Pokemon VGC 2010 Team Discussion

[CT Chia]

With the VGC coming up, I think it's a good idea to have a thread in which we can all discuss strategies for making teams that are allowed under the VGC 2010 rules. If anyone needs to know the rules you can check them out at www.pokemonvgc.com under the rules section.

I'm having a lot more trouble creating a team this year over last because of the new granted ubers allowed. It definitely opens up a lot more possibilities, but it's unfortunately going to make Kyogre extremely over used imo, though this opens up opportunities for other weather users to stop him in it's tracks. One particular combination I can hardly seem to beat is leading with Kyogre/Metagross, or Palkia/Metagross with a Kyogre in reserve. I'm having trouble designing a team that can counter this combination, and still perform well against all types of teams.

What kind of plan will you all take when creating a team for the VGC?

 

[ss118]

I was thinking about an anti-team of sorts. Something like:

Kyogre
Groudon

Have both of them to swap back and forth to combat Rain and Sun teams.

Ludicolo- Has Fake Out, and can hit ubers with Surf/ GK. Resistance to both surf and EQ is very useful. Last move might be the general protect.

Mewtwo- Fairly bulky, speedy Taunt. Can also Self-destruct and run Trick room to counter-act Dialga + Togekiss or w/e the tactic might be.

Giratina O - Levitate + Resistance to both surf and fire moves is useful. Also immune to explosion

Metagross- Explodes, resists stuff: whatever

I have to do an entire team in a very short time though so I may have to cut corners or something.....

 

[CT Chia]

I thought about a kyogre groudon before, but il look into it more. I like ur ideas for ludi, mewtwo, and gira.

Another idea I'm thinking of is a sandstorm team with hippo and tyra cause i can switch between em so if they use a kyo groud to stop my sand, its easy to bring back

 

[Sixonesix]

Coming up with teams is getting pretty annoying. I usually always think along these lines:

"Ok, I want to have a team with Pokemon A. Pokemon A is weak to these threats so I'll partner it with Pokemon B to fend them off. They're both weak to this other threat so I'll add Pokemon C to cover it, and I also need a way to change the weather so I'll add Pokemon D."

Then whatever team I come up with like that is always weak to Groudon or Ho-oh or Garchomp or Life Orb Ludicolo or fighting moves or Blizzard or some other stupid nonsense...

 

[ss118]

That may work for singles: Doubles can be summerized as either trying to execute your own strategy or negating your opponents.

The SS idea is interesting but you run into the fact that even with a SS boost Tyranitar won't be taking enough STAB surf's to be worthwhile. Hippowdon is even worse: both of them are mediocre in doubles, as well. Other than the SS they bring, they don't add anything terribly worthwhile to the table. Abomasnow + Snow Cloak abuser would probably be a more worthwhile strategy.

Edit: If you really want to continue with that strategy, start with Hippowdon and something that can take a good bit of water abuse. Give it the smallest amount of speed to go last(even give it an item[like Iron Ball] if necessary), and if you go against a bunch of water abusers protect and hopefully your partner pokemon can do something to help. I dunno what, something with a water resist and potentially explosion.

 

[DA_RAIN]

i thikn very clearly that kyogre mewtwo metagross rayquaza gengar palkia are some of the best available pokemon in tha format

 

[Sixonesix]

I'm having trouble finding a useful Rayquaza set that isn't outclassed by some other dragon in doubles.

 

[RoxburyGuy58]

^^ The tough part about dragons is that who wins is based on speed. There are so many fast and powerful dragons that are going to be all over the place, and what you want to do is make the first move. Much easier said than done. I wouldn't worry about Scarfed Garchomp (fastest thing in Ubers I think, may need to check that), because of the limitations of choice items, they're probably not common in doubles.
However, if you want another good dragon instead of another good set, Kingdra is something to consider. Swift Swim+Adamant nature+full EVs in Atk+Waterfall+Life Orb+Dragon Dance=DEATH :D I think Swift Swim makes him the absolute fastest legal dragon allowed in the VGC, barring scarf users.

Now, I need some help from someone. I gots a Mew2 on a rain team, it's like this:

Jolly nature @ Expert Belt
EVs: 36 HP/252 Atk/220 Spe
- Rain Dance
- Recover/Bulk Up/Taunt
- Brick Break
- Ice Punch

He moves first with a base 130 Spe to put the rain back and put the hurt on Ttar, Groudon, and Blissey. Smogon says physical Mew2 is not terribly effective without Bulk Up, but he may not get a chance to use it because of his 90/90 defenses. What would be a wise choice for the 2nd slot? If it helps, his partners are Swift Swin physical Kingdra, a generic Kyogre special sweeper, and Rain Dish Ludicolo for support with Grass Knot, Protect, Rain Dance, and Leech Seed.

