Shield pressure

DHD

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jun 24, 2015
Messages
44
#2
I'm not a very good player and I play mostly shananaNess, but if you're still interested.

Wave bounce Magnet or Magnet Dash mix-ups to bait grabs.
If they're under the edge of a platform you can sometimes Wave dash and wave bounce (if needed) pk-fire to get behind them and then follow up with whatever suits the situation. If they just shield I'll go for a grab or wave dash away to short dash jump f-air, Magnet dash, standing magnet, short hop up air, djc d-air (or rising if you think you can get a follow up from a hit) to grab

I also like to approach with falling up airs, L-cancel and then follow up with a quick d-air to another L-cancelled falling up air if they miss the tech. And even if they do tech, most people panic and tech to the side, meaning you can get a tech chase.

Generally I try to move around them and approach shields from behind or bait out a grab.

If you're on a flat stage with little movement options, sometimes you can bait an unsafe jump by approaching with a pk fire, b reverse it, then wavebounce it.The bolt might miss, but if you get a punish it'll be worth it. And if they approach you they might get hit with the bolt.
 

Steak1ey

Smash Cadet
Joined
Aug 6, 2014
Messages
49
Location
Boulder, CO
3DS FC
2380-3765-3357
#3
Ness has better shield pressure than most people give him credit for. Grounded Magnet > JC > Aeriel Magnet > JC Fair can rack up huge damage to their shield. For the first Grounded magnet, make sure to tip with the magnet. The mag tip is super important for a lot of Ness' neutral in general, and in this case it keeps you out of grab range. For the JC > Aerial Mag, you can be closer, but be sure to do it just above their grab range, or at the tip of their shield.

At this point, you have a lot of options. The BEST option is dair; dair does the most damage on shield, and has the highest shield stun. No matter what you choose to do, make sure to influence the momentum of the DJC towards the back of their shield, so that you land behind them. Rinse and repeat, and follow their rolls with magnet. Fair is the easiest option, and I actually like it more because it makes it look like you're adding on more pressure than you really are. It's much faster than dair, and puts you in a good spot behind their shield.

In emergency situations when you're not in complete control, just start with tipper magnet above their shield. ALWAYS DJC behind their shield, or you're going to get grabbed. If you're facing them, turn around in magnet to JC Dair, and you'll have a free grab. You can also just pivot after the dair, but they usually escape with a roll at that point.

This all sounds super precise, but it's actually not so bad. The key is SPEED. Work on optimal mag JC to aerials. How fast you execute it is the real pressure, and being comfortable with that speed is everything. You'll force a LOT of rolls, and if you space your pressure around their shield right, you'll avoid being shield grabbed. If they roll, wave dash out of your mag and grab, or just pk fire if it looks free. Use Ness's Aerial mobility to your advantage.
 
Joined
Sep 7, 2014
Messages
57
#4
What strings do you use, what aerials do you lead in with, do you resort to cheesy down tilt spam? Or do you just avoid engaging shields?
What do you have against downtilt spam? It's great, probably the best thing he has to challenge shields.

The point of shield pressure imo is to either get a shield stab or get them stuck in shield long enough to grab them, and downtilt chains can do both of those things very well. Also (and someone please correct me if I'm wrong) the only thing that can beat a downtilt chain is crouch cancel punishing or buffering a roll.

Apart from that, my favorite magnet-on-shield tech is crossup magnet -> DJC backair. It protects you from shieldgrabbing, and you can space the backair low and far enough to safely retreat or defend from an OOS option. If you watch some of Calabrel's videos, he uses it really well.

Any other kind of magnet tech, to my knowledge, is not safe on shield, because none of Ness's aerials are positive on shield and only aerial magnet is postive (+2); grounded magnet is -1. It's not that the other stuff is horrible, but in optimal play you'll risk getting punished by a competent player with good OOS awareness, so it's not truly safe as far as I know.
 

Boiko

:drshrug:
Premium
Joined
Mar 31, 2011
Messages
1,457
Location
New York
#5
Aerial magnet is +4 on shield if you immediately DJC on the first possible frame. It is -1 grounded if you jump out on the first possible frame.

