Pokemon Game Overhaul

[Hairbrother]

I've had my own ideas for a new pokemon game It pretty much goes like this. Feedback please. Be as harsh as you can as I want your opinion. Now before I start I want to say that I suggest that the current turn based system continue, and this new system I have thought up be used in another series to be released along side the current games.

Battling
The controls would be:

D-Pad - Movement
ABXY - 4 Attacks
L - Jump
R - Dodge (they always dodge in the show)

Special Attacks can be used from anywhere, and are automatically directed towards the foe and hit based on the attack accuracy, Physical Attacks must be used close to the foe, and if you aren't close enough, the attack fails (like slashing the energy sword from too far away in Halo).

Levels
Here I say that there should be a removal of the 100 lvl limit. Max lvl is now infinity. I also propose EVs be infinite, and that IVs be removed, so that all pokemon are more equal, as the ideals of the show clearly say it should be. This would lead to the ability to overly outlevel everything in the game, so wild pokemon, and other trainers lvls are determined based on your highest pokemons lvl at the time you last beat a gym. The elite 4s lvls would be based on your lvl at the time you beat the 8th gym. After beating the elite 4 trainers stop leveling up unless you battle them.

PVP
In player vs player battles the pokemon would get 1000 stat points. Percentage of total stats would be calculated and then percentage of 1000 would be given to that stat. All stats that are below 10 percent would automatically be 100 though, and so the max for a stat would be 500, with all other stats being 100.

Updates based on what you guys think, and any new ideas I come up with in the future.

 

[Bowser King]

I've had my own ideas for a new pokemon game It pretty much goes like this. Feedback please. Be as harsh as you can as I want your opinion. Now before I start I want to say that I suggest that the current turn based system continue, and this new system I have thought up be used in another series to be released along side the current games.

Battling
The controls would be:

D-Pad - Movement
ABXY - 4 Attacks
L - Jump
R - Dodge (they always dodge in the show)

Special Attacks can be used from anywhere, and are automatically directed towards the foe and hit based on the attack accuracy, Physical Attacks must be used close to the foe, and if you aren't close enough, the attack fails (like slashing the energy sword from too far away in Halo).

Levels
Here I say that there should be a removal of the 100 lvl limit. Max lvl is now infinity. I also propose EVs be infinite, and that IVs be removed, so that all pokemon are more equal, as the ideals of the show clearly say it should be. This would lead to the ability to overly outlevel everything in the game, so wild pokemon, and other trainers lvls are determined based on your highest pokemons lvl at the time you last beat a gym. The elite 4s lvls would be based on your lvl at the time you beat the 8th gym. After beating the elite 4 trainers stop leveling up unless you battle them.

PVP
In player vs player battles the pokemon would get 1000 stat points. Percentage of total stats would be calculated and then percentage of 1000 would be given to that stat. All stats that are below 10 percent would automatically be 100 though, and so the max for a stat would be 500, with all other stats being 100.

Updates based on what you guys think, and any new ideas I come up with in the future.

Only if its a spin off...

infinite lvl would be hacked for like lvl 100000000 making them invincible. Plus if your not a hacker the infinite evs would be enough to make your pokemon beyond others. Dodging would be over used , there should be a limit. But that still makes moves like blast burn useless (dodge then attack while there stunned).

 

[0RLY]

Infinite levels & EVs = Fail. If such battling mechanics were introduced, there would be a lack of strategy. Swift, dodge, swift, run away, swift, dodge, swift, gg. Explain how accuracy would work. Are we going to aim flamethrower and ice beam, now? Are we going to jump over hypnosis? Will Goldeen drown on land? etc. etc.

 

[Spire]

A really quick, small Pokemon could dodge every attack of a large, slow one. Golem would never win...

... Although, the system is interesting. The only thing that I do not see room for is the use of items -- unless this is a game where there is no Pokemon trainer and you just play as a Pokemon. Strange, but maybe with a more structured system it could work. Cut what the last two posts said to do and start refining what you have at that point. Maybe then you could present the idea again and some deeper discussion could ensue.

