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What if Diddy got buffs...

APlainOldBanana

Smash Cadet
Joined
Mar 28, 2015
Messages
36
Whenever the next balance patch comes out (if another balance patch comes out), would it be out of the question for Diddy to get buffs? Personally I think Diddy is fine as he is but I'm also fine with him getting buffs. MINOR buffs. If you want to see Diddy buffed next balance patch, what do you want to see buffed? The 1.0.8 nerf was kind of unnecessary as many of us will agree, so personally I'd like to have his Uair come out on frame 3 again. I'm fine with its kill power right now.
 

Sonicninja115

Experiment. Innovate. Improve.
Joined
Jul 8, 2015
Messages
2,429
Aerial wise, I don't think anything should be buffed. It is pretty balanced considering he is a combo character. Other then that, I don't know. He is sitting pretty comfortably at the 15-19 range on the tier list IMO and I don't think there are many things that need buffed. His throws are good, they could kill a bit earlier but meh. and his Smash Attacks, while not necessarily fast and powerful anymore are pretty good. I think they might unnerf his Dtillt or possibly give his Utilt more combo ability. I just think that he is sitting pretty comfortably in the viable at high level range.

Like seriously, ZeRo still beats the best Shieks in the world with twice nerfed Diddy. The only reason people place him at tenth is because of that.
Whenever the next balance patch comes out (if another balance patch comes out), would it be out of the question for Diddy to get buffs? Personally I think Diddy is fine as he is but I'm also fine with him getting buffs. MINOR buffs. If you want to see Diddy buffed next balance patch, what do you want to see buffed? The 1.0.8 nerf was kind of unnecessary as many of us will agree, so personally I'd like to have his Uair come out on frame 3 again. I'm fine with its kill power right now.
 

APlainOldBanana

Smash Cadet
Joined
Mar 28, 2015
Messages
36
Yeah, you're right I suppose... It's just something that's been on my mind for a while now and I've wondered what others opinions were on the matter. I was very happy about the Usmash buff in 1.1.0 and thats when i started thinking about this.
 

Snackss

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Feb 12, 2015
Messages
362
Aerial wise, I don't think anything should be buffed. It is pretty balanced considering he is a combo character. Other then that, I don't know. He is sitting pretty comfortably at the 15-19 range on the tier list IMO and I don't think there are many things that need buffed. His throws are good, they could kill a bit earlier but meh. and his Smash Attacks, while not necessarily fast and powerful anymore are pretty good. I think they might unnerf his Dtillt or possibly give his Utilt more combo ability. I just think that he is sitting pretty comfortably in the viable at high level range.

Like seriously, ZeRo still beats the best Shieks in the world with twice nerfed Diddy. The only reason people place him at tenth is because of that.
The only reason? Banana is one of the best tools in the game, his aerials are great, good down tilt, a solid forward smash, great mobility. I think it's ridiculous to put him anywhere but top 10. He's, at worst, "only" as good as Mario now. I don't understand how you can play Shulk and Mewtwo, two characters not even near the top 10 range, and not see how good Diddy still is.

Up air recovering a little faster. It was crazy that he got 36% off of one down throw with previous fame data, and run up up air being a viable approach was questionable, but it could at least not have had its recovery nerfed so much.
 

Sonicninja115

Experiment. Innovate. Improve.
Joined
Jul 8, 2015
Messages
2,429
The only reason? Banana is one of the best tools in the game, his aerials are great, good down tilt, a solid forward smash, great mobility. I think it's ridiculous to put him anywhere but top 10. He's, at worst, "only" as good as Mario now. I don't understand how you can play Shulk and Mewtwo, two characters not even near the top 10 range, and not see how good Diddy still is.

Up air recovering a little faster. It was crazy that he got 36% off of one down throw with previous fame data, and run up up air being a viable approach was questionable, but it could at least not have had its recovery nerfed so much.
His aerials were great, Uair is almost useless. It's only combo ability is as a sub-par finisher, while other options are much better.

Banana is one of his best options, but it is still a double-edged sword. It is one of the reasons he is so high.

Fsmash is now very punishable, and doesn't kill until after 95% at the ledge especially if you have good DI. It is still good, bt not as good. compare it to RosaLuma's or even ZSS. ZSS is on about the same level. The reason Diddy's Fsmash is more viable is because of the banana.

His mobility is amazing, that is the thing I love most, though I wish his grab range was a bit longer.

Diddy Kong
Pros-
Mobility
Banana
Great combo game, usually gets 15-25% off of a throw
long recovery​
Cons-
No kill options without avoidable set-ups (Dtilt-Usmash 15% kill window/ Banana to smash/ dtilt-RAR Bair, only at the edge of the stage.)
EASILY gimped, but people don't learn.
Comparatively low damage aerials. Highest being dair at 13% lowest nair at 5% Uair 6% Fair 10% Bair 9%
DI'able combos, however there are a lot of them so you need to pretty skilled to not take any damage.
Bad MU against Top Tiers
Analysis-
He is very good, but not as good as the top 7 (Sonic, Shiek, ZSS, CF) and he is on-par with the top 20-11. I don't know exactly where he lies in that range but considering how hard it is for him to beat top tiers, and even chars like DK, I find it doubtful that he is top ten. He is a good character, but not nearly as great as he once was.
 
