Waveplucking

[leprechaunlink727]

This is a hypothetical Olimar Advanced technique: waveplucking. In theory, taking a few liberties with predicting Olimar's aerials I guess, Olimar should be able to pluck while wavelanding. If this is accomplishable, then Olimar can easily pluck while moving in either direction, making him a much more efficient character.

Seriously though: WAVEPLUCKING. I officially patent this technique. If it doesn't exist, then forget it.

1. The dojo says that Olimar only needs Pikmin for some of his aerial attacks.

2. According to Gimpy, Wavelanding was done in the Brawl demo by performing an aerial attack that pulls you in one direction just before landing on the ground.

3. Assuming Olimar can pluck whenever he touches the ground, even for only a split second, and one of his Pikmin-less aerials can be used to waveland, then Olimar should theoretically be able to wavepluck.

some problems:

1.The plucking animation may not be momentum driven and automatically halt Olimar's movement when the move is performed.

2. Olimar's Pikmin-less aerials (If he actually has any) may not be wave-landable. I don't see why waveplucking can't be performed with one Pikmin already out however.

3. Wavelanding is removed from the final version of Brawl. This would suck majorly.

Performing this move will be one of the first things I try in Brawl. If it doesn't exist, oh well. But if it does, I DISCOVERED IT!

Thoughts?

 

[Blade Knight]

Seconded I as a future olimar secondary/mainer(Kirby before Olimar) i will love wave plucking

 

[leprechaunlink727]

I'm a casual player, an I might have just discovered the foundation of Olimar's metagame.

I'M SO PROUD OF MYSELF!

 

[Blade Knight]

As vital as pluking is Olimar is a fast character and as shown in many pictures he plucks fast im thinking only sonic will give him a hard time plucking.

 

[leprechaunlink727]

The thing is, if plucking is a stationary attack and iusn't momentum driven, then this wouldn't work at all.

 

[Itakio]

You'll need to be fast falling to get the l-cancel benefits, which means less momentum horizontal momentum, I would think. If you aren't fast falling, then you'll suffer lag and I don't think you'll have enough momentum by the time the lag goes away to make use of it. Sorry, but I don't think it'll work.

 

[leprechaunlink727]

You'll need to be fast falling to get the l-cancel benefits, which means less momentum horizontal momentum, I would think. If you aren't fast falling, then you'll suffer lag and I don't think you'll have enough momentum by the time the lag goes away to make use of it. Sorry, but I don't think it'll work.

There's a significant amount of reasons I don't think it'll work either, but I'm still going to try it. And try it. And try it. It would be an "Advanced Technique" after all.

 

[Blade Knight]

Besides to pluck a pikmin you would need to land stationary no left or right

 

[leprechaunlink727]

Besides to pluck a pikmin you would need to land stationary no left or right

That's what i was saying about plucking not being momentum driven. But you can't really tell from one picture on the dojo, which truthfully, is all we know about the plucking mechanic.

 

[Blade Knight]

But if Sakurai is Pulling a moveset from pikmin for olimar as severly he did for sonic (all sonics moves come frome sonic the hedgehog 1-3) then each pikmin should only require a half a second max

 

[Itakio]

I wouldn't take the info directly from the game. Links spin attack lasts almost double what it does in the actual games (I think...).

 

[Blade Knight]

But Link has the same moveset with a TP look upgrade

 

[Itakio]

Same moveset, yes, but the small details are very different from LOZ in many cases.

 

[leprechaunlink727]

You guys are looking too much into this. Aerials don't have too much lag, and fast-falling is pretty easy. Basically, if plucking doesn't stop Olimar in his tracks and make him stationary, this would be a pretty easy technique to perform.

Waveland (Jump, fast-fall, aerial), B,B,B,... Simple really. And you've suddenly got 3 Pikmin and you're on the opposite side of the stage from your opponent.

example: You're about to get owned, and you have no Pikmin to defend yourself with. What do you do? WAVEPLUCK! You've got Pikmin again and enough distance from your opponent for a surprise counter-attack.

A technique like this could easily help Olimar run with the best of them. Even if you only have enough time to pluck one Pikmin while wavelanding, it's still dramatically more effective than plucking in place and leaving yourself open, if only for half a second.

 

[Pyr0]

Plucking is already REALLY fast (as evidenced by the screenshots) so fast, I dare say that you only need to have one pikmin, do a small smash attack and you should have enough time to pluck another one (or two) with no problem

 

[Itakio]

If you are falling faster onto the ground, then you would have more friction to put up with (i.e. you wouldn't move as far as if you didn't), or at least I think that's how it would work in real life. Also, I don't think wavelanding will go very far, or at least, not nearly as far as what you are talking about.

Another thing is that if you don't have any Pikmin left and you had time to jump, why wouldn't you just pull one where you were standing? If you need distance, you might as well just run and then pull one up on the other side of the stage. You move faster on the ground anyway.