 

[DarkJynch]

Maybe instead of the infinite level and EVs, the Pokemon can level up more and get more EVs when they're more advanced. For example: Pichu can get to the maximum level of 70 and EVs up to 300. When it evolves to Pikachu, the max level is 100 and EVs are 510. Raichu gets up to 130 and up to 620 EVs. That way you can't have a Pichu killing Raichus like they're nothing; there are explicit differences between them and their powers and abilities. Each Pokemon has to balance out dodging and power, you cannot have one that can evade your attack like nothing then kill you with a tackle. Put more emphasis on power, you do more damage but cannot dodge very well, more into dodge its harder to hit you but you do less damage. Of course, the more powerful Pokemon like legendaries will naturally have higher level and EVs, and there will be new Pokemon abilities which can augment the Pokemon's chosen path or temporarily elevate it levels when used in battle. Good idea in concept, though.

 

[TombStone]

I've had my own ideas for a new pokemon game It pretty much goes like this. Feedback please. Be as harsh as you can as I want your opinion. Now before I start I want to say that I suggest that the current turn based system continue, and this new system I have thought up be used in another series to be released along side the current games.

Battling
The controls would be:

D-Pad - Movement
ABXY - 4 Attacks
L - Jump
R - Dodge (they always dodge in the show)

Special Attacks can be used from anywhere, and are automatically directed towards the foe and hit based on the attack accuracy, Physical Attacks must be used close to the foe, and if you aren't close enough, the attack fails (like slashing the energy sword from too far away in Halo).

Levels
Here I say that there should be a removal of the 100 lvl limit. Max lvl is now infinity. I also propose EVs be infinite, and that IVs be removed, so that all pokemon are more equal, as the ideals of the show clearly say it should be. This would lead to the ability to overly outlevel everything in the game, so wild pokemon, and other trainers lvls are determined based on your highest pokemons lvl at the time you last beat a gym. The elite 4s lvls would be based on your lvl at the time you beat the 8th gym. After beating the elite 4 trainers stop leveling up unless you battle them.

PVP
In player vs player battles the pokemon would get 1000 stat points. Percentage of total stats would be calculated and then percentage of 1000 would be given to that stat. All stats that are below 10 percent would automatically be 100 though, and so the max for a stat would be 500, with all other stats being 100.

Updates based on what you guys think, and any new ideas I come up with in the future.

@Spire: Yeah, I was thinking this kind of system would make Ninjask invincible. Just zip around and Fury Cutter or something. Speed and Evasion seem like they would directly correlate in this game.

I don't see how you can keep a turn based system in effect with free movement. Speaking of free movement, what about the effects of terrain? What if the battle is between a water-only pokemon and a land-only pokemon?

How would a Flying type's movement work? Would you need to add the extra dimension of height to incorporate flight? If so, how would you direct attacks at a flying pokemon?

What about accuracy? How would you make Thunder 30% less accurate than Thundershock? And how would you make a difference between Thundershock (which technically has 100% accuracy) and ShockWave (which cannot miss at all)? What kind of targeting system do you need to implement in a game like this, anyway?

Oh, and how would stuff like paralysis work? Or Sleep, Confusion, Ingrain, Spikes, etc.? And Quick Attack, Mach Punch, Ice Shard, etc... Would there be stun from getting hit by an attack like Close Combat? And if there is, how would it be different from the Flinch condition?

The dodge feature will completely nullify Protect and Detect. There needs to be a limit and/or some kind of recoil from dodging.

What would jump be for? Are you suggesting complex, multi-leveled terrain? That would take the system mechanics to a new level of difficulty.

What you proposed gives Special Attacks a broken advantage over Physical Attacks. Equal power with an indefinite difference in range is unfair.

What if, for example, you had a Wailord against Pikachu. How would you manage to incorporate the massive size differences?



I like this new battle system idea (for a spin-off title only though). There are just a LOT of details that need to be ironed out. Have fun.

