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Specific Characters Match-up: Pikachu vs Link

A10theHero

SSJ Fraud
Joined
Dec 18, 2014
Messages
2,937
Location
The Hoenn region
NNID
A10theHero

We will also be discussing the Link matchup this week.

Remember these discussion points:
  • Neutral
  • Advantaged State
  • Disadvantaged State
  • Combo Ability
  • Punish game
  • Ground-Ground, Air-Ground, and Ground-Air interactions
  • Edgeguarding
  • Killing
  • Favorable stages
  • Analysis of Top Level Matches (Not simply stating win records, but actually looking into some sets and seeing what the players did right and wrong. Along with that, this entails talking about what the options were in a given situation and if the opposing character had the tools to respond to the other choices. Stuff like that.)
  • Quirks (ie. If Pikachu aims a Quick Attack towards the ground and hits Megaman's Crash Bomber when doing so, he slides across the stage, similar to his Super Wavedash in Melee)
  • Anything else important that I may have forgotten to mention
Have fun discussing! :)
 
Last edited:

The_Devious

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 27, 2015
Messages
75
NNID
The_devious97
Link has a few projectiles and a powerful sword. We have better frame data, but we shouldn't allow ourselves to get hit by his smashes or he can take us out fairly quickly.

Neutral
Obviously link has the better neutral, possessing the gale boomerang, bombs and a bow. As opposed to our thunder jolt. Since Link is generally better in this state, we should approach link whenever we are in the neutral and only reset to neutral to avoid being killed.

Approaching
Link is generally better in the neutral, but luckily we have good approach options. We can duck under charged arrows and perfect shield bombs and the boomerang, then run in between. We can also close the gap with quick attack.

Racking up %
Once you are past his wall of projectiles, you still have to get past his sword. Since link uses a sword, he has a lot of disjoints. Our only disjoint is F smash, but we should save this for killing. The rest of our moves have bad range and require baiting to be pulled off. After link uses a laggy attack, you can combo him. A lot. Seriously, link just cracks under the pressure at this point.

Killing
Once you have link at the edge of the stage, you can go for a sweetspotted f smash or you can take him offstage and kill him with a thundercloud spike.
 

GerMoj

Smash Cadet
Joined
Aug 6, 2015
Messages
40
Location
Ciudad de México / Mexico City
NNID
GerMoj
3DS FC
2595-0240-5750
Hi again! Happy to partocipate in this thr-ea*d *as a former Link main (got enlighted by the Chu and now I love the mouse). This time I can put what goes through the mind of Link as also the Pika so this is gonna be interesting.

  • Neutral
This is the state that Link usually wants to be in as with his profectiles he can rack damage little by little and aim to wall out Pikachu. Lot's of Bombs, Nair, Fair, Boomerang, Z-air, Wavebounce and B-reverse arrows are coming towards Pikachu in a hope of keeping him away. Pikachu can do his work on spamming too, but rememember Jolt, cancels boomerang and arrow but it is beatan by bomb. We can have two aproaches thar work pretty well: an easy steady approach or the neutral breaking QA. Try to use a mix of both accordingly of what you see on your opponent.

The easy steady approach usually works well in most scenarios, but the payload is not as big as a mid % (30 onwards) QA. Your best shot (in my opinion) is to watch out carefully and go in with QA as Link pulls of a bomb, that is the time where it is most vulnerable and you can get the most of it. If you fail to catch Link while pulling a jump here's the time to aproach a tad more carefully, specially if you notice that the Link has some bomb tech like instant drop, bomb fake, instant throw and aoutcanceled dair

Finally, remember that Nair, Up-air, D-air and F-air can beat our QA because the first three linger and the last comes with two hits.
  • Advantaged State
Most of the time you get into the ADV you must get a lot of damage or a stock. In my opinion the most optimal way to proceed is not to go for high damaging combos (Link is heavy and it has greater kill potential than us so rage is a bad thing to give him) but to snatch his second jump or to get him offstage is usually the best as without it he is at your total will.

Link on the other hand can do little on the ADV (his most dangerous state is when you get grabbed as he can combo or kill you if yoe are not aware of his options)
  • Disadvantaged State
We are at this when Link catches us with an Up-Tilt or grabs us as he can rack damage pretty well. At higher percents we only need to be catious of his killing options so it is not that bad as they are easily avoided.

