Really, how could you switch to brawl now.

[Demon_machinE]

No L cancelling.

I mean there's a LOT wrong with brawl, but L cancelling is pretty much a major step backwards for the super smash brothers series.

Im wondering now, since the general consensus is that melee will die completly (tournament wise) and people will ONLY compete in brawl

how many of you are still going to switch, now that brawl is officially a very much watered down version of melee gameplay wise, with 50 times as much stickers, and flashy kiddy stuff?

Ill play brawl, it looks sooo fun, but heck no I am not going to compete in a smash game with no L cancelling. Ive got a lot of reasons for not playing brawl, but Im going to stick to the L cancel argument here because L cancelling is universally accepted as an extremly well placed technique that divides the good players from the bad.

Also : If L cancelling is automatic (and it is) then how will you miss one? And where does the punishment game go?

Automatic = no miss = less of a game = boring for competitive play.

Do what you will, Im not trying to preach here, I just wanna find out what you guys think now that we know what the damage is.

 

[gnosis]

There's a few arguments people try to use to argue in favor of having difficult execution in games:

1. "It differentiates the good players from the bad players!"

Some people seem incredibly insecure that without their advantage of god-like execution to cling onto, scrubs will be storming the high-level castle in force, turning fighting games into an egalitarian fairyland where everyone is equal. Funnily enough it never seems to be good players saying this, for obvious reasons; there is far, far more that distinguishes good players from bad than who has the better execution. If scrubs could execute everything just as perfectly as master players, they would still lose every game. And if that's not the case, or the dominance factor is decreased? So be it! That dominance was based on bull****, arbitrary, uninteresting tests of manual skill! If you want to see that kind of dominance again, encourage developers to make even deeper strategic games!

That's what I've felt about L-canceling for a while. Although it's possible that this is just a demo and it could be in the final version, I don't really care either way.

The loss of l-canceling, which is just a technical hoop to jump through, is nothing compared to the loss of wavedashing, which is a technique that's real learning curve comes when you try to figure out not how to do it, but how to use it.

That being said, I'm way excited for Brawl and can't wait to be playing it, both casually and competitively. The new things are making up for the loss of some old things, though I still regret that they're gone...

Edit: I'm not quoting that to try and directly counter what you're saying, or trying to imply that you're arguing what's argued against in there. It just sums up my feelings on silly technical barriers like l-canceling.

 

[shadydentist]

I'm going to withhold judgment on brawl until it comes out.

 

[psicicle]

how do you know its not in?

 

[Arcturus]

There's no way I'm going to quite melee when Brawl comes out, even if Brawl turns out to be conducive to competitive play. I agree that it probably won't be though. My feeling is that Brawl is intended to be geared towards a more casual, "party game" audience and the game play is going to reflect that. Serious gamers are in the minority, and Nintendo is appealing to the market where it thinks the most money is.

So in other words,

VIVA LA MELEE!

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

how do you know its not in?

Gimpyfish tested Brawl. And Pro smashers are the only people I trust when it comes to brawl critique, IGN is a bunch of noobs.

To above poster : You own. I agree with you sooo much, everyone who plays melee should.

Brawl no longer potentially sucks. It's just plain suck.

 

[KirbySSB]

I'm going to withhold judgment on brawl until it comes out.

This. Seriously everybody is completely losing their heads

 

[G&Wismyhomeboy]

I'm going to withhold judgment on brawl until it comes out.

How DARE you present such a radical idea. As if we need to wait until a game is out before deciding whether it fails. Sheesh.

Seriously, calm down everyone. There will probably be new techniques to separate the pros from the newbs. Was Melee an instant success because of its potential for wavedashing? Before Melee came out, did anyone even CONCEIVE that air dodging at an angle into the ground was to be an essential technique to high end play?

Maybe this ink drop / dash canceling thing is the next big advanced technique. Or maybe it's footstool jump to dodge to fair to nair to down-b. Maybe playing with a Wii remote and shaking it around makes your character shoot lightning out of its eyes.

PS howcome this is in the melee discussion forum?

 

[gnosis]

PS howcome this is in the melee discussion forum?

Because it's addressed to Melee players.

 

[G&Wismyhomeboy]

Because it's addressed to Melee players.

And threads in Brawl discussion are addressed to Brawl players?

*rushes excitedly to the nearest gamestop*

 

[gnosis]

The Brawl boards suck if you're trying to talk to Melee players. A lot.

 

[G&Wismyhomeboy]

The Brawl boards suck if you're trying to talk to Melee players. A lot.

