Shulk feels too slow

[Kirby Phelps (PK)]

I really like Shulk and all...but he feels too slow. Not just his movement, but his attacks too. The all have a delay to them and I can never perform split second reaction moves. I was fighting again a Lucina and I felt like I had no options because in comparison, Lucina is much much quicker. She always moved first. What should I do in cases where I'm fighting a fast character. I considered using Shulk's Speed Art, but from what I can tell, that only makes Shulk move faster and doesn't do much for his attacks. I'm trying to really feel it. Someone help me really feel it.

 

[Berserker.]

I really like Shulk and all...but he feels too slow. Not just his movement, but his attacks too. The all have a delay to them and I can never perform split second reaction moves. I was fighting again a Lucina and I felt like I had no options because in comparison, Lucina is much much quicker. She always moved first. What should I do in cases where I'm fighting a fast character. I considered using Shulk's Speed Art, but from what I can tell, that only makes Shulk move faster and doesn't do much for his attacks. I'm trying to really feel it. Someone help me really feel it.

Problem is, Shulk's a defensive character for the most part so he isn't notable for his speed. Maybe with jump or speed, you can rushdown but Shulk's predominantly a defensive character. Take advantage of your range and damage. Punish with your smash attacks. Space with your tilts, n-air and f-air. Master pivot grabbing. You don't have to move that much. I barely dash with Shulk (Unless I have speed activated). I just jump and space n-air or f-air. Also, your counter is really good so use that at the right time

But seriously, Jump Shulk is amazing. Use that if you want to rush down

 

[Kirby Phelps (PK)]

Jump is probably the Art I use least. A lot of people I fight stay low, so I never saw much use for it.

 

[Jgod]

Nair is lagless.

 

[Masonomace]

I really like Shulk and all...but he feels too slow. Not just his movement, but his attacks too. The all have a delay to them and I can never perform split second reaction moves. I was fighting again a Lucina and I felt like I had no options because in comparison, Lucina is much much quicker. She always moved first. What should I do in cases where I'm fighting a fast character. I considered using Shulk's Speed Art, but from what I can tell, that only makes Shulk move faster and doesn't do much for his attacks. I'm trying to really feel it. Someone help me really feel it.

When it comes down to a character like Lucina, I feel there should be little trouble with spacing Shulk's aerials against her. You outrange her with all of your moves, all that's needed is decent timing & aerial DI forward or stationary. Also Nair is amazing & I think at this point it's Shulk's BnB move. It's practically an auto-canceling aerial & you follow up with basically any Tilt or Jab or Grab upon landing, including landing pivot grab as a cross-up. If he feels too slow, make up for it by abusing his long-range aerials with the Beam portion of his moves.

 

[Berserker.]

Jump is probably the Art I use least. A lot of people I fight stay low, so I never saw much use for it.

I don't think fighting low really helps against jump. N-air covers a lot of area and F-air covers your front-lower area. Oh and you should grab with it more often--- I meant pivot grab. It helps in making your rushdown less predictable

 

[Kirby Phelps (PK)]

I think I'm gonna need a visual example, because I'm trying out Jump and I'm not seeing how it can be effective... (currently getting owned by a Little Mac)

 

[Berserker.]

I think I'm gonna need a visual example, because I'm trying out Jump and I'm not seeing how it can be effective... (currently getting owned by a Little Mac)

Oh right him. You're better of using Vanilla Shulk. Don't use any power up against him

Oh here are some videos of amazing jump utilization
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aCY92iqRuck
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zhTMY_PdeE0

 

[Jerm]

For little mac you want to use that buster/smash counter. Does a disgusting amount of damage/knockback respectively.

 

[InfiniteTripping]

To be fair it is a common complaint with a lot of characters, that they are slow. At least he has range to make up for it.

 

[Kirby Phelps (PK)]

Okay, is pivot grabbing where you run, turn around, and then quickly grab? Because whenever I turn around and press the button I assigned to grab (Y button), my character does a tilt attack instead.....wh-WHAT!!? Is that normal!? I have to wait a second before my Y button turns back into a grab. What the hell!!?

 

[Berserker.]

Okay, is pivot grabbing where you run, turn around, and then quickly grab? Because whenever I turn around and press the button I assigned to grab (Y button), my character does a tilt attack instead.....wh-WHAT!!? Is that normal!? I have to wait a second before my Y button turns back into a grab. What the hell!!?

Yeah, you'll get used to it

I also had a hard time at first because I wasn't feeling it

 

[Masonomace]

Shulk to me felt slow because I was adjusting to 3DS controls honestly. The only major adjustments I needed to condition myself to get used to were Jump button & Grab.

This is coming from a GCC player who used the to shield & never used at all EXCEPT for Yoshi stuff. 3DS's is grab thus royally screwing me over, but I was used to it within a minute when doing Speed sliding pivot grabs. *Whew*
And yes I know you can change controls but I only played 10 minutes tops testing whatever I could for myself in Training Mode at my friend's house.