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Snackss

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Feb 12, 2015
Messages
362
People don't gimp Diddy because quite a few characters in this game just don't have options for gimping. It's not "easy" to gimp when none of your moves have lingering hitboxes and/ or have vertical knockback that allow Diddy to simply up b again.
How many other characters have a 4 frame up air? It was a big nerf in knockback and frame data. But it's still incredibly fast to come out and helps Diddy maintain stage control as well as gives him a follow-up option in 3 directions with forward air and back air.

Diddy Kong is still a character who has combos, incredibly fast aerials, KO setups, and an incredibly strong neutral tool in a game where 80% of the cast have one or none of those things. I would say he's still in the top 10 range. He's closer in power to Fox and Mario now than he was to Sheik, but I still can't see him not being in top 10.

And I wouldn't mind reverting the nerf to endlag on his throws. Grabs are basically Diddy Kong's ground game, as annoying as up throw up air/ forward air can be.
 

Sonicninja115

Experiment. Innovate. Improve.
Joined
Jul 8, 2015
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2,429
People don't gimp Diddy because quite a few characters in this game just don't have options for gimping. It's not "easy" to gimp when none of your moves have lingering hitboxes and/ or have vertical knockback that allow Diddy to simply up b again.
How many other characters have a 4 frame up air? It was a big nerf in knockback and frame data. But it's still incredibly fast to come out and helps Diddy maintain stage control as well as gives him a follow-up option in 3 directions with forward air and back air.

Diddy Kong is still a character who has combos, incredibly fast aerials, KO setups, and an incredibly strong neutral tool in a game where 80% of the cast have one or none of those things. I would say he's still in the top 10 range. He's closer in power to Fox and Mario now than he was to Sheik, but I still can't see him not being in top 10.

And I wouldn't mind reverting the nerf to endlag on his throws. Grabs are basically Diddy Kong's ground game, as annoying as up throw up air/ forward air can be.
Most of the cast can Gimp diddy kong.

In regards to gimping, if diddy kong doesn't have a second jump and he gets hit out of barrels, then he has to charge. sure he can hold charge for awhile, but he is in the prime position to be hit again. He is one of the easier characters to gimp. Not as easy as luigi/Bowser, but on the same level as characters like Fox, ROB and Pit. Predictable recovery, but ways to get around being gimped. All the top tiers have the ability to easily gimp diddy kong, as well as a fair number of the High tiers and a scattering below that. He is very good compared to the majority of the cast, but not when comparing it to the top tiers, and on par with the high tiers.

High tiers like Pit have a strong combo game, fast projectile, strong smash attacks and a good recovery. Pit also has moves with super armor and fast powerful aerials.

Mario, with a 7-12 placement has a great combo game, pretty good recovery, Strong kill potential, damaging aerials and a reflector and air staller.

KO setups are good, but not great. You have to get the set-up first and at a very specific percent kill them. he has no throw combos that kill, unless on dreamland on the top platform. He has trouble killing without the setups, and other characters don't need setups.

Even though Diddy has good kill setups, he needs more work then most high tiers to get it. Sure banana is a great kill setup, but there are ways around banana. not always but there are ways.

I agree with the neutral and combo game, that in coupling with the banana are his greatest strengths. but kill setups are both a gift and a curse. I am not saying he is bad, he is quite good. I am just saying that he can't compete with the top tiers anymore, (unless your ZeRo) and he has trouble with some of the high tiers now. A solid 16-12 I would think but I don't see him as seventh when the first patch brought him down to fifth and that patch was small compared to the second.

Also, most people think Fox is a contender for top 5 if shiek gets nerfed.


Do you think he might get an Fthrow buff? like maybe it will kill 10% earlier, it kills at 155% now with bad DI.
 

Diddy Kong

Smash Obsessed
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Dec 8, 2004
Messages
25,969
Switch FC
SW-1597-979602774
N Air is a move I'd really like to see getting buffed since a long time. I basically want it to function as a sex kick, or a move similar to Ness's N Air, an ideal "get off me" move that'd help tremendously against characters like Sheik, Mario and other rushdown characters. With a damage buff alone, it could even help making Diddy's aerial mixups far more effective. Give it a sweetspot, and a sourspot if they have to. Or remove all cooldown so it can at least combo into the now almost useless U Air.

D Smash was another move that I desperately wanted buffed, but am 100% content with the move now as of 1.10! It doing 23% damage on the sweetspot is just beautiful. U Smash is also another ugly duckling move that's wonderful now. If they only gave F Smash the same endlag as it initially had, Diddy would have better Smashes than 90% of the game probably.

F Air could be a little stronger to though in terms of damage, and KO-ability. I do miss the raw power of this move sometimes.

A 10% kill buff to F Throw is also something that could work wonderfully for Diddy.
 

ILOVESMASH

Smash Ace
Joined
Sep 12, 2014
Messages
590
NNID
Marioman123450
3DS FC
3368-1022-7382
Just give him a Dash attack that isn't complete ****.
 

Lylo

Smash Cadet
Joined
May 19, 2015
Messages
54
Location
France
NNID
Chompypy
3DS FC
0490-8557-3079
With the 1.1.1 shield changes, Diddy actually got a huge buff
 
D

Deleted member

Guest
Make Up-Smash better. It's actually pretty crap. Only the first hitbox hits when your opponent is on a platform so it does like no knockback and like 4%. The first hitbox is actually higher than the first so it's really for your opponent to di the first hit to avoid being hit by the second hit. It only starts killing reliably at like 130%. Up-Tilit starts killing reliably at about 140%...

Overall it just needs a knockback and damage buff to make it kill at 115 instead and actually make the second hit, hit.
 
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