Haha, I agree.

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

The Brawl boards suck if you're trying to talk to Melee players. A lot.

There are like 12 people max who post regularily in the brawl section that know how to play smashbrothers.

the other 50000000000000000000000000 hate you. They will also point out that you have no life and abuse ''glitches to win'' and patronize you, since they of course have fun when they play, and us tourney goers are SERIOUS and wear business suits.

 

[Eggm]

If its not changed at all from the demo, I"m most likely just going to play it for fun, and play a different game either melee or SC 2 competitively.

 

[BigRick]

The Brawl boards suck if you're trying to talk to Melee players. A lot.

yea I think I made at least 10 spam posts in there saying that I dont like the brawl boards lol

 

[UltiMario]

No Wavedashing = Luigi is Nerfed, bottom tier
No L Cancelling= Bowser get pushed back from his "somewere in High tier from new found Awesomeness" spot
No Competitive = No Brawl Tourneys

Thats my view of Melee To Brawl.... MAN the Demos show that Brawl sucks and is just showing off at this point, BUT a demo has NEVER been the finishing product, NEVER, SO THERE IS STILL HOPE YOU LUIGI PLAYERS (like me)

 

[G&Wismyhomeboy]

No Wavedashing = Luigi is Nerfed, bottom tier

Because Luigi is not being changed one bit from Melee to Brawl.

No L Cancelling= Bowser get pushed back from his "somewere in High tier from new found Awesomeness" spot

No. Most attacks' landing lag has been reduced to what they would be if they had been L-canceled. If anything, this make Bowser much easier for a new player to pick up.

No Competitive = No Brawl Tourneys

No competitive what? No competitive toast? No competitive omelets? No competitive gravel??

 

[Platypus]

The Smash team is definitely going to compensate for the loss. We don't really have all the data. [A third non-inflammatory comment goes here.]

 

[bovineblitzkrieg]

How can they make it SLOWER???

All I've wanted for like 5 yeras is MORE SPEED and MORE OPTIONS... that = more, better, deeper mindgames!!!

I'm afraid.

 

[MattDel]

i dont see how they could take out all the advanced techniques... surely they can still add them in...? if not... i might be sticking to melee for a while...

 

[BigRick]

How can they make it SLOWER???

All I've wanted for like 5 yeras is MORE SPEED and MORE OPTIONS... that = more, better, deeper mindgames!!!

I'm afraid.

A fast game doesn't necessarily mean a good game btw...

 

[Chained Up]

I could easily switch to brawl. Sorry, but the new characters are tempting.

 

[Frozenserpent]

If being able to wavedash and L-cancel is the only thing allowing you to utterly destroy a noob, then I don't know what to say.

 

[Megavitamins]

I'm surpised that l canceling hsa been taken out. I mean it's been in both of the other 2 gmaes,I was almost positive it was in. But then again, it's only a demo and alot of things can change from a demo to the real thing.

 

[.Yoshi]

Brawl isn't Melee 2.....People still can't deal with that little fact.

It's a new game...for Wii...with new characters...new stages...new layout...new DYNAMICS.
Melee will always be there, so don't worry about it.

 

[BentoBox]

Gimpyfish tested Brawl. And Pro smashers are the only people I trust when it comes to brawl critique, IGN is a bunch of noobs.

To above poster : You own. I agree with you sooo much, everyone who plays melee should.

Brawl no longer potentially sucks. It's just plain suck.

And you were quite oblivious to the fact that there were quite a few people from your "camp" who did look forward to playing Brawl. Stop putting everyone in the same basket because of a superiority complex. Not everyone thinks like you. Casuals and pros alike. And have you ever thought of the fact that you acting like a total ******* might be one of the few factors that led people into hating you? Hell, I've heard you've got quite a reputation over the internet now.

http://www.getyourtournament.com/multimedia/podcast1018.wav

How will you guys switch to brawl? Maybe my devoting some time to it as you've done so for Melee? Do I need to state that it'll be a new game for everyone?

 

[Goron red]

I find it pathetic how you guys think brawl will suck because no wd or l-cancel.

O NOES NO WD MY LYFE IS OVA :O

Seriously guys, its not even out yet...

 

[alphameric]

You people are idiots.
It's a new game.

It's not 64.
It's not melee.
It's brawl.

You know, brawl. A new game. Not melee deluxe plus.

I for one am quite pleased with the new take on the game.
I've been waiting for a new game and not a rehash of the same thing that I've been playing for the past six years.