 

[Silver Forte]

Yeah I'm just getting tilts when I try to pivot grab, I dunno if its the controls or me since I just learned about pivot grabbing yesterday.

 

[toadster101]

That's because he is slow, but that doesn't mean he isn't good.

 

[Kirby Phelps (PK)]

Hoooly crap. I just fought a Kirby that literally did nothing but roll. Just rolled all over the stage and never attacked me head on. I was the one that had to approach, and I always ended up getting punished. It was so stupid. Isn't rolling not the best option? Isn't it super punishable? I even tried grabbing him once he rolled toward me, but he just down smashed before I could grab. It was like he had more priority out of a roll. I even tried using Nair and Fair as best I could, but again, SHULK IS SO SLOW! Kirby would just end up attacking me before I could do it. In hindsight, I probably should've saved the match so you guys could see what was going on, but I was too frustrated...

 

[Masonomace]

That's on you then.
Rolling abuse like that no matter how relatively safe rolling became in Sm4sh, is still rolling, & to the extent of what it sounds like, you should of abused using Dsmash, turnaround Fsmashes, or reading with a dash grab behind you if it was that bad. I'd need to see the match to give advice, but the frustration doesn't help me.

 

[Kirby Phelps (PK)]

The next time I epicly lose with Shulk, I'll save the replay for critiquing purposes.

 

[MarioFireRed]

Try short hop Speed Nair approaches. Helps build momentum and to safely close distance between you and the opponent. From there try predicting shield rolls with grabs and follow up from there.

 

[InfiniteTripping]

His counter comes out too slow and if it misses, leaves you vulnerable. It's my favorite move of his but it's just so slow going. It never seems to come out fast enough. I'm really giving Shulk a chance because I like the feel of the character and his range, but I keep getting shut down by spammy projectile characters. There's not a lot in Shulk's arsenal that can deal with something like that, unless I'm missing something.

 

[Berserker.]

Campy characters are definitely something Shulk has trouble against. Your best bet is speed or jump. That's not to say that it guarantees victory. It just makes things more bearable

And also, counter comes out slow? O_o'

 

[InfiniteTripping]

Maybe just online it does. I anticipate an attack and I hit the button and nothing happens and I get whacked.

 

[Berserker.]

Maybe just online it does. I anticipate an attack and I hit the button and nothing happens and I get whacked.

Probably. Well, I don't play that much FG matches since my internet is crap so I'm unsure about this (I play local mostly)

 

[Masonomace]

His counter comes out too slow and if it misses, leaves you vulnerable. It's my favorite move of his but it's just so slow going. It never seems to come out fast enough. I'm really giving Shulk a chance because I like the feel of the character and his range, but I keep getting shut down by spammy projectile characters. There's not a lot in Shulk's arsenal that can deal with something like that, unless I'm missing something.

Interesting. Are they ever near your "Zone" appearing when you Vision counter?

An alternative to your issue can be to use the Powerful Vision Custom Move since it's counter-window increases allowing Vision reads to be more frequent. . .however the "Zone" that I just talked about doesn't appear for this Vision variation so you're left with no help to slow them down while parrying. But that's in the future or against friends only.

Depending on the projectile, the 9% rule is the magic priority rule when it comes to projectiles. Let's say a Samus shoots a baby missile that does 4%; when you put Buster on, if you Ftilt the missile, you will destroy it out-prioritizing it because Ftilt's damage that regularly does 12% with the Blade portion now deals at least 16%. Buster oddly helps in dealing with projectiles that way because of the % damage increase. This is also why it's great to use the Blade portion of your moves to stop projectiles except Nair which does more damage with the Beam. Hope that helped

 

[InfiniteTripping]

Interesting. Are they ever near your "Zone" appearing when you Vision counter?

An alternative to your issue can be to use the Powerful Vision Custom Move since it's counter-window increases allowing Vision reads to be more frequent. . .however the "Zone" that I just talked about doesn't appear for this Vision variation so you're left with no help to slow them down while parrying. But that's in the future or against friends only.

Depending on the projectile, the 9% rule is the magic priority rule when it comes to projectiles. Let's say a Samus shoots a baby missile that does 4%; when you put Buster on, if you Ftilt the missile, you will destroy it out-prioritizing it because Ftilt's damage that regularly does 12% with the Blade portion now deals at least 16%. Buster oddly helps in dealing with projectiles that way because of the % damage increase. This is also why it's great to use the Blade portion of your moves to stop projectiles except Nair which does more damage with the Beam. Hope that helped

I think it has to do with online mode with the counter, to be honest. I know I am hitting the buttons before a hit but it doesn't even get to make a failed attempt - their hit just comes out first. To do a counter you really have to have that split second reaction and either the move is not fast enough to allow for that, or the online mode just lags - and I'm thinking it is the latter because I don't have problems timing it with the computers. It's rough too because that counter could do a lot to stop the spamming characters, because you can just hug them and the range of his counter should reach no problem.

