Wanna play Ike? Wanna know more? Zareidriel is taking questions.

[Zareidriel]

I'm sitting here with this Japanese brawl in front of me and Ike in my hands. Any questions?

Previously Answered Questions:

Does Ike spike with his Nair?
Don't think so, it's never gone below the horizontal plane as far as I've seen.

Does Quick Draw have little enough end lag to use in combos?
Usually too much end lag to do anything good out of, but depending on the opponent and the damage, Utilt, Usmash, or Aether may be effective.

What moves of Ike's have Super Armor Frames?
Eruption has SAF when Ike stabs his sword into the ground. Aether has it similarly, when he first throws the sword up. Thanks to Miller for correcting this.

Is Quick Draw (SideB) good for recovery, especially when charged for a large amount of time?
If you have a choice between Aether or Quick Draw for recovery, definitely use Quick Draw. It's hard to counter, its distance can be massive when charged in the air, and it's quick (as hinted at by the name).

Does the Fair spike?
Just like the Nair, I don't think so.

Will Counter reflect projectiles or damage the attacker?
No, Counter will nullify projectiles though. If you're close enough, you'll nullify the projectile and damage the enemy.

Will Aether spike?
I'll try it eventually, but even if it does, you'll both die. >_>

Does Ike have a Wall Cling?
Nope.

Is Ike able to grab the ledge, spike with Dair, and make it back to the ledge?
I think not, the lag from Dair is too huge, and Aether doesn't go high or far enough. I have been able to recover from doing a Bair, though.

Take a guess at the lag order of Ike's moves.

Here's my best estimate:

Bair
Aether
Quick Draw
Dair, Fair, Nair, Uair are really similar
UTilt
DSmash
Usmash
Eruption
FSmash

Disclaimer: Information I divulge may be inaccurate. If you have evidence against my claims, please tell me and I'll update the information.

 

[/~Dogma~\]

can ikes nair spike?
how much post lag is after sideb? can u combo after it?
where r any SAF?
if u charge side b in the air long enough can it cover insane distances?
can the ending stroke of his fair spike?
can counter reflect projectiles? can it damage the user who used the projectile?
can aether spike?
im pretty sure he cant but can ike wall cling?
is it safe to jump off edge and spike someone AND recover

try this combo and tell me if it works

AA tap r quickly sideb utilt aether
sry for the over kill of Q but ive been asking these for a long time

 

[Zareidriel]

It's not my turn yet so I'll answer the ones I know.

Nair Spike - TBA
SideB Lag - TBA
SAF? - What?
Insane SideB Distance - Yes, I've found side B to be an amazing recovery move, especially when charged long and sweetspotted.
Fair Spike - TBA
Projectile Counter Reflect - No, it just nullifies them.
Aether Spike - Not sure, but it wouldn't be a good idea to try cause you'd most likely kill yourself. >_>
Wall Cling - No.
Spike from Edge - No, his down air is way too long and Aether doesn't go high enough. You'd have to spike them from on the platform. I'm pretty sure if the other airs spike they'd be too slow as well.
Combo - TBA

I'll try some of the others when I play again.

 

[/~Dogma~\]

Super
Armour
Frames
this is were u cant be flinched but im sure u already knew that
yeah im saying aether suicides..XD
the counter disapoints me
but yeah if u wana try SAF charge eruption (you have it while ur charging) so lure someone in but in a combo that could work

side b jump dair spike they dont tech and try a get up move and ur charging eruption XD

 

[Zareidriel]

Yeah, Eruption has SAF, and I think Aether does too.

Update

Nair Spike - Not yet, pretty sure it doesn't.
SideB Lag - It really depends, usually there's too much lag to do anything.
SAF - Eruption has some, but I think Aether has more.
Fair Spike - Don't think so, we'll see.
Combo - I don't think it'll work, for two reasons; one, combos are too iffy and damage-dependent in any smash game, and there's usually to much lag time after the SideB to go into the utilt. Also, Aether is best when you hit them directly with the sword, if they go too high or too low, it won't work.

 

[/~Dogma~\]

hhhmmmm i see
but yea ike has SAF right ahen he throws his sword for upb unitl he lands and post lag is gone and he has SAF WHILE he charges eruption
hmmm i heard that side has very little lag after u hit someone but das okay...

