We've Been Had!

[Excellence]

That's right Olimar Boards, we've been had. Recently, I discovered people were starting to play smarter against Olimar, so I started to do some snooping around the other boards and I found a lot of material. Apparently, people have figured out how to stop Olimar thanks to posts like this:

There is a very specific strat I like to use against Olimar with GW that works even better with MK.

Ok, Olimar is good at camping. He has an amazing grab game, and he can pivot grab almost anything you do. His grabs have follow-ups a low%'s and blue/purple pikmin kill pretty fast at higher %'s from throws.

A key way to gain and keep the lead in this match-up is stage control. You want to put olimar in a position to where his options have more risk then reward and that will create oppertunities for you to punish and kill him. There are a couple of ways to go about this.

First of all you need to play carefully against Olimar. Don't be reckless unless you are both off the stage. Pay attention to his jump patters and when he likes to pivot grab, and what moves he uses before and after he grabs. It might suprise you how fast you can catch on to what he is doing and take advantage of it.

Lets take a look at the problems MK has in this match-up. Olimar can pivot grab almost any of MK's approachs and it's really dangerous to be abover Oli because of how good his Uair and Upsmash are. Olimar's moves arn't telegraphed at all because they all practically look the same, meaning you are going to have a hard time telling if he is grabbing or smashing for example. If you stay away from olimar he will just throw pikmin at you.

How do we overcome this? Stage positioning.

Approach olimar by walking towards him. Stay about 3-4 character lengths away so he can't grab you. Approach him slowly like this and SH fair/Ftilt/Dtilt towards him to bat away pikmin he is throwing at you. Eventually as he moves backwards he will get near the edge of the stage and this is where you take full advantage of him. At the edge of the stage, olimar isn't going to be able to pivot grab you. He can't camp you and his moves will actually become telegraphed(something that almost never applies to olimar) at the edge because of the lack of options he has. If you keep approaching him slowly like this you can punish pretty much anything he does and hopefully get a gimp off. Olimar will try really hard to get past you, probably going to a grab or just running past you. Staying in the air but close to the ground helps a lot in this position. If you do this the whole match eventually Olimar might start approaching you out of frustration and you should be able to handle it from there.

Now some people have known about this for a very long time and it's nothing new. The only difference between now and 'then' is that word has traveled down the grape vine and even common players are starting to utilize this strategy. What does this mean for Olimar? For one, it means that people aren't going to be trying to shield what they think is a Forward Smash, which was really a grab (carefully placed after a stock of force feeding false habbits).

Naturally, I think that this could be what we need to take Olimar's metagame to the next level. Maybe? Yes... ? No... ? Alright, regardless, we should figure out a way to deal with this strategy. It's a lot easier to combat an enemy we can see. With that being said here's the problem (listed above), now let's fine a solution.

 

[XienZo]

There's always the epic "run straight past your opponent and pivot grab them from the other side" but that gets predictable way too quickly...

 

[Fino]

This thread gives me aids...

in before lock


~Fino

 

[DanGR]

None of this is new. Hylian just said stuff that most people are too lazy to learn by themselves.

 

[Llumys]

As said before, this is known, but now even the mediocre players know about it.

I don't really care, though. It's not like every Olimar will react to this strategy the same way.

 

[A2ZOMG]

What? You have to be TOLD to do this against Olimar? Seriously?

I mean it's common sense. Duh. -_-

You do this to Sonic too since his entire strategy involves running away and doing stuff.

 

[asob4]

i guess Y and X stop working when you play as olimar

 

[Llumys]

Yep. Apparantly Olimar only has ground game.

 

[Fino]

Guys... I'm quitting olimar....


~Fino

 

[Dyyne]

Guys... I'm quitting olimar....


~Fino

As am I......... this is too much for my oli to handle....






Seriously though, it does seem like over time, players are going to be able to take advantage of weaknesses like that better. I mean, it is pretty old, what you're posting lol. But, still, good to keep newer players alert of what to watch out for

 

[Gigabyte_]

Stop ****ing whining, oli is the king of camping. You should be able to beat anyone with pikmin to throw and a 92 foot grab range.

 

[Neb]

Game & Watch is having the same problem, that is, players growing accustomed to his initial gimmicks.
But as mentioned, it is actually stimulating his metagame rather than hurting it.

 

[Cook]

This topic title is misleading.

 

[Fino]

fsmash destroys this entire plan...

fsmash > grab range

fsmash > mk's dtilt, ftilt, SH fair (if timed properly)

*sigh* and that's only one strategy against this... there's so many more options

HEY GUYS! I got one thing to get past olimar, this means we completely eradicate his game w00t. Sure this only applies to certain olimar play styles, or perhaps even one aspect of his game.... but he's useless now.

This is almost as ******** as the people who say peach sucks because she can't dsmash.


~Fino

 

[asob4]

but she does suck
dsmash was her bread and butter and now it's gone :D

 

[Llumys]

It's a shame she doesn't have great aerial game and a turnips...

 

[Aztec Avenger]

Rofl my Copter.

