Super Smash Flash 2 At Apex 2015

[warriorman222]

@ LiteralGrill could you please add in the news post that SSF2 has a booth and therefore didn't replace PM, and possibly that a fan game causes less legal issue? The last thing we need is another 4 pages of doing nothing but planting salt trees, constructing sodium mines, and forging planets entirely out of Na.

 

[LiteralGrill]

@ LiteralGrill could you please add in the news post that SSF2 has a booth and therefore didn't replace PM, and possibly that a fan game causes less legal issue? The last thing we need is another 4 pages of doing nothing but planting salt trees, constructing sodium mines, and forging planets entirely out of Na.

I would but...

Super Smash Flash 2 has had a presence at Apex since 2013 and will be returning again this year to host a booth at Apex.

It's been there the entire time. I can't force people to read, it just sucks folks probably just saw the title, spewed salt, and didn't take a single moment to think about what I wrote

 

[warriorman222]

I would but...



It's been there the entire time. I can't force people to read, it just sucks folks probably just saw the title, spewed salt, and didn't take a single moment to think about what I wrote

You know what? You're right. If people bothered reading much, then this wouldn't have happen. I'll admit I jumped straight into the topic not knowing there was a booth, knowing that people would be salty.

It's unfortunate that I can't convert digital salt into real salt, considering my fries always need extra salt.

 

[JayTheUnseen]

I would but...



It's been there the entire time. I can't force people to read, it just sucks folks probably just saw the title, spewed salt, and didn't take a single moment to think about what I wrote

You could edit the title to incorporate that,and maybe say also that it is returning.

 

[Deleted member]

And you're saying I'm using bad logic... Please don't come to the most ridiculous conclusions just for the sake or mining salt and trying to look right, without any reasoning behind it.

It's not a ridiculous conclusion. You're using the legality of the issue as a defense of the logic of the decision but failing to understand that the legality is itself, to put it simply, stupid. You might was well be arguing that it makes sense to stop people from wearing the color red because there is an illogical law banning people from wearing the color red.

Any reason for PM being "less legal" than SSF2 is nonsensical BS.

 

[Deleted member]

. His argument against PM is that hacking into a console and changing a game's code, at least with the Wii, is a way larger offense compared to just using the characters in a fan game.

And my argument is that that is absolutely idiotic reasoning, especially considering PM, unlike SSF4, actually benefits Nintendo by encouraging people to purchase Brawl and a Wii to play it. Why in the world should PM be "less legal" than a game like SSF4 that uses the same copywrited characters but doesn't require you to purchase anything from Nintendo? Never mind the fact that SSF2 mixes in non-Nintendo characters that have never appeared in a Smash game before while PM uses pre-existing characters that have alteady been in Smash.

 

[warriorman222]

It's not a ridiculous conclusion. You're using the legality of the issue as a defense of the logic of the decision but failing to understand that the legality is itself, to put it simply, stupid. You might was well be arguing that it makes sense to stop people from wearing the color red because there is an illogical law banning people from wearing the color red.

Any reason for PM being "less legal" than SSF2 is illogical BS.

Legality may be stupid sometimes, but law is law. If it was a law to not wear red, i'd not stop people, I'd advise them not to wear red. I want PM in, but it IS less legal no matter what.

PM is hacking into code of a Nintendo game, modifying game files, adding Nintendo characters, that were, yes removed, and distributing this mod.

SSF2 is making a game based on a popular franchise with it's own engine, mechanics, and some new characters unrelated to Nintendo.

And my argument is that that is absolutely idiotic reasoning, especially considering PM, unlike SSF4, actually benefits Nintendo by encouraging people to purchase Brawl and a Wii to play it. Why in the world should that be less legal than creating a game from scratch, using copywrited characters, in a way that allows people to play the game without having to buy anything from Nintendo?

Now you're grasping straws. Good or bad reasoning, we can't change how law works. PM is hacking into a game, someone out there can and will use that against Nintendo if they sponsor a tourney with PM in it.

