WFT - “Keep Your Bottom Tucked In”: Useful moves, techniques, tricks and general good practice

[DRU192]

So l discovered WFT' FAir has like, the earliest auto-cancel imaginable. It can AC after frame 25. Frame 25. That's like, super early for aerials, especially considering most AC windows were worsened in the transition to SSB4.

Also, almost all the rest of her aerials have great AC windows as well. Especially UAir, which is comparable to FAir.

As someone relatively new to smash what does auto cancel mean and what benefits does it bring?

 

[SpScarecrow]

I picked up playing as her yesterday. I was bored with normal bunch of mains, so I started using her and I am pleasantly surprised. She is fun, challenging, and very satisfying to win with. I ave actualled played some of the harder matchups against some pretty skilled players online (Zero Suit and Diddy Kong being the tougher matchups) and have had great success. C.Falcon gives me some trouble too due to WFT's cool down periods. She can be very punishable, but if you know proper spacing she is a very very, I repeat, VERY viable contender for competitive play.

I like the fact not many people (at least that I have faced at this point) have a lot of experience fighting her.

I would love to continue my practice with her to see what I can come up with for pointers. I will be uploading a video from 1v1 for glory on wii u at some point during the holiday break. Stay tuned.

-- oh and as for the above statement, I too love her USmash, as well as her aerial u smash. Her Fsmash though, that kill power is real

Make Capt. Falcon respect your space with uncharged sun spam. Falcon kick can be shield grabbed. Also the startup of aptor Boost can be rabbed

 

[SpScarecrow]

I picked up playing as her yesterday. I was bored with normal bunch of mains, so I started using her and I am pleasantly surprised. She is fun, challenging, and very satisfying to win with. I ave actualled played some of the harder matchups against some pretty skilled players online (Zero Suit and Diddy Kong being the tougher matchups) and have had great success. C.Falcon gives me some trouble too due to WFT's cool down periods. She can be very punishable, but if you know proper spacing she is a very very, I repeat, VERY viable contender for competitive play.

I like the fact not many people (at least that I have faced at this point) have a lot of experience fighting her.

I would love to continue my practice with her to see what I can come up with for pointers. I will be uploading a video from 1v1 for glory on wii u at some point during the holiday break. Stay tuned.

-- oh and as for the above statement, I too love her USmash, as well as her aerial u smash. Her Fsmash though, that kill power is real

Make Capt. Falcon respect your space with uncharged sun spam. Falcon kick can be shield grabbed. Also the startup of Raptor Boost can be grabbed if close enough. Sorry for the double post try figure out how to delete it.

 

[xx99]

• Air pivot Sun Salutation: If you want to quickly fire off a sun salutation in the opposite direction you’re facing while maintaining momentum, perform a Nair or Air Dodge then quickly press SS and then the direction you want to fire in. WFT should then instantly turn around and fire her SS. I can definitely see this being a useful tool when you're being chased.

Nice find! Turnaround-B's can also be executed in a simpler (if more difficult) way. Flick the control stick in the direction you want to turn, let it return to neutral, and press B immediately afterward. Alternately, if you press the control stick very slightly in the direction you want to turn and press B, you'll do a turnaround-B with neutral-B instead of side-B.

It takes time to learn the execution, but it's applicable to every character in the game and quite useful.

You can also do a b-reverse by pressing the control stick in the opposite direction immediately after pressing B. This changes the direction you're facing and instantly flips your horizontal momentum.

A wavebounce is a combination of a turnaround-B and a B-reverse. Flick the stick backwards, let it return to neutral, immediately press b, immediately press the stick forwards. The end result is flipping your horizontal momentum without changing the direction you're facing.

You can perform all of these with up-B, side-B, and down-B as well. Up- and down- are obviously not too useful with WFT as they aren't really affected by WFT's facing.

I haven't found much use with WFT's b-reverse or wavebounce, but I'm also not great at executing them. I use turnaround-B's a lot, and WFT can use them to great effect too. I guess it's also possible that some of her specials can't be turned around, reversed, or wavebounced. Should spend some time in the lab real quick to verify.

A more detailed breakdown can be found here: http://smashboards.com/threads/turnaround-bs-b-reverses-and-wavebounces-know-the-difference.334389/.

 

[Kith]

My new hobby is ducking under Falcon's dash attacks.

 

[DRU192]

Nice find! Turnaround-B's can also be executed in a simpler (if more difficult) way. Flick the control stick in the direction you want to turn, let it return to neutral, and press B immediately afterward. Alternately, if you press the control stick very slightly in the direction you want to turn and press B, you'll do a turnaround-B with neutral-B instead of side-B.

