Video Game Mafia 2 - End of Line

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Raxxel who do you actually want dead and why?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

On my cursory reread, yes, Rax is looking worse. You're looking better.

Curious on details here, just your thought process.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

For the record I am Damon Gant from ace attourney.

Can someone explain the scythe thing then?

 

[Raxxel]

Raxxel who do you actually want dead and why?

If I'm to be honest, you're who I want dead the most right now. As I mentioned, immediately voting during MYLO is a good way to jeopardize town's chances of winning. You did unvote, but I'm convinced it's because you realized how anti-town it made you look.

 

[Pythag]

Raxxel, you were worried about people voting yesterday, and the day passed without you even voting. It looks like you’re doing the same thing again here.

It looks like you’re trying to appear town.

 

[Pythag]

Well, for starters, you’re typically write shorter sentences. Brevity is good for town imo.

if UP and rax were both thought of as scummy, then maybe UP saw the writing on the wall for himself, and sacrificed himself while trying to “secret hammer” rax, while we take that as a scramble. that would successfully drop some of the heat around rax, and move town off the case. Before I didn’t think it could happen. Now I’m leaning kn

I also don’t like that yesterDay he didn’t vote.

we Might of had 3 townies arguing about who to lynch. But we had rax over here just arguing that voting is scummy in its own right. Yet he didn’t vote, so as not to appear scummy. I don’t think he has any convictions or ideas of who to vote, because he IS scum and doesn’t feel safe putting a vote out there.

He’s doing the same thing by just saying your vote and then unvote is scummy.

 

[Raxxel]

Well, for starters, you’re typically write shorter sentences. Brevity is good for town imo.

if UP and rax were both thought of as scummy, then maybe UP saw the writing on the wall for himself, and sacrificed himself while trying to “secret hammer” rax, while we take that as a scramble. that would successfully drop some of the heat around rax, and move town off the case. Before I didn’t think it could happen. Now I’m leaning kn

I also don’t like that yesterDay he didn’t vote.

we Might of had 3 townies arguing about who to lynch. But we had rax over here just arguing that voting is scummy in its own right. Yet he didn’t vote, so as not to appear scummy. I don’t think he has any convictions or ideas of who to vote, because he IS scum and doesn’t feel safe putting a vote out there.

He’s doing the same thing by just saying your vote and then unvote is scummy.

I honestly just got gimped by the deadline. I should've laid my vote down sooner, though it's ultimately irrelevant since the vote was nullified. Still, I don't see what you mean that I lacked convictions. I made my case as to why you should be the one we vote for. I avoided outright laying down a vote because I was concerned about the amount of scum left since we only ever flipped one, and if I was wrong and had a vote hanging out then scum could exploit it. I should have voted once we agreed upon you, yes, but I thought there was a genuine risk to doing so without agreement which is why I didn't immediately do it, and then missed the deadline. Also, if I was scum, 2 people had already laid down their vote for you. Why wouldn't I be opportunistic and hammer at that point when I was the one who initiated the conversation against you in the first place? I'd have already given my reasoning then, so it wouldn't look suspicious.

The UP plot doesn't make much sense to me. Consider that he was actively pushing the scum narrative before the wagon on me when he wrote that angered message towards me after my response to Z's bus driver claim. There's bussing by hopping on the wagon last minute, but then there's actively pushing for said wagon to begin in the first place. It's inconsistent if nothing else, I could see it if UP did this after the wagon was forming to disassociate, but he was partially responsible for casting suspicion on me in the first place. I also do want to note however, Red Ryu never voted for UP. He acknowledged UP's far more scummy behavior, but then only unvoted while doing nothing to push for a wagon on UP instead. It seems to me like he had every intention of letting me die still while trying to look less scummy for ignoring UP's tendencies later on. Also again worth noting that he did this only after it being pointed out out by Xivii. Someone with an active eye for scumhunting and speculation would have caught this on their own.

 

[Raxxel]

Regarding my point about the UP plot, look at it this way. Which is more likely, UP actively pushes to have his teammate lynched while he himself knows that he's likely next, essentially jeopardizing his entire team, then just 180s the plan altogether in hopes that the pressure is moved to him so that I don't somehow die anyway this far into a wagon, or UP knows he's being scumread, and knows that his teammate who also pushed for my lynch will be up on the chopping block when I flip town, so he acts scummier so that his teammate can disassociate from the wagon without looking suspicious and keep his name clear for later days? The latter seems simpler.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I reason I 180’d on UP is due to what Xivii argued with me on lynch, still.

Majority vote is on me, my dude. It's just three people basically raising the idea of a UP lynch instead, you and UP need to calm down, you're getting your lynch.

