Broasty
Smash Journeyman
Project Goal: To create a complete chain grab chart for every matchup so you know the following
-What percents you have a guaranteed chain grab
-What percents you can react to the opponent and get a chain grab
-What percents you can predict the opponent and get a chain grab
-What throws to do in order to accomplish a chain grab
-What grab actions to do in order to CG in these ranges
=Phase 1: Complete=
What:
This phase's objective was to make CG chart for the whole cast with no DI. The reason for this is to get a general idea of the grab characteristics of Luigi and it's effect on the diverse PM cast.
How:
In Training mode, I tested 3 types of grab possibilities at every 5% for each character and recorded my results. I tested each point in the data about 10 times consecutively by pressing start twice (which causes no DI) while the opponent is grabbed. After Down Throwing (or in the exception cases which are marked of Up Throw), I used the rumble on the controller to determine the exact moment which I can follow up with a type of grab (the timing AFTER the rumble finishes is the same for all characters, though the timing from initiating the DThrow is not). Once I noticed the opponent could easily do something to get out of the grab outside of DI, including watching the CPU Airdodge its way out, I stop the iterations.
How to read the chart:
-Unless specified, the throw is Down Throw.
-The percent denotes what the percent is right before you do the throw
-1 is Pivot grab
-2 is Jump Canceled Grab
-3 is Running Grab
-Unless a delay is specified, the grab action was done the exact moment you can act using the rumble method
-L means the character's trajectory was too low to be CG'd
-R means the character is in range to be CG'd
-H means the character's trajectory is too high to be CG'd
Where is it:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Qp7uZSxhGVBfzguHM_lPhuq2-QZsXyd58bwB0pCLzLg/edit?usp=sharing
What to take from this:
-If you think you can CG, do a JC Grab.
-Don't bother trying to CG
(unless <=5%)(unless >=10%)
-Chances are the Spacies can be CG'd for the most part, but there exists a point between when you should UThrow and DThrow where they can't be CG'd at all
-Rumble can be used to determine follow up timing on ALL matchups
-Grabs are EXTREMELY underrated for Luigi
=Phase 2: In progress=
What:
The goal of this phase is to figure out the ranges in the data which allow us to reach the goals of the whole project.
-Percent Range you have a guaranteed chain grab
-Percent Range you can react to the opponent and get a chain grab
-Percent Range you can predict the opponent and get a chain grab
-Throws to do in order to accomplish a chain grab
-Follow up actions to accomplish the chain grab
Let me elucidate what exactly these ranges dictate.
1. Guaranteed: The opponent has no option to get out of the follow up CG. If executed perfectly, you will get the CG.
2. React: The opponent has the options to get out of the follow up CG, but you can simply react to their position in order to pull of the CG. If executed perfectly, you will get the CG.
3. Predict: The opponent has the options to get out of the follow up CG, but they are limited to DI in a range that you could CG them. If you predict the opponent's DI correctly using the corresponding action, you will get the CG.
The following grabs would apply to 2 and 3.
Pivot Grab
Dash Grab
JC Grab
WD Grab
WD Pivot Grab
Why does this matter to you (a Luigi player)?
Because CG knowledge will allow you to know what your hardest punish is based off the percent before you throw. Whenever you pull off a grab on a CG'able character, you have the opportunity to circumnavigate the entire neutral game using your knowledge of the game. This is a big thing for Luigi since he's extremely easy to get off stage and edge guard.
Wanna make this thing happen faster?
