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So, it's just impossible for me to actually improve huh?

G

guedes the brawler

Smash Lord
Joined
Jan 3, 2009
Messages
1,076
Location
Brazil. Sadly. Living here SUCKS!
NNID
Rafabrawl
I live in Brazil, barely any normal smash pro scene, let alone a PM scene. So i though "hey, at least i can still fight CPUs to improve!"

Since i don't actively use any advanced techs (even the basic ones like L-cancelling or SHFF) because i don't remember about them mid-match (10+ years or not using them does that to you.), i though the CPU being tough would force me to improve and remember them... but...

sometime s it's by my own skill, sometimes it's because of their dumb edge behavior, but i can consistently win against Lv9 CPU unless i'm using a character that i don't know much about or one that really needs an advanced mindset to work decently... i see videos of PM pros and such and i'd love to get even close to that, but... any help?
 
Thane of Blue Flames

Thane of Blue Flames

Fire is catching.
Joined
Nov 23, 2013
Messages
3,135
Location
The other side of Sanity
guedes the brawler said:
I live in Brazil, barely any normal smash pro scene, let alone a PM scene. So i though "hey, at least i can still fight CPUs to improve!"

Since i don't actively use any advanced techs (even the basic ones like L-cancelling or SHFF) because i don't remember about them mid-match (10+ years or not using them does that to you.), i though the CPU being tough would force me to improve and remember them... but...

sometime s it's by my own skill, sometimes it's because of their dumb edge behavior, but i can consistently win against Lv9 CPU unless i'm using a character that i don't know much about or one that really needs an advanced mindset to work decently... i see videos of PM pros and such and i'd love to get even close to that, but... any help?
Click to expand...
Just force yourself to practice them. Go to an infinite time match yourself on Battlefield and Wavedash off the top platform, waveland off the second and then the main stage. Repeat. Practice your SHFFs. Work on your edge game - test which aerials are practical to use returning from the edge and in what situations. Work on your walljumps and wavedashes out of quick draw that one's probably just for me unless you main Ike.

Lack of a scene does hold you back but if you can't implement techs in a match with a CPU, that's on you.
 
P

Phaiyte

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 6, 2010
Messages
932
All I can tell you is as long as you actively try to improve your movement skills instead of just fighting the cpu, you will greatly improve. Before my first tournament, my only real experience was fighting lvl 3 cpu bowser for hours on end. But I didn't really fight Bowser that much, I took more time to learn what my character was capable of doing. I asked myself questions like "If I do this, and he DIs this or that way, wouldn't this be a better or worse option in that case?" And I would test it over and over until I finally got the CPU to act the way I wanted it to to simulate what I wanted to see.

I never could find a Smash scene, so I created one. I haven't lost a tournament in my region yet. Don't give up, bro.
 
Ultimate Sneeze

Ultimate Sneeze

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Dec 8, 2013
Messages
94
Location
Tri Cities, WA
I have the same sort of situation (although my lack of online play is because I just really don't like online play, I should stop being a goober). I won't say that I'm top tier or anything (or anything that comes within 3,000 miles of top tier), but I've been on my own basically for like 10 months now, and about December-ish I started to really get consistent with wavedashing and l-cancelling, as well as looking into more wavelands, land-canceled projectiles and the like. While I won't say I can apply everything 100% well 100% of the time, about a week ago I did a wavedash backwards into Up-Smash with Marth that would've made this Zelda rage, if the Zelda was being played by a human. Finally, something I'm still working on, is tech reaction time. When the CPU hits you, can you tech 100% of the time? Because I can't. If anything, you can practice being a sandbag.

I haven't gotten 10 years of habits like you mentioned, though, I started playing around 2007.

Usually I play against level 7 CPUs, because I've heard they DI more like humans do.
 
G

guedes the brawler

Smash Lord
Joined
Jan 3, 2009
Messages
1,076
Location
Brazil. Sadly. Living here SUCKS!
NNID
Rafabrawl
oh, teching. i NEVER remeber to do that. but i guess this one is easy to practice, if i hang around the lower part of Temple or something.

Do you guys think training Techs in brawl (cage custom stage) will help me in PM?
 
C

Crescent Monkey

Smash Apprentice
Joined
May 9, 2011
Messages
106
Location
Olney, MD
Why even bother to get better if you're never going to play other people. Fighting CPUs is boring, and you'll only get so good, and you'll pick up a boatload of bad habits. If you want to play this game, you have two options:

-Try and get a local scene started, it worked for a few of my friends, there may be more people like you in your area than you think

-Get a computer that can handle netplay. No Money johns, the computer will be a one time cost, and if that is the only way you get to play a game you love, than its worth it

The only thing you should use computers for is combo practice on low levels when you are first learning your character. Please don't force yourself to play them anymore. Find people
 
sushifreAk

sushifreAk

Smash Cadet
Joined
Dec 18, 2012
Messages
51
Location
Philippines
NNID
Cyb3Rnite
3DS FC
4554-0880-9460
Crescent Monkey said:
Why even bother to get better if you're never going to play other people. Fighting CPUs is boring, and you'll only get so good, and you'll pick up a boatload of bad habits. If you want to play this game, you have two options:

-Try and get a local scene started, it worked for a few of my friends, there may be more people like you in your area than you think

-Get a computer that can handle netplay. No Money johns, the computer will be a one time cost, and if that is the only way you get to play a game you love, than its worth it

The only thing you should use computers for is combo practice on low levels when you are first learning your character. Please don't force yourself to play them anymore. Find people
Click to expand...
That sounded a little rude, but it's true. Our scene in the Philippines contains around 20 people who can barely find anyone to play, and are used to fighting CPUs. We only have meets every few months. Our whole meta is basically "who can get rid of their CPU-fighting habits first wins."
 