Also for the love of god if I'm already dead then next day PLEASE lynch UP that man hopped on a wagon last second without explanation and WIFOM'd. The fact that you're dismissive of that tier of scum behavior is remarkably scummy in of itself.

I need to think of this ******* set up is making me think too much on this.

Quotes like this are making me think if this is a bus or not.

UP’s acting look like that, which is why I also flipped on him that day.

How Raxxel reacted seems maybe more in line perhaps? Gonna vote today one way or another.

What are both your roles again?

 

[Pythag]

Yuki from the wonderful everyday down the rabbit hole - Dreaming God

Not only does RR really benefit from a reread, he seems to have caught Rax really really early on with his 'arm chair / sidelines play'.

I would also like to add that Rax claimed N. Trance from Crash Bandicoot.
no idea how much water it holds but :

https://crashbandicoot.fandom.com/wiki/N._Trance

It would appear that's an evil character.

@Rax,

I honestly just got gimped by the deadline. I should've laid my vote down sooner, though it's ultimately irrelevant since the vote was nullified. Still, I don't see what you mean that I lacked convictions. I made my case as to why you should be the one we vote for. I avoided outright laying down a vote because I was concerned about the amount of scum left since we only ever flipped one, and if I was wrong and had a vote hanging out then scum could exploit it. I should have voted once we agreed upon you, yes, but I thought there was a genuine risk to doing so without agreement which is why I didn't immediately do it, and then missed the deadline. Also, if I was scum, 2 people had already laid down their vote for you. Why wouldn't I be opportunistic and hammer at that point when I was the one who initiated the conversation against you in the first place? I'd have already given my reasoning then, so it wouldn't look suspicious.

Talk is cheap.

I think it's odd to be worried about how many scum are left at that stage in the game.

All this is self preservation stuff, which I think has been your entire game.

You would've seen opportunistic, because you were just kinda talking to the wind, and seeing if anyone would agree with you.

You wouldn't have if you were actually trying to pressure me instead of just letting everyone else talk and decide stuff.

The UP plot doesn't make much sense to me. Consider that he was actively pushing the scum narrative before the wagon on me when he wrote that angered message towards me after my response to Z's bus driver claim. There's bussing by hopping on the wagon last minute, but then there's actively pushing for said wagon to begin in the first place. It's inconsistent if nothing else, I could see it if UP did this after the wagon was forming to disassociate, but he was partially responsible for casting suspicion on me in the first place. I also do want to note however, Red Ryu never voted for UP. He acknowledged UP's far more scummy behavior, but then only unvoted while doing nothing to push for a wagon on UP instead. It seems to me like he had every intention of letting me die still while trying to look less scummy for ignoring UP's tendencies later on. Also again worth noting that he did this only after it being pointed out out by Xivii. Someone with an active eye for scumhunting and speculation would have caught this on their own.

consider the fact that if it's a bus, UP would ABSOLUTELY want to distance himself from you.

The last game I played the mafia set up a situation where the main lynch target tried to self hammer, but his mafia buddy, on the lynch, unvoted at the 'last second.' People coordinate and do stuff like this.

WRT RR and his vote on UP/you, I also didn't have my vote on UP until Xivii. Are you gonna find me scummy for that too?

Can't believe it Rax, there's 3 people left and 2 of them are scum! How unlucky! /s

Regarding my point about the UP plot, look at it this way. Which is more likely, UP actively pushes to have his teammate lynched while he himself knows that he's likely next, essentially jeopardizing his entire team, then just 180s the plan altogether in hopes that the pressure is moved to him so that I don't somehow die anyway this far into a wagon, or UP knows he's being scumread, and knows that his teammate who also pushed for my lynch will be up on the chopping block when I flip town, so he acts scummier so that his teammate can disassociate from the wagon without looking suspicious and keep his name clear for later days? The latter seems simpler.

But it wasn't the push for the lynch that cleared you, it was his 'try to hammer' play.

I'm inclined to believe that UP actually didn't 'miscount,' and try to hammer. He's a pretty active player and reads a lot. That's a hard sell for me. (at this point)

RR on reread, has been asking good questions, making connections, and trying to see what's going on.
You have pretty much just been hammering one note all game "this/that is anti town. That appears scummy...etc etc etc."

This is what I mean when I say RR looks way better.

 

[Raxxel]

I reason I 180’d on UP is due to what Xivii argued with me on lynch, still.



I need to think of this ******* set up is making me think too much on this.

Quotes like this are making me think if this is a bus or not.

UP’s acting look like that, which is why I also flipped on him that day.

How Raxxel reacted seems maybe more in line perhaps? Gonna vote today one way or another.

What are both your roles again?

N. Trance. I had a redact switch, ability to negate negative effects on players, and could send anonymous messages through PM.

