Wario Needs Some Help

FrankTheStud

Smash Journeyman
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May 21, 2015
Messages
248
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FrankDaStud
Haven't posted for a while, but Wario needs some help in Ultimate. My most played characters are Mario, Doc, and DK and I feel that they're rock-solid characters. DK in particular is bery rewarding to play as he has a lot of options and his frame data feels good.

Then we have Wario. He doesn't deal a lot of damage, he has a LOT of lag whether it be startup of ending, he has very few reliable kill options, (no spike and no kill throw--neutral B may kill at ledge at high percents) and overall feels like a Smash 4 character stuck in Smash 5.

I feel like Wario does damage like Mario but is slower and laggier with less kill options and doesn't reward as much as DK or Doc for successful hits, combos, and setups. (Aside from waft which is more of a gimmick/trick) It's difficult to justify playing him over other characters because how difficult it is to play him well.

His kill moves aren't powerful enough to warrant how risky they are.
His forward smash has to be the laggiest one in the game om startup and ending.
Down smash has ok kill potential and lots of endlag.
Upsmash is decent but has a lot of end lag and doesn't kill as early as it should.

All of his smash moves are unrewarding for the amount of lag on them.

Dtilt can lead into combos at very high percents but deals like 2% damage (really?) and is useless until then. It seems faster than his terrible jab but that's about it.

Utilt is solid but like Mario/Doc doesn't have as good a "scoop" which means you have to be directly below or basically within grab range to use it successfully.

Ftilt is ok... It has too much startup lag but least it can kill at very high percents.

Jab is a borderline joke. Decent angle but high startup and end lag and don't always connect.

Dash attack is awesome.

Up B is okay but not great in killing power or recovery switchup. Highly predictable and doesnt have a lot of priority. Easy to spike and doesn't reach high enough too low, even with bike.

Neutral B needs option to direct the spit out... At the very least backwards. (Like K Rools gun) and should have more kill potential if Wario doesn't get a kill throw or spike.

Bike has lots of lag (even when recovering) and down time is pretty high.

Waft is waft.

Upair is more of a combo hit but never kills. It feels like Fox's upair with less reward at high percents.

Fair sex kick is solid and good for strings and setups.

Neutral air is solid for setups and mixups, way better than Smash 4.

Bair is an ok kill option with a bit of startup lag and lots of end lag. Difficult to edgeguard with due to lag.

Dair is solid for setups and mixups, can even kill at high percents.

Fthrow isn't a kill throw but can sometimes lead to an extra hit or two.
Backthrow is the same way even though it's reminiscent of a kill throw.
Upthrow can kill at top platform at high percents and can lead to combos at lower percents.
Down throw launches them backwards and downwards which is a nice switchup and leads to dash attack or aerial setups somewhat reliably.

Positives
+lots of mixups between neutral b grab and shield pressure/crossups
+decent combo game between airials, neutral B, and tilts
+decent recovery options
+Waft and shoulder bsrge dash attack

Cons:
- More laggy moves than anyone I've played yet in game.. Feels like Smash 4 character in Smash 5.
- No kill thow
- No spike
- Difficulty killing others... Few reliable/non risky kill moves/options
- Damage on moves feels unrewarding sometimes
- takes incredible amount of effort to play well, especially in comparison to other heavy or medium weight characters but doesn't reward.
 

Sebas22

Smash Journeyman
Joined
May 28, 2019
Messages
317
It's absurd how little damage Wario deals, considering the herculean strength he posseses in his games. The man can suplex T-Rexs!
 

FrankTheStud

Smash Journeyman
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May 21, 2015
Messages
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FrankDaStud
It's absurd how little damage Wario deals, considering the herculean strength he posseses in his games. The man can suplex T-Rexs!
He just takes so much effort to play for such little reward. It's ridiculous how much lag his moves have. His forward smash is almost Falcon Punch levels of lag with half the power
 

USAnyan

Smash Cadet
Joined
Aug 28, 2018
Messages
60
I imagine that’s all to balance out waft and his raw aerial mobility. Thing is that means you have to play him pretty much extremely well to get much out of him. I imagine this level of learning curb is probably why he hasn’t really gotten any particularly huge buffs-although I’m sure this applies just as much to nerfs too since barely anyone has any faith in him besides anyone following tourney results.

If he actually does get something I hope they buff his recovery, his up b feels like an worst pretty much fun version of Mario’s, despite a worst double jump in the long run.
 

FrankTheStud

Smash Journeyman
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May 21, 2015
Messages
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FrankDaStud
I imagine that’s all to balance out waft and his raw aerial mobility. Thing is that means you have to play him pretty much extremely well to get much out of him. I imagine this level of learning curb is probably why he hasn’t really gotten any particularly huge buffs-although I’m sure this applies just as much to nerfs too since barely anyone has any faith in him besides anyone following tourney results.

If he actually does get something I hope they buff his recovery, his up b feels like an worst pretty much fun version of Mario’s, despite a worst double jump in the long run.
His aerial mobility is alright but he has to put himself in horrible situations to use and he ends up having to respect a majority of the cast as his hitboxes are small and doesn't trade well as he has no spikes or strong hitting aerials.
Heck his air mobility is good but it's risky to edgeguard with him because of how bad his trades are and how laggy his bair is.
Wario would benefit greatly from an actual killthrow.
 

MERPIS

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 28, 2015
Messages
1,700
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AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
Wario is literally one of the best characters in the game, he has zero problems killing and his damage output is made up for by the ridiculous combo game he has, he is by far the least laggy heavy in the game except for maybe yoshi, and this “effort to play” thing? Welcome to smash bros god forbid you actually need to learn to play a character rather than mash buttons like you do with dk and doc.
 
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