Wavedashing vs. Dash Dancing

[L33thal]

I've been trying to theorycraft a lot lately about Fox's movement tools and one thing I've been pondering about is the use of wavedashing versus dash dancing.

Fox's dash seems to be faster than his wavedash since you can Fox-trot across FD faster than you would if you wavedashed across it. So this begs the question: why use wavedashing when dashing is faster? Hypothetically, you'd be able to weave in and out faster. You could fake an approach like run-in grab and dash away from your opponent's counter-play faster as opposed to wavedashing back. You can also space your zoning more precisely since you have so much control over the moment you turn around, etc.

On the other hand, it feels like if you're too reliant on dash dancing your selections for when you go in and when you back out become more predictable (since you need to position yourself so that you have the right spacing). Also, for some reason in cases like anticipating your opponent going in against you, wavedash back into dash dance tends to work out better than just simply dashing back.

This has actually been really bugging me and it's on my mind lately every time I practice lol. Does anyone have any thoughts on this?

 

[vynleren]

In general, I agree that dash dancing seems more useful on average than wave dashing. It's confusing why players like Hax seem to wave dash so frequently when dash dancing seems like an option with less commitment.

That said, wave dashing lets you do things like up tilt, where dashing won't. Just watch any Leffen vs. Floaty and you will see him do WD turnaround uptilt as a zoning tool.

Overall I think that dash dancing is generally more useful for reasons you mentioned. But wavedashing definitely has its time and place. Mixing it up is key!

 

[bboss]

I've been trying to theorycraft a lot lately about Fox's movement tools and one thing I've been pondering about is the use of wavedashing versus dash dancing.

Fox's dash seems to be faster than his wavedash since you can Fox-trot across FD faster than you would if you wavedashed across it. So this begs the question: why use wavedashing when dashing is faster? Hypothetically, you'd be able to weave in and out faster. You could fake an approach like run-in grab and dash away from your opponent's counter-play faster as opposed to wavedashing back. You can also space your zoning more precisely since you have so much control over the moment you turn around, etc.

On the other hand, it feels like if you're too reliant on dash dancing your selections for when you go in and when you back out become more predictable (since you need to position yourself so that you have the right spacing). Also, for some reason in cases like anticipating your opponent going in against you, wavedash back into dash dance tends to work out better than just simply dashing back.

This has actually been really bugging me and it's on my mind lately every time I practice lol. Does anyone have any thoughts on this?

I personally dashdance with Fox a heck of a lot more than I wavedash. I find it's more useful and stuff too, and some of my friends who play Melee make fun of it, saying I'm not good because I don't wavedash in game as much as them, but I know it doesn't matter and that you are right. I think that Fox in general has very good movement that does not necessitate wavedashing.

 

[krazyzyko]

In general, I agree that dash dancing seems more useful on average than wave dashing. It's confusing why players like Hax seem to wave dash so frequently when dash dancing seems like an option with less commitment.

That said, wave dashing lets you do things like up tilt, where dashing won't. Just watch any Leffen vs. Floaty and you will see him do WD turnaround uptilt as a zoning tool.

Overall I think that dash dancing is generally more useful for reasons you mentioned. But wavedashing definitely has its time and place. Mixing it up is key!

Hax WD's more because he is still a Falcon main at heart. Falcon's dash extends his hurtbox especially the back of his feet. So to retreat in a micro distance he uses those short wavesashes. That's also why he barely uses normals and sticks mainly to aerials.

The DD vs WD discussion can be broken down into what cancels what.
So even if dash is faster and has more coverage, you can't dash out of shine nor shield.