Link on the other way can hardly do anything at this state, specially without his double jump
  • Combo Ability
Go and do the usual Pika stuff. Link's fastest move is Nair (frame 6) so if you feel like you don't have another option to continue, drop the combo with a Nair to be safe.

Link gets combos from Boomerang and Bombs, a two hit combo at most (just please reset neutral then and don't DI into boomerang into boomerang, into boomerang ... into boomerang). Keep always in movement and try not to get grabbed as Link can down throw into up tilt and most of his aerials to low-mid percents. Watch out for Jab, jab, grab; jab jab down smash, jab jab down tilt (doesn't work if you DI up and away on the jabs and jump away).
  • Punish game
Our must optimal way to punish is to steal his second job, he's pretty much death without it. Also Punish witt the usual Pika stuff. Finally if you can bait a grab now you can go ham on him

I think Link's must dangerous punish is if we miss Up-throw thunder as if he manage to air dodge he can fastfall down air and kill us at high percents. Watch out when landing, if you feel uneasy QA away. Finally, never NEVER never air dodge his downthrow if you air dodge he can up air (the lingering hitbox maintains), short hop fast fall and charge an smash and Link kills pretty earlier with that. The most optimal way is to jump again and land safely after and be wary of the double jump up-b (we can punish that because it is not a true combo if we jump away)
  • Ground-Ground, Air-Ground, and Ground-Air interactions
Groung ground we have to deal with his projectiles basic stuff. We are the ones who approach and if Link wants to rush down us... *sighs* then he is not meant to play smash.

Air ground, we actually need to be patient here, a well placed up-tilt or up smash can be really bad for us- Link can land with Nair, Fair or the For Glory Down Air (but be catious if Link knows how to cancel the last one)

Ground air. Here is whe he is ours. He can't do much out of this.
  • Edgeguarding
Pretty simple for us. Be creative, if Link likes to tether I recommend using this: (used on Toon Link but works on the regular one too)


The same goes if he is aiming to hit you with his Up-b while recovering.


On the pther hand, Link has a really bad time edgeguarding us. His best bet is to Z-Drop a bomb or try to intercept our QA with a lasting move, but because of Link's poor air speed we can easily avoid that. We can also go real low to be safe and if he gets greedy we can thunderspike him if we still have our jump.
  • Killing
Our killing moves are the regular Pika stuff and edgeguards. Be careful with up.throw thunder as if he manages to air dodge he can fast fall d-air and kill at high %

His killing moves are fair, dair, up air, smashes, tilts and up-b.

Fair can con from a double jab and he reads the jump away, down smash cames from the double jab and no jumping. F-.smash comes from down throw and Pika air doding infront of him, the same as up.smash. and up air. Up b can true combo from bomb if he is near you (but not fair or up air). or OoS if you hit his shield (risky though) And the tilts can con from random, the good thing is that must of this things aren't true and too slow to actually be harmful
  • Favorable stages
Most of them are pretty OK, but I thing the best is Lylat and Smashville for easy QAC's
  • Analysis of Top Level Matches
I don't remember seeing Nakat or ESAM or any other Pikachu playing against a TOP Link. I can give you a match where I played ESAM on stream as me as Link a time ago. That time I got pretty proud I took a stock from him, now seeing the match is kinda embarrasing (the things I do for you guys still love you all)


I was trying to wall ESAM our but he took advanteof me everytime I pulled out a bomb. My most importante tools were some tilits on the ground as well as jabs because of its long hitboxes, nevertheless everytime he got in he did a lot of damage. At some point he was a aproaching with a jolt + quick attack to mixup as I wasn't able to react to both options accordingly (covered roll, spot dodge and jump + attack, grab can be done if I stayed on shield)

As I knew ESAM could easilly gimp me, my Up-b's were directed to ESAM to have a hitbox to protect me, also they were B-reverse so they would send ESAM into the blastzone ( he actually smashed DI godly to live one of those)

My first stock was rare, I think i air dodged just when the bomb exploded so I couldn't reach the ledge again. The second one he conditioned me two shield and expect the jolt and that's how he got a surprise grab with no DI
  • Quirks
Nothing too important. Link's bomb go for like 6 seconds if I remember corrctly. Most Link's like to pull on te recover. So when they are long way go and they won't get the ledge DON'T hit them, the bomb explodes too late for it to be of any help, if you hit them then the bomb will blow off and they'll get another chance.
[
 
Last edited:

Migetman3214

Smash Rookie
Joined
Dec 2, 2014
Messages
11
NNID
MegaVulcan3000
3DS FC
3566-2036-2119
Hi again! Happy to partocipate in this thr-ea*d *as a former Link main (got enlighted by the Chu and now I love the mouse). This time I can put what goes through the mind of Link as also the Pika so this is gonna be interesting.