Down tilt on shield is arguably his best pressure.
 
Last edited:

Steak1ey

Smash Cadet
Joined
Aug 6, 2014
Messages
49
Location
Boulder, CO
3DS FC
2380-3765-3357
#6
Aerial magnet is +4 on shield if you immediately DJC on the first possible frame. It is -1 if you jump out on the first possible frame.

Down tilt on shield is arguably his best pressure.
His best pressure on shield, but not nearly as many follow-ups as mag pressure.
 

Steak1ey

Smash Cadet
Joined
Aug 6, 2014
Messages
49
Location
Boulder, CO
3DS FC
2380-3765-3357
#8
Dtilt has a ton of follow ups.
not nearly as many
I'm not debasing Dtilt as shield pressure. It's great for a lot of scenarios, but mag has a lot more variability in terms of how you can approach a shield and how you can follow up on shield escape. It's easy to punish a roll from dtilt pressure buuuut it's easier with mag, because timing is not as much of a factor; you can JC at any time to react from a roll, whereas if they roll and you have a dtilt on buffer, your offensive options are a little limited, and can definitely turn things around on you. It's just never felt right to me compared to Mag.

Mag also LOOKS better, and is much more overwhelming to your enemy. I think it gives plenty more mental pressure on your opponent, whereas dtilt just won't have that effect (most of my opponents laugh lol)

but honestly I want to incorporate more dtilt in my game tho
 

Boiko

:drshrug:
Premium
Joined
Mar 31, 2011
Messages
1,457
Location
New York
#9
Dtilt tech chase options are better than mag tech chase options. It's always better to tech chase on the ground than it is in the air.
 

DHD

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jun 24, 2015
Messages
44
#11
Like previously said, mag provides better approaches. other than that; if you do better with one of them, go for it.
 

Getsafe

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jun 20, 2015
Messages
94
Location
Appleton, Wisconsin
#17
Which aerials are best to lead into a shield pressure string (if any?) I'm assuming DJC Dair/Fair?


Ness shield pressure potentially some of the best in PM right now.
Well he still gets beat out by spacies+Lucas, lucario, probably GnW and snake too, but he's definitely up there. Actually samus has wicked shield pressure now too but I think ness' beats hers
 
Last edited:

Boiko

:drshrug:
Premium
Joined
Mar 31, 2011
Messages
1,457
Location
New York
#18
Samus doesn't have good shield pressure.

Ness has interesting pressure but it's not particularly good. Magnet into djc Bair cross up d tilt spam is pretty good.
 

Boiko

:drshrug:
Premium
Joined
Mar 31, 2011
Messages
1,457
Location
New York
#20
Samus has pseudo shield pressure where it's actually not completely safe. Even jab cancels aren't completely safe. It's interesting, because it's fast, but none of it is actually that safe. What makes her shield pressure respectable is that she has a lot of different options to use on shield. But most good players know how to just circumvent that. I guess "not good" is a bit of strong term, because it's not particularly bad. But it's not amazing.
 
Last edited:

Getsafe

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jun 20, 2015
Messages
94
Location
Appleton, Wisconsin
#21
Samus has pseudo shield pressure where it's actually not completely safe. Even jab cancels aren't completely safe. It's interesting, because it's fast, but none of it is actually that safe. What makes her shield pressure respectable is that she has a lot of different options to use on shield. But most good players know how to just circumvent that. I guess "not good" is a bit of strong term, because it's not particularly bad. But it's not amazing.
Right yeah that's why I just kinda threw her in there at the end. Ness' is better and 1000x easier inputs.

I really dig the magnet buff. I was in the process of learning Ness and was going to switch to Lucas but maybe I'll stick it out now
 
Joined
Sep 7, 2014
Messages
57
#22
Which aerials are best to lead into a shield pressure string (if any?) I'm assuming DJC Dair/Fair?
Fair is terrible on shield, so I'd avoid using it. Like other people have said, Magnet into the other aerials is pretty decent, but after the aerial you probably don't have frame advantage anymore. The strongest pressure honestly might be to wavedash out of the Magnet and start downtilting.
 
Top Bottom