Taki's marf * Critique Please!*

[takieddine]

Hi all,

I'm a fox main for as long I've been playing this game(2.5 yrs), but I've picked up Marth during the last summer to try to get a solid second or another main. Since i play a fairly technical fox, i also consider my Marth pretty competent technically as well. I need advice/suggestions etc...tell me what I did wrong(besides if you think I've messed up technically) , and what I do right.

Here are some of the matches i was able to upload:


v. Peach
v. Peach2
v. Sheik
v. Young link
v. Young link2

v. Fox
v. Fox2
v. Fox3
v. Falco

 

[Aiko]

Ok, I'll start with the good. You are definitely competent technical wise with marth, but as you've said you main fox, so marth shouldnt be a problem. You're general play and mindgames is pretty solid too. There are a few things I can see wrong with your marth though.

Spacing is the biggest problem I see. Obviously marth is all about spacing, and that only comes with experience. Considering you've only been playing him since summer, I'd say you're well on your way to getting good with marth. There are times when I see you Dtilt repeatedly, (most noticably vs Peach 1) and it doesnt knock the other person away far enough for you to safely follow up with another Dtilt, but you do anyway. Most of the time you got off easy, but in the first game, peach should've CC dsmashed you. In general, you need to work on getting your tips with the sword, but as i've said before, its just experience.

Grabbing is another problem I see. You don't grab enough imo. Marth has a huge grab, abuse it. vs peach, you should be chaingrabbing with F throw at 0-10%. Peach doesnt tumble so you can just run forward and grab again, tech chasing between 10-50%. peach actually hits the floor between these % but you can still chain grab if they DI wrong. at 50-75% you can forward throw, wavedash tipper. Vs fox, obviously you can chaingrab, theres loads of threads on this so just do a little research, but generally up throws to uptilts/shffl uairs to tippers.

Edgeguarding is ok, but its got a lot of room for improvement. I noticed in your game vs fox, fox went really low to avoid getting gimped, and you followed him all the way down and got hit by firefox. You should follow him and when you realise hes going low, jump back up and forward b to edgehog. I notice you take alot from M2K's style (hey we all do it, myself included) but I would reccomend watching other marths too for edgeguarding as M2K knows alot of options he has, so he selects which one he needs and you dont learn the other variations. definitely watch ken, azen, tani etc. they all have good edgeguarding.

Those are the major points, there are a few minor points too. Sweetspotting is difficult but essential with marth. Ive seen many a time where you up B onto the stage (unforced) and get punished (or even worse, you dont get punished). Sweetspotting is a must.

Use ledgehop bair or jump of stage and fair/bair. especially against sheik. It *****. again, M2K does it alot so watch his vids.

Finally, ken combo. Its awesome.

Overall your marth is good, has a lot of potential, and I must admit, its actually very creepy similar to mine... very creepy. Maybe because I use M2K stuff alot too

 

[takieddine]

Wow, thanks that was really constructive and helpful advice.

 

[Aiko]

oh yeah, i forgot to mention 2 things. Using SH double fairs is a good approach but can get predictable. I would definitely reccomend on working shffld fairs into your game. Tipped shffl fairs are awesome combo starters. they're also really good for attacking someone on the ground as you can wait till they get up/get up attack and then fair. Hopefully you'll have spaced yourself well enough so you dont get hit if they attack. If they roll then they'll be too laggy to punish your fair and you can probably catch them with a grab if you're quick enough.

Secondly, retreating shffld fairs/ sh double fairs are really good too. They allow you to space yourself and retreat. They're also awesome for defending yourself when they try to ledgehop attack. Make sure you stand at tipper length when they're on the ledge. Just watch a few azen and ken matches and you'll see this pretty clearly.

 

[Retroking2000]

haha aiko is a marth prodigy

 

[Aiko]

I wish I'm working on it though, plus ive seen a fair no. of marth vids.

 

[takieddine]

Is the Marth board dead, or is there something wrong with my thread, lol.

Usually the fox boards, you'd get at least like 5 long replies from different people.

 

[Retroking2000]

not the thread its just i cant really watch all the matches i am busy but i am not the only person on marth boards

 

[sonofashrub]

i only watched one vid (vs fox), and i'm not too great at marth, so yeah. this advice will probably suck.
You lost a life once for forward b'ing twice. The second time you don't get any vertical height, so you coulda saved a life if you up-b'd earlier. That's a technical issue though. Mostly, i'd say more upthrows to up tilts. Less smashing in general. Especially if they're not forward smashing. There isn't all that much reason to chase after someone during edge guarding with marth, so if it's risky it's probably better that you just wait for them to come into smashing range. Also, more wavedashing. Marth has a great one, and it makes all his moves have like a million range. Also great for spacing which is what marth is all about. More grabbing. Grabbings a great way to start combos. Don't play too defensively. I saw that when you reached 90% on your last life you ran away and then ran back in. Running away and running back in is a bad idea for marth, cause all that's gonna happen is he's going to get hit by projectiles and make it even more dangerous for you. More mindgames? With marth's lagtimes, it's dangerous to rely just on technical skill. Um. yeah. That's about it?

 

[Hazygoose]

hello lurker of the CT board :D
i has a few tips for you.

1) stop rolling into people. you're marth. you've got a ridiculous range, just ridiculous. there is no reason to get close to someone unless you have an immediate means of attacking, like a grab or a tilt. if they are in your tipper range and you're not attacking, we have a problem

2) on that same note, SPACING. you use dash dancing a lot, but you always use it for "mindgames" purposes. it is definitely better suited for spacing, and fading in and out of tipper range, so that you can play defense, or go in for a grab or attack.

3) edgeguarding should be more intense. people are scared of marth. install that fear by being mother****ing relentless. moar S-word!

4) sweetspoting. 'nuff said

and finally 5) i demand you get on the stage with more than a ledgehop. it becomes predictable and very punishable. plus when you do it, it is usually completely unnecessary, where standing up would have done the same thing, like no one is around for you to shield, grab, or attack after the ledgehop. so yeah, mix that up, and find uses for every way to get back onto the stage.

:D

 

[takieddine]

yay thx for the help gaiz

 

[pockyD]

your edgeguarding is so sloppy =[

 

[Silas06]

You need to turn up the gay. See Cort's thread.

 

[Aesir]

To emphasize on the ledge hopping thing, its very very punishable.

more then half the kills spawn gets on me are from predictable ledge hops.

get up attacks are good if they're just waiting for you.

 

[takieddine]

Wow, i didnt think i was that bad with ledge hopping...>_>. I usually make sure i camp on the ledge a fair amount of time before i do something...

I've improved my game however thanks to your tips.

 

[brawlpro]

Taki, I will hopefully get marth vidz soon, I would like you to check em the **** outz =D, nice marth btw, cool you improved your game, hey post new vids soon.