Remind me, what is wrong with wanting Melee 2.0?

[pika-power]

I have see this phrase bandied around a lot lately.

"You are trying to make the game melee 2.0!"

"This is a new game, not melee 2.0"

"I will be having fun with brawl, not melee 2.0!"

I do not get this.

First off, what is wrong with trying to find a way of making this game like the bestselling game for gamecube?

Second, people say that competitive players should just go back to melee. Well I say why should they? Everyone wants the pretty graphics, the new stages, the characters, etc. So what is wrong with trying to use the game's options to make the game like melee?

Third and finally, if Sakurai puts an option such as heavy brawl, or item switch into brawl, there is nothing wrong with using it. By trying to streamline the game into only normal brawl, you are trying to limit the fun Brawl can produce.


So, the best argument I can see is that Brawl is a new game, and we should play it as one. Well we can do this. We can play on nice, fresh stages. We can use interesting characters. We can play with more balance. We can also try to optimize the fun. If an option is in the game to make the game better, do it.

So, I want melee point two zero. What is wrong with this?

 

[LavisFiend]

Is it SO hard to not use Scar's/Gimpy's/Drag's thread for this?

 

[CraigUK37]

1&2) because thats a cheap sell out, i was looking for something new in brawl, melee with more characters and stages is just a cop-out

3)competative plays can play what ever they like, what they dont need to do is try to change the rules for everyone else, rules are chosen to make the games more competative and require more skill, im sure they took items and heavy brawk into consideration when they decided not to use it, like most people have.
Sakurai also put in clear mode, lets turn that on too.
Just because its there it doesnt have to be used, most of it is useless in competative play

 

[Supax]

Uhmm.. First all, a melee 2.0 would be great.. I would love to see a faster paced game with more ATs and all that jazz...

But the physics engine, and the randomness factor added into Brawl makes it IMPOSSIBLE to recreate Melee with this game, and people are trying too hard. Minor setting changes to alter gravity to test competition is fine, but going out of your way to change around all of the settings is ridiculous.. Changing damage, speed, and gravity is too much for this game, and it will just make it worse competitive wise. You have to realize that there are so many factors being changed when these modifications are being made... It's not just, ok my guy can move fast and put more % on enemies easier this is great... You have to look into changes in recovery, how the settings effect each character, and each of their indivdual moves..

Let's say you turn on high speed... Characters like D3 will now be running at a speed that can keep up with a lot of faster characters, and his attacks will come out much faster too.. This makes him overpowered because it is eliminating his weakness and capitilizing on his strengths... On the other end a character like fox who is already extremely fast, will still be going fast, but because his enemies are faster, they will be able to keep up on a relatively small stage. This makes fox's strength almost worthless... Now let's see you add gravity on top of that.. Characters like Jigglypuff and Kirby, who's strengths include their recovery, will now have a much harder time recovering because of the gravity, and while they are floating, they will be at a huge disadvantage because of the speed boost of the player on the ground. Now the player on the ground can use his speed to keep up with the slow kirby/jigglypuff and use the damage boost to hit them off the stage, and perform aerial combos while the kirby/jigglypuff has limited options...
Sticking with JUST a gravity modification can speed the game up, and I can see this working in Brawl, but there still hasn't been much time to test it and work out it's flaws, so we will just have to wait.

Basically, if you didn't feel like reading my rant. A melee 2.0 would be impossible to create with the physics engine and options possible with Brawl. Too many setting modifications are just killing the game.

 

[PwnyRide]

 

[Rash]

That horse is pure mush at this point.

 

[TheGlitchMaster]

ehhh, melee two point o has come up in my roundtables that me and my friends started having. *thanks youko!* but really, we needed a sequal, and if you don't like it, play the old games then!

 

[JusticeWillPrevail]

To put it simply we needed a new game. One that doesn't look as hard as melee to get into, so hopefully newer players will enter the competitive scene. I really didn't want the same game with just some new characters or stages. I would probably get bored of it, like I did with Guilty Gear series (though I like it how they make the new one with a new AT or 3 and the same engine over and over again bored me.) But yeah I was looking forward to a new game not an expansion pack.

 

[Blackadder]

That horse is pure mush at this point.

He is gorgeous and I think he is beautiful. In a sort of... bloody... beaten... slimey... way.
Kinda cute. ^^

Melee 2.0... I can't say I ever cared to be part of these arguments and threads. I like Brawl, it be fun. And be fun it do. Maybe even fun do be. I can see how some players wish ot to be so, but, in all honesty, I like both it and Melee. I am not posting on topic very well. I am sleep deprived.

