returned to sheik

[Jartravious]

so after about 3 months of switching around mains I have settled back where I started with sheik. I really enjoy using platforms for movement but it isn't coming as naturally as I'd like it so any advice on what to practice? Also if anyone has any advice on what to do avoid being edge guarded that would be awesome. I'm confused on if needle canceling actually stores needles and general uses for nair. I apologize a head of time for the sporadic nature of this. I just typed it as it came to mind.

 

[DtJ Jungle]

for things to practice for platform movement, basic wavelands, then doing other things with your wavelands i guess.

You have to be more specific when you say 'avoid being edge guarded' as it depends on the character you are up against

it does store needles, yes.

nair is an amazing edgeguard tool and OoS option. I've seen Plank approach with it vs Falco.

 

[Jartravious]

its mainly when i get hit off stage and I think I can only get the edge but all someone has to do is edge hog

and for nair OoS what characters from your experience does it work well against

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Well if you're too far to get to anything but the edge and they edgehog, you're screwed. Unless you want to try recovering as Zelda.

Nair out of shield can be as fast as a shieldgrab, so, anyone, really, as long as you're in range to hit them.

 

[DtJ Jungle]

If you think you can only grab the ledge you're fairly boned.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

...are you sure you're a girl, Junglefever? It's okay if you are, we won't judge you.

 

[DtJ Jungle]

I is not female

 

[Jartravious]

figured there weren't many options .... what are some general ways you guys mix platforms and needles into your game

also is switching to zelda for the up b even worth it? seems like your just asking for death

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Your avatar's a girl and your text is "Dutchess of Gallia" so...

Needles are awesome as an approach. They're basically short-range shorthop lasers, so use them however you would use those. I'm pretty sure you can get the grab off on them before they can get the grab off on you, if you do it right.

Platforms are nice to mix up approach angles. You can like... platformdash behind someone with a bair or something like that, then grab them from behind. Lots of options.

The thing with switching to Zelda on the recovery is you might not die, but if you do, you lose your beginning invincibility.

 

[rhan]

Nair OoS also works well against Falcon. Both as an edge guard and just to do it.

I never switch to Zelda just for the addition up B boost. Cause it usually fails anyway or gets you killed some other way than edgehogging. Plus when you have to switch back to Sheik after you lose your stock you lose your invincibility. Either by switching or trying to get your opponent off the stage so you can switch safely.

 

[DtJ Jungle]

The only time SH needle is useful is when you are falling and throw them, but at that point it's pretty predictable. It's better as a defensive tactic really.

If you have enough of them, you can keep them in shield stun and grab. The only real use i find for them is jumping onto a platform and saying gtfo. or platform drop needle -> grab.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Aerial needles are good for edgeguards too.

And I dunno, I think they're excellent on the approach, since you can shorthop, needle to reduce your jump height, cancel needle and aerial, or just needle to grab or something. Lots of options.

 

[DtJ Jungle]

They are good for edge guards if you cant grab the ledge quick enough. Ledge drop/hop bair and nair are some o the best options.

I see needles as very situational. SH needle is very punishable. I don't really know anyone that falls for needle cancel aerial, though I do it to turn around and bair sometimes as an approach. Needle grab is good from dropping platforms or if you have alot of them and are falling.

Needles are good for making characters approach.

Dunno though, difference in play style i guess

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Needles are safe. If you needle someone charging Fire Fox/Bird, they're probably not coming back. Also if you hit Marth out of his second jump, he's probably not going to make it back. It's not a cure all, but it's something good.

Punishable how? I mean yeah, if you get predictable with it, you can get punished, but otherwise, it's not much different from a shorthop laser approach.

 

[TemPesT-]

The thing with switching to Zelda on the recovery is you might not die, but if you do, you lose your beginning invincibility.

i've falcon punched a shiek who used his invincibility to switch to zelda at the beginning of the new stock. after he died i knew he'd switch back asap, and i nailed him.

 

[DtJ Jungle]

it is very different from a sh laser because after you fire your needles 1) they are angled down and 2) you have a whole lot of lag after you throw them (unless you are falling, but then their range shortens).

I agree your schpeal on edgeguarding though. It's a good option, though I think most prefer ledgehop nair/bair.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

I dunno, I remember Magus saying that if you hit them at the last instant, they can't avoid a shieldgrab or something. It's pretty safe, anyway. The concept is, though, that they have no lag, so it's like a powered up empty shorthop =P

EDIT: Also there's no reason you have to use just aerial needles to edgeguard. Sheik jumps pretty high, so you can use them to pare down their options, then grab the edge and ledgehop whatever you like from there.

 

[DtJ Jungle]

Yes that's correct you can hit them with needles on the descent and grab them from it. I guess it's true they have no lag, but you're stuck in the air and it's pretty punishable since you cant do anything after you throw them.

I never said you have to just do one or the other, it's just that if you can, grabbing the ledge and drop/hoping and bairng and nairing cover almost every option other than high.

 

[Teczer0]

This quite honestly belongs in the q&a thread.

Please use that thread next time for general questions and tips.

Your friendly sheik moderator?