I couldn't give a **** about the *lack* of l-canceling, wavedashing and other techniques.
New techniques will be made.
Feel good about being on the forefront of a new game and the potential of being a person who discovers new metagames and techniques that weren't possible in the past games.

FFS, give over.


**idiots referring to people with the negative/whiney mindset

 

[Luigi Ka-master]

You people are idiots.
It's a new game.

It's not 64.
It's not melee.
It's brawl.

You know, brawl. A new game. Not melee deluxe plus.

I for one am quite pleased with the new take on the game.
I've been waiting for a new game and not a rehash of the same thing that I've been playing for the past six years.

I couldn't give a **** about the *lack* of l-canceling, wavedashing and other techniques.
New techniques will be made.
Feel good about being on the forefront of a new game and the potential of being a person who discovers new metagames and techniques that weren't possible in the past games.

FFS, give over.


**idiots referring to people with the negative/whiney mindset

lol probably because you didn't use them in the 1st place.

The reason why the l-cancel argument is so **** is because it can be argued that l-canceling IS part of Smash. And quite a major part too.

The game isn't Barney's Toyland.

It's not Mario Party

It's Smash as we've known it to be for as long as the series has been out.

 

[choknater]

Brawl is going to be newer and better than Melee.

Why would I want to play an outdated game when I could freaking play BRAWL.

 

[tafutureboy]

yes, we must wait till brawl comes out to judge.............from what i've seen its 64=melee=a bunch of new stuff.....

 

[Firestorm88]

Gimpyfish tested Brawl. And Pro smashers are the only people I trust when it comes to brawl critique, IGN is a bunch of noobs.

To above poster : You own. I agree with you sooo much, everyone who plays melee should.

Brawl no longer potentially sucks. It's just plain suck.

I think that maybe, just maybe you missed the really large red letters that screamed THE GAME IS FREAKING FUN. Maybe you missed the part that said "Most Important Update" before it or just skipped it. I dunno.

Anyway, the point is, you're one of the worst posters on this board and a few forums I go on are quoting you for laughs. Seriously. Shut up. You give this board a bad name and are posing as a tournament player when you're likely just some scrub who learned to wavedash and thinks he's hot ****.

 

[Arcman]

I don't think these differences will be the end of the world for Smash.
It'll take a little time to adapt, but there's no doubt in my mind that it'll be a great game.

Oh, and also...
It's a freaking demo that everyone is despairing over Brawl from.
A DEMO.
It's NOT exactly like what the finished product will be.

 

[Tony_]

Brawl no longer potentially sucks. It's just plain suck.

OMG BRAWL SUCKS BECAUSE IT HAS NO ADVANCED TECHS.

Yeah. Quit acting like your a pro. Your not even close. Brawl will be superior to melee in every way and *gasp* Melee was meant to be a party game too. :O Those who deny this are, in a nutshell, ignorant.

 

[Lesheik]

Brawl is not Melee. Play both.

End of thread.

 

[FalconPunch]

There are like 12 people max who post regularily in the brawl section that know how to play smashbrothers.

the other 50000000000000000000000000 hate you. They will also point out that you have no life and abuse ''glitches to win'' and patronize you, since they of course have fun when they play, and us tourney goers are SERIOUS and wear business suits.

I seriously LOL at this.

 

[GildedPunch]

I will play wherever the competetiveness goes.
If people play melee, i'll play melee,
if people play brawl, i'll play brawl.
COMPETETIVELY!

I'm still gonna play brawl even if it's just casual.

 

[Linkster47]

I hate the Brawl boards. There's always 500 plus people complaining about everything. It's mostly scrubs saying yay, ad techs suck, wee, I will become a pro at Brawl now! You didn't use ad techs in Melee, you won't use them in Brawl = no pro. Ad techs are the first thing people learn when becoming a competitive smasher and there is not one true competitive smasher who can't use at least one advanced tech. Sure they don't ensure your a pro, but they get your technical skill to the max and ensure your not a scrub.

The Brawl boards are just a big arguement about ad techs, it's annoying and stupid. We should start a Brawl conversation in the Melee boards before too many of the "I think I'll be a pro" people come here.

 

[pugfug90]

dum, l-canceling is mindless button clicking, useless creating barriers between elites/nonelites

wavedashing also creates barriers but actually uses skill


So what good is keeping in . lcancelling?

I know that wasn't very coherent. But lcancel sucks. lesslaggy aerials ftw

 

[theONEjanitor]

my favorite thing in the whole world is when people claim to know everything about how good, bad, complete, competitive or "watered down" a game they've never played (and one that non one else has played for more than a few hours total) is.