SSF2 isn't letting them play the game without Nintendo buying it because it's a different game with a similar concept. It's different, and if you say it's the same, I'm sorry but you'll lose all rights to be taken seriously when talking about this.

A fan game isn't breaking into anything, and while copyright infringement can be there, they're not using the same models, bringing back their characters or so. Only 2 newcomers of SSF2 are Nintendo owned, and both are 2nd party.

PM has nearly identical/identical models, hacking into a Nintendo-owned game, breaking far more laws, is by concept a spite mod, bringing back ccut characters and stages owned by Nintendo. PM can also be less legal because it has more Nintendo characters, more Nintendo stages, while most new things in SSF2 are 3rd party, 4th party or 2nd party. Because of that, even if you'll twist or ignore all my other points, less SSF2 content belongs to Nintendo, more PM content belongs to Nintendo.

tl;dr: There is no tl;dr. If you won't read everything I said, don't bother arguing with me. Enjoy your evening

 

[Deleted member]

Legality may be stupid sometimes, but law is law. If it was a law to not wear red, i'd not stop people, I'd advise them not to wear red.

And here we come to the root of your problem. The only way things change is by people questioning pre-existing standards. Laws change because some laws are stupid/unnecessary/nonsensical and people put forth strong arguments as to why that is. If everybody had your attitude, we'd never progress. Laws wouldn't change.

tl;dr: There is no tl;dr. If you won't read everything I said, don't bother arguing with me. Enjoy your evening

I read everything you said, and I responded to what you said. It's clear that you're trying to be a good little boy by refusing to question laws that don't make sense and refusing to acknowledge the lack of logic behind those questionable laws, using their mere existance as a defense of their existance in the first place.

If you're going to be that person who is perfectly okay with spending the rest of your life on your knees, refusing to question anything because that's just the way it is, then be my guest. However, I suggest you try to stay away from debates.

 

[Redd500]

And here we come to root of your problem. The only way things change is by people questioning pre-existing standards. Laws change because some laws are stupid/unnecessary/nonsensical and people put forth strong arguments as to why that is. If everybody had your attitude, we'd never progress. Laws wouldn't change.

If your issue is with the law and how it works currently, take it up with your representative or whatever government leader you have. Getting mad at people following the law for following the law you find stupid isn't actually going to do much besides piss people off. You can raise awareness about your cause if you tell them that you think the law is stupid and they should help fight it, but acting mad isn't the way to do it.

 

[Deleted member]

If your issue is with the law and how it works currently, take it up with your representative or whatever government leader you have. Getting mad at people following the law for following the law you find stupid isn't actually going to do much besides piss people off. You can raise awareness about your cause if you tell them that you think the law is stupid and they should help fight it, but acting mad isn't the way to do it.

"Acting mad" is exactly the way to do it. Seeing as how this is Smashboards, this is the perfect place to discuss topics such as this. You chose to participate in the discussion. You have every right to leave the discussion if you don't want to participate. And if you're going to sit there participating, I have every right to respond. The fact that my argument pisses you off is not my concern, and it is not my responsibility to make you happy by mindlessly argreeing with your "just follow the illogical, freedom-restricting laws" argument.

 

[Redd500]

"Acting mad" is exactly the way to do it. Seeing as how this is Smashboards, this is the perfect place to discuss topics such as this. You chose to participate in the discussion. You have every right to leave the discussion if you don't want to participate. And if you're going to sit there participating, I have every right to respond. The fact that my argument pisses you off is not my concern, and it is not my responsibility to make you happy by mindlessly argreeing with your "just follow the illogical, freedom-restricting laws" argument.

Discussion =/= getting mad. Getting mad involves acting like a general douche, like insulting others, yelling, etc. Also, I never once stated my opinion on the matter at hand, that's something you assumed and then proceeded to insult me.