 

[Raxxel]

Aight. Before I respond to what you're saying Pythag, I want to first ask what your abilities are. You too Ryu. Pythag, I remember you mentioning that you're offered an action that is random by TK every night. You mentioned you didn't know about its function until it plays out, but that makes me want to ask then, why were you so comfortable being voted for yesterday if you didn't know you would be resurrected/protected from the lynch?

 

[Pythag]

Aight. Before I respond to what you're saying Pythag, I want to first ask what your abilities are. You too Ryu. Pythag, I remember you mentioning that you're offered an action that is random by TK every night. You mentioned you didn't know about its function until it plays out, but that makes me want to ask then, why were you so comfortable being voted for yesterday if you didn't know you would be resurrected/protected from the lynch?

Lol, I got lynched yesterday, and you're honestly trying to make ME look suspicious because of it?

Where were you when Doop was trying to get himself lynched?


Once More

My Role :

I'm a dreaming god.

I'm aligned with town.

I have a list of 10 actions, with very random names :
(Pterodactyl, Outdated MTX, Absolutely Unhelpful, Ping, Crash Landing, etc)

I HAVE to choose one of them each night.

I'm not told what they do.

The ones I have done :

N1. Absolutely Unhelpful
N2. Crash Landing
N3. The Hitchhiker's Guide on How to Save a Life
N4. Pterodactyl

I did not use an ability N5 because functionally I was dead.



I was 'comfortable' being lynched because

This game is a frustrating puzzle box with not very clear logic.
I thought z25 was scummy, no one agreed, and because I couldn't figure out what was going on with xivii, doop and the rest, I just figured that I wouldn't be able to either 1. figure it out, and 2. convince anyone else.

I had my opinion, and my vote.

I saw a lot of opinions, but it mostly seemed like hemming and hawing, which I saw as ultimately fruitless.
(could be this, could be that, etc) None of that really means much until you actually vote.

So yeah, I was ready to be done with the game.
I said my piece, and I got voted out for it.
I was set to enjoy watching how it played out.

Then: oh joy, I'm still alive.



Here's what I see against you :

1. You're alive, and everyone was viewing you as town yesterDay. That should've been a scum pick off from the get go. Why was Z25 targetted and you not?
2. Your character in your game is evil, while Red's character and my character are good.
3. Strange interactions with UP at the beginning. Potential bus.
4. Kevin wanted you dead.
5. RR was on your case early about your play style, which you never really improved, and it still looks like self preservation. See : Still trying to find me scummy after you all lynched me.

I think a stronger play would've been if you had treated me as clear, and tried to get me to lynch Ryu. You're split though, and trying to play both sides. Since you don't find either of us scummy, you're trying to make both of us appear that way to one another.
This is what I mean when I say you're not speaking with conviction.

Here's what I see against RR:
1. Didn't vote UP until after Xivii's case (which is essentially what I did as well)

Anonymous voice has claimed that RR didn't kill kevin.


My thought is this :

N. Trance in the video game can hypnotize people.

Perhaps you could hypnotize people into carrying out the night kill.

 

[Pythag]

So Actually Rax.

You claim You can inhibit yourself in order to unlock other abilities.
What abilities did you unlock?
How have you used your actions?

 

[Raxxel]

Lol, I got lynched yesterday, and you're honestly trying to make ME look suspicious because of it?

Where were you when Doop was trying to get himself lynched?


Once More

My Role :

I'm a dreaming god.

I'm aligned with town.

I have a list of 10 actions, with very random names :
(Pterodactyl, Outdated MTX, Absolutely Unhelpful, Ping, Crash Landing, etc)

I HAVE to choose one of them each night.

I'm not told what they do.

The ones I have done :

N1. Absolutely Unhelpful
N2. Crash Landing
N3. The Hitchhiker's Guide on How to Save a Life
N4. Pterodactyl

I did not use an ability N5 because functionally I was dead.



I was 'comfortable' being lynched because

This game is a frustrating puzzle box with not very clear logic.
I thought z25 was scummy, no one agreed, and because I couldn't figure out what was going on with xivii, doop and the rest, I just figured that I wouldn't be able to either 1. figure it out, and 2. convince anyone else.

I had my opinion, and my vote.

I saw a lot of opinions, but it mostly seemed like hemming and hawing, which I saw as ultimately fruitless.
(could be this, could be that, etc) None of that really means much until you actually vote.

So yeah, I was ready to be done with the game.
I said my piece, and I got voted out for it.
I was set to enjoy watching how it played out.

Then: oh joy, I'm still alive.



