Should I be worried? I think I suck.

[WaterDemonBaku]

I seem to have trouble fighting Level 9 CPU's all the time. Like regardless of the match up I seem to get pummeled because of their spot on air dodges and power shielding and rolls and all that AI stuff. Yet when I play on For Glory mode or with friends, I win more than I do with CPU's. It can't be everyone else because I have almost 500 matches on For Glory clocked in.

Would like some guidance about this situation.

 

[Snigg]

To be fair, CPU are made to avoid as many attacks as possible and punish anything unsafe. The slightest mistake a player makes can result in a nasty punishment. Humans are typically easier for some because you can actually read people and predict what they might do. Unless you understand the AI of a Level 9 CPU and what they will do in certain types of situations, CPU's can be a lot harder than actual humans... In my opinion :x

 

[Drarky]

Human patterns are easier to beat than a CPU that's designed to wait for your move to punish, don't feel too bad about it, you'll learn some things with that experience in the end.

 

[Fooni]

Level 9 CPU's will see you coming from a mile away. I tested it and the only thing that can defeat Lv 9 CPU
is by being a spammer yourself. Take Ness for example. Also they have been improved upon latest patch
according to most players.

 

[Blue Warrior]

CPUs are different from human players because they have perfect reaction times. Shield is accessible from frame one, so the optimal playstyle for a computer is to block/dodge and punish. Humans, especially with online latency, are much more reliant on actual prediction and pattern memorization to win in a fight.

So you have to change your mindset when you fight an AI. Instead of trying to get the jump on them with certain moves, you have to outsmart them. Instead of racing them, you have to confuse them. Find scenarios and setups that the AI don't know how to deal with.

 

[Wintropy]

Honestly, relying on CPUs will only do more harm than good in the long run. They're fine to brush up on your techniques or as a casual sparring partner, but remember that they don't function in the same way as a human player does. You're at risk of developing unsavoury habits if you learn by fighting the AI.

If I'm playing against the CPU, I stick with level 8. I find that offers the best balance between "challenging" and "not relying on frame-perfect dodges".

 

[Ravine]

I read a post here that an item will force them to air dodge and then to hit them is to just punish their air dodge. Not a very good way to train since you will learn how to fight against CPUs instead of humans.

 

[Photon Jet]

You have nothing to fear. We can all have trouble with those CPU's at max level but with practice, we can overcome them!

 

[Deleted member]

First of all, unless you are practising tech skill against lvl 3 cpu, you should probably play against lvl 8 cpu. Lvl 9 cpu know your inputs as soon as they are entered, have faster than human reaction times and are frame perfect. Don't play against them unless you are prepared for a whooping.

 

[Purin a.k.a. José]

CPU's are programmed to be like that... they are literally frame-perfect. Really made to piss you off. So, it's not like you suck. If you lost against real people, then you should be worried.

 

[EddyAOS]

Don't worry man, I used to do the same thing, trying to train with level 9 CPU's, and I would get absolutely crushed every time. It used to make me really mad

 

[Neku ネク]

I would take that opportunity to improve certain skills that you have. CPUs read inputs because their AI has been programmed that way (people have probably said that already but who reads, anyway?).

If you want some practice, try doing spot-dodge drills. It helps a lot when preparing to counter attack. Don't rely on smash attacks immediately out of dodges, either. Try using tilts or jabs. It won't send them flying but it'll rack up damage.

Also, if you play a character with counters, CPUs are pretty basic when they're going to attack. Sometimes, their moves are so readable, you'd swear you were in a library (hue). Pay attention to what times they attack and counter accordingly. If they roll, use moves to counter their rolls like down smashes that cover the stage all around or specials (for me, it's Lucas's PK Fire and Peach's Peach Bomber). Also, try doing pivot grabs when they're shielding.

You will have a tough time regardless, but practicing tech is how you improve your own gameplay, especially when you can fight against people who read your moves.

 

[WindHero]

Am I the only one to curbstomp Lv. 9 CPUs..? Nah, nah, just kidding, they are actually at about 50/50 with me when I fight them. Usually, I lose the first match, then try again and beat them. However, I have noticed that they foster some bad habits. (Personally, they taught me to use dodge rolls as a primary form of locomotion... Boy did I get punished by a Sheik player in my first tournament!) I have found one technique quite useful for downing CPUs: shield>grab. If you can bait them to attack, then shield grab them, you can keep them off-kilter long enough to get one or two combos in. However, be prepared for them to try grabbing you instead of attacking next time. Really, it may just be me, but it seems like CPUs are on an endless cycle of attack/grab/attack/grab/etc.-ad-nauseum. They react to your shields and counters by moving to a grab strategy, and they react to your attack strategies by shielding and attacking out of shield.
(Before the first patch, I managed to beat every CPU at Lv9 using Robin, no joke. Usually within the first 1-3 tries as well.)

Still, I must say that I myself am in a bind when it comes to practice. My internet is limited to the point that I can't play Smash online at will, I have to wait til I can go somewhere with fast and free wifi. So, my main opponents are CPUs, or my friends at college during the school year.... And now it's Summer...

 

[Hyruleslink]

Level 9 CPU's will see you coming from a mile away. I tested it and the only thing that can defeat Lv 9 CPU
is by being a spammer yourself. Take Ness for example. Also they have been improved upon latest patch
according to most players.