 

[Deleted member]

I put forth reasons as to why claiming that SSF2 should be more legal than PM is illogical. Your counter argument was "that's the law" without ever actually addressing my points, and by backing up warriorman who is saying exactly the same thing. The fact that you got insulted that I didn't agree with you is, again, not my concern.

 

[The 0ne]

I will NEVER understand why he didn't decide to just name it Super Flash Bros. Well, I guess that could get mixed up with Super Mario Bros.

Well why not Super Flash Bros. Brawl?

 

[Redd500]

I put forth reasons as to why claiming that SSF2 should be more legal than PM is illogical. Your counter argument was "that's the law" without ever actually addressing my points, and by backing up warriorman who is saying exactly the same thing. The fact that you got insulted that I didn't agree with you is, again, not my concern.

1) I never once offered a counter argument for the legality of the two games. My first post here was telling you what warriorman was saying. My second was telling you that if you had an issue with the law, don't get mad at random people and insult them, instead write to those who make the laws and convince others to do the same without being a douche.

2) If I had offered a counter argument, I'm pretty sure I never used the word "should" when discussing the legality. Instead, I believe I used the word "is" when discussing the legality, which means that currently, hacking a game console and reprogramming a game is worse than making a fan game in the eyes of the law. In fact, I'm pretty sure no one has once said that should be the case, just that is currently how it is, and is why PM isn't in while SSF2 is.

3) I'm not taking issue with any of your argument points in terms of being insulted or mad. However, calling people mindless for thinking a specific way is insulting.

 

[warriorman222]

I put forth reasons as to why claiming that SSF2 should be more legal than PM is illogical. Your counter argument was "that's the law" without ever actually addressing my points, and by backing up warriorman who is saying exactly the same thing. The fact that you got insulted that I didn't agree with you is, again, not my concern.

My argument isn't "that's the law. I know the law can be argued and changed. So if you want PM in so bad, go and change it. If everybody was like me, things would progress, it' just that the law is the law, the way it is now. It can be changed, but it's not gonna be changed quickly. It's far too late for it to be changed just so PM can be in.

I personally think that law is unnecessary, and if I wanted it changed I'd bring some good arguments. But to be honest, I don't care. Blatantly insulting me just to prove me wrong is not how an argument goes. You're clearly getting salty simply because I disagree with you. I put that tl;dr there because with the way you're acting, I wouldn't expect it of you to read a few paragraphs, when you misunderstand one sentence to the point of starting this, and refusing to admit that there is a possible chance of you being wrong.

If you actually think that PM sis more legal than SSF2, according to the law, flawed as it is, you are wrong. The can, and possibly should be changed but for now, you are simply wrong. I'm sorry, your arguments are fine, but you're wrong for reasons I can't at the time change, like or argue. If you want to change them, go ahead. Try your best. I'd like it if you succeeded, I'd prefer PM to be in someday with nintendo sponsoring then not. Until then, the (albeit changeable) law dictates that hacking into a game, changing the code, the way it is played, and distributing these modifications is at least slightly less acceptable then making a computer game loosely based off said game, while having it played in a different way with no base game. I want PM to be in Apex, but it's not, and it won't be this year. Maybe next year. But not this year.

Also, you acting mad, or getting mad for disagreeing is not the way to argue. In any case.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

PM has a lot more legal issues. Like a lot more.

Smash flash 2 is also built from scratch while is using code stuff that they don't own.

 

[masterpad]

Yes, but all jokes aside, who would want to play as Sandbag in a really huge competitive tournament like APEX?

me!!!

 

[[TSON]]

I will NEVER understand why he didn't decide to just name it Super Flash Bros. Well, I guess that could get mixed up with Super Mario Bros.

Well why not Super Flash Bros. Brawl?

Super Flash Bros. is iirc a pair of brothers who made Smash Bros.-related Flash movies when SSF1 was popular

(They have a game on Steam now wtf!)