It took about 20-30 hours to make this sheet...and this is a pretty controlled case. As such, I'd imagine this would take a REALLY LONG TIME to do my self. So, I'm asking you guys, my fellow Luigi brethren, to help take the Luigi Meta to a whole new level. I think the best way to go about this is to just take one character to work with per person and go from there. As far as getting those data points, you're gonna need a friend to control the opponent character so they can test the following possibilities:
DI towards the left
DI towards the right
Fastest acting attack (like Luigi's Nair for example)
Airdodge
Who's down to change the tier list?!? :D
-What percents you have a guaranteed chain grab
-What percents you can react to the opponent and get a chain grab
-What percents you can predict the opponent and get a chain grab
-What throws to do in order to accomplish a chain grab
-What grab actions to do in order to CG in these ranges
=Phase 1: Complete=
What:
This phase's objective was to make CG chart for the whole cast with no DI. The reason for this is to get a general idea of the grab characteristics of Luigi and it's effect on the diverse PM cast.
How:
In Training mode, I tested 3 types of grab possibilities at every 5% for each character and recorded my results. I tested each point in the data about 10 times consecutively by pressing start twice (which causes no DI) while the opponent is grabbed. After Down Throwing (or in the exception cases which are marked of Up Throw), I used the rumble on the controller to determine the exact moment which I can follow up with a type of grab (the timing AFTER the rumble finishes is the same for all characters, though the timing from initiating the DThrow is not). Once I noticed the opponent could easily do something to get out of the grab outside of DI, including watching the CPU Airdodge its way out, I stop the iterations.
How to read the chart:
-Unless specified, the throw is Down Throw.
-The percent denotes what the percent is right before you do the throw
-1 is Pivot grab
-2 is Jump Canceled Grab
-3 is Running Grab
-Unless a delay is specified, the grab action was done the exact moment you can act using the rumble method
-L means the character's trajectory was too low to be CG'd
-R means the character is in range to be CG'd
-H means the character's trajectory is too high to be CG'd
Where is it:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Qp7uZSxhGVBfzguHM_lPhuq2-QZsXyd58bwB0pCLzLg/edit?usp=sharing
What to take from this:
-If you think you can CG, do a JC Grab.
-Don't bother trying to CG
(unless <=5%)(unless >=10%)-Chances are the Spacies can be CG'd for the most part, but there exists a point between when you should UThrow and DThrow where they can't be CG'd at all
-Rumble can be used to determine follow up timing on ALL matchups
-Grabs are EXTREMELY underrated for Luigi
=Phase 2: In progress=
What:
The goal of this phase is to figure out the ranges in the data which allow us to reach the goals of the whole project.
-Percent Range you have a guaranteed chain grab
-Percent Range you can react to the opponent and get a chain grab
-Percent Range you can predict the opponent and get a chain grab
-Throws to do in order to accomplish a chain grab
-Follow up actions to accomplish the chain grab
Let me elucidate what exactly these ranges dictate.
1. Guaranteed: The opponent has no option to get out of the follow up CG. If executed perfectly, you will get the CG.
2. React: The opponent has the options to get out of the follow up CG, but you can simply react to their position in order to pull of the CG. If executed perfectly, you will get the CG.
3. Predict: The opponent has the options to get out of the follow up CG, but they are limited to DI in a range that you could CG them. If you predict the opponent's DI correctly using the corresponding action, you will get the CG.
The following grabs would apply to 2 and 3.
Pivot Grab
Dash Grab
JC Grab
WD Grab
WD Pivot Grab
Why does this matter to you (a Luigi player)?
Because CG knowledge will allow you to know what your hardest punish is based off the percent before you throw. Whenever you pull off a grab on a CG'able character, you have the opportunity to circumnavigate the entire neutral game using your knowledge of the game. This is a big thing for Luigi since he's extremely easy to get off stage and edge guard.
Wanna make this thing happen faster?
It took about 20-30 hours to make this sheet...and this is a pretty controlled case. As such, I'd imagine this would take a REALLY LONG TIME to do my self. So, I'm asking you guys, my fellow Luigi brethren, to help take the Luigi Meta to a whole new level. I think the best way to go about this is to just take one character to work with per person and go from there. As far as getting those data points, you're gonna need a friend to control the opponent character so they can test the following possibilities:
DI towards the left
DI towards the right
Fastest acting attack (like Luigi's Nair for example)
Airdodge
Who's down to change the tier list?!? :D