It takes time to learn the execution, but it's applicable to every character in the game and quite useful.

You can also do a b-reverse by pressing the control stick in the opposite direction immediately after pressing B. This changes the direction you're facing and instantly flips your horizontal momentum.

A wavebounce is a combination of a turnaround-B and a B-reverse. Flick the stick backwards, let it return to neutral, immediately press b, immediately press the stick forwards. The end result is flipping your horizontal momentum without changing the direction you're facing.

You can perform all of these with up-B, side-B, and down-B as well. Up- and down- are obviously not too useful with WFT as they aren't really affected by WFT's facing.

I haven't found much use with WFT's b-reverse or wavebounce, but I'm also not great at executing them. I use turnaround-B's a lot, and WFT can use them to great effect too. I guess it's also possible that some of her specials can't be turned around, reversed, or wavebounced. Should spend some time in the lab real quick to verify.

A more detailed breakdown can be found here: http://smashboards.com/threads/turnaround-bs-b-reverses-and-wavebounces-know-the-difference.334389/.

Thanks for the info, just spent some time in training mode and performing turnaround-B the way you described works perfectly, I'll update the main post, thanks bro!

 

[DRU192]

I like to use her down tilt after landing the jab combo. Great info and post.

Tested this out in training mode and it's the most damaging ground follow-up (20% dmg). I knew it was decent but was genuinely surprised by how good it was. Thanks for sharing bro!

 

[BJN39]

As someone relatively new to smash what does auto cancel mean and what benefits does it bring?

An auto-cancel window is a time during an aerial (a few frame before, and some time after the hit-boxes appear/disappear.) where landing during that time will allow you to land without ANY lag. This can be advantageous for being safer on shields, and for use in a neutral situation.

Alternatively, landing the aerial during the NON-auto cancel window will result in a landing-lag animation that varies in lengths between aerials. This is generally a disadvantageous position.

 

[SpScarecrow]

Ive been practicing perfect pivot but since I'm playing on handheld i only get ftilt but the application is godly because she hits both sides. Gais try it out. Also S-Smash Fsmash gives her range (also known as kara smash). Slightly delay the timing of the A button press. You'll do a micro dash and fsmash. It gives her the range needed. I can also get upsmash but i have to be quicker than normal. Just in training mode today.

 

[⑨ball]

Ive been practicing perfect pivot but since I'm playing on handheld i only get ftilt but the application is godly because she hits both sides. Gais try it out. Also S-Smash Fsmash gives her range (also known as kara smash). Slightly delay the timing of the A button press. You'll do a micro dash and fsmash. It gives her the range needed. I can also get upsmash but i have to be quicker than normal. Just in training mode today.

I'm not 100% sure, but I believe perfect pivoting functions different between the 3DS and WiiU. In the 3DS version(for sure, might be available in the WiiU), WFT has access to Delayed-Dash techniques because stopping her dash through pivots or returning to neutral registers her as still dashing for a few extended frames.

I guess this counts as a contribution to the thread, but as an addition, there are actually two moves that can be done out of a SHAD approach. The first has been mentioned, the Bair, but Uair can also be used. These moves are particularly powerful when used from a RAR because Uair's hit box start from WiiFit's front, Bair has a Snake esque lowerbody hitbox on Bair meaning it's just as effective from the center as it is from max range, and hitting on the back of a shield means that you're less likely to get shield grabbed. Uair also recovers super fast and combos into other aerials on hit. Ofcourse this also means you just empty hop it because her SHAD autocancels, and then grab. Works on characters as short as Ness consistently, but can also hit characters as short as Kirby.

TLDR: You can Uair out of short hop air dodges and it works really well if you pivot before jumping back and through your opponent.

 

[Pazzo]

Hi guys. I'm new here. Is there any Skype chat room for Wii Fit Trainer mains to join? I prefer to learn from other people.

EDIT: Keep up the good work in this thread of course.

 

[Catsby]

Hey, new to Smashboards, joined because I think I have discovered something interesting about Header. Now, keep in mind, I am still fooling around with it, but for the most part, I think I have a basic idea of how this works.

The start of Header hits behind Wii Fit AND it can still spike. I first noticed this in a FG match against a Yoshi. Both of us ended up offstage, Yoshi coming up behind and above me. As a habit, I use Header to start my recovery. Yoshi was directly behind me and hit my hand/head area and was spiked downwards.

I had a hard time testing it afterwards, but for the most part, I think it holds water. I could post more as I figure it out for realsies.