  • Neutral
This is the state that Link usually wants to be in as with his profectiles he can rack damage little by little and aim to wall out Pikachu. Lot's of Bombs, Nair, Fair, Boomerang, Z-air, Wavebounce and B-reverse arrows are coming towards Pikachu in a hope of keeping him away. Pikachu can do his work on spamming too, but rememember Jolt, cancels boomerang and arrow but it is beatan by bomb. We can have two aproaches thar work pretty well: an easy steady approach or the neutral breaking QA. Try to use a mix of both accordingly of what you see on your opponent.

The easy steady approach usually works well in most scenarios, but the payload is not as big as a mid % (30 onwards) QA. Your best shot (in my opinion) is to watch out carefully and go in with QA as Link pulls of a bomb, that is the time where it is most vulnerable and you can get the most of it. If you fail to catch Link while pulling a jump here's the time to aproach a tad more carefully, specially if you notice that the Link has some bomb tech like instant drop, bomb fake, instant throw and aoutcanceled dair

Finally, remember that Nair, Up-air, D-air and F-air can beat our QA because the first three linger and the last comes with two hits.
  • Advantaged State
Most of the time you get into the ADV you must get a lot of damage or a stock. In my opinion the most optimal way to proceed is not to go for high damaging combos (Link is heavy and it has greater kill potential than us so rage is a bad thing to give him) but to snatch his second jump or to get him offstage is usually the best as without it he is at your total will.

Link on the other hand can do little on the ADV (his most dangerous state is when you get grabbed as he can combo or kill you if yoe are not aware of his options)
  • Disadvantaged State
We are at this when Link catches us with an Up-Tilt or grabs us as he can rack damage pretty well. At higher percents we only need to be catious of his killing options so it is not that bad as they are easily avoided.

Link on the other way can hardly do anything at this state, specially without his double jump
  • Combo Ability
Go and do the usual Pika stuff. Link's fastest move is Nair (frame 6) so if you feel like you don't have another option to continue, drop the combo with a Nair to be safe.

Link gets combos from Boomerang and Bombs, a two hit combo at most (just please reset neutral then and don't DI into boomerang into boomerang, into boomerang ... into boomerang). Keep always in movement and try not to get grabbed as Link can down throw into up tilt and most of his aerials to low-mid percents. Watch out for Jab, jab, grab; jab jab down smash, jab jab down tilt (doesn't work if you DI up and away on the jabs and jump away).
  • Punish game
Our must optimal way to punish is to steal his second job, he's pretty much death without it. Also Punish witt the usual Pika stuff. Finally if you can bait a grab now you can go ham on him

I think Link's must dangerous punish is if we miss Up-throw thunder as if he manage to air dodge he can fastfall down air and kill us at high percents. Watch out when landing, if you feel uneasy QA away. Finally, never NEVER never air dodge his downthrow if you air dodge he can up air (the lingering hitbox maintains), short hop fast fall and charge an smash and Link kills pretty earlier with that. The most optimal way is to jump again and land safely after and be wary of the double jump up-b (we can punish that because it is not a true combo if we jump away)
  • Ground-Ground, Air-Ground, and Ground-Air interactions
Groung ground we have to deal with his projectiles basic stuff. We are the ones who approach and if Link wants to rush down us... *sighs* then he is not meant to play smash.

Air ground, we actually need to be patient here, a well placed up-tilt or up smash can be really bad for us- Link can land with Nair, Fair or the For Glory Down Air (but be catious if Link knows how to cancel the last one)

Ground air. Here is whe he is ours. He can't do much out of this.
  • Edgeguarding
Pretty simple for us. Be creative, if Link likes to tether I recommend using this: (used on Toon Link but works on the regular one too)


The same goes if he is aiming to hit you with his Up-b while recovering.


On the pther hand, Link has a really bad time edgeguarding us. His best bet is to Z-Drop a bomb or try to intercept our QA with a lasting move, but because of Link's poor air speed we can easily avoid that. We can also go real low to be safe and if he gets greedy we can thunderspike him if we still have our jump.
  • Killing
Our killing moves are the regular Pika stuff and edgeguards. Be careful with up.throw thunder as if he manages to air dodge he can fast fall d-air and kill at high %

His killing moves are fair, dair, up air, smashes, tilts and up-b.