 

[666blaziken]

My argument isn't "that's the law. I know the law can be argued and changed. So if you want PM in so bad, go and change it. If everybody was like me, things would progress, it' just that the law is the law, the way it is now. It can be changed, but it's not gonna be changed quickly. It's far too late for it to be changed just so PM can be in.

I personally think that law is unnecessary, and if I wanted it changed I'd bring some good arguments. But to be honest, I don't care. Blatantly insulting me just to prove me wrong is not how an argument goes. You're clearly getting salty simply because I disagree with you. I put that tl;dr there because with the way you're acting, I wouldn't expect it of you to read a few paragraphs, when you misunderstand one sentence to the point of starting this, and refusing to admit that there is a possible chance of you being wrong.

If you actually think that PM sis more legal than SSF2, according to the law, flawed as it is, you are wrong. The can, and possibly should be changed but for now, you are simply wrong. I'm sorry, your arguments are fine, but you're wrong for reasons I can't at the time change, like or argue. If you want to change them, go ahead. Try your best. I'd like it if you succeeded, I'd prefer PM to be in someday with nintendo sponsoring then not. Until then, the (albeit changeable) law dictates that hacking into a game, changing the code, the way it is played, and distributing these modifications is at least slightly less acceptable then making a computer game loosely based off said game, while having it played in a different way with no base game. I want PM to be in Apex, but it's not, and it won't be this year. Maybe next year. But not this year.

Also, you acting mad, or getting mad for disagreeing is not the way to argue. In any case.

I agree, on top of all that, having nintendo supporting a mod that breaks coding would be really awkward. While the PMDT respects nintendo and borrows some of their ideas for their game, the vocal fans of PM on smashboards don't support nintendo and go against smash 4. In other words; even if there were no legal issues, the PM fan base could be seen as a threat to nintendo's future because to them, PM is an act of rebellion. SSF2 fanbase isn't as vocal about going against smash 4 as the PM fanbase because there aren't enough of them to really make an impact.

 

[Proobie44]

areyoukiddingmerightnowapexareyoufreakingkiddingme?

 

[ThePlacidPlatypus]

as pm players we have to be honest together here- we cant compete with a game that has isaac.

someone tell strongbad to put isaac into pm

and then goku

Well if you've been paying attention to a certain leak then you wouldn't be saying that.

 

[Deleted member]

Well if you've been paying attention to a certain leak then you wouldn't be saying that.

i've known about it for like a year and a half lol. and some other fun stuff. no sharesies tho.

 

[Exzerko]

WHAT?! WHO THOUGHT OF BRING A FLASH VERSION OF SMASH TO APEX?!

iloominaughty cunfurmed

 

[warriorman222]

WHAT?! WHO THOUGHT OF BRING A FLASH VERSION OF SMASH TO APEX?!

iloominaughty cunfurmed

And here exhibit B: Someone who doesn't read.

Seriously, why be like 80% of the people here and jump in without reading and post some salty comment? It's a booth. One that has been there since 2013.

 

[Exzerko]

And here exhibit B: Someone who doesn't read.

Seriously, why be like 80% of the people here and jump in without reading and post some salty comment? It's a booth. One that has been there since 2013.

It was joke. Why take me seriously when i write something like "iloominaughty cunfirmed" ? lol

 

[warriorman222]

It was joke. Why take me seriously when i write something like "iloominaughty cunfirmed" ? lol

I was going to edit my post for a more laughy tone but forgot where I put it. Sorry.

 

[mattergamer47]

Does no one understand that PM is a mod of Brawl, Nintendo's game. and SSF2 along with the other super smash flashes are complete fan made games. NOT mods of a pre existing game

 

[[OCK]LLama]

Ah, so this is why Project M was removed.

I'm not impressed.

At all.

How ignorant can you be? SSF2 has been at apex for 3 years. This has nothing to do with project M. Like honestly the salt is real with all these butthurt people in the comments. I love PM more than any other smash and even I can understand why this is happening