Seriously, when the HELL are we getting another balance patch? (Angry rant, about more than balance)

[Poppy100]

If you don't want to read all this, don't, saying "wall of text" is really just spam. >_>

I'm so SICK of only losing to high tier characters...or rather...Captain Falcon and Fox, (mostly the former though, yeah I said it) what did Sakurai say regarding balance patches? There was an article about it a few months ago, but people were throwing a lot of contradictory information around in that topic, its like seriously everyones flocking to this ONE character (Captain Falcon) and thats NOT a glaring issue!? (though in contrast, I guess you don't see Mac much at all anymore...) How are Captain Falcon (and fox I guess) SERIOUSLY not at the top of that tier list from Japan a while back? Are they easier to play as then the other top tiers, so the general public just flocks to them, (Well I don't think people flock to Fox...) or is everyone else just stupid!? Diddy Kong is undeniably good...but I don't think he seriously beats either of these guys, even with an easy kill combo, what with his slow aerial speed...(I'd be talking about this for several more paragraphs, but I feel like complaining more than debating)

You can tell me to adapt or whatever, but when the characters hit at LEAST with average strength with all their attacks, and are so fast that they can be in many different spots in less than a second, theres not a whole lot you can do about it! Just to be super clear, I only lose to fox if the player is unusually good, (but in the same way as Falcon more or less) I lose to an unsettling number of people with an even decent sense of how to use Captain Falcon, and everyone has him as their secondary, if not primary.

Just to cover all possible bases, Sakurai said theres a character that he considered average, but has the most wins by far online, assuming that hasn't changed, who do you people think it is? (Heres a hint, I said everyone flocks to HIM above) Its not rocket science!

Speaking of Japan, those people are ticking me off to no end, you can say whatever the hell you want about them being xenophobic or whatever, (and I believe its true to an EXTENT) but when they otherwise only leave as soon as they WIN a damn match, thats cowardice! Case and point, I beat one Japanese player recently, he then switched to my character, surprisingly, he was at LEAST as good with him as I was, and I NEVER saw anyone else using Duck Hunt this well, we're both around 140%, he gets the killing blow on me, wins, and leaves IMMEDIATELY, WTF IS THIS?

I mean some American players have done it too, but its not every GOD DAMN ONE OF THEM, (though its still enough to discourage me from experimenting with new characters, if I only get 1 shot...better make it count right?) and it always seems like the players who are absolutely terrible want to stay for more, (everyone in the world appears to do this) WHY? Should it not be the other way around? Wheres the logic in this? The crappy players should realize they need to leave because they're getting tossed around like ragdolls! Theres no chance for them to learn something because its too intense for them to think about the situation! Am I wrong!? I mean it doesn't REALLY matter if a lousy player stays, since I leave from a boring fight very quickly, but why do good players (even some Americans lately) leave after one match when they win?

I can't believe the 1.05 patch did nothing in regards of balance...By the way, I have a 92% win rate, with over 8000 matches played, I'm ONLY mentioning this because it APPARENTLY bugs people for some reason. (Which I will NEVER comprehend) -_-

 

[diclonyuus]

Honestly?

Here's a rough redraft of your core message that I disagree with:

"This game is unbalanced! Fast characters with good approaching options are way too strong.

[...]I play Duck Hunt[...]"

I have never yet had a problem with Falcon and Fox, and I've rarely heard the same in other discussions on this forum. Maybe they're just good against what you play. DHD relies on keeping the opponent at a distance with projectiles - something that Falcon (great speed, great dash options, good priority on Falcon Kick) and Fox (good speed, a MF'ing reflector) just deal with pretty well. If they were really that blatantly strong, don't you think we would have seen more of them at Apex?

On people leaving after one match, I play the game next to my computer. If a friend messages me he wants to play me, I'll leave you after one win or one lose. If I play a round before I have to go to work / before I go out / before the time I've agreed to play a round of Smash or other games with my buddies, I'm also going to leave you after one match. For Glory isn't a competitive tournament environment, and someone leaving after one win isn't always disrespecting you. Sure, you might take FG serious, and hell yeah it's fun and great if you don't have a local scene (which I fully understand since I'm in the same position), but damn, not everyone takes it that seriously. If I wanna get a quick round in before I go to bed or to sleep, then it's not cowardice to leave... Cowardice is SDing when you think you're going to lose instead of putting up a fight.