Ok. That is totally false. I have no issues fighting level 9 CPUs and I don't need to be a "spammer". It's all about mixing up your attacks and strategies. Keep practicing to increase your reaction time. Back in the Melee days I wanted to get really good so I decided to train DBZ style (100 times gravity). I played against a team of three level 9s constantly. I got destroyed a lot, but eventually my reaction time in Smash increased so much that it came to a point when no one could beat me that I played. That type of Smash Training is intense and requires a LOT of patience. Do that training everyday for an hour for a month and your reaction time should increase greatly.

 

[Swampertrulz]

Just keep your guard and watch their movements.

 

[Ryuki of Spiral Rhapsody]

Ok. That is totally false. I have no issues fighting level 9 CPUs and I don't need to be a "spammer". It's all about mixing up your attacks and strategies. Keep practicing to increase your reaction time. Back in the Melee days I wanted to get really good so I decided to train DBZ style (100 times gravity). I played against a team of three level 9s constantly. I got destroyed a lot, but eventually my reaction time in Smash increased so much that it came to a point when no one could beat me that I played. That type of Smash Training is intense and requires a LOT of patience. Do that training everyday for an hour for a month and your reaction time should increase greatly.

"Mixing up your attacks and strategies" doesn't change the fact that Smash 4's CPUs literally read your inputs (This input done by the player has 4 frames of start up, so I'll just use this move which happens to be 2 frames).

Man, I wish I was a life form with Smash 4's frame data programmed into my head. I might start winning more often!

 

[A_Kae]

"Mixing up your attacks and strategies" doesn't change the fact that Smash 4's CPUs literally read your inputs (This input done by the player has 4 frames of start up, so I'll just use this move which happens to be 2 frames).

Man, I wish I was a life form with Smash 4's frame data programmed into my head. I might start winning more often!

CPUs, if I recall correctly, have 1 frame reaction times. Not quite input reading, but close enough.

Fighting CPUs, and especially level 9 CPUs, trains you to fight CPUs. They don't improvise, they don't learn, and they react much faster than is actually possible.

Fight real people, not AI.

 

[Izayoi]

If I'm playing against the CPU, I stick with level 8. I find that offers the best balance between "challenging" and "not relying on frame-perfect dodges".

There are certain characters that perform like a Lv9 even at Lv8 from all my casual "sparring" with them, actually. Of course, they are a little bit easier to beat than their Lv9 AI but man are they annoying.
- That cape spam and roll grabs are so tiring to deal with. Not exactly hard to kill, just extremely frustrating to so.
- Hoo boy, their grab game is real. Also they won't hesitate in catching you with a Side B just because of the super armor.
- All they do is try to grab you at every given opportunity. It drives me insane when all they do is Power Shield and grab you. Oh, but...they won't do anything to you and instead just roll spam backwards if you stand still with a charged projectile like Thoron or Aura Sphere. It's weird.
- Hilariously strong in the hands of an AI. Still dies whenever we slap them.

Any counter character- Power Shields into grabs, while they also have a Counter to boot! Yay!

- They actually do Jab cancels and it's frustrating when they do.
- I'm only listing him here because he's Sonic.



Speaking of AI, there are AIs that are hilariously bad even at Lv9... This is taken from my experience when playing a mini-game called Journey with my friend as we fight (with team attack on) a 10 Stock Lv9 CPU with only 1 Stock.
- Just floats there and does nothing...Even there are free punishes on display. I'm serious.
- They seem to forget what Luma is.
- They always use their Monado Arts at the worst possible time. Especially Buster and Smash.
- They seem whiff a lot...maybe that's just me.
- Whenever they catch you with an Egg Lay they will always whiff TWO smash attacks. Namely Down and Up smash.
- They try so hard to spike you they actually kill themselves. Or get spiked themselves. Most often the former.
- Too new for good AI, I guess. The shenanigans Lv9 Ryu pulls are hilarious.
- Maybe just me, but they are the sandbaggiest of the heavies when played by Lv9 CPUs...
- They Side B a lot when off stage. They will actually fall for repeated punishes from the Side B spam.


...I think I derailed too much. But I spent like 30 minutes typing this so bah.

 

[Hyruleslink]

"Mixing up your attacks and strategies" doesn't change the fact that Smash 4's CPUs literally read your inputs (This input done by the player has 4 frames of start up, so I'll just use this move which happens to be 2 frames).

Man, I wish I was a life form with Smash 4's frame data programmed into my head. I might start winning more often!

My name is Neo.

 

[Gilly]

My response to this is to just keep fighting with them to get better, that's how I got better with Ganondorf.

 

[ELITEWarri0r115]

They're good practice to try and learn how to use a character. otherwise, you don't suck, from what I read/heard, Level 9 AI are supposed to read your button reaction 1 fps at a time resulting to punish you 67% of the time if you're good, and 98% of the time if you're bad. keep practicing. Don't say you suck because of an AI

 

[Khao]

Ignore it, it's not an issue.

I can easily defeat a lvl. 9 CPU most of the time, yet I've seen players that are far better than I ever will getting hilariously destroyed by them.

 

[NGUY (guitarstage)]

CPUs are **** for training used to train like that on brawl and won. but was **** when i went to sm4sh i was still ****