Here's what I see against you :

1. You're alive, and everyone was viewing you as town yesterDay. That should've been a scum pick off from the get go. Why was Z25 targetted and you not?
2. Your character in your game is evil, while Red's character and my character are good.
3. Strange interactions with UP at the beginning. Potential bus.
4. Kevin wanted you dead.
5. RR was on your case early about your play style, which you never really improved, and it still looks like self preservation. See : Still trying to find me scummy after you all lynched me.

I think a stronger play would've been if you had treated me as clear, and tried to get me to lynch Ryu. You're split though, and trying to play both sides. Since you don't find either of us scummy, you're trying to make both of us appear that way to one another.
This is what I mean when I say you're not speaking with conviction.

Here's what I see against RR:
1. Didn't vote UP until after Xivii's case (which is essentially what I did as well)

Anonymous voice has claimed that RR didn't kill kevin.


My thought is this :

N. Trance in the video game can hypnotize people.

Perhaps you could hypnotize people into carrying out the night kill.

I asked a mere question because it definitely seemed odd you were alright with dying without the knowledge that you would come back beforehand, why are you getting so defensive? Also, watch the game play out? If you did die and didn't get brought back because of our lynch, there would be no game to play out, either you would be the last scum and we would win, or you would still be town, and two people, one of them being scum, would be left assuming Z25 still dies the night after, meaning a scum win via Endgame. This doesn't match either way. Are you saying you were essentially throwing?

As for the reasoning...
1. Very easily explainable. If Z was telling the truth about his redirection ability, the scum likely knew about it and wanted to get rid of it.
2. This falls apart when UP, our only known scum flip, turned out to be Ralsei.
3. Examples please.
4. This really isn't strong reasoning. What makes Kevin's word hold any weight?
5. This ironically comes across as self-preservation on your end. You have a problem with me not giving your actions a free pass? I want to analyze both of you, because I want to make the correct choice when I vote. If I only consider one possibility the entire time, I leave myself open to overlooking something and making the wrong decision entirely. Nobody is clear in this game, it's a ******* game lmao. You're trying to pressure me into not reading into your actions at all.

So, you're going to overlook that Ryu outright didn't vote for UP and was actually denying that UP was being scummier than I was until Xivii called it out? It's not "he didn't vote for UP until", it's "he didn't vote UP".

So Actually Rax.

You claim You can inhibit yourself in order to unlock other abilities.
What abilities did you unlock?
How have you used your actions?

I have the ability to negate negative effects on people. For example, I can correct the path of an action regardless of a bus driver's actions, or I can make a vote function normally. I can also send anonymous messages via PM. I attempted to use the effect negation on myself on n2. It didn't seem to work as nothing changed, I wonder if I was blocked somehow. N3 I wanted to anonymously message GLG to kill me so that I may see how he would respond. He perished however as we know. I then used my effect negation on Red Ryu n4. I have no idea if it did anything, perhaps if Z targeted him for the redirection thing then it didn't do through.

 

[Pythag]

As for the reasoning...
1. Very easily explainable. If Z was telling the truth about his redirection ability, the scum likely knew about it and wanted to get rid of it.

More than a 'clear'? I disagree.

2. This falls apart when UP, our only known scum flip, turned out to be Ralsei.

You mean the godfather? the scum who's supposed to appear good? Yeah, seems like it still holds up.

3. Examples please.

I just talked about it. You argued that since UP was leading the lynch against you, that clearly it couldn't be a bus.
I disagree.

If it's not a bus, then you're arguing that UP thought that you were L-1, and tried to hammer.
Is that what you think happened?

4. This really isn't strong reasoning. What makes Kevin's word hold any weight?

Kevin's good at this game, flipped town and wanted you and UP gone.

5. This ironically comes across as self-preservation on your end. You have a problem with me not giving your actions a free pass? I want to analyze both of you, because I want to make the correct choice when I vote. If I only consider one possibility the entire time, I leave myself open to overlooking something and making the wrong decision entirely. Nobody is clear in this game, it's a ******* game lmao. You're trying to pressure me into not reading into your actions at all.

I don't know how you can argue that I'm coming across as 'self preserving' while also accusing me of being 'comfortable' with my lynch yesterDay.

Which is it? Am I self preserving or am I self destructing?
You're not coming down hard on anything, and you haven't all game, aside from just label different actions as scummy.

So, you're going to overlook that Ryu outright didn't vote for UP and was actually denying that UP was being scummier than I was until Xivii called it out? It's not "he didn't vote for UP until", it's "he didn't vote UP".

Did you read the conversation around it though?

If I'm supposed to take your lack of voting yesterday as townie, then why is his lack of voting scummy?

