Question about Ike..

[rtmcs1017]

Okay, so Brawl is finally out here in the states and after playing all the characters a little bit, I've decided that Ike has the best initial appeal to me so far. I picked him up pretty fast and certainly have a long way to go since the game has only been out for a few days here, but he seems to be my character of choice. It does make sense to a small degree, however, since I mained Ganondorf and Captain Falcon in Melee. A lot of people seem to be comparing him to the likeness of Captain Falcon, anyway.

Naturally, I've been playing with a lot of my friends and one in particular is kind of annoying and stubborn about something. He claims that Ike is one of, if not THE best character on the game, and that he is overpowered, mainly because I think I picked up Brawl faster than he. I'm winning many, many matches with Ike because his moveset seems to tailor very well to my play style. I wanted to ask all of you guys if you think the same as him. Is Ike overpowered? I certainly don't think so.. I figured where better to ask than here so please, voice your opinions on this one if you could.

Thanks in advance for your responses.

EDIT: Forgot to add that I was playing both two-player and four-player matches with zero items, but primarily two player.

 

[Timat the Slayer]

Well...Ike is good. Really good IMO. And if someone doesn't know how to FIGHT Ike, then they're going to get ***** by Ike. In time I'm sure he'll learn to watch out for certain things and stand up against Ike better, similar to how everyone was expecting the shine spike from fox in Melee.

Also, what characters was he using? It's also possible that you had a character advantage against him, or that he didn't know how to use an advantage he had against Ike (such as spacing projectiles or some such).

That's my input.

 

[rtmcs1017]

Well...Ike is good. Really good IMO. And if someone doesn't know how to FIGHT Ike, then they're going to get ***** by Ike. In time I'm sure he'll learn to watch out for certain things and stand up against Ike better, similar to how everyone was expecting the shine spike from fox in Melee.

Also, what characters was he using? It's also possible that you had a character advantage against him, or that he didn't know how to use an advantage he had against Ike (such as spacing projectiles or some such).

That's my input.

Thanks for the reply. He uses mainly Pokemon Trainer and sometimes Wolf. I also fought a few Snakes and tooled them all pretty easily.

 

[Timat the Slayer]

Which pokemon did he use mainly? Cause in my opinion, Charizard and Ivysaur don't quite stack up against Ike cause they just fall into all of his attacks. On the other hand, if you land a decent hit on Squirtle, he'll be pretty much out cold no problem.

I personally haven't played a decent wolf yet (hell, now that I think about it I only played a computer wolf twice, once to unlock him, and another time in events, but computers don't count) but from what I've played of him (very little) he might be at least a decent match up if played correctly (smart).


As far as Snake goes, people on here say it's a hard match, but I don't think so personally. My friend played snake and he's a smart player (esp. considering he is a huge RTS gamer) and really as soon as you can close the distance between him and you, it's not much of a fight.

I think you may have had a decent advantage character wise, but it's a little early to tell.

I think he may have just been pissed that you adjusted more quickly than he did.

 

[kin3tic-c4jun-3]

I hate to tell you this but Ike is really noob-freindly. Basically, anyone can pick him up and go from what I've seen. Not to say you're not good, and that there isn't room for improvement, but the fact you have chose Ike is mainly why you've picked up the game pretty quick IMHO.

However, your friend being stubborn and claiming that Ike is the best and overpowered is wrong. So far I've found the game more balanced than Melee. Almost EVERY character seems to have a fair chance.

And the thing with Ike is, once you know how he plays, and you know what strategies to use against an Ike, you can give him a pretty **** good run for his money. A good Snake or even ranged character for that matter will be great VS Ike.

My friend played snake and he's a smart player (esp. considering he is a huge RTS gamer) and really as soon as you can close the distance between him and you, it's not much of a fight.

Don't get me wrong here, I understand how it relates and I don't doubt your friends abilities, but comparing Brawl to an RTS is dangerous lol

I'm not trying to be an *** but I really don't think that if you're good at RTS's you'll be good as a Snake player. While Snake takes strategy, it's a completely different strategy than micro-management and key-board short-cuts.

What Snake IS all about is TIMING IMO. Yes you can say, "Ahh a c4 here and a proxy there will funnel him into this position for a great set-up here using a mortar," but in the end, if you can't time any of that it's going to be useless.