I am still a beginner with Shulk, but I did recently learn what Buster even did and I was using Smash as my default, so now I'm switching it up. Go Buster first, then switch to Smash at high percentage. I don't even use the other arts. I think Jump is pointless from what I've used of it, and actually helps to mess up short hops than do anything good, speed just increases movement speed and does nothing to speed up his attacks which would have been really useful, and defense... I suppose defense is kinda useful for turtling, like if you have to preserve a stock to take it to sudden death. But in any normal, non-online rules, it's probably pretty useless too. It just stalls the inevitable.

 

[_Magus_]

This is the reason I pursued a different main. I started playing as shulk, but he was far too slow for my playstyle.

 

[Masonomace]

I think it has to do with online mode with the counter, to be honest. I know I am hitting the buttons before a hit but it doesn't even get to make a failed attempt - their hit just comes out first. To do a counter you really have to have that split second reaction and either the move is not fast enough to allow for that, or the online mode just lags - and I'm thinking it is the latter because I don't have problems timing it with the computers. It's rough too because that counter could do a lot to stop the spamming characters, because you can just hug them and the range of his counter should reach no problem.

I am still a beginner with Shulk, but I did recently learn what Buster even did and I was using Smash as my default, so now I'm switching it up. Go Buster first, then switch to Smash at high percentage. I don't even use the other arts. I think Jump is pointless from what I've used of it, and actually helps to mess up short hops than do anything good, speed just increases movement speed and does nothing to speed up his attacks which would have been really useful, and defense... I suppose defense is kinda useful for turtling, like if you have to preserve a stock to take it to sudden death. But in any normal, non-online rules, it's probably pretty useless too. It just stalls the inevitable.

I can see the online point being more plausible if anything. Counter attacks do require a read ahead by at least half of a second to be truly effective; you have to have the thought to counter a move literally a second before they input that move so I feel for you.

There are times using Smash at the start of a match is actually rewarding for Shulk. For one, it helps escaping combo strings much quicker & much earlier such as, Sheik's Ftilts or Lucario's Utilts. Speaking of Lucario, Smash is a great Art to use against him because it cheats his AuraBoost% built-in mechanic; Smash doesn't increase the % damage you take & only increases launching you take while dealing less % damage to him thus ruining his AB%.
Jump & Speed have their uses, but they affect Shulk's mobility so much you'd have to play with them for a good while to fully adjust to their game-play, because a Jump's ShortHop is basically equal to Vanilla Shulk's FullHop height, not to mention the gravity, falling speed, & air speed that icnrease in Jump mode. Speed's usefulness boosts your grab-game & your pivot grab the most, which is mostly the reason people use Speed at all other than punishing stage-wide mistakes. Shield imo is the most underrated Art & should be used more often for turtling like you mentioned. Shield is also my most-favored Art to use simply because it's a great Art to stall the match thus slowing it down, baiting your opponent to come to you & make mistakes & get stressed out unable to KO you; it's the Art I think that helps outplay others that also sets yourself up to use Smash perfectly with the Rage boost you get from high %.

This is the reason I pursued a different main. I started playing as shulk, but he was far too slow for my playstyle.

B-but, Speed Art. ;_; Even Jump Art airborne is fast too.

 

[Shulkmania]

Nair is lagless.

What he said. ALSO, if you learn how to Art Cancel (yay for new tech) everything becomes lagless and you can get F-Smash and Jab combos in really easily, and if you MArt Cancel into Buster the percentages rack up. Shulk seems like he's gonna be really technical, but really good if we make him.

Ya gotta' feel it.

 

[InfiniteTripping]

Sometimes I get the feeling from Shulk that he will be pointlessly technical in the same manner the Pokemon Trainer was. I really put a lot of time into trying to make the Trainer good in Brawl, which was ultimately wasted. Then again I have a history of putting time into characters initially that I ultimately abandon (like Ganondorf in Melee, or even Ness in the original).

 

[Neoleo21]

Sometimes I get the feeling from Shulk that he will be pointlessly technical in the same manner the Pokemon Trainer was. I really put a lot of time into trying to make the Trainer good in Brawl, which was ultimately wasted. Then again I have a history of putting time into characters initially that I ultimately abandon (like Ganondorf in Melee, or even Ness in the original).

I think you'll get more out of shulk, his gimmick seems much more applicable than the poke trainer and he has techs to alleviate some flaws. The monado cancel is one of the biggest discoveries period and is the best thing that could've happened to this character.

 

[InfiniteTripping]

I think you'll get more out of shulk, his gimmick seems much more applicable than the poke trainer and he has techs to alleviate some flaws. The monado cancel is one of the biggest discoveries period and is the best thing that could've happened to this character.

I think I am bailing for Bowser Jr. regardless. One thing I did towards the end was use back slash to recover. Sounds crazy I know, but it just is not expected and nails a nosy edge guarder good. I'll still play him occasionally but he's just a tad too slow for me, and I don't think I'll be able to put the arts together to make him a good character.