I have the ability to negate negative effects on people. For example, I can correct the path of an action regardless of a bus driver's actions, or I can make a vote function normally. I can also send anonymous messages via PM. I attempted to use the effect negation on myself on n2. It didn't seem to work as nothing changed, I wonder if I was blocked somehow. N3 I wanted to anonymously message GLG to kill me so that I may see how he would respond. He perished however as we know. I then used my effect negation on Red Ryu n4. I have no idea if it did anything, perhaps if Z targeted him for the redirection thing then it didn't do through.

So, you didn't do anything N1?

N2 - self use
N3, you used on someone who died
N4, you used it on one of the two players, it can't really be confirmed what you did.

Were you also responsible for anonymous messages in the main thread?

 

[Pythag]

Why did you target RR with your negation? Wouldn't you have wanted to prevent z25 from being blocked?

 

[Pythag]

I’m an oracle or sorts and i’ll never be the target of a night kill.

RR, do you wanna expand on this?

You'll never be killed by the mafia?

That'd be awfully convenient.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Anonymous voice here, none of you killed KevinM

 

[Thirdkoopa]

In all fairness Raxxel, it doesn’t matter if something is more likely than another. I really don’t like the thought of you writing out the possibility of yourself being a mafiosi through chance, or simply, luck. If you’re really town, give us something more to work with than Utopian’s actions.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

RR, do you wanna expand on this?

You'll never be killed by the mafia?

That'd be awfully convenient.

I offered the idea of lynching me instead of Doop when he and Xivii got lynched.

I couldn't stop it when the lynch happened,

Unless someone has something else I think I am the weird psuedo cop in this game. Just for me I need to be lynched/night killed before my results are put out there.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

In all fairness Raxxel, it doesn’t matter if something is more likely than another. I really don’t like the thought of you writing out the possibility of yourself being a mafiosi through chance, or simply, luck. If you’re really town, give us something more to work with than Utopian’s actions.

Hi, whats up.

Who do you think is scum here so I can bump my ideas around.

I'm pretty sure it is Raxxel at this point.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Either way, gonna vote Raxxel unless my opinion changes one way or another.

Play wise I wrote him off due to UPs actions with the slot but I have a hard time seeing Pythag as scum at this point.

Sure I could be running in circles due to this set-up but frankly I don't want to over think this.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Before I forget, I should reveal my identity. Regrettably, I am not actually a living player at this moment. (This is the “I am a separate entity” poster for the record). While I would love to learn the identity of Anonymous Poster number 1, I am lucky enough to reveal myself as [BEEP] I believe that the other poster is Maven based on the nature of the posts as well as the timing of when they started appearing. however, I wouldn’t be surprised if Anonymous Poster 1 was never in the player list to begin with.

For clarification, I privately messaged TK if I was allowed to say who I am. He said there was never a rule prohibiting it. Frankly though, my existence as an Anonymous Poster shouldn’t be imperative to focus on. It would be much easier for everybody to accept the existence of Anonymous Posters and continue to add meaningful discussion, rather than rely on me to play the game.

Not that this was the case of course. Treat the APs as players in the game who can’t really contribute besides adding comments

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Huh... weird. It still censors who it is.

 

[Pythag]

These two posts man :

I'm not for a raxxel lynch because of hour UP was ready to just end him. Also feeling the slot is more likely town.

I'm not convinced it was a bus given how UP posted yesterday.

I doubt Xivii is with UP given his push to get him lynched. Right move would have been to keep it on Raxxel as scum.

Kevin kill is weird,

I'm down to lynch Z25, what is he at?

Also considering seeing myself lynched would help with many things currently in play. otherwise I see myself being a liability and might need to use my role now than later.

I'm trying to figure if you're setting something up, or if this is a super safe statement to make since no one was even considering you.

Play wise I wrote him off due to UPs actions with the slot but I have a hard time seeing Pythag as scum at this point.

Sure I could be running in circles due to this set-up but frankly I don't want to over think this.

This is mainly how I'm thinking.

Though AP trying to help out Rax makes me wonder even further what the heck is going on.
I still don't know what to make of the fact that none of us killed kevin. Are we just against a 3rd party?

I'm close to just saying GG whoever, and letting the chips fall where they may.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

These two posts man :





I'm trying to figure if you're setting something up, or if this is a super safe statement to make since no one was even considering you.



This is mainly how I'm thinking.

Though AP trying to help out Rax makes me wonder even further what the heck is going on.
I still don't know what to make of the fact that none of us killed kevin. Are we just against a 3rd party?

I'm close to just saying GG whoever, and letting the chips fall where they may.

I had an oracle set one on Z25 and one on Giraffelasergun, Maven died who was my day 1 pick.

I pick during the day for these actions.

That's why I was offering it at the time.

Answers a potential lynch and I wasn't doing enough.