That strategy is not all that great, because what Olimar player would CONTINUE to throw pikmin after they keep dying. The strategy does work,but the thing is that who would only spam with Olimar in a situation like that. Anyway G&Ws aren't that patient, they are bound to want to use the turtle.

 

[Excellence]

Game & Watch is having the same problem, that is, players growing accustomed to his initial gimmicks.
But as mentioned, it is actually stimulating his metagame rather than hurting it.

Yes, it would be nice to learn from this and advance Olimar's metagame, but the people in the Olimar boards seem to think it's ridiculously simple to get past and have taken it upon themselves to be disrespectful of the idea proposal. Regardless, I've already learned that these boards fail more than the usual and you should learn things on your own.

 

[Sudai]

Please stop posting in red text....

Also, this tact is rather simple to get around...get over it..

 

[Excellence]

Please stop posting in red text....

Is it because you don't like the color? If that's the reason the answer is no, sorry. If it hurts your eyes or it's tough for you to read, I'll gladly switch for you.

 

[asob4]

cause he posts in red when he closes threads and goes into angry mod mode

 

[Excellence]

cause he posts in red when he closes threads and goes into angry mod mode

Skank, like who was talking to you, like you're pissing me off, like I'm about to f you up yo, like, like, really, like... No j/k <3 Thanks for the explination. I'll chain it to RoyalBlue.

POOOF

 

[Sudai]

It's hard to read was the main point. I tend to bold + turn stuff red when doing moderation things, but I didn't really care about that as much.

 

[Excellence]

It's hard to read was the main point. I tend to bold + turn stuff red when doing moderation things, but I didn't really care about that as much.

When I sound rude, 90% of the time I'm joking, and 9% of the time I don't even realize it - of course I'll chance my color for you.

 

[Sudai]

Kay. Whatever.

Back on topic people, before infractions fly.

 

[asob4]

at first i didn't scroll down enough and i only saw sudai's post, so i thought he locked the thread D:

i <3 excellence
we be homies before oli was high tier lol

 

[ufo90]

I have noticed that after January 5th Olimar started to be expected. The easiest thing to do was play as a fighter who has a complete opposite attack pattern first. Then while the opponent thinks you are going to keep doing that you switch to Olimar and show them why Olimar got to his B tier ranking.

Another problem is that people have not found any new Olimar ATs. So with Whistle Armor and SGC the only options you have is to use regular attacks. Those can only be put into so many combination and only some of those are going to be useful.

But still Olimar can usually hold his own when fighting most people.

 

[kirbywizard]

Great camping, and a great offensive. So much more as well. But hey we have many ways to get past other characters as well. If it where not for such a gimpable recovery, we would be true monsters on the field.

 

[knightzy]

^^hahahahahaha shy guy cancelling,lol,anyways we have a few techs,wave plucking,whistle armor,we are also still trying to find desyching as far as i know,if we get that we will have alot more ways to play.

 

[ufo90]

Well we could try to spread the SGC as a new AT and see if people get scared of Olimar with an offensive AT.

“The goal of modern propaganda is no longer to transform opinion but to arouse an active and mythical belief” - Jacques Ellul

So SGC is how we get wins. We do not tell people what SGC is and they will fear it.

I also have a video on the subject.
They have been got.

 

[Sudai]

lol

Fino gonna be mmaadd.

Problem is, even if we got a good convincing fake vid, people would try it themselves and quickly realize it's fake..or just dig here and search for SGC. <.<

 

[kirbywizard]

lol

Fino gonna be mmaadd.

Problem is, even if we got a good convincing fake vid, people would try it themselves and quickly realize it's fake..or just dig here and search for SGC. <.<

well we can just visit their boards to find stuff on them. I mean how else did they figure this stuff out about olimar

 

[Zorai]

At this point of Smash Bros, I don't think Olimar's metagame could take another noticable step in advancement...
Only the dominant players will continue to advance in superior playstyle. There's nothing to be discussed; but rather overcome.

 

[Fino]

lol

Fino gonna be mmaadd.

Problem is, even if we got a good convincing fake vid, people would try it themselves and quickly realize it's fake..or just dig here and search for SGC. <.<

SGC is worthles...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8L_CSW2MZtg

Look start watching at 1:00... occurs at 1:02

To say the least I was F@CKING pissed
SGC is legit though... just not in the sense that anyone thinks. Arkive and I tested it out, I can probably explain to people in the olimar chat, though it's kinda known =-/


~Fino

 

[Dabuz]

you do know shy guy canceling exists in a way, if olimar is launched and hits a shyguy with upair while being launched its stops alot of momentum, its very random and impossible to setup but it is kinda a tech

 

[Dyyne]

You guys aren't doing it right, it has to be done the semi infinite way on mk. Only through this can oli easily beat anybody evar.

 

[Fino]

you do know shy guy canceling exists in a way, if olimar is launched and hits a shyguy with upair while being launched its stops alot of momentum, its very random and impossible to setup but it is kinda a tech

*sigh*yes we know that...
**** i dunno how many times I've been saved by the balloon on smash ville ^^;


~Fino