Fair can con from a double jab and he reads the jump away, down smash cames from the double jab and no jumping. F-.smash comes from down throw and Pika air doding infront of him, the same as up.smash. and up air. Up b can true combo from bomb if he is near you (but not fair or up air). or OoS if you hit his shield (risky though) And the tilts can con from random, the good thing is that must of this things aren't true and too slow to actually be harmful
  • Favorable stages
Most of them are pretty OK, but I thing the best is Lylat and Smashville for easy QAC's
  • Analysis of Top Level Matches
I don't remember seeing Nakat or ESAM or any other Pikachu playing against a TOP Link. I can give you a match where I played ESAM on stream as me as Link a time ago. That time I got pretty proud I took a stock from him, now seeing the match is kinda embarrasing (the things I do for you guys still love you all)


I was trying to wall ESAM our but he took advanteof me everytime I pulled out a bomb. My most importante tools were some tilits on the ground as well as jabs because of its long hitboxes, nevertheless everytime he got in he did a lot of damage. At some point he was a aproaching with a jolt + quick attack to mixup as I wasn't able to react to both options accordingly (covered roll, spot dodge and jump + attack, grab can be done if I stayed on shield)

As I knew ESAM could easilly gimp me, my Up-b's were directed to ESAM to have a hitbox to protect me, also they were B-reverse so they would send ESAM into the blastzone ( he actually smashed DI godly to live one of those)

My first stock was rare, I think i air dodged just when the bomb exploded so I couldn't reach the ledge again. The second one he conditioned me two shield and expect the jolt and that's how he got a surprise grab with no DI
  • Quirks
Nothing too important. Link's bomb go for like 6 seconds if I remember corrctly. Most Link's like to pull on te recover. So when they are long way go and they won't get the ledge DON'T hit them, the bomb explodes too late for it to be of any help, if you hit them then the bomb will blow off and they'll get another chance.
[
This is done really good information. I'll put this into practice and hopefully I'll see some good results. Thanks!

And great match with Esam.
 

Dadrik

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jan 10, 2016
Messages
34
Location
France
NNID
Dadrik
Hi again! Happy to partocipate in this thr-ea*d *as a former Link main (got enlighted by the Chu and now I love the mouse). This time I can put what goes through the mind of Link as also the Pika so this is gonna be interesting.

  • Neutral
This is the state that Link usually wants to be in as with his profectiles he can rack damage little by little and aim to wall out Pikachu. Lot's of Bombs, Nair, Fair, Boomerang, Z-air, Wavebounce and B-reverse arrows are coming towards Pikachu in a hope of keeping him away. Pikachu can do his work on spamming too, but rememember Jolt, cancels boomerang and arrow but it is beatan by bomb. We can have two aproaches thar work pretty well: an easy steady approach or the neutral breaking QA. Try to use a mix of both accordingly of what you see on your opponent.

The easy steady approach usually works well in most scenarios, but the payload is not as big as a mid % (30 onwards) QA. Your best shot (in my opinion) is to watch out carefully and go in with QA as Link pulls of a bomb, that is the time where it is most vulnerable and you can get the most of it. If you fail to catch Link while pulling a jump here's the time to aproach a tad more carefully, specially if you notice that the Link has some bomb tech like instant drop, bomb fake, instant throw and aoutcanceled dair

Finally, remember that Nair, Up-air, D-air and F-air can beat our QA because the first three linger and the last comes with two hits.
  • Advantaged State
Most of the time you get into the ADV you must get a lot of damage or a stock. In my opinion the most optimal way to proceed is not to go for high damaging combos (Link is heavy and it has greater kill potential than us so rage is a bad thing to give him) but to snatch his second jump or to get him offstage is usually the best as without it he is at your total will.

Link on the other hand can do little on the ADV (his most dangerous state is when you get grabbed as he can combo or kill you if yoe are not aware of his options)
  • Disadvantaged State
We are at this when Link catches us with an Up-Tilt or grabs us as he can rack damage pretty well. At higher percents we only need to be catious of his killing options so it is not that bad as they are easily avoided.

