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Villager's design philosophy?

Duck SMASH!

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I don't get it.
What did Sakurai have in mind when he made this character?
At first, you'd think heavy zoner, with the slingshots, lloid, tree, and whatnot.
And then there's pocket, which is one of the best neutral B moves in the game and completely invalidates other zoners with proper usage.
Ok fine. That makes sense.

Then you look at Villager's air game, and see Fair and Bair. That makes sense for him to have projectile aerials. Slingshot was a clever choice.
Then you see the other aerials.
His other aerials have hitboxes that last a year, and are surprisingly strong. Nair is better than Yoshi's at breaking combos, for example, and his Uair/Dair also last for years, completely shutting down attempts to challenge Villager in the air. I bet even Ike struggles to challenge Villager's Uair/Dair.
Ok, so he's a heavy zoner with a ridiculously strong air game. That's not too crazy, right?

But then you look at everything else...
His throws are surprisingly powerful - he has one of the strongest Bthrows in the game.
His Fsmash is stupidly powerful and extremely effective at edgeguarding. And even if you hit him, the ball still falls and can still kill you. If Villager is set up at the ledge, there is literally nothing you can do unless your recovery is good enough to allow you to stall, or power through the ball somehow....
His recovery is the kicker, being literally one of the best in the game... so if you don't kill Villager outright he's going to make it back unless you somehow only hit his balloons when edgeguarding.

I'm not saying he's broken or anything, but what the hell was Sakurai thinking in designing Villager? He never gets gimped, is excellent at zoning, some of his aerials cannot really be challenged, can also guarantee death if you're offstage once he sets up properly, and can kill with throws faster than freaking Bowser...
I don't get it.
What do you guys think he had in mind when he made Villager the way he is now?
 

zFrost

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landing lag from aerials suck, can't get low slingshots without it or approach well without reads and lloids, if u get outcamped u basically lose
 

AnchorTea

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We finally got a salt thread in the Villager boards. Took only a year.
 

AnchorTea

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It's not really salt as much as it is bafflement.
I call it salt because you make Villager sound more powerful than herself.

Sakurai wanted to make Villager a "Joker" type of character, almost like The Joker from Batman. Villager has out-of-this-world quirks for a character, can avoid dangrous situations with ease, and has tools to frustrate and cause stress on opponent(s). But once Batman (AKA You) manages to slip past all the traps and deceptive tools, its game over for Joker (AKA Villager).

Sakurai made Villager like this because... Well... Its sort of a joke. You gotta admit, its funny as hell to see a normal kid who fishes, catch bugs, and do innocent activities become a powerful character.

For an analogy: Remember those cliché Action/Adventure films where there is a character who is a kid that is slightly more clever than the adults and ends up surviving more situations? That's Villager in a nutshell.

And the Villy community love it. :4villager:
 

Duck SMASH!

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I call it salt because you make Villager sound more powerful than herself.

Sakurai wanted to make Villager a "Joker" type of character, almost like The Joker from Batman. Villager has out-of-this-world quirks for a character, can avoid dangrous situations with ease, and has tools to frustrate and cause stress on opponent(s). But once Batman (AKA You) manages to slip past all the traps and deceptive tools, its game over for Joker (AKA Villager).

Sakurai made Villager like this because... Well... Its sort of a joke. You gotta admit, its funny as hell to see a normal kid who fishes, catch bugs, and do innocent activities become a powerful character.

For an analogy: Remember those cliché Action/Adventure films where there is a character who is a kid that is slightly more clever than the adults and ends up surviving more situations? That's Villager in a nutshell.

And the Villy community love it. :4villager:
Well... when you put it that way, I guess it sorta makes sense......
Bizarro logic I guess...
 

De Wolfe

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Villager does not invalidate other zoners because of pocket. Infact some of his worst matchups are heavy projectile characters like Megaman and Toon Link.

His grab is pretty well balanced because its so slow to come out. You can't grab punish things that 90% of the rest of the cast can because of it and if you whiff the grab you're toast.

Villager is a strong character don't get me wrong, but hes nowhere near broken. He probably is one of the more 'annoying' characters to fight against though if you're unfamiliar with him or if you're one of his good matchups.
 

Tommy - S.N.

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Villager does not invalidate other zoners because of pocket. Infact some of his worst matchups are heavy projectile characters like Megaman and Toon Link.

His grab is pretty well balanced because its so slow to come out. You can't grab punish things that 90% of the rest of the cast can because of it and if you whiff the grab you're toast.

Villager is a strong character don't get me wrong, but hes nowhere near broken. He probably is one of the more 'annoying' characters to fight against though if you're unfamiliar with him or if you're one of his good matchups.
This might be better to mention in the MU thread but i'm not sure if TL is as bad as Megaman or Link is for us. Although it might just be me though...
 

zFrost

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i feel like tlink is pretty easy, at least at low to mid level where most tlinks don't have great bomb skills and have to rely more on boomerang
 

De Wolfe

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I've heard mixed things. I just feel like a smart Tlink can outprojectile villager and force him into bomb and grab traps. At lower levels its not so hard because Tlink actually takes quite a bit of skill to play and most Tlinks are pretty one dimensional. Its hard to get an idea on Villager matchups in general though because theres not a great amount of match vids with him outside of Ranai. Its even harder to find vids with Villager playing against some of the more obscure/lower tier characters who I think give him trouble like Palutena.

I still stand by the fact that pocket doesn't negate zoning though. Pocket is abit overrated in general imo. Its a situational/matchup dependent tool that requires good reactions and or reads to use vs alot of characters.
 
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Moosseff

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Villager isnt broken lol hes far from it. Hes not a high tier but hes not a low tier. I say the very lowest you can put him as mid. A good opponent with punish villagers recovery, grab whiffs, basically anything with landing lag can be punished as villager (Except nair dair and uair those dont count xD) His smashes although strong lack distance or speed. Dsmash is too slow, fsmash will only really be used at the edge, and usmash is a good anti aerial but really unsafe on block so its only really good for catching landings, bthrow kills but his only good grab is his pivot and even then its still bad lol. His tree kills but its similar to his upsmash in the sense that its only a good anti aerial. Axe kills but allsomeone has to do is sheild and it doesnt have as much range as his aerials. overall villager can kill as early as 60% but can keep their opponents alive because he struggles getting the kill. Believe me I played an amazing ZSS and he lived untill like 145% with proper DI
 

Darklink401

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Sakurai just wanted to make a broken character, then give him a crappy grab
So he made ZSS.
Then he's like
"This is fun"
And made Villager too.
 

arncakes

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Villager is moves super slow in the air and on the ground and can't do very much up close which are his two main drawbacks imo apart from the crappy grab/recovery already mentioned
 

Darklink401

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Villager is moves super slow in the air and on the ground and can't do very much up close which are his two main drawbacks imo apart from the crappy grab/recovery already mentioned
I do think he's the "Peach of Smash 4" in that he's one of the slowest in the game, but still top tier XP
 
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