 

[rtmcs1017]

I hate to tell you this but Ike is really noob-freindly. Basically, anyone can pick him up and go from what I've seen. Not to say you're not good, and that there isn't room for improvement, but the fact you have chose Ike is mainly why you've picked up the game pretty quick IMHO.

However, your friend being stubborn and claiming that Ike is the best and overpowered is wrong. So far I've found the game more balanced than Melee. Almost EVERY character seems to have a fair chance.

And the thing with Ike is, once you know how he plays, and you know what strategies to use against an Ike, you can give him a pretty **** good run for his money. A good Snake or even ranged character for that matter will be great VS Ike.

Haha, I don't really take offense to what you said there since I consider myself a Brawl noob. I consider Brawl and Melee two completely different games. It's just that I've seen many new players try to play Ike and fail horribly at it so I wanted to get some other people's input on the character itself. I used to go to a ton of Melee tourneys, some even with the person I mentioned above, and we would usually place very highly, sometimes even win. But none of that is valid, because Brawl is, again, completely different.

I might be good with Ike simply because he's noob-friendly, sure, but I think it has more to do with me maining Ganondorf in the past and utilizing slower and more powerful characters. The difference in my playing that I see most people not using are mainly pertaining to aerials and Super Armor, in addition to air dodging. For some reason, with Ike, I learned how to air-dodge effectively quite quickly and string it into my combos to prevent them from being broken. I also utilize the Super Armor in Eruption quite a bit to get finishers off. I haven't seen many doing that. I found Wolf and Pokemon Trainer both a little easier to pick up than Ike, mainly because missing a hit wouldn't result in a massive retaliation, such is the bane of the slower characters. I've been waiting for a character exactly like Ike since the N64 Smash days so I'm thinking a psychosomatic effect is also taking place here, haha. I'll try to get some of my matches recorded so I can get even more relevant input but thanks already for whats here.

 

[Hellbeing]

Ugh, my friend is a good ivysaur, and it is a bi*** to fight with bullet seed and razor leaf

 

[Timat the Slayer]

Don't get me wrong here, I understand how it relates and I don't doubt your friends abilities, but comparing Brawl to an RTS is dangerous lol

I'm not trying to be an *** but I really don't think that if you're good at RTS's you'll be good as a Snake player. While Snake takes strategy, it's a completely different strategy than micro-management and key-board short-cuts.

What Snake IS all about is TIMING IMO. Yes you can say, "Ahh a c4 here and a proxy there will funnel him into this position for a great set-up here using a mortar," but in the end, if you can't time any of that it's going to be useless.

I pointed out that he played RTS's in the fact that he plays smart and knows how to think ahead. I'm not comparing the two in any way lol. He's actually a rather good smasher, but he doesn't really goto tournies or anything.



And Bullet seed? That never gives me any problems at all, you can smash DI out of that without even taking about 10% most of the time (or at least I can...)

 

[kin3tic-c4jun-3]

I would say maining slower characters in the past would definately make playing Ike feel like putting on a perfect, personally tailored, comfortable glove lol

 

[Hellbeing]

I would say maining slower characters in the past would definately make playing Ike feel like putting on a perfect, personally tailored, comfortable glove lol

I mained roy and i have a PERFECT feel for Ike, actually, Ike is actually the only character i really CAN use lol.

 

[fire_wulf]

And Bullet seed? That never gives me any problems at all, you can smash DI out of that without even taking about 10% most of the time (or at least I can...)

Really... must not be the best PT cuz my Bullet seed can rack up at least 30 damage on my buddy when executed correctly.. and he DIs like it's job. Granted... i have a pretty sick Ivysaur

 

[carpedro]

like with everything ike has its ups and downs. yes ike does have alot of power but to compensate for that he is a bit slow. i would compare him to donkey kong not c. falcon. captain falcon gets his strenth with a combination of speed and power while ike has raw strenth like donkey kong. some of ikes moves are also a bit sluggish and you need to exicute them with anticipation to get the full effect of them.

anyways thats just my 2 cents. hope it helps :-)

 