 

[⑨ball]

Hi guys. I'm new here. Is there any Skype chat room for Wii Fit Trainer mains to join? I prefer to learn from other people.

EDIT: Keep up the good work in this thread of course.

Hey, new to Smashboards, joined because I think I have discovered something interesting about Header. Now, keep in mind, I am still fooling around with it, but for the most part, I think I have a basic idea of how this works.

The start of Header hits behind Wii Fit AND it can still spike. I first noticed this in a FG match against a Yoshi. Both of us ended up offstage, Yoshi coming up behind and above me. As a habit, I use Header to start my recovery. Yoshi was directly behind me and hit my hand/head area and was spiked downwards.

I had a hard time testing it afterwards, but for the most part, I think it holds water. I could post more as I figure it out for realsies.

Hello fellow Trainers, and welcome to the WFT boards~

Here's a large thread containing links to other informational posts about your inquiries including the Skype thread and all the fantastic options you have from header :

Spoiler: Yes. Header can spike from behind.

http://smashboards.com/threads/nutrition-and-supplements-the-wft-compendium-and-index.377562/

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

Gonna incorporate more of this into my style. I'm aware of most of it but wouldn't use too much of it. Hopefully it'll make the Diddy and sheik match up not as dreadful lol Did get to play against Tyrant and Zero and man are they something else :o

 

[GalaxyWaffles]

So I was playing around and discovered (not sure if it''s really a discovery) but Nair>Nair>Header is an actual thing.

 

[⑨ball]

So I was playing around and discovered (not sure if it''s really a discovery) but Nair>Nair>Header is an actual thing.

So is nair>nair>nair header. (:

http://smashboards.com/threads/wii-fit-combos.379806/

 

[DRU192]

Found some more interesting stuff while in training mode today:

- Short hop > quick header has no landing lag
- Air to ground charge cancelling allows for some nice options on landing

Treat these findings as useful reminders if they are already common knowledge, also I'm no Spielberg so please excuse the quality of the video.

 

[Salad Bowl]

Oh there's also Deep Breathing Air Dodge Cancel

This is done by using deep breathing in the air then air dodging. It makes you freeze for a second like a melee air dodge but you don't fall into freefall. This can mess up your opponents timing when they try to hit you in the air, or trying to stop you from falling to the stage.

You can do tricky things with this AT like jumping at your opponent then DB air dodge canceling back so they might be stuck in ending lag after they try to punish.

There's so many potential air mixups with this.

@ DRU192 you never added this to the OP.

 

[DRU192]

@ DRU192 you never added this to the OP.

Updated, any other goodies you've found?

 

[Salad Bowl]

Updated, any other goodies you've found?

After you ground the with jab once, if you read them pop out, you can ground then again with jab.

Also sakurai never said no more balance patches. It was translated badly. He said he doesn't have plans for them yet. There's a big chance that balance patches are gonna be in the future

 

[Mechageo]

Recently I fell in love with WFT

Please forgive me, but are eyes without pupils dominant or recessive?

I'm just concerned for your children.

 

[mmik]

I need to get better at mixing up my game. I have handfuls of matches online where I start off strong, and end up losing because my opponent figures me out. I mostly just do the same things the whole match, because I don't know what else to do.

Am I supposed to play a strong punish game as wft? That's what it's starting to seem like from what I've seen and played myself. Is it best to focus on being slippery and dodgy and punishy? And less agressiveness from myself?

 

[G-Guy]

I need to get better at mixing up my game. I have handfuls of matches online where I start off strong, and end up losing because my opponent figures me out. I mostly just do the same things the whole match, because I don't know what else to do.

Am I supposed to play a strong punish game as wft? That's what it's starting to seem like from what I've seen and played myself. Is it best to focus on being slippery and dodgy and punishy? And less agressiveness from myself?

From my experience, WFT has the tools to be aggressive, especially in the air.
Her nair combos well into other attacks, all aerials come out rather quickly with the exception of dair, while bair, fair and uair have kill potential. fair especially has good range diagonally up, something enemies don't expect often.

However, her projectile game let's her zone pretty effectively. you do not have to get in to do you damage, like i.e. falcon.

It's your streingth to apply massive pressure in the air and from afar, while your tilts are great "get off me!" moves. pivot ftilt especially launches enemies into the air to allow for follow ups! (One of my favorite things to do early in matches is to go for a
SHFF nair > utilt > reverse side tilt > nair > nair > header. sooooo satisfying when it hits!)

