The Daitoryo for Smash 4 Thread. Goko; opponent wins game 4. (Disconfirmed)

[BluePikmin11]

I played the Okami DS demo not too long ago, I would love for Daitouryou to have that kind of style of fighting in Smash.

 

[Pacack]

I played the Okami DS demo not too long ago, I would love for Daitouryou to have that kind of style of fighting in Smash.

I'd enjoy that too. Especially considering the HD.

And welcome to page 8, guys!

 

[BluePikmin11]

Looks like have a new rumor in our hands:

Not sure if this has been posted yet. If it has, my bad.

New leak from the NeoGAF. I dunno about this one.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=97630169&postcount=9607

First off, I do not know what Sakurai plans to update with for individual POTDs, as he does it as his own pace bar special examples like revealing characters to coincide with releases and Nintendo Directs.

Anyway, I have been talking to a source of mine who knows quite a bit about Smash 4, and has shared with me various details that I have compiled, some of this info is based on planned content and may not make it into the final cut, however, he believes that at this point in time everything is more or less set.

First, the only cuts are Snake (due to issues with Konami), and Lucario and Ike, due to lacking "relevancy" when the character roster was being formed.

Newcomers are Villager, WFT, Mega Man, Rosalina, Little Mac, Mii, Pac-Man, Medusa, Mewtwo, Genesect, Mach Rider, Chrom, and a new original character named "Master Hanafuda". Little Mac will be the next newcomer to be revealed, but I am not sure when, but in a soon-to-be Nintendo Direct.

Rather than typing up the mass amount of info I've been given, instead I will answer questions asked about what is, or isn't, included in Smash. Believe me or not, but I shall provide answers regardless to any question.

Says the the new original character will be "Master Hanafuda."
Seems really interesting.

 

[Pacack]

Looks like have a new rumor in our hands:

Says the the new original character will be "Master Hanafuda."
Seems really interesting.

I'm calling fake, but I would be interested to see myself proven wrong.

Also, expect a new support thread from me soon. I've stumbled across another very interesting character that may serve as competition to Daitoryo on these boards.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

Looks like have a new rumor in our hands:

Says the the new original character will be "Master Hanafuda."
Seems really interesting.

Link to dairoyu rumor

 

[BluePikmin11]

The link was there in the quote but ok.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=97630169&postcount=9607

 

[Pacack]

You know that "never appeared on actual cards" thing?

Stumbled across this in my research:

I'll update you guys if I find more like this. This deck is circa 1947-1951. Seems that he's on a little more than just Hanafuda cards.

 

[Zzuxon]

Yay, thread not dead.

 

[Pacack]

Yay, thread not dead.

I'm trying, at least. Hard to keep the supporters interested and talking. I mean, he's just a historical character, after all. Not tons to talk about.

Though, if anyone's interested, we could work on making a moveset based around an interesting gimmick for Daitoryo. If Daitoryo combos using moves that are associated with matching cards, they will do more damage and knockback, making him a very powerful, in your face sort of character, but balancing him out by making him fairly predictable as a result. The reason I haven't really worked on it myself is because this is a very difficult thing to do. We need to design moves in a way that they'll combo well (something like down throw moves people into position where you can do down a, which lets you do side b or up air, etc.) if they are in the same family and would get you points in a game of Koi-Koi, while making them lousy to combo and fairly weak if they're of completely different card families (like brights and ribbons). It's not the easiest thing to design, but it would make Daitoryo one of the most unique characters in the game, with a very interesting, fast-paced playstyle that's combo-oriented, but predictable once you decide what you're sticking to, just like a game of Koi-Koi. If you decide to attack with a certain set of attacks, it would be best to stick with those moves so that they gain power and knockback. If you decided to switch it, you're punished by reverting back to weak attacks until you get going for a bit. Then, of course, to balance things out, the sets that have more cards (moves) would have less startup and ending lag, but would be weaker, while ones with only three or so cards would have higher startup and ending lag, but would be far more powerful. Then, there's the possibility that we wouldn't be able to fit all the cards into his moveset in a balanced way, so we might have to implement a shuffling aspect to his moves to give him room (imagine that, the first time you use side-b, it's one move, while the second time you use it, it's another. Then, maybe, if there are two or three of the same cards (commons) in the deck, you would be able to use the the move based off of those cards two or three times before it switches.) It's complicated, but it would be really cool and really worth it to give him a truly unique playstyle.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Maybe I'll make a moveset soon, I think I got a good grasp of what Daitouryou's normal attacks could be.

