Shine

[BrosUnited]

I don't think we should expect old things to return with any character. Fox lost is shine characteristics in brawl, and now he lost his up-air power in Smash 4. It doesn't mean Fox's been nerfed, just remade; kinda like Marth losing double f-air per low hop, but gaining b-air speed. I mean, at least Fox gets his side-b followed by up-b now. :-)

- Ace

 

[Rhus]

I don't think we should expect old things to return with any character. Fox lost is shine characteristics in brawl, and now he lost his up-air power in Smash 4. It doesn't mean Fox's been nerfed, just remade; kinda like Marth losing double f-air per low hop, but gaining b-air speed. I mean, at least Fox gets his side-b followed by up-b now. :-)

- Ace

This is usually how I try to look at things and how most people should look at it as changes rather than direct nerfs/buffs. The mechanics of the different smash games literally change a single move's functionality independently of other changes and thus it's hard to really understand nerfs and buffs when the whole game is completely different.

Although I admittedly expected laser cancelling to be back. I'm still pretty bitter if that nerf gets taken to release.

And who knows? There may be other ways to cancel the shine and/or usability of it. The shine has always been a move of weird "hidden" mechanics that are not noticed immediately like the two frames of invincibility on Fox's shine in Brawl.

 

[Oatmeal.]

It really gets to me when people call it a 'shine'. It's a reflector, dang it.

Just my little pet peeve.

 

[Zekk]

It really gets to me when people call it a 'shine'. It's a reflector, dang it.

Just my little pet peeve.

its a common nickname people use because its easier when typing shine instead of reflector

 

[Bedoop]

I just hope it'll still be able to use above Pikachu when Pikachu's using his Down B so Pikachu hits himself. Love doing that.

 

[Zekk]

I just hope it'll still be able to use above Pikachu when Pikachu's using his Down B so Pikachu hits himself. Love doing that.

Nah take out damaging yourself.

By the way your signature say game and watch is one of the newcomers you want in sm4sh hes in melee, and brawl buddy not a newcomer just letting you know no hate.

 

[Bedoop]

Nah take out damaging yourself.

By the way your signature say game and watch is one of the newcomers you want in sm4sh hes in melee, and brawl buddy not a newcomer just letting you know no hate.

I meant to put him there. Game & Watch has a special place in my heart.

 

[Zekk]

I meant to put him there. Game & Watch has a special place in my heart.

yea but hes not a newcomer lol

 

[Bedoop]

yea but hes not a newcomer lol

He is to me. >:C

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

I feel like Illusion Cancel to aerials might be a thing, especially if the momentum on it works like Brawl.

 

[Rhus]

I feel like Illusion Cancel to aerials might be a thing, especially if the momentum on it works like Brawl.

Man, can you imagine with Fox's increased Fall speed how effective and illusion cancelled Nair with that momentum would be as an edgeguard because he can Foxcopter and Firefox back onto the stage after doing that?

I'm worried about the state of Fox in this game, but he is still Mr. McCloud and thus he will probably be solid. I feel as though they enhanced his movement options (No fast fall on illusion, retaing fast jump speed and increasing fall speed, dash speed adjusted slightly etc.) to exemplify his speed but had to cut down on some of his other attributes because of that. If this is the case, I'm okay with it, as they are accentuating his greatest strength.

 

[Dr. James Rustles]

Honestly I think the one frame activation in Melee was OP. It's meant to be a reflector and a get-off-me attack.

How many frames do you want an attack to have if it's to get another characters off of you? 30?

 

[Guybrush20X6]

How many frames do you want an attack to have if it's to get another characters off of you? 30?

Enough that it's a bad idea to throw it out at any time and you need to look for a small gap in the foe's offensive? It's not rocket science.

 

[Rhus]

Enough that it's a bad idea to throw it out at any time any you need to look for a small gap in the foe's offensive? It's not rocket science.

Brawl's Shine was perfectly balanced for this. It had three frames of activation with two frames of invincibility but enough lag to make it punishable.

 

[NFST4R]

What kind of changes would you like to see made to Fox's shine (assuming wavedashing doesn't return).

It was so trash in Brawl so at this rate I'll take any improvement they give us lol.

That's true I think maybe Sakurai watched his fair share of Chillin videos lol.

 

[RPK]

I wonder if you can illusion cancel to an aerial. That'd be dope. Also Fox's shine was still amazing in brawl. It just had a different use than it's melee counter part. It wasnt there for the spiking but to help with recovery. Its extremely useful and was one of his best moves.

 

[fennel69]

It should be jump cancelable because there is no more wavedash.

 

[OptimistNic]

It would be cool if one of the custom variants of the reflector acted like the Brawl reflector in that it ends immediately and is good for attacking like Melee, but at the cost of not being able to hold it down and reflect projectiles. I think we need to see what custom specials are best for competitive play before we outright ban them (we can make Mario's FLUDD actually viable with Scalding FLUDD).