... 1:27 AM... and I'm out of food. Someone please make this pain end.
My food was very nice. I miss it so.

My post is over. I will spam post somewhere else now.

 

[User33]

How this thread remains open, but my thread gets closed is beyond me. Just goes to show how biased the mods are.

 

[Dime]

The only problem with wanting melee 2.0 is that there is no release date for it and no confirmation that it is in development. Melee 2.0 is not going to happen. Look at the bright side, you have 2 options: play melee 1.0 or play brawl.

 

[Resident_Smash_Genius]

That's f***ed up.

 

[Jackal478]

This whole Melee > Brawl crap is killing me.

It seems like thats the only thing the boards is going to be used for until the next smash or until this site dies.

 

[InvincibleAgent]

People don't care if you play Brawl like Melee, they only care if you try to determine the way that the competitive scene should be played based on how Melee was played.

 

[Sogeking]

How this thread remains open, but my thread gets closed is beyond me. Just goes to show how biased the mods are.

stop whining

Melee 2.0 would be a bad thing because it would just be an expansion. There would be nothing game changing at all and there would only be mostly aesthetic changes in the form of new stages (pointless really, you would all still play final destination) and the same all characters would still dominate.

 

[tafutureboy]

ok....sigh

I'm tired of seeing people say this. It's not melee 2.0 your right. If it was it wouldn't be as fun in my opinion. I liked playing melee with friends but after I heard about Brawl I was ready for a new game, and i'm sure someones said it by now, if you don't like Brawl then go back to Melee. Not trying to be rude, but it's true.

 

[A2xA]

ok....sigh

I'm tired of seeing people say this. It's not melee 2.0 your right. If it was it wouldn't be as fun in my opinion. I liked playing melee with friends but after I heard about Brawl I was ready for a new game, and i'm sure someones said it by now, if you don't like Brawl then go back to Melee. Not trying to be rude, but it's true.

Sorry for bumping the thread, but that's the exact thing he's talking about. Why should competitive players have to go back to melee when they are the ones loyal to the game and will play it longer anyways. I'm pretty sure 99% of the casual players didn't play melee for all the years, but controllers from theirs breaking, entering tournaments, etc... even though the
competitive players are the minority in standings to the casual player. Does this mean Sakurai is trying to appeal to the larger group?

 

[CraigUK37]

we arent telling them to play melee instead of brawl, we are just saying, if you dont like it too bad there isnt anything you can do about it, you mayswell go play melee. its not our fault they cant play brawl, perhaps they should spend time enjoying it instead of moaning about how different it is

 

[zarkawi]

Melee 2.0 would be a bad thing because it would just be an expansion
thank you sogeking... let me expand a bit on this.
Lets say you loved the original starcraft and you play it a lot. Would you want the expansion pack for it (a couple new units and another campaign) or starcraft 2? Obviously the choice would be starcraft 2 (as it'll be better in every way )

The people who want melee 2.0 just want some minor tweaks but the same buggy, glitchy, and totally imbalanced game. Bottom line, brawl is a new game, play it however you want, but don't make the rest of us do the same.

/end rant
-zarkawi

 

[User33]

Why isn't this closed already?

 

[SmashBro99]

The problem is not that you want Melee 2.0, the problem is everyone is trying to change Brawl into it, and it cannot ever happen, but I guess this concept hasn't been drilled into their skulls enough...

 

[GreenKirby]

OK here's why it's dumb to except Melee 2.0 (Or anything 'insert game title' here 2.0)

It would just be an expansion. That's it. Nothing more. That's a bad thing. And contrary to what you think you WILL NOT be satisfied.

And expecting Melee 2.0 is ******** because you'll just be disappointed. Don't believe me? Look at Yoshi Story and Mario Sunshine. Plenty stooges out there believed them to be Yoshi's Island 2.0 and Mario 64 2.0, respectively. And when they didn't get it, people thought they were bad games because of that. >_>

 

[Super Drybones]

You don't put training wheels on a car just because you don't like how it drives

 

[0RLY]

Play whatever you believe is fun, and we will play whatever we believe is fun. I will be playing both heavy and normal gravity.

Also, if heavy gravity becomes the standard, it won't really affect characters like Jigglypuff and Kirby at all. It will just become the norm to fall faster. Besides, it's giving up recovery for offense. Don't you wish you could utilt to rest again? If you guys like playing 3 stock 6 min matches where you die at 180%, go for it. If you like playing 4 stock, 4 minute matches where you die at 100%, that's fine too.