[carpedro]

like with everything ike has its ups and downs. yes ike does have alot of power but to compensate for that he is a bit slow. i would compare him to donkey kong not c. falcon. captain falcon gets his strenth with a combination of speed and power while ike has raw strenth like donkey kong. some of ikes moves are also a bit sluggish and you need to exicute them with anticipation to get the full effect of them. so i would not say he is overpowered, if you know how to counter his brute force.

anyways thats just my 2 cents. hope it helps :-)

 

[Timat the Slayer]

Really... must not be the best PT cuz my Bullet seed can rack up at least 30 damage on my buddy when executed correctly.. and he DIs like it's job. Granted... i have a pretty sick Ivysaur

What's with all these people out to prove themselves recently. Chill man. I said Smash DI, not DI, there's a big difference. Two smash DIs and your out, period. Unless there is some crazy circumstance in which smash DI does not work with bullet seed, your friend needs to smash DI more, and you'll find it's not as amazing.

And how can you be sick? The game has barely been out. Once again, you don't need to prove yourself, calm down.

 

[fire_wulf]

What's with all these people out to prove themselves recently. Chill man. I said Smash DI, not DI, there's a big difference. Two smash DIs and your out, period. Unless there is some crazy circumstance in which smash DI does not work with bullet seed, your friend needs to smash DI more, and you'll find it's not as amazing.

And how can you be sick? The game has barely been out. Once again, you don't need to prove yourself, calm down.

People are out to prove themselves cuz the game just came out. Its all about bragging rights.. every one will be cocky... don't worry about it...

Once again... if you get caught perfectly into a bullet seed.. you will get at least 25 damage... smash di, tap di, or regular di... you will get damage.

And i just took some valium so i am very calm.... or should i say chilled?

 

[Renth]

People are out to prove themselves cuz the game just came out. Its all about bragging rights.. every one will be cocky... don't worry about it...

Once again... if you get caught perfectly into a bullet seed.. you will get at least 25 damage... smash di, tap di, or regular di... you will get damage.

And i just took some valium so i am very calm.... or should i say chilled?

Your post cannot be more wrong.

People are not out to prove themselves and if they're they are wasting their time. All of the good players who put years into melee and moved into brawl are spending the majority of their time trying to make the game more competitive faster. We're all out to helping the community not trying to prove who has the best Blah blah blah within a week. However, I know there are a lot of people that think the way you do and it's false.

We're trying to help the community and then random scrubs go on saying they have an amazing "insert random crap here". I've been part of the smash community long enough to know not everyone will be cocky and it's not about bragging rights. and yes you can SDI out of bullet seed very easily.

 

[rtmcs1017]

Haha, hopefully we don't get too off topic here but I think I have my answer. I need to tell my friend to quit *****ing and practice because Brawl is different than Melee and though we both spent many years playing Melee competitively, Brawl is the new game, and the new game is entirely different.

And also, it seems like your guys' opinion is that Ike isn't overpowered or cheap in the slightest. In four player I could see him being an easy character to wreak havoc with but one on one he definitely requires someone controlling him who knows what they're doing. Again, thanks for all the replies. I'm gonna go practice my back dash dair spamming. :D

EDIT: Just wanted to say I wholeheartedly agree with Renth in the post above me about the Melee community trying to get Brawl to become competitive faster.. I'm doing the same myself. And please don't let this turn into a "flame the jerks who talk all big" thread.. People are always gonna be childish about competitive gameplay. It's sad, but inevitable and as long as we don't feed the trolls we'll be fine.

 

[Timat the Slayer]

Actually, I think Ike is bad in the multiperson brawls, simply because there is more random crap that can hit him than in a 1v1. At least in 1v1s you can guess what'll come at you at any point and can sort of work around it.

This is just based off my experience in very hard SSE though, where if something has a slight chance of hitting you, it will (and probably kill you) as Ike.

 

[fire_wulf]

I'm Being an A** cuz i have nothing better to do right now... friends that i play with are currently in class.

But we will be posting numerous videos once we think that we are good enough to even watch.. i would prefer to be someone who people enjoy watching due to talent. Me friends and i don't think that we are at that point yet so we are waiting.

It's going to take time to make Brawl competitive.. just like Melee.

I guess some people know more about SDI than i do.. so i will go and do some testing to put false opinions down... even if they are mine.