 

[ss118]

ugh I'm having a much harder time knowing that we can't see the opponent's team beforehand and decide on our six members afterwards. >_>

 

[kirbyraeg]

The following Pokémon NOT eligible for use in the tournament:
489 - Phione???

I am very, very new to the doubles metagame, especially with this limited ubers usage, but what's stopping somebody from just running through with a choice scarfed kyogre and rain sweepers/supporters?

Also...This might be a fun gimmick for you guys to try: Feint Skarmory. This only has one real purpose...letting you fully abuse a powerful explosion from one of your other pokemon. skarm's typing and nice defense lets it take the hit and still have plenty of health left while you assuredly take down the other (two possibly, one for sure) pokemon with explosion. This could be a late-game pair after eliminating ghosts with something like scarfed tyranitar?? I can imagine something like this working with metagross or even something like lickilicky for comedy value.

 

[Sixonesix]

The following Pokémon NOT eligible for use in the tournament:
489 - Phione???

I am very, very new to the doubles metagame, especially with this limited ubers usage, but what's stopping somebody from just running through with a choice scarfed kyogre and rain sweepers/supporters?

Also...This might be a fun gimmick for you guys to try: Feint Skarmory. This only has one real purpose...letting you fully abuse a powerful explosion from one of your other pokemon. skarm's typing and nice defense lets it take the hit and still have plenty of health left while you assuredly take down the other (two possibly, one for sure) pokemon with explosion. This could be a late-game pair after eliminating ghosts with something like scarfed tyranitar?? I can imagine something like this working with metagross or even something like lickilicky for comedy value.

There's several reasons:
- People build their teams with Kyogre in mind, like by having mostly pokemon that resist water, and EVing the pokemon that don't resist it to be able to survive Water Spout.
- Weather changes a lot. It's not uncommon to see teams using both Kyogre and Abomasnow, or even Groudon and Tyranitar, just to maintain control of the weather.
- Trick Room is harsh for scarfed anything, and it's pretty common in VGC.

I personally don't even like using Kyogre because it's so predictable (and because I hate getting paralyzed by Thunder every match).

 

[Wave⁂]

Rayquaza stops all weather, and with a Yache Berry can survive some Blizzards and Ice Beams.

 

[Sixonesix]

Not Dialga's Dragon Pulse or Palkia's Spacial Rend though. Frankly I'd be more worried about those two than Blizzard, especially because Rayquaza can't do a whole lot back to them.

 

[DA_RAIN]

Metagross @ Shuca Berry
Clear Body, Jolly
4 HP / 252 Att / 252 Spe
Bullet Punch
Earthquake
Explosion
Protect

Kyogre @ Choice Scarf
Drizzle, Timid
4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Water Spout
Hydro Pump
Ice Beam
Thunder

Gengar @ Focus Sash
Levitate, Naive
4 Att / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Shadow Ball
Thunderbolt
Explosion
Protect

Mewtwo @ Life Orb
Pressure, Hasty
4 Att / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Self-Destruct
Thunderbolt
Ice Beam
Protect

 

[Terywj [태리]]

Metagross @ Shuca Berry
Clear Body, Jolly
4 HP / 252 Att / 252 Spe
Bullet Punch
Earthquake
Explosion
Protect

Kyogre @ Choice Scarf
Drizzle, Timid
4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Water Spout
Hydro Pump
Ice Beam
Thunder

Gengar @ Focus Sash
Levitate, Naive
4 Att / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Shadow Ball
Thunderbolt
Explosion
Protect

Mewtwo @ Life Orb
Pressure, Hasty
4 Att / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Self-Destruct
Thunderbolt
Ice Beam
Protect

If you're using Kyogre wouldn't you want to use Thunder on Mewtwo instead of Thunderbolt? Or Groudon too prevalent?

-Terywj

 

[ss118]

Consider Substitute on Gengar: I've found Ghost using SUbstitute + Explosion/ Self-Destruct to be extremely devestating.

 

[Sixonesix]

Metagross @ Shuca Berry
Clear Body, Jolly
4 HP / 252 Att / 252 Spe
Bullet Punch
Earthquake
Explosion
Protect

Kyogre @ Choice Scarf
Drizzle, Timid
4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Water Spout
Hydro Pump
Ice Beam
Thunder

Gengar @ Focus Sash
Levitate, Naive
4 Att / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Shadow Ball
Thunderbolt
Explosion
Protect

Mewtwo @ Life Orb
Pressure, Hasty
4 Att / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Self-Destruct
Thunderbolt
Ice Beam
Protect

I suggest putting Hammer Arm on Metagross instead of Earthquake to hit Trick Room Dialga leads harder without forcing you to switch to Gengar.
Sludge Bomb might be better on Gengar to hit Ludicolo and Abomasnow super effective and neutral targets like Palkia for more damage than Shadow Ball. You could put it over Explosion since it won't really KO anything (Thunderbolt does almost as much damage to Kyogre as Explosion would).