punishing ledgehops?

[CandyAppleBlueCherry]

Ok, I've only gotten to try this against good players a few times, but basically, if you're edgeguarding and your opponent manages to grab on to the ledge, one of the things they can do is ledgehop an aerial (common with characters like marth or c.falcon).

What i used to do most of the time was wavedash back/dash back and try and run back in for a grab, but this is pretty easy to predict and avoid. So what I've been doing now, is dashing off the edge and jumping back into an aerial. If i time it right, usually they'll miss their attack and I get a free aerial from behind. Depending on %, I've done n-air into combos, u-air to kill, b-air to kill on small stages like yoshi's, or d-air into grab or shine.

My question is, how viable is this as a real edgeguard, i.e., is it good or was I just getting lucky? Obviously I don't use it every time, but I like to do it as a mix up

 

[TheLake]

Your from pittsburgh?! O_o

Have you checked the pittsburgh weeklies thread?

 

[ArcNatural]

Ok, I've only gotten to try this against good players a few times, but basically, if you're edgeguarding and your opponent manages to grab on to the ledge, one of the things they can do is ledgehop an aerial (common with characters like marth or c.falcon).

What i used to do most of the time was wavedash back/dash back and try and run back in for a grab, but this is pretty easy to predict and avoid. So what I've been doing now, is dashing off the edge and jumping back into an aerial. If i time it right, usually they'll miss their attack and I get a free aerial from behind. Depending on %, I've done n-air into combos, u-air to kill, b-air to kill on small stages like yoshi's, or d-air into grab or shine.

My question is, how viable is this as a real edgeguard, i.e., is it good or was I just getting lucky? Obviously I don't use it every time, but I like to do it as a mix up

It works, but it has it's weaknesses. If they happen to expect it and they somehow hit you before you hit them, your basically off the stage without your double jump. So it's all about keeping them guessing so that doesn't happen to you.

 

[CandyAppleBlueCherry]

Your from pittsburgh?! O_o

Have you checked the pittsburgh weeklies thread?

I've been to pittsburgh weeklies a few times, though I can't make it on fridays now |: if you know Taki though, I'm driving him to SPOC as of right now XD and maybe Tim as well.

Do you know if they're playing the day after Thanksgiving? Because I can make it then (*goes to check anyways*)

~~~~~~on topic~~~~~~

Yeah, getting punished for it would suck...but, on the other hand, getting punished from a missed grab sucks too. I agree though, it needs to be used sparingly

 

[RaynEX]

wavedash back and charge forward smash. lol everyone wants to sidestep. Marths roll alot + their range is gay and the sword might hit you anyways.

My strategy is:

Keep my back facing the edge, everytime they ledge-drop and re-grab or stall or any kind of movement, I jump. I keep making my fullhops simultaneous with their jumps. Eventually they try to jump on, then I land with a bair...or sometimes I land, quick DD grab. Jumping keeps you safe and you usually get a free hit or force them back into their shield. Its a good way of keeping them pressured.

Alternatively, you can just block and do things out of shield like shine or usmash.

 

[Velox]

walk right up to the edge and intentionally whif a grab randomly (this is bait)

then immediately shine afterwards (it'll hit them if they ledge hop, trust me), that'll get you thinking in the right direction


but you're thinking in the right direction, running off the stage and jumping back on with an aerial is an excellent thought, keep it up. In particular, with Fox, you could waveland backwards off the stage as if you were going to edge hog, but immediately double jump high and comeback down on the (now during/post ledgehoped opponent) with a b-air, which is sure ****.


The point of all this is they no longer have a double jump cause they used it to attack and haven't yet landed on the stage (hopefully) when you hit them. Ledgehoping is always dangerous at high levels of play.

 

[CandyAppleBlueCherry]

I never tried faking an edgehog o: but it sounds like it'd work as long as it's not spammed. And yeah, ledgehopping is dangerous but it's tough to get around against some character (*cough* marth *cough*)

 

[MikeHaggarTHAKJB]

if they ledgehop and arial with no hitbox above of it (like marth's nair) you could fulljump and fall down with a bair/nair on them

 

[RaynEX]

if they ledgehop and arial with no hitbox above of it (like marth's nair) you could fulljump and fall down with a bair/nair on them

lol if only people read my post.

<3

 

[knightpraetor]

for marth..i run in JC upsmash underneath or grab depending on the spacing..is that bad? i'm trying to think whether the aerial will hit me before the upsmash gets out..or whether it trades..or what...also..i do what rayne said against nonmarth characters

..i don't really charge fsmash against marth..i gues i could see doing it if marth is at a percentage wher he will die if hit..but if you get grabbed..you're probably going to die that close to the edge.

 

[CandyAppleBlueCherry]

Marth is the person i have trouble with the most I usually can't run in charge usmash or stay on the ground at all or they'll hit the aerial, if you go under them they can hit with the first hit of the nair = free grab pretty much haha, at least with good spacing xD

Sometimes against marth i'll just stay back and let him come up then try and hit him afterwards. The problem with that, of course, is that he can just not attack... but if he misses or if he shield afterwards it's pretty easy to get him back off the edge.