 

[dimensionsword64]

No thank you. He's too obscure, even by Sakurai's standards.

 

[Pacack]

No thank you. He's too obscure, even by Sakurai's standards.

I highly doubt that's the case. Sakurai knows more about Nintendo than practically anybody. He'd at least be familiar with the Daitoryo deck.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Definitely not obscure, explain why Hanafuda cards are still being made by Nintendo to this day, that shows it's not really obscure.

 

[dimensionsword64]

I highly doubt that's the case. Sakurai knows more about Nintendo than practically anybody. He'd at least be familiar with the Daitoryo deck.

Sakurai may know about him, but barely anyone else does. People would be wondering why some old-fashioned guy with a deck of cards would be fighting Mario and Pikachu.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Sakurai may know about him, but barely anyone else does. People would be wondering why some old-fashioned guy with a deck of cards would be fighting Mario and Pikachu.

Everyone in the US, but it's technically very well known in Japan.

 

[dimensionsword64]

Everyone in the US, but it's technically very well known in Japan.

The US is a fairly large part of Nintendo's customers, so it's important that we at least know who the character is.
(Although Sakurai may not think this way)
And he doesn't fit at all (in my opinion) into Smash Bros. He's important to Nintendo, but I don't think he could fit well in a Smash Bros game.

 

[BluePikmin11]

He could definitely fit, he made Snake fit into a Smash Bros. game, which would've been really damn hard to translae well before the Brawl trailer was revealed, it's just pretty hard to think of a moveset when you're not familar with the Hanafuda cards.

 

[dimensionsword64]

He could definitely fit, he made Snake fit into a Smash Bros. game, which would've been really damn hard to translae well before the Brawl trailer was revealed, it's just pretty hard to think of a moveset when you're not familar with the Hanafuda cards.

I'm not familiar with the cards, so that may be part of it, but the main problem I have with him is he literally is a guy, sometimes called Napoleon, who looks like he was ripped right out of real world history. I can't picture him fighting Mario, Link, and Kirby.

 

[BluePikmin11]

It's pretty easy to imagine actually, it's Napoleon with an Okami-vibe art style, which suits the world of Smash Bros. very well.

 

[dimensionsword64]

It's pretty easy to imagine actually, it's Napoleon with an Okami-vibe art style, which suits the world of Smash Bros. very well.

True. I just don't feel like his character is at all designed for smash.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

True. I just don't feel like his character is at all designed for smash.

So a gentleman with cards sounds odd? How? smash has an electric rat, a fat plumber, an elf wearing some skirt, a walking fox, a pink blob that eats, another pink blob, a yoga instructor, a child villager, a princess, a princess with magic, a dude with a tiara that swings a sword, a flying fairy bat, some sassy hedgehog, a robot, a robot chick, a psychic boy. And you think a gentleman that uses cards would stick out like a sore thumb? He would blend perfectly with all that madness

 

[dimensionsword64]

So a gentleman with cards sounds odd? How? smash has an electric rat, a fat plumber, an elf wearing some skirt, a walking fox, a pink blob that eats, another pink blob, a yoga instructor, a child villager, a princess, a princess with magic, a dude with a tiara that swings a sword, a flying fairy bat, some sassy hedgehog, a robot, a robot chick, a psychic boy. And you think a gentleman that uses cards would stick out like a sore thumb? He would blend perfectly with all that madness

Well, everyone's very cartoony, and then you put in a person who looks like he's from real life and it just seems odd.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Snake looks like he's from real life, yet no one seemed to be bothered by it. Pretty low excuse to not add him.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

Well, everyone's very cartoony, and then you put in a person who looks like he's from real life and it just seems odd.

Saying someone wouldn't fit in smash is one of the laziest excuses I've ever heard to be honest

 

[dimensionsword64]

Snake looks like he's from real life, yet no one seemed to be bothered by it. Pretty low excuse to not add him.

He's old fashioned. He doesn't seem at all to be someone fighting Mario and Link. You could actually imagine someone like Snake fighting with them. It would be hard, but it would still be possible. I can't say the same for this guy.

And Elite Gamer, it may be a lazy excuse, but it's a true excuse.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Then I say you should imagine a bit more deeper, because his yellow skin easily distincts him from the real Napoleon making him fit with the rest of the Smash cast.

 

[dimensionsword64]

Then I say you should imagine a bit more deeper, because his yellow skin easily distincts him from the real Napoleon making him fit with the rest of the Smash cast.

