'd do round robin pools, but Apex staff collectively has decided on bracket pools.

 

[Han Solo]

Ultimately, it's up to Alex Strife. I just don't see why a tournament with 1/3 of the entrants as the other two games needs to have bracket pools. You can say you want the games to be treated equally, but they're not equal. More attention is given to the other two games, so why can't we get round robin pools to make up for that.

 

[Nintendude]

I mean you could argue that the schedule should take advantage of a tournament having less entrants by also having it finish sooner. I fully support bracket pools from a logistics / planning perspective.

Think of it this way - Apex has tournaments for like 10 different games. Let's say all of them are scheduled with the mentality you described above (less entrants = justification to use methods that take longer). How do you expect such an event to finish in a timely manner?

 

[SheerMadness]

It really doesn't seem like Strife cares AT ALL what ssb64 does with out rule format. He's let Nintendude ban hyrule and allow alternate input devices so I fail to see why he would care at all what type of pools we do.

He doesn't seem involved with our tourney at all. He just leaves it to Nintendude and chain-ace.

The only issue is if we were using TV's that brawl/melee needed. But we had our own TV's last year so I don't see why that would be an issue.

 

[clubbadubba]

Gah I'm so split on this.

On the one hand, bracket pools would make you feel in control of your own destiny because you know when you are on your last life. RR never creates that sense of urgency until the very last game. Bracket would undoubtedly be more hype as we would see early elimination matches between decent/good players. In RR pools, based on Zenith people don't know how important a match is until after the entire pool is finished. I'm not just talking about the players, I'm talking about commentators and therefore spectators as well. Theoretically people could figure out pool standings, but in practice that doesn't happen.

On the other hand, RR pools would obviously give lower level players more competitive games. It would also be more accurate in determining who gets out of pools as it won't be so dependent on who you face in bracket. And if we provide our own equipment like we usually do, its not like we would be taking resources from other games.

Really close call and I'm fine either way. Seems like Apex staff is calling the shots though so its out of our hands.

 

[Han Solo]

I mean you could argue that the schedule should take advantage of a tournament having less entrants by also having it finish sooner. I fully support bracket pools from a logistics / planning perspective.

Think of it this way - Apex has tournaments for like 10 different games. Let's say all of them are scheduled with the mentality you described above (less entrants = justification to use methods that take longer). How do you expect such an event to finish in a timely manner?

Are all 10 tournaments run on the same TVs and run by the same TOs? No. Tournaments can and do run in parallel. It's not going to take three days to run a 128-man tourney with one round of RR pools. Melee tourneys do that in one day.

 

[The Star King]

Don't get your hopes up guys. There will probably be a big majority for round robin pools, BUT...

Nintendude is gonna do what he wants. Not what we want.

You forgot to call him Hitler. 2/10

 

[Maliki]

The majority vote is on red robbin so far. But will that even make a difference to Alex or the TO's ?

 

[prisonchild]

with all the time we save on DL we could probably make a 128 man league with playoffs.

 

[Cobrevolution]

^10/10 post

 

[Maliki]

I think we should get TOs that are for the players decisions.

 

[thegreginator]

The majority vote is on red robbin so far. But will that even make a difference to Alex or the TO's ?

I definitely second Maliki's vote for red robin.

 

[clubbadubba]

with all the time we save on DL we could probably make a 128 man league with playoffs.

SSBL Season 3, The Reddest Robin

 

[B Link]

RR would not be good for me. My hands get tired after playing too many matches and I do worse. The less matches the better (I support Japan's single elimination ruleset)

Bracket pools is a nice balance between the two extremes, so I voted for that.

 

[Skrlx]

sgahshgshdshjgkyl;;ljhkljhggf;ujh

 

[KoRoBeNiKi]

RR would not be good for me. My hands get tired after playing too many matches and I do worse. The less matches the better (I support Japan's single elimination ruleset)

Bracket pools is a nice balance between the two extremes, so I voted for that.

As a KB user, my fingers/wrist are going to feel hilarious.

Bracket pools would only be fine if
A: top 4 got out
B: it was properly seeded.

 

[Komotonoto]

This **** better go through. I ain't goin to apex to finish a tourney and then have to watch other scrubs play.

 

[kys]

You forgot to call him Hitler. 2/10

Stop forcing Godwin's law, and let it come naturally.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law

 

[Dext3rM.]

i just dont want to play mariguas becuase he is from my city i guess japan also dont want to play each other until the final rounds same to brazil or any other country

 

[Maliki]

This **** better go through. I ain't goin to apex to finish a tourney and then have to watch other scrubs play.

Komos alive?

 

[clubbadubba]

i just dont want to play mariguas becuase he is from my city i guess japan also dont want to play each other until the final rounds same to brazil or any other country

They do a pretty good job of making sure you don't play people from your region in pools/early rounds of bracket for exactly this reason.

 

[Nintendude]

Yeah, there's a reason why when you register you are supposed to provide your country/state.

 

[Maliki]

Yeah i wouldn't want to be put into a bracket where I have to play tommy(standed) first round I play him all the time.

 

[mixa]

is that a no??????

 

[Cobrevolution]

if that's a no, straight bracket please.

 

[RickySSB]

no

^ That's a no.

 

[Han Solo]

Even though bracket pools are basically the same as having a full bracket, it'll be easier to seed pools then reseed to a smaller bracket than to seed a whole 128-man bracket. Also, telling "Pool X" to play at "TVs 1 and 2" is easier than telling every single player who they're playing.

Pools is the way to go for the number of entrants we're having. Round robin pools is just what everyone wants.

 

[Annex]

Let's say all of them are scheduled with the mentality you described above (less entrants = justification to use methods that take longer). How do you expect such an event to finish in a timely manner?

Came in here to pretty much post exactly that.

But honestly I don't care if it's a tournament or not, I just want to play against the best in the community, so my hope is people aren't sandbagging in friendlies...

 

[Han Solo]

How many setups would we need for 128 entrants?

We could do 16 pools of 8 people, two waves of pools (8 pools at 11am, 8 pools at 3pm or something), two setups per pool, meaning 16 tourney setups. We had around 16 setups last year, maybe more. Someone tell me how we CAN'T finish this in a timely manner.

 

[Cobrevolution]

should probably get that setup thread going again...

 

[Fireblaster]

I really don't understand Alex Strife. It has been shown and estimated that 64 can finish plenty on time even with round robin pools with the number of setups we have. Players from the other games have shown that they don't mind if 64 gets round robin pools and they don't as long as it doesn't affect other games. Does he have the intent of making the game finish in one day just to have it streamed at 9 AM on saturday morning this time?