 

[leprechaunlink727]

If you are falling faster onto the ground, then you would have more friction to put up with (i.e. you wouldn't move as far as if you didn't), or at least I think that's how it would work in real life. Also, I don't think wavelanding will go very far, or at least, not nearly as far as what you are talking about.

Another thing is that if you don't have any Pikmin left and you had time to jump, why wouldn't you just pull one where you were standing? If you need distance, you might as well just run and then pull one up on the other side of the stage. You move faster on the ground anyway.

Smash Physics are very, very different from earth physics. Trust me. Wavelanding is also very different in this game from what it was in Melee. I saw Sonic and Mario doing it in some gameplay vids from E 4 All. It seemed they both went about the same distance, which was roughly as big as Luigi's wavedash in Melee, which was pretty huge.

 

[Itakio]

Do you have a link to the videos?

 

[leprechaunlink727]

I wish I could say i did. I can't be positive I actually saw it either. i just PM'ed Gimpy about whether or not he thinks this move could work based on what he knows about Brawl wavedashing.

 

[Itakio]

Well, there's still my other point. Wouldn't it just be faster just to run to where you want to go?

 

[Gimpyfish62]

if the admitedly glitchy looking and feeling waveland remains in brwal for the final game this would probably be possible, but i wouldn't hold my breath

 

[Pyr0]

Even if it is, I doubt its going to make a world of a difference.

Air time = slower than ground time. So why not just dash and dodge then pluck.

 

[leprechaunlink727]

Do any of you other than Gimpy know how wavelanding actually works?

 

[Smash Ninja]

This theory has about a 50/50 chance of being possible.

It would add something to P&O's metagame and would make even more mindgame potential for Oli's already mindgame-happy moveset.

I like this idea. Heres hoping it works. I wouldnt bet on it, though, as there still is an equal chance that it isnt even possible at all...

 

[_Xanatos_]

Well, I like to look at this move in comparison to Peach's Down-B. When pulling turnips from the ground, Peach is stationary. I think it will work the same for Olimar since it is a very similar move.

It's still possible the waveplucking will be possible, though. But if you think about it, Olimar would be dragging the Pikmin through the ground before plucking, and that might cause serious injury to them.

 

[MetaNiGHTs]

Correction in the games picking is always momentum driven if you pick more than one pikmin

 

[leprechaunlink727]

Can you wavepluck with peach in melee? That would be the best indicator of whether this will work or not.

 

[Itakio]

She has too much traction to pull a turnip without stopping first, or at least she doesn't move far once she does start the move.

 

[UltimateLink]

waveplucking would be a really good addition to olimar, but if you picture it, you can pluck atleast one pickman and throw it at the other person, that person will be occupied with that pickman, from there on, you can pluck more pickman. if you use wavepluck, you can easily appoarch with it and throw 3 pikman, pull 3 more right in front of there face and from there on, a combo starts. waveplucking would be such a great thing, but if you notice the animation, a little burrow thing is there, it wouldn't be so realistic seeing a hole moving. but it look differnt, like the hole stays but you still move while plucking. but thats just my opinion.

 

[Smash Ninja]

Y'know, after thinking about the physics, I actually thing that waveTHROWING the pikmin would be more possible.

Then you could... wavethrow up to opponent, smash, wavethrow, smash, wavethrow, smash, wavethrow, smash, wavethrow, finish off with an arial.

 

[Layupfreak]

Please, I like this, but dont make a "wave" _____ topic yet. don't get too far into that.

 

[TheMirrorTwin]

Also, wave dashing is not quite the same as it was in melee:
(http://www.smashwiki.com/wiki/Wavedashing#Wavedash_in_Super_Smash_Bros._Brawl)

With this in mind, wave plucking my not be possible or practical if wave dashing isn't there or works differently. Also, his pluck is probably quick enough that "waveplucking" wouldn't become his whole metagame but an occasional technique.

 

[courte]

wow... that march 9th hit some people really hard--

 

[leprechaunlink727]

wow... that march 9th hit some people really hard--

Except I thought of this concept a week before that.

 

[Cronos_Rainbow]

It's all good and well....but even if it is possible the fact you're going for it will make it next to impossible to attempt it without being thwarted as you have to jump then come back to the ground, be facing a direction that will make it obvious which way you're going to land (due to new physics). The opponent will be able to simply run to where you're bound to land and hit you with a smash.
I think you're better off planning on hitting the opponent and plucking in the lag time. A spike could be good for this as it will at least stun, and best case scenario leave them having to tech giving pluck-time-a-plenty.
I could be painfully wrong however - it's not impossible. Good work for your creative thinking at the very least

 

[KingDaniel]

Hm

Well...If he can, then he will have an advantage over all other characters. I am thinking about maining olimar, but i can just choose one. Update us on march 9th.