Her smashes are great, but you'll use them for punishes most of the time. Usmash can be used to knock characters away that come with fast falling attacks, if timed right, due to invincibility frames (Greninja's/Bowser's down smash)

wew, that was way more text I actually intended to write! I just love the trainer, that's all :-)

 

[mmik]

I had some good matches just now. No idea how to do that combo you said effectively or anything like it really... I can get some good reads and punishes. And my aerials connect often. But I don't know how to do bread and butter combos or cancels or anything side from jab into dtilt. Lol

 

[G-Guy]

I had some good matches just now. No idea how to do that combo you said effectively or anything like it really... I can get some good reads and punishes. And my aerials connect often. But I don't know how to do bread and butter combos or cancels or anything side from jab into dtilt. Lol

as a general guideline, the combo i described works on Mario at around 30%. some parts are not a true combo, but many will not see it coming, making it a rather usefull string of attacks.

 

[mmik]

I tried to sneak in a a few upsmashes today because of the invincibility, but I couldn't get the timing right. Is it worth practicing?

 

[DRU192]

Not sure if jab-cancelling (that Link-infinite vid got me thinking) with WFT has been examined in depth yet. Looking to do some extensive lab work when I get home from work. So far jab-cancelling into Ftilt, pivot Ftilt, Dtilt (surprisingly) & grab seem to show potential. Have you guys found anything interesting/useful?

 

[Fancykong]

I've used jab canceling with WFT ever since I saw a TKBreezy match where he did it.

I use it mostly against rush-down players or landing from an aerial to shoo grabbers away from me. Jab - grab helps in team matches too.

 

[⑨ball]

Nothing Link levels of amazing as we don't have that knockback growth or blackhole properties. I mainly use it for crossups like jab>pivot grab, jab>utilt, jab>ftilt, ect.

Looking forward to anything you find~

 

[Fancykong]

I wonder if the Mewtwo/Miiverse Stage/Tournament/Sharing update will be a balance patch as well, considering that Nintendo went out of their way to "fix" Wii Fit Trainer of all characters in the last one. I just keep imagining the Link jab cancel being dummied out to match the others like how WFT's oddities were homogenized with the rest of the cast.

 

[⑨ball]

There's a good chance it will if it becomes prevalent enough. Along with some random nerfs in other places to characters no one even asked for.

Here's hoping shield stab returns.
Haha, not a chance in hell. ;-;

 

[DRU192]

That great feeling when you're in the lab looking for tech and you find surprise tech you didn't expect!
- WFT can cancel the upward momentum from a successful on-stage footstool (pretty much instantly) by using deep breathing, this could potentially open up the way to some nice combo possibilities.

Man, training mode is my favorite part of any fighting game I just love building the meta! PS still experimenting with jab-cancelling, getting the timing right is really tricky for me can't tell if I'm doing it right, any tips?

 

[DRU192]

That great feeling when you're in the lab looking for tech and you find surprise tech you didn't expect!
- WFT can cancel the upward momentum from a successful on-stage footstool (pretty much instantly) by using deep breathing, this could potentially open up the way to some nice combo possibilities.

Man, training mode is my favorite part of any fighting game I just love building the meta! PS still experimenting with jab-cancelling, getting the timing right is really tricky for me can't tell if I'm doing it right, any tips?

UPDATE!: Even better than using Deep Breathing which requires you to DB-Cancel before you can attack (which limits your options due to dodge recovery lag *sadface) you can use Header which not only cancels your momentum but allows you to use an aerial attack on the way down! Going back to experiment some more (managed to pull it off with a Bair, exciting times!)

UPDATE #2: Both DB & Header have positive applications after a on-stage footstool, on a high jumping opponent: footstool > DB-cancel > Fully charged SS works a treat on larger characters (KO's at high %) and on low jumping opponents: footstool > quick Header > Bair is does good damage and can also KO at high %. This is definitely a AT for advanced players or those who want to style on someone.

 

[RobertDan]

I've found that WFT's Nair can actually combo into itself 3 times if the opponent is at the right percentage (it varies with each character). Basically, do a Fast Fall Nair, and if both hits connect, jump, then Nair again, then double jump, then Nair again. If done right, this can do 42% (48% with Deep Breathing!), so I think this could be considered useful by some.

Afterwards, people tend to air dodge thinking there's another hit. That's when I use header. I believe it's unblockable on heavy characters. Of course if they jump fast fall and try up air or fair. And of they spike to the stage, or bottom blast zone, you can use a fair, fast fall up smash, or possibly a bair depending on their speed and your placement. Most of the times I cannot follow up though, but it's free damage. (I'm not sure if this has been said or not, or if this is the right place. If not sorry.)