It's also disadvantageous to bash Sakurai for his poor balancing decisions, then justify your opinion based on his statement of what he considers "average". If you think the man is wrong, you can't call upon his opinion as the correct one later.

As for your 92% Winrate with 8000 games... I believe that you should call upon objective argumentation and making good points. That will justify and solidify your statements a lot better than just flat out saying a winrate and pointing at your games played. That could also be why people might tend to disagree with you (is that what you're trying to say in that last sentence?).

 

[FalKoopa]

Okay, let's see...

First off, your main is Duck Hunt Dog. He's a zoner, who is most effective at mid-range and have trouble keeping off rushdown characters once they get too close. I am a ROB main, I share your pain. Diddy Kong is a counter to those. Banana and Monkey flip are your friends. Just so you know, Not every single character is evenly matched with every other character.. In a game with as many variables as Smash, that is nigh impossible to achieve.

From my experience with Japanese players, I can only assume they seriously dislike lag. Of course, given the geographical distances and internet connection speeds, it's natural that they prefer someone closer than on the other side of the world. Though it only happens half of the time. On ocassion, I've played 10+ with the same Japanese player. It really depends.

As for the last bit about crappy players sticking around even if they lose, not everyone cares about their Win ratio. I believe that a good chunk of For Glory players are just there to have fun without the randomness of For Fun. I'm assuming that if someone gets trounced by you, they see you as a worthy opponent and want to give it a 2nd try, while if they win, then they think you're not on their level.

I don't get why you're saying your Win rate though. Anyway, mine is 48% from 500+ matches.

 

[Ranias]

Speaking of Japan, those people are ticking me off to no end, you can say whatever the hell you want about them being xenophobic or whatever, (and I believe its true to an EXTENT) but when they otherwise only leave as soon as they WIN a damn match, thats cowardice! Case and point, I beat one Japanese player recently, he then switched to my character, surprisingly, he was at LEAST as good with him as I was, and I NEVER saw anyone else using Duck Hunt this well, we're both around 140%, he gets the killing blow on me, wins, and leaves IMMEDIATELY, WTF IS THIS?

I personally just find a new player if my opponent has a Japanese name. There is always too much input lag for me to play effectively (as a Ness player). Projectiles are always really annoying to play against with lag, and seeing as you main Duck Hunt, I don't blame Japanese players for not wanting to fight you.

I can't believe the 1.05 patch did nothing in regards of balance...By the way, I have a 92% win rate, with over 8000 matches played, I'm ONLY mentioning this because it APPARENTLY bugs people for some reason. (Which I will NEVER comprehend) -_-

I agree that some things should be patched, but I wouldn't mind if it doesn't. It's impossible to make a perfectly balanced game with so many characters and variables. I'd be surprised if we don't see a balance patch with Mewtwo. I think instead of worrying about winning in For Glory, you should just try to have fun and improve. For Glory isn't really as much of a test of skill as local play anyway (due to lag, only FD, etc.).

 

[RBreadsticks]

You play DHD you'll always have a problem with rush downs.

There's nothing about falcon or fox you mentioned that needs to be patched. So it doesn't really make sense to call for a patch when you don't even state what they would be patching. And with a 90 percent win rate you really shouldn't be having trouble with falcon...

Japanese players don't leave any more or less than American players. They're each individual's and like American players will leave or stay on a match depending on if they want to or not.

 

[outfoxd]

Also, if you're having trouble as such the DHD subforum's inhabitants are likely happy to help.