Right now if I die I reveal Raxxel, not like it matters. It's why I didn't pick anyone yesterday but whoops. Busy.

vote: Raxxel

Gonna go this way.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

First off, very funny TK. I mean, I guess it doesn't really matter. I was going to post my actions and whatnot, but I can't do that for you.

Secondly, and a bit more meta, these messages were written on Tuesday, even it took a while for TK to post. I should probably timestamp these. It's Thursday today.

I don't want to let this message go to waste, so here we go. It was a pleasure to play with everybody, but I don't think I'll be able to stick around for postgame. I figured I could give my final thoughts early. I'll try to keep them pertained to toDay's events.




This has to be one of the worst massclaims that I've seen for all my years of playing. Raxxel's are near impossible to prove and rely on many conviences, Pythag reiterates the gamerule with no indication of alignment whatsoever, and Red Ruy's abilities seem to correlate with a mafiosi's abilities, and cannot be disproven. All in all, it would have been best for Pythag to predict a gamerule, because there's no indication about whether its Pythag or Theo behind the scenes. For Raxxel... you must have gotten screwed over REALLY bad if you're town, because your targets have to be the absolute worst. Finally, it's Ruy's turn. Now, I know you have more history than the other two left... and... I think you have a very safe fakeclaim. You are the Oracle, of sorts might I add, who cannot be killed. While I am skeptical of Raxxel simply for the fact that none of his ability have been confirmed, and somewhat of Pythag for just reiterating TK's posts, I really don't enjoy this level of ambiguity.

Now, here are some player specific points that I noticed today.

Pythag: Even though I don't think you had a great claim, I am getting complete town vibes from you. So far, nobody questioned your gamerules, and you seem to be genuinely considering both sides of the coin as you progress, unlike the other two. I'm feeling that the game is going to fall into your hands, as either of them could be a mafiosi in my mind. You have been equally objective of both parties, and piece apart everybody's post to ask meaningful questions. While I don't necessarily think that Raxxel is the most sus, it's the effort to progress discussion that leaves the impression that you're town. You make good points, and this is one of your best games imo. 5/5 town

Raxxel: Oh my lord, come up with more reasoning. It feels like your defenses for yourself are kind of stale, and I get that creating arguments comes with practice, but you need to move past UP's wagon to show other aspects of your game. If I wasn't as suspicious of Ruy, I would probably vote for you as an informative lynch. However, you have never used a night action before today, so I guess that it's understandable on why it is difficult to confirm your alignment. Don't make me regret giving you the benefit of the doubt. My advice for you is to breadcrumb more often, and don't try to self-preserve. You are alive to help the town, not to survive as long as you can. Of course, that depends if you're the Indy Survivor. However, I know that to be impossible because I was an indy. 2/5 town

Ruy: Ah yes. To cut to the chase, my advice for you is, if you're town, to be more bold. You have been listening to the majority / who you believe are most likely to be town, and just rolling with their decisions. Granted, an unsure townie is best to buddy with someone that they believe are town to help get them out, and that's great! It worked with UP's lynch in this game! However, this play being used by a mafiosi can allow them to scoot through the days, appealing to the town ringleaders with a history of successful lynches. I feel like that's what's happening here. You're too good of a player to conveniently make it to the end to not post much content on the last day when Pythag is leaning towards Raxxel. And, as scum, you could also safely put a vote on Raxxel because it would influence Pythag, and hey: at least it's not you. Your position on the second to last Day was that it was Pythag, because you couldn't see the other two being scum. Now, once Pythag is basically town confirmed after his reincarnation, you have no choice but to resort to Raxxel. You have been mostly neutral, or, if I may, a loungechair critic. Slightly more decisive than an armchair critic, but enough of a resume to go under the radar as the easier lynches disappear.


But what do I know? I already lost the game, but I'm going to help town out and leave. I would have posted my actions, but I feel like they would just get censored or something.

 

[Pythag]

Daggone

I can’t believe I didn’t claim what rule I was going to use in advance. It wouldn’t have done anything last night, as I was dead.

AP has also posted pretty much what I’m thinking.

It’s a coin flip to me.

Ryu hasn’t been especially wordy the entire game, but I don’t think that means he’s been anti town.

Its just :
super safe claim vs. super unlucky actions

Super brevit and chill vs. super talky and nervous.

I can see both being scum.
Rax you got anything for me?

 

[Raxxel]

More than a 'clear'? I disagree.


You mean the godfather? the scum who's supposed to appear good? Yeah, seems like it still holds up.



I just talked about it. You argued that since UP was leading the lynch against you, that clearly it couldn't be a bus.
I disagree.

If it's not a bus, then you're arguing that UP thought that you were L-1, and tried to hammer.
Is that what you think happened?