 

[Zareidriel]

Actually, he doesn't have that much SAF with Eruption, most hits will still damage him and knock him out of the Eruption. And yeah, I thought there'd be less lag after the SideB, but there's a considerable amount.

 

[Deleted member]

General speed of moves.

Please could you rank which has the most lag, for example?

 

[Zareidriel]

Uh, this is going by memory, I'll revise later.

Lag Order, fastest to slowest:

Bair
Aether
Quick Draw
Dair, Fair, Nair, Uair are really similar
UTilt
DSmash
Usmash
Eruption
FSmash

FTilt and DTilt are useless as far as I've seen, so I didn't rank them. I'm really not sure.

Again, it's a really iffy list, I'm not sure on these.
As a side note, his best moves IMHO are USmash, Aether, and Quick Draw.

 

[WhiteOblv]

and his jab, his jab is very good.

 

[ama(m/t)]

dtilt spikes.

side B has extremely minimal lag if you whiff with it, so it can be used as an approach once you get the spacing down.

 

[Black Waltz]

could you try my "waltz of death" combo? @ 0%, uthrow>utilt>(opt. utlit)>usmash.
ty

 

[WhiteOblv]

short hoping from sheild to a spaced fair works well

 

[Fodder]

What move would be the most useful if a speedy character is charging Ike?

 

[/~Dogma~\]

AAA or quick draw

 

[DKpunch!]

Ike rocks.

 

[Zareidriel]

Quick Draw from the ground because of its high priority, if they're approaching from the air I'd suggest Aether.

I'll try the other things out tomorrow, the guy with Brawl went home for the day. But if you have any questions I can answer from memory, I can try to answer them.

 

[/~Dogma~\]

well how is ike overall how does he stack up against the rest of the cast

 

[GenG]

If there's fast people around you, just use AAA. Seriously, Ike lives because of this move, it's fast, powerful and sends people up to the sky were Ike dominates.

 

[Fizz-sama]

What I REALLY want to know at the current moment is the potential behind jab canceling. Yes, AAA is absolutely wonderful and awesome and I will not argue that for a moment, but I think jab canceling could open up a lot of doors that'll lead your opponent to a lot of sad faces, XD.

Either way, these are some of the things I was wondering:

1. How far/how much stun does the first jab give? Then the kick?
2. Given the damage and the first, second, or the first two attacks, what can you lead into?
a. f-tilt
b. d-smash
c. grab
3. Ike is sexy.

 

[/~Dogma~\]

alls i no is the first A deals damage and stun no knockback second deals a little knockback

 

[Fizz-sama]

I've heard the general properties of the attacks and what not, but I'd really like to see some tests on video from my last post.

 

[Zareidriel]

If I can get my video to work in this webcam instead of just pictures, I'll post video answers. Until then:

1. How far/how much stun does the first jab give? Then the kick?

From my experience, neither the jab nor the kick push very far, which often allows all three hits. But I've also experienced that there isn't always enough stun to protect Ike; certain attacks can break/punish the AAA.

2. Given the damage and the first, second, or the first two attacks, what can you lead into?
a. f-tilt
b. d-smash
c. grab

The f-tilt is way too slow, grabbing should work well, (though his grab range isn't nearly as good as Marth's) and the DSmash is a possibility depending on the character and damage.

3. Ike is sexy.

I'd do him. <_<

 

[/~Dogma~\]

............^^^^^^^>.<

 

[Fizz-sama]

If I can get my video to work in this webcam instead of just pictures, I'll post video answers. Until then:

1. How far/how much stun does the first jab give? Then the kick?

From my experience, neither the jab nor the kick push very far, which often allows all three hits. But I've also experienced that there isn't always enough stun to protect Ike; certain attacks can break/punish the AAA.

2. Given the damage and the first, second, or the first two attacks, what can you lead into?
a. f-tilt
b. d-smash
c. grab

The f-tilt is way too slow, grabbing should work well, (though his grab range isn't nearly as good as Marth's) and the DSmash is a possibility depending on the character and damage.