 

[stancosmos]

If you don't want to read all this, don't, saying "wall of text" is really just spam. >_>

I'm so SICK of only losing to high tier characters...or rather...Captain Falcon and Fox, (mostly the former though, yeah I said it) what did Sakurai say regarding balance patches? There was an article about it a few months ago, but people were throwing a lot of contradictory information around in that topic, its like seriously everyones flocking to this ONE character (Captain Falcon) and thats NOT a glaring issue!? (though in contrast, I guess you don't see Mac much at all anymore...) How are Captain Falcon (and fox I guess) SERIOUSLY not at the top of that tier list from Japan a while back? Are they easier to play as then the other top tiers, so the general public just flocks to them, (Well I don't think people flock to Fox...) or is everyone else just stupid!? Diddy Kong is undeniably good...but I don't think he seriously beats either of these guys, even with an easy kill combo, what with his slow aerial speed...(I'd be talking about this for several more paragraphs, but I feel like complaining more than debating)

You can tell me to adapt or whatever, but when the characters hit at LEAST with average strength with all their attacks, and are so fast that they can be in many different spots in less than a second, theres not a whole lot you can do about it! Just to be super clear, I only lose to fox if the player is unusually good, (but in the same way as Falcon more or less) I lose to an unsettling number of people with an even decent sense of how to use Captain Falcon, and everyone has him as their secondary, if not primary.

Just to cover all possible bases, Sakurai said theres a character that he considered average, but has the most wins by far online, assuming that hasn't changed, who do you people think it is? (Heres a hint, I said everyone flocks to HIM above) Its not rocket science!

Speaking of Japan, those people are ticking me off to no end, you can say whatever the hell you want about them being xenophobic or whatever, (and I believe its true to an EXTENT) but when they otherwise only leave as soon as they WIN a damn match, thats cowardice! Case and point, I beat one Japanese player recently, he then switched to my character, surprisingly, he was at LEAST as good with him as I was, and I NEVER saw anyone else using Duck Hunt this well, we're both around 140%, he gets the killing blow on me, wins, and leaves IMMEDIATELY, WTF IS THIS?

I mean some American players have done it too, but its not every GOD DAMN ONE OF THEM, (though its still enough to discourage me from experimenting with new characters, if I only get 1 shot...better make it count right?) and it always seems like the players who are absolutely terrible want to stay for more, (everyone in the world appears to do this) WHY? Should it not be the other way around? Wheres the logic in this? The crappy players should realize they need to leave because they're getting tossed around like ragdolls! Theres no chance for them to learn something because its too intense for them to think about the situation! Am I wrong!? I mean it doesn't REALLY matter if a lousy player stays, since I leave from a boring fight very quickly, but why do good players (even some Americans lately) leave after one match when they win?

I can't believe the 1.05 patch did nothing in regards of balance...By the way, I have a 92% win rate, with over 8000 matches played, I'm ONLY mentioning this because it APPARENTLY bugs people for some reason. (Which I will NEVER comprehend) -_-

You're not even losing to top tier characters. You just need to get better at the game, Not have the game conform to your skill level. And who the hell cares if people leave matches? they have lives dude. I've had to leave matches to get things done, this is your problem because you'll never find a game where people are 100% committed and never want to leave you. Some people care about their W/L (like you) and quit if they lose. The reason people stay until they win, those are the players that are actually trying to improve and decided to disregard their W/L to keep playing you until their win after 10 losses. Why do you care at all if your opponents switch out? This isn't in any way an issue that Nintendo needs to solve, this is you being unreasonable, the game isn't going to conform to salty players. Play against some CPUs then, they can play endlessly.
And honestly.. you're complaining about how much you lose with a 92% win rate... You want nintendo to patch the game until you're at 100% and it favors your character entirely? People need to stop making dumb salt-driven posts on this message board.

 

[digiholic]

Dude, Fox is like... 20th place. At best.

 

[Gamr_8]

If there is one thing they can do is shorten the stun on all of ZSS stun moves

 

[GSM_Dren]

"I main Y character and I have a difficult time against X character(s), so they must be broken! There needs to be a balance patch because I shouldn't have to adapt my playstyle against these OP characters, not even diddy is this good. Btw I have a 92% WR so there!" Okay we get that you're frustrated and ranting, but you should really analyze what you're saying.