Kevin's good at this game, flipped town and wanted you and UP gone.



I don't know how you can argue that I'm coming across as 'self preserving' while also accusing me of being 'comfortable' with my lynch yesterDay.

Which is it? Am I self preserving or am I self destructing?
You're not coming down hard on anything, and you haven't all game, aside from just label different actions as scummy.



Did you read the conversation around it though?

If I'm supposed to take your lack of voting yesterday as townie, then why is his lack of voting scummy?



So, you didn't do anything N1?

N2 - self use
N3, you used on someone who died
N4, you used it on one of the two players, it can't really be confirmed what you did.

Were you also responsible for anonymous messages in the main thread?

1. Clearly I'm not clear however. Also, wasn't Ryu also pretty clear from the rest? Hell, I'm pretty sure we cleared him more than we cleared me given that we agreed the scythe wasn't his work. Why is this same line of thinking not extended to him?

2. So, I looked up Damon Gant (Red Ryu's role). Spoilers for the game he's from, he's evil. He's a corrupt district chief of police who murdered someone.

3. I mean, I thought I was L-1 before UP voted me. That's why my response to that assumed that I was already dead. I don't think UP thought the same however given his push for others to vote for me.

4. This is still just based on his read and not his reasoning for it. Keep in mind how early into the game it was, especially since day 1 barely had much in the way of scumhunting and was just us arguing about the game's setup, even a good player can't really have a solid read yet.

5. I'm accusing you of being comfortable with your lynch yesterday because I think you knew you wouldn't be killed. You don't have that same privilege today, which is why your actions have come across as self preservation.

The lack of voting has two different contexts, no? Once again, while I understand that after the fact it means little to you, I had the intention to lay my vote down for you yesterday, but the deadline caught up first. I also laid down the case as to why you were to be voted for, I prompted the conversation, and Ryu essentially just rode the wave. Which are you really willing to trust, the person who laid down their reasoning in the first place, or the person who merely voted? As for Ryu's lack of voting against UP, at the time we knew the deadline was coming up quick. He supposedly at this point decided UP was more scummy than me, and yet he did nothing nothing to turn the wagon around and stop me from dying. As you said, talk is cheap. He may have unvoted me, but that hardly matters given the overarching majority vote on me that would lynch me anyway had we not gotten lucky and had both TK and ? voting for UP. He did not do what he could to ensure the outcome that he supposedly wanted that day. Compare that to my vote ultimately being inconsequential to you since the majority vote was on you anyway. There is a difference.

N1 I used the redaction switch on myself.

No, I don't have that power. At most, I could maybe have PM'd whoever is sending those messages if they happen to be ?.

 

[Raxxel]

Also, given you didn't take advantage of Ryu's vote just now, I'm going to assume you're town Pythag. So, that leaves me with Ryu, which makes sense anyway despite my grievances with how you played. So, I'll make this a little easier for you.

Vote: Red Ryu

You obviously don't have to vote now and I much prefer we keep talking, but you are indeed responsible for this game's outcome.

I do want to ask one thing. What did you think of Xivii? I noticed they never flipped.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

First off, very funny TK. I mean, I guess it doesn't really matter. I was going to post my actions and whatnot, but I can't do that for you.

Secondly, and a bit more meta, these messages were written on Tuesday, even it took a while for TK to post. I should probably timestamp these. It's Thursday today.

I don't want to let this message go to waste, so here we go. It was a pleasure to play with everybody, but I don't think I'll be able to stick around for postgame. I figured I could give my final thoughts early. I'll try to keep them pertained to toDay's events.




This has to be one of the worst massclaims that I've seen for all my years of playing. Raxxel's are near impossible to prove and rely on many conviences, Pythag reiterates the gamerule with no indication of alignment whatsoever, and Red Ruy's abilities seem to correlate with a mafiosi's abilities, and cannot be disproven. All in all, it would have been best for Pythag to predict a gamerule, because there's no indication about whether its Pythag or Theo behind the scenes. For Raxxel... you must have gotten screwed over REALLY bad if you're town, because your targets have to be the absolute worst. Finally, it's Ruy's turn. Now, I know you have more history than the other two left... and... I think you have a very safe fakeclaim. You are the Oracle, of sorts might I add, who cannot be killed. While I am skeptical of Raxxel simply for the fact that none of his ability have been confirmed, and somewhat of Pythag for just reiterating TK's posts, I really don't enjoy this level of ambiguity.

Now, here are some player specific points that I noticed today.