I have been trying really hard to see this guy from your perspective.

I can't. I cannot imagine this guy fighting Mario.
Even with yellow skin, he still looks like a real person. And that skin color could be a real skin color. When I first saw him, I didn't notice anything abstract about him. I did notice that he looked like a real general. And my view on him hasn't changed.

 

[Pacack]

I have been trying really hard to see this guy from your perspective.

I can't. I cannot imagine this guy fighting Mario.
Even with yellow skin, he still looks like a real person. And that skin color could be a real skin color. When I first saw him, I didn't notice anything abstract about him. I did notice that he looked like a real general. And my view on him hasn't changed.

The skin is actually much more orange than yellow. Much more. This is coming from someone who owns the deck.

I can understand people seeing him as looking like a real person...but why is that a problem? We have Link, Zelda, Sheik, Ganondorf, Samus, Pit, Marth, Roy, Ike, and Snake who are all more realistic depictions of humans that fight Mario in the Smash Bros. universe. Several of them even use real-world weaponry to fight him (swords, explosives).

Are you telling me that a semi-realistic depiction of a human general with an unrealistic skin tone that uses birds, plants, and other odd forms of "weaponry" is more of a problem than Snake, who is a realistic depiction of a human soldier that uses literal explosives such as grenades and C4?

Tell me that's not what you're telling me.

 

[dimensionsword64]

The skin is actually much more orange than yellow. Much more. This is coming from someone who owns the deck.

I can understand people seeing him as looking like a real person...but why is that a problem? We have Link, Zelda, Sheik, Ganondorf, Samus, Pit, Marth, Roy, Ike, and Snake who are all more realistic depictions of humans that fight Mario in the Smash Bros. universe. Several of them even use real-world weaponry to fight him (swords, explosives).

Are you telling me that a realistic depiction of a human general with an realistic skin tone that uses birds, plants, and other odd forms of "weaponry" is more of a problem than Snake, who is a realistic depiction of a human soldier that uses literal explosives such as grenades and C4 that are changed to look less serious?

Tell me that's not what you're telling me.

Fixed. And that's what I'm telling you. All I'm trying to say is I can't see him fighting Nintendo's All-Stars. You may be able to, but I can't. That's all I'm trying to say.

 

[Pacack]

Fixed. And that's what I'm telling you. All I'm trying to say is I can't see him fighting Nintendo's All-Stars. You may be able to, but I can't. That's all I'm trying to say.

Again, it looks more orange than yellow. I own the deck. It does not look yellow and does not look like an Asian person's skin-tone. Nor does it look like a Native American's orange skin-tone.

What I'm saying is that there's a literal soldier that uses explosives to fight Mario and it's no problem. I'm not saying you have no right to your opinion. I'm just saying that your opinion is wrong. If there's no problem with Snake, there's no problem with Daitoryo.

 

[dimensionsword64]

Again, it looks more orange than yellow. I own the deck. It does not look yellow and does not look like an Asian person's skin-tone. Nor does it look like a Native American's orange skin-tone.

What I'm saying is that there's a literal soldier that uses explosives to fight Mario and it's no problem. I'm not saying you have no right to your opinion. I'm just saying that your opinion is wrong. If there's no problem with Snake, there's no problem with Daitoryo.

First off, someone's opinion can't be wrong. Second of all, I'm not trying to throw around opinions. I'm saying I can't imagine him in in Smash. And if I can't imagine a character in Smash, then I'm not going to want that character. That's all I'm trying to say. I find it hard to imagine him fighting Mario, Link, Pikachu, and Kirby. This is where I stand on Daitoryo.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

Napoleon being realistic prevents him from being in smash?

Welp it looks like Zero suit samus, captain falcon and snake can't be on smash 4 cause thier too realistic

Also wii fit trainer is just a woman with white skin. Should she be cut because she doesn't blend in with the other cartoony characters?

Heaven forbid a character that uses fitness moves based on real life be included in smash

 

[dimensionsword64]

Napoleon being realistic prevents him from being in smash?

Welp it looks like Zero suit samus, captain falcon and snake can't be on smash 4 cause thier too realistic

Also wii fit trainer is just a woman with white skin. Should she be cut because she doesn't blend in with the other cartoony characters?

Did you read my post?

 

[Pacack]

First off, someone's opinion can't be wrong. Second of all, I'm not trying to throw around opinions. I'm saying I can't imagine him in in Smash. And if I can't imagine a character in Smash, then I'm not going to want that character. That's all I'm trying to say. I find it hard to imagine him fighting Mario, Link, Pikachu, and Kirby. This is where I stand on Daitoryo.