Capt falcon and fox (sheik and sonic too) are typically played as rushdown characters who thrive to stay in close combat for the majority of the match. DHD on the other hand plays different and will instead zone the character out with his multitude of projectiles and attacks. You should not expect for all matchups to be equal, and you WILL have to ADAPT in order to win. Go to your character boards and ask for matchup advice, because I'm sure there's plenty of healthy discussion about these characters.

You also need to realize that people stay even when they lose because they want to keep trying and they want to LEARN. You putting down players cause they're bad and keep playing, and in the same breath complain that good people leave after a win shoud be an eye opener for you.

 

[Leoinu]

By the way, I have a 92% win rate, with over 8000 matches played, I'm ONLY mentioning this because it APPARENTLY bugs people for some reason. (Which I will NEVER comprehend) -_-

I lol'd

 

[Octagon]

The characters don't have to be patched further. The game is complete, it's not like Sakurai gave Nintendo an unfinished game. If you get beat by another person there are two possible reasons why you lost.
1. Your opponent is better than you at Smash
2. It was a bad matchup and you should switch to your secondary
No amount of patching will make the game 100% balanced, but this is the most balanced smash game ever made, so just pick a character, excel with that character, and beat any Falcon, Diddy, or Fox that gets in your way

 

[Leoinu]

Right, I'll be the one to say it.

You're in serious need of an attitude adjustment. From reading your previous posts its painfully clear you're a salty mediocre player who takes FG way to seriously and thinks that anything he cant get around is broken.

Take this as advice, every time you get KO'd is linked to something you did wrong, everything in this game can be beaten and countered.

Drop that ****ty "FG is life" attitude. If all you play is FG, you're trash, plain and simple. I'm new to smash but I've seen this in tons of other communities. You're the best out of your group of friends, you think you're the best, then you go to some local tournament and just get absolutely bodied. Same happened with me, but I didnt go in thinking I was hot ****. I use FG as a learning and training experience (When players from locals arent in my dorm training with me) and I LOVE when I get bodied by someone, especially with no input lag and match lag, its the best opportunity for you to learn from someone else, and if they leave? Oh well. Hell, FG is meaningless anyway, all it does is track win/loss. Theres no leaderboards, theres no overall rank, you put so much importance on a meaningless e-peen boost that you just set yourself up for massive disappointment.

You cant beat falcon? Fox? Anyone you deem "Unbalanced"? Play them, research them. Dont come onto the Boards and make a stupidly salty post that just paints the image of what you think you arent. A scrub at smash.

 

[Ryuji]

This game doesn't need another balance patch. Moreover, even if there were, no amount of balance patches will make the game balanced for every single character and their matchups. You're asking for the impossible. What I suggest you do other than adapt and improvize, is to learn a secondary. This way you can switch to this character should you have a bad matchup. This might take quite a bit of time depending on how fast you learn, but once you learn that character, it's better than losing tons of times using your main.

 

[visvim]

You're probably not going hard enough, OP. Falcon players go hard.

 

[Darklink401]

I LOVE how you put parentheses that sounded so calm IN BETWEEN the angry rant.

It's so funny to me.


That aside, zoning characters will always have trouble dealing with rushdown characters, like it or not.

Have a secondary. The guy who played DHD at Apex had Mac as a secondary for this reason.

 

[_Iggy_]

Falcon and Fox need to be nerfed...? What?
Falcon and Fox are TOP TIER?

As a Duck Hunt main, of course you're going to struggle with 2 characters that thrive on strong approaches and can close the distance quite quickly.
But that means 1 of 2 things.

1. You play a different character in those match ups. Regardless of whether or not the community believes it's a strong or weak matchup for the character, if you don't like facing Falcon or Fox as Duck Hunt, pick up a character you feel comfortable facing them with.
2. You continue to play Duck Hunt, but you learn how to adjust and beat them when they get close range.

But seriously, asking for a nerf to characters just because you can't beat them is silly. If Sakurai nerfed a character every time someone asked all characters in the game would be roll tier.