Pythag: Even though I don't think you had a great claim, I am getting complete town vibes from you. So far, nobody questioned your gamerules, and you seem to be genuinely considering both sides of the coin as you progress, unlike the other two. I'm feeling that the game is going to fall into your hands, as either of them could be a mafiosi in my mind. You have been equally objective of both parties, and piece apart everybody's post to ask meaningful questions. While I don't necessarily think that Raxxel is the most sus, it's the effort to progress discussion that leaves the impression that you're town. You make good points, and this is one of your best games imo. 5/5 town

Raxxel: Oh my lord, come up with more reasoning. It feels like your defenses for yourself are kind of stale, and I get that creating arguments comes with practice, but you need to move past UP's wagon to show other aspects of your game. If I wasn't as suspicious of Ruy, I would probably vote for you as an informative lynch. However, you have never used a night action before today, so I guess that it's understandable on why it is difficult to confirm your alignment. Don't make me regret giving you the benefit of the doubt. My advice for you is to breadcrumb more often, and don't try to self-preserve. You are alive to help the town, not to survive as long as you can. Of course, that depends if you're the Indy Survivor. However, I know that to be impossible because I was an indy. 2/5 town

Ruy: Ah yes. To cut to the chase, my advice for you is, if you're town, to be more bold. You have been listening to the majority / who you believe are most likely to be town, and just rolling with their decisions. Granted, an unsure townie is best to buddy with someone that they believe are town to help get them out, and that's great! It worked with UP's lynch in this game! However, this play being used by a mafiosi can allow them to scoot through the days, appealing to the town ringleaders with a history of successful lynches. I feel like that's what's happening here. You're too good of a player to conveniently make it to the end to not post much content on the last day when Pythag is leaning towards Raxxel. And, as scum, you could also safely put a vote on Raxxel because it would influence Pythag, and hey: at least it's not you. Your position on the second to last Day was that it was Pythag, because you couldn't see the other two being scum. Now, once Pythag is basically town confirmed after his reincarnation, you have no choice but to resort to Raxxel. You have been mostly neutral, or, if I may, a loungechair critic. Slightly more decisive than an armchair critic, but enough of a resume to go under the radar as the easier lynches disappear.


But what do I know? I already lost the game, but I'm going to help town out and leave. I would have posted my actions, but I feel like they would just get censored or something.

Not really, the big reason I have been lurky is my job and my stuff outside of work.

Keeps me super busy, 22 hours of overtime these few weeks.

This might be the last game for me for a bit unless I can super dedicate to a mafia game. I did a poor job this game with it. A lot of people have used it as a scum tell for me when really it’s not old 2011 ruy who lurks anymore.

Honestly I just see Raxxel was my gut pick earlier on, and given Pythag did not auto vote to hammer. Seems I was right with my earlier gut reads.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Daggone

I can’t believe I didn’t claim what rule I was going to use in advance. It wouldn’t have done anything last night, as I was dead.

AP has also posted pretty much what I’m thinking.

It’s a coin flip to me.

Ryu hasn’t been especially wordy the entire game, but I don’t think that means he’s been anti town.

Its just :
super safe claim vs. super unlucky actions

Super brevit and chill vs. super talky and nervous.

I can see both being scum.
Rax you got anything for me?

Not much I can do about it outside or what I posted before the Doop Lynch asking to lynch me instead when I was not on the table.

You make the call.

Not much else I can say really for myself.

 

[Pythag]

Yeah, I'm thinking.

Now that I'm here I don't freaking want to lose.

I'm still leaning Rax.

The only question I have is what it would mean if RR didn't kill kevin.
Was he a mafia who got roleblocked, and kevin died from a third party?

I do want to ask one thing. What did you think of Xivii? I noticed they never flipped.

My thought is he was town aligned third party turned jester due to the contract.

If you look at the flips, they give you colors.
Maven was Green
UP was red
Xivii was like black / yellow
Doop was yellow
I was black.

I don't think xivii was always a jester, which is why I was believing his take on being a tracker.
If he turned jester that day though, he could've just been faking it to try to get lynched. ::shrug::

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Pythag says “Xivii was a town-aligned third party turned Jester” based on the colors. Pythag flip was also black. Third party slip by Pythag.

That doesn’t really mean much for the reasons I already gave, but it’s a note. While Red doesn’t need to post every day, as irl always comes first, the posts they made have been unbelievably passive.

 

[Pythag]

It wasn’t a slip dude. Ha, I was kinda brandishing that.

I only win with town. I was very surprised to see my color be black instead of green.

 

[Pythag]

I'm thinking the oracle claim now is kinda lazy.

looks like lame bread crumbing.

When's deadline?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I'm thinking the oracle claim now is kinda lazy.

looks like lame bread crumbing.

When's deadline?

We don’t know and have never known.

 

[Pythag]

Vote Red Ryu

Sorry everyone. Hard decision.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Was town, oh well