An opinion can absolutely be wrong. (Although you're still perfectly entitled to it)

Let's say that, before Snake's reveal in Brawl times, I think Snake cannot possibly be included due to being too realistic and violent.

Snake is revealed.

My opinion was wrong. He was included. My opinion was that he could not be included and he was.


Saying that you cannot imagine him in Smash is indeed an opinion of yours. I understand that you don't want the character since you can't imagine him, and I respect that, but I'm arguing that there's no solid basis for this. Since Snake could be added with no issue, Daitoryo could as well. Your opinion is not rooted in fact and cannot be used as an argument. That's all I'm saying. I'm sorry if I insulted you.

 

[dimensionsword64]

An opinion can absolutely be wrong. (Although you're still perfectly entitled to it)

Let's say that, before Snake's reveal in Brawl times, I think Snake cannot possibly be included due to being too realistic and violent.

Snake is revealed.

My opinion was wrong. He was included. My opinion was that he could not be included and he was.


Saying that you cannot imagine him in Smash is indeed an opinion of yours. I understand that you don't want the character since you can't imagine him, and I respect that, but I'm arguing that there's no solid basis for this. Since Snake could be added with no issue, Daitoryo could as well. Your opinion is not rooted in fact and cannot be used as an argument. That's all I'm saying. I'm sorry if I insulted you.

Actually an opinion can't be wrong, but we're not here to talk about the definition of opinion.
You bring up a good point that I can't really counter. Daitoryo does have a chance, just I can't imagine him in Smash, so I can't support him.

 

[Pacack]

Actually an opinion can't be wrong, but we're not here to talk about the definition of opinion.
You bring up a good point that I can't really counter. Daitoryo does have a chance, just I can't imagine him in Smash, so I can't support him.

We may very well be having a misunderstanding with definitions.

I understand that. At the very least, you have my thanks for visiting and for provoking discussion in my humble little thread.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

Still is a lazy excuse.

No more human shaped character because they will ruin smash!

 

[Pacack]

Still is a lazy excuse.

No more human shaped character because they will ruin smash!

Shh. I'm trying to end it on a good note.

 

[dimensionsword64]

Shh. I'm trying to end it on a good note.

I think we've finally came on a somewhat agreement.

 

[Pacack]

Nintendo’s history definitely suggests that Nintendo has always flexibly innovated itself in line with the times.
After Nintendo started the manufacture and sale of Hanafuda (traditional Japanese playing cards) 125 years ago, it has innovated itself from a playing card company to a toy company, a toy company to an electronic toy company and an electronic toy company to a company running video game platforms. What has remained the same, however, was we always tried to create something new from materials and technologies available at that time and to position entertainment as our core business. Furthermore, even after we established the business structure of video game platforms, we did not stop innovating ourselves. For instance, home video game consoles were born to play coin-operated arcade games at home, but we have evolved them into something uniquely appealing. Another example is the games to expand the gaming population that we have offered with Nintendo DS and Wii in the last decade, which were clearly foreign to the mainstream video games at that time but were accepted by a great variety of consumers. In this way, we will continue to value self-innovation in the future.
In addition to self-innovation, we have shaped our future by collaborating with various outside partners which we saw as appropriate at the time in order to adapt to environmental changes. Such collaboration has been a part of all our operations from research and development to manufacture and sales. In addition to our own efforts, collaborating with good partners will be one important way to adapt to the recent dynamic changes surrounding video games.

Given this background, in expanding our dedicated video game platforms in the future, we hope to firmly decide what aspects from the past should be kept and what should be dramatically changed in order to leverage our core competency.

This time, we decided to redefine our notion of entertainment as something that improves people’s quality of life in enjoyable ways, and take a step forward in expanding our business areas. Being an entertainment company, making “enjoyable improvements” is something that Nintendo excels at, and this definition provides us with a clear distinction from simply “improving QOL.”
Ever since Nintendo was founded 125 years ago as a manufacturer of Hanafuda, Nintendo has continued to transform itself into offering various propositions to consumers from toys, electronic toys, and then video games, improving, in my view, people’s QOL in enjoyable ways.

Taken from their new Corporate Management Policy Briefing/Third Quarter Financial Results Briefing. Proves that they still know and respect their origins and consider their roots when they're making decisions even now. Gotta give 'em credit for that.