 

[Pikachu'sBlueWizardHat]

There's nothing "wrong" with wanting Melee 2.0 per se. I just don't like the fact that so many Melee players are so blindly devoted to the game that they can't accept when changes have been made, in most cases for the best.

And like several other people have said already, Melee 2.0 would just be an expansion. Some competitive players would prefer that, but many more players (the casuals, who far outnumber the competitives) would be pissed. So it makes sense that Sakurai wants the game to appeal to a larger fanbase.

Also, see the sig

 

[everlasting yayuhzz]

Please notice how all the people defending Brawl are the people with the 2008 join dates. Scrublets.

 

[Pikachu'sBlueWizardHat]

Please notice how all the people defending Brawl are the people with the 2008 join dates. Scrublets.

gb2/bed/ Dylan

10charizards

 

[JusticeWillPrevail]

Yeah my bad, sorry about that. I forgot I had to prove to you that through my join date I did play before brawl and competitively in melee. Cause you know there is no such thing as browsing the forums without posting.

 

[Heavenly Spoon]

Also, if heavy gravity becomes the standard, it won't really affect characters like Jigglypuff and Kirby at all. It will just become the norm to fall faster. Besides, it's giving up recovery for offense. Don't you wish you could utilt to rest again?

No, I wish I could utilt to rest-kill, not utilt to pathetic little flower-on-the-head.

Pound is still a viable recovery option, though, I've tried both and I really wouldn't mind the change. BTW, Heavy-brawl makes edgeguarding with jiggs so very easy again, like it should have been, and she's still floaty as hell.

 

[User33]

LOL @ everlasting yayuhuzz because he thinks he's so 1337 for joining 4 months before some other people. Really awesome man.

 

[VulgarHandGestures]

hey yayuhzz, when did you first start playing melee competitively? i started about 4 years ago.

 

[JusticeWillPrevail]

He won't believe you. I mean come on man, just look at your join date!

 

[Time2Brawl]

I have see this phrase bandied around a lot lately.

"You are trying to make the game melee 2.0!"

"This is a new game, not melee 2.0"

"I will be having fun with brawl, not melee 2.0!"

I do not get this.

First off, what is wrong with trying to find a way of making this game like the bestselling game for gamecube?

Second, people say that competitive players should just go back to melee. Well I say why should they? Everyone wants the pretty graphics, the new stages, the characters, etc. So what is wrong with trying to use the game's options to make the game like melee?

Third and finally, if Sakurai puts an option such as heavy brawl, or item switch into brawl, there is nothing wrong with using it. By trying to streamline the game into only normal brawl, you are trying to limit the fun Brawl can produce.


So, the best argument I can see is that Brawl is a new game, and we should play it as one. Well we can do this. We can play on nice, fresh stages. We can use interesting characters. We can play with more balance. We can also try to optimize the fun. If an option is in the game to make the game better, do it.

So, I want melee point two zero. What is wrong with this?

First off, it's better than the gamecube version in so many ways. Why would you try to change something that is already good?

Second, yeah, you can do that, and put half the characters at a disadvantage, unable to up+b or kirby/jiggs/dedede. Go back to melee if you wanna play melee.

Third and finally, no, you're limiting brawl with "heavy mode" disabling, as I said before, half the characters.

This isn't melee 2.0, the title is clearly Super Smash Bros. Brawl.

 

[pika-power]

See, but there is a fault.

In melee, no one can play anyone except a select few high tiers. Where is Pichu in melee? Where in Mario? Where is mewtwo? How about kirby? All un-noticed, because of Marth and his pals.

Perhaps I want a game with a bit more balance. Brawl is closer to this, but has been spoiled with camping, and general floatyness.

Better to put half of 35 at a disadvantage, than have only a fifth of 25 being able to preform.

You say it is better than the gamecube in so many ways. Clearly some people think that the punishment system is far too weak. These people may want the nice new graphics, and new characters, with a system that does not rely on camping.

You can use the phrase "It is a new game" and I respect that. But how about we take the good things, like subspace, graphics and characters, and put them with a better physics system? Ever heard the saying if it isn't broken, don't fix it? Seems to be a perfect saying here. Adventure was poor in melee. They fixed it. Events: They made these different. Classic: Sakurai fiddled around with this, and made people dislike it. Notice, the only old thing people do not complain about are trophies, because there was nothing new added except more of them.

The dream of a (slightly) balanced fight, new graphics, characters, and stages mixed with a better punishment system is achievable. Not in melee, the thing I am told to go back to, but Brawl.