D

drummaniac28

Smash Cadet
Joined
Nov 22, 2013
Messages
40
Location
Indianapolis, IN
Ultimate Sneeze said:
I have the same sort of situation (although my lack of online play is because I just really don't like online play, I should stop being a goober). I won't say that I'm top tier or anything (or anything that comes within 3,000 miles of top tier), but I've been on my own basically for like 10 months now, and about December-ish I started to really get consistent with wavedashing and l-cancelling, as well as looking into more wavelands, land-canceled projectiles and the like. While I won't say I can apply everything 100% well 100% of the time, about a week ago I did a wavedash backwards into Up-Smash with Marth that would've made this Zelda rage, if the Zelda was being played by a human. Finally, something I'm still working on, is tech reaction time. When the CPU hits you, can you tech 100% of the time? Because I can't. If anything, you can practice being a sandbag.

I haven't gotten 10 years of habits like you mentioned, though, I started playing around 2007.

Usually I play against level 7 CPUs, because I've heard they DI more like humans do.
Click to expand...
It's probably not your reaction time, but most likely you are spamming the shield button. After full-pressing shield, the window to tech stays open for 20 frames, but then there is a 40 frame cooldown before you can tech again, which can cause problems if you full-press to L-cancel, or just start spamming shield right after being hit. If you L-cancel with a full-press, switch to only using a light-press. If you go in for an aerial, try to L-cancel with a full-press but whiff it and get hit, you won't be able to tech the ground, a problem that's eliminated by only using a light-press for L-cancels.
 
D

Daftatt

"float like a puffball, sting like a knee"
Joined
Mar 16, 2013
Messages
1,219
Location
Olympia, WA
NNID
Daftatt
guedes the brawler said:
I live in Brazil, barely any normal smash pro scene, let alone a PM scene. So i though "hey, at least i can still fight CPUs to improve!"

Since i don't actively use any advanced techs (even the basic ones like L-cancelling or SHFF) because i don't remember about them mid-match (10+ years or not using them does that to you.), i though the CPU being tough would force me to improve and remember them... but...

sometime s it's by my own skill, sometimes it's because of their dumb edge behavior, but i can consistently win against Lv9 CPU unless i'm using a character that i don't know much about or one that really needs an advanced mindset to work decently... i see videos of PM pros and such and i'd love to get even close to that, but... any help?
Click to expand...
I was a brawl player for 5 years before I picked up P:M, advanced tech was really hard for me to start using. When I started there wasn't anyone around to play with so I just fought the CPUs and practiced wavedashing/L-canceling in training mode, and then eventually in CPU fights. I play squirtle and ZSS and I can definitely say that if you just practice your tech skill and play against CPUs A LOT, then you will learn nearly all of the correct DI in the game and you can definitely become very VERY good doing just that. Eventually I found some other people to play with, and taught some others from the ground up, and now I have burgeoning smash scene in my town where there was literally none previously. I even am TO for a monthly tournament starting next week.

Smash communities can sometimes just coalesce in larger cities, but in smaller/rural places it takes one person to have the initiative to find and organize smashers. As for your AT skill the only way you will ever get better is going to the lab and practicing unhindered, focusing on using just your ATs.

Hope your prospects improve, as for me I'm still fighting CPUs because i honestly think it's the most efficient way to develop a strong foundation of technical ability.
 
MLGF

MLGF

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 19, 2013
Messages
1,922
You don't play CPU's to win.
You play them to style and notice what you do wrong.
But mostly style.
God the style.
Oh man, style.
Style.
 
supreme jd

supreme jd

Smash Rookie
Joined
Mar 28, 2014
Messages
20
You should force yourself to remember to apply your tech skill against the CPU, that's the whole point of playing them. Once you can do it comfortably against the CPU, then it'll be easier when you have to do it in a real match. It sounds like you are blaming the CPU for not being able to remember to practice your techniques. You need to be aware that you are autopiloting and stop it.

If you can't do it perfectly vs a CPU then you're gonna have a hard time doing it against a real opponent, just saying.
 
Rhus

Rhus

We're going top speed!
Joined
May 17, 2014
Messages
529
Location
Canada, MB
I am in a similar predicament. I live in an area with no Smash Scene pretty much whatsoever, so I've been trying to get some guys together from the University to play. Slowly but surely we are expanding...a little.

I main Fox, so I tend to just sit in training mode, struggle through techs and hopefully get it down consistently. I am not sure whether or not I'm just a poor player or Fox is just this hard to learn, but I find myself improving very gradually, at a snail's pace. I can consistently waveland and full length wavedash with him and got he SHFFL completely down and I can B-reverse SHDL pretty much without errors. My teching has improved drastically too, but I think Fox's fall speed means that whenever I'm knocked horizontally and hit the stage I HAVE to tech, otherwise I die, so there's more urgency to learn it.

While I can waveshine well, I can only do it once for some reason and I really struggle to combo out of it at all ie. Waveshine to grab, Usmash etc. In addition, I completely ignore my OoS options just because I forget about it.

All in all, I find if I just sit in training long enough, I learn what I usually want to, but have trouble applying it. For instance, I can wavedash fine, but I have issues acting out of it entirely, so I usually just use it defensively.
 
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