3. Ike is sexy.

I'd do him. <_<

Now, when you say his ftilt is too slow, do you think this would also apply to a A or AA combo at higher percentages? Either way, grabbing is good enough for me. I asked about the dsmash because of how quick I heard it was. Maybe, JUST maybe, it could lead to even more jab cancels, XDDD.

 

[Zareidriel]

Haha, yeah, DSmash is pretty quick, but it's only a line of effect instead of an arc, so it'll miss if the percentages are too high and they're in the air. And I think it'd apply at any percentage, the FTilt is like useless-slow. I mean, you can hit with it like Ike's other moves, but there's no reason to, since there are faster and better attacks.

 

[Miller]

Zareidriel, Read the PM I sent you. Also about Dair'ing and recovering, it does work, just make sure you still have your second jump afterwards. Also Aether doesn't nesseccarily "spike" but it drags them down with you. Do not use on your last life as you die first.

 

[Fizz-sama]

Haha, yeah, DSmash is pretty quick, but it's only a line of effect instead of an arc, so it'll miss if the percentages are too high and they're in the air. And I think it'd apply at any percentage, the FTilt is like useless-slow. I mean, you can hit with it like Ike's other moves, but there's no reason to, since there are faster and better attacks.

I'd experiment with it and put the videos up if I could, but alas. -_-

 

[Zareidriel]

Front page updated with a small correction. I'm trying to get video to work now, it should work by the time I play again, which should be tommorow.

Also, us Ikers have achieved a small victory; in a 16 person tournament today (no items/finals, Final D or Battlefield), I came in first. >8D Hoorah for the Ike community!

 

[/~Dogma~\]

rrrooooooaaaaarr moar ike this is were we start chanting ike.....

aaaasnnnyways good job were lookin forward to ur gameplay vidz

 

[Zink]

if you want high quality video, consider buying an Adaptec AVC-1400 Gamebridge. This model will allow you to plug the output from your Wii into your computer using their little gadget, and then record the result, so it's taken directly from the feed with no drop in quality. very nice stuff.
I wanna know exactly how well Ike kills. Like, take Mario to Final D and check the lowest percent you can kill him at from a set position with each move to see what his BEST kill moves are. yeah, I know, he kills everything anyway, but it would be awesome to see exactly what percentage range we can shoot for.

 

[/~Dogma~\]

^^^^^^ actually that is very important for seriuosly maining someone i did that with marth

 

[Zareidriel]

I'll see if I can try that out tommorow, good idea. And I'll see about the gamebridge thing.

 

[Doomblaze]

Do you think Ike will be able to keep up with characters like metaknight and mario in terms of competitive play? Meta and mario are amazing in brawl

 

[Zareidriel]

Actually, from what I've read, Meta and Mario are only mediocre. IMHO, he'll have problems with Pit, Marth, and Sonic.

 

[ZidaneK13]

Is Ike's counter as good as Roy's or Marth's even?

 

[GenG]

Ike's counter deals a % depending on the countered attack. Better than Marth's, although Marth's has improved this time around, it doesn't have fixed knockback anymore.

 

[Zareidriel]

It's definitely better than either Marth's or Roy's. The problem with Marth's counter is its lack of damage and knockback. Roy's problem was its lack of duration. Ike's has both; it lasts as long as Marth's, and has huuuge knockback and damage. If you can counter a smash attack, you'll probably kill them.

 

[ZidaneK13]

It's definitely better than either Marth's or Roy's. The problem with Marth's counter is its lack of damage and knockback. Roy's problem was its lack of duration. Ike's has both; it lasts as long as Marth's, and has huuuge knockback and damage. If you can counter a smash attack, you'll probably kill them.

That's just what I like to hear. Roy was one of my main's in melee and since he's gone I've been planning on using Ike instead. if Ike's counter is better then Roy's then Ike is already my fav character in Brawl. Any character with counter is good (so Lucario will probably be my third main for this game).

 

[-Aether]

A few questions:

If you're doing a ledge-hop to aerial (I assume this is possible), are any of your aerials really affective for that kind of offensive recovery? Few people seem to use ledge-hops to aerials - In melee, they were really good.

Have you tried doing that new advanced technique that lets you turn around an do B-airs with full foward momentum? I hear those are really good with Ike. The technique is called reverse aerial rushing (RAR) and can be found on the general forums.