Link on the other way can hardly do anything at this state, specially without his double jump
  • Combo Ability
Go and do the usual Pika stuff. Link's fastest move is Nair (frame 6) so if you feel like you don't have another option to continue, drop the combo with a Nair to be safe.

Link gets combos from Boomerang and Bombs, a two hit combo at most (just please reset neutral then and don't DI into boomerang into boomerang, into boomerang ... into boomerang). Keep always in movement and try not to get grabbed as Link can down throw into up tilt and most of his aerials to low-mid percents. Watch out for Jab, jab, grab; jab jab down smash, jab jab down tilt (doesn't work if you DI up and away on the jabs and jump away).
  • Punish game
Our must optimal way to punish is to steal his second job, he's pretty much death without it. Also Punish witt the usual Pika stuff. Finally if you can bait a grab now you can go ham on him

I think Link's must dangerous punish is if we miss Up-throw thunder as if he manage to air dodge he can fastfall down air and kill us at high percents. Watch out when landing, if you feel uneasy QA away. Finally, never NEVER never air dodge his downthrow if you air dodge he can up air (the lingering hitbox maintains), short hop fast fall and charge an smash and Link kills pretty earlier with that. The most optimal way is to jump again and land safely after and be wary of the double jump up-b (we can punish that because it is not a true combo if we jump away)
  • Ground-Ground, Air-Ground, and Ground-Air interactions
Groung ground we have to deal with his projectiles basic stuff. We are the ones who approach and if Link wants to rush down us... *sighs* then he is not meant to play smash.

Air ground, we actually need to be patient here, a well placed up-tilt or up smash can be really bad for us- Link can land with Nair, Fair or the For Glory Down Air (but be catious if Link knows how to cancel the last one)

Ground air. Here is whe he is ours. He can't do much out of this.
  • Edgeguarding
Pretty simple for us. Be creative, if Link likes to tether I recommend using this: (used on Toon Link but works on the regular one too)


The same goes if he is aiming to hit you with his Up-b while recovering.


On the pther hand, Link has a really bad time edgeguarding us. His best bet is to Z-Drop a bomb or try to intercept our QA with a lasting move, but because of Link's poor air speed we can easily avoid that. We can also go real low to be safe and if he gets greedy we can thunderspike him if we still have our jump.
  • Killing
Our killing moves are the regular Pika stuff and edgeguards. Be careful with up.throw thunder as if he manages to air dodge he can fast fall d-air and kill at high %

His killing moves are fair, dair, up air, smashes, tilts and up-b.

Fair can con from a double jab and he reads the jump away, down smash cames from the double jab and no jumping. F-.smash comes from down throw and Pika air doding infront of him, the same as up.smash. and up air. Up b can true combo from bomb if he is near you (but not fair or up air). or OoS if you hit his shield (risky though) And the tilts can con from random, the good thing is that must of this things aren't true and too slow to actually be harmful
  • Favorable stages
Most of them are pretty OK, but I thing the best is Lylat and Smashville for easy QAC's
  • Analysis of Top Level Matches
I don't remember seeing Nakat or ESAM or any other Pikachu playing against a TOP Link. I can give you a match where I played ESAM on stream as me as Link a time ago. That time I got pretty proud I took a stock from him, now seeing the match is kinda embarrasing (the things I do for you guys still love you all)


I was trying to wall ESAM our but he took advanteof me everytime I pulled out a bomb. My most importante tools were some tilits on the ground as well as jabs because of its long hitboxes, nevertheless everytime he got in he did a lot of damage. At some point he was a aproaching with a jolt + quick attack to mixup as I wasn't able to react to both options accordingly (covered roll, spot dodge and jump + attack, grab can be done if I stayed on shield)

As I knew ESAM could easilly gimp me, my Up-b's were directed to ESAM to have a hitbox to protect me, also they were B-reverse so they would send ESAM into the blastzone ( he actually smashed DI godly to live one of those)

My first stock was rare, I think i air dodged just when the bomb exploded so I couldn't reach the ledge again. The second one he conditioned me two shield and expect the jolt and that's how he got a surprise grab with no DI
  • Quirks
Nothing too important. Link's bomb go for like 6 seconds if I remember corrctly. Most Link's like to pull on te recover. So when they are long way go and they won't get the ledge DON'T hit them, the bomb explodes too late for it to be of any help, if you hit them then the bomb will blow off and they'll get another chance.
[
Great advices man, thanks a lot !
A lot of info and insights.
 
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