 

[H@wK]

It would be awesome if they make a fighting game like Smash Bros, but for Pokemon. A game where you dodge, attack, run, grab, etcetera, but instead of percentages (%) HP (Life Bars), applying the level and stats of each Poke, Defense, Speed, Attack etc. Each attack having the same power like in the games, Flamethrower having 95, Fire Blast 120, Overheat 140 and so on.

 

[shadydentist]

But that still makes moves like blast burn useless (dodge then attack while there stunned).

Blast burn is already useless.
I agree with you though. Maybe for a spin off, but the core rpg mechanics can't be messed with.

 

[Bowser King]

Maybe instead of the infinite level and EVs, the Pokemon can level up more and get more EVs when they're more advanced. For example: Pichu can get to the maximum level of 70 and EVs up to 300. When it evolves to Pikachu, the max level is 100 and EVs are 510. Raichu gets up to 130 and up to 620 EVs. That way you can't have a Pichu killing Raichus like they're nothing; there are explicit differences between them and their powers and abilities. Each Pokemon has to balance out dodging and power, you cannot have one that can evade your attack like nothing then kill you with a tackle. Put more emphasis on power, you do more damage but cannot dodge very well, more into dodge its harder to hit you but you do less damage. Of course, the more powerful Pokemon like legendaries will naturally have higher level and EVs, and there will be new Pokemon abilities which can augment the Pokemon's chosen path or temporarily elevate it levels when used in battle. Good idea in concept, though.

That makes pokemon like tyranitar and all other pesudo-legendaries stronger then they all ready are. As well as all other pokemon with only a second evolution, they would have to stick with 510 evs. Unless your saying the last pokemon would automatically get an amout of 620 evs. Though that still makes single evolutions usless.

Blast burn is already useless.
I agree with you though. Maybe for a spin off, but the core rpg mechanics can't be messed with.

Ya I know it useless but think about like likiliky with its STABed selfdestruct, all of a suden it's useless as well as other pokemon that use or need selfdestruct. Anyway, I know you get the main idea but just wanted to bring that up.

 

[ss118]

Take Pokemon and make it with melee controls

BAM: better'n brawl!

 

[Sariku]

Ugh. I would hate it, to be honest. Not even a spin off, as it would just degrade the Pokemon name even more. i won't say much, as I am trying to read my Bleach manga, but infinite levels would just equal something like www.TheNinja-RPG.com . It's great fun, but when you start playing, there is no way you will be able to beat a player who started playing 4 years ago. A competitive game could give everyone a fair chance at being good, and his just wouldn't do it.

 

[plasmid]

I don't think a lot of you get this. In battles between 2 players, no matter what the lvl of the pokemon is thier stats get balanced. Check the PvP section. Basically what I'm trying to say is that infinite lvl wouldn't effect player matches at all. A lvl 1000000 Tyranitar could go up against a lvl 2 Cleffa in PvP and the cleffa could still win. Basically I just really don't like the way the game is so different from the show, the way in the show the whole message is that any pokemon can win any battle, and in the game some pokemon are just worthless.

Also I'm not saying that all the attacks from the turn based games would work here, and so not all of them would translate over. For others, mechanics would need to be reworked. Like with protect, or detect, maybe you auto dodge the next attack if it is within 10 seconds of when you used protect, then the lag for getting out of a dodge is shorter, and you can attack more easily.

Since many of you bring up a valid point that dodging would make the game easy for light fast characters, comsider that dodging is based on your personal timing, your speed stat, and the accuracy of the attack you are trying to dodge. This still sounds like it would make it easier for light fast characters, but then consider that with the PvP system, they would lose attack and defense if they had good speed, so it would balance out. In short dodging wouldn't be easy to do, and would obviously be balanced to make the game equal for fast vs slow characters.

Now to answer some of TombStone's questions.

Flying pokemon would have the appearance of being off the ground, but the game would still be 2d. You would have to jump to hit them with physical attacks. They would be immune to ground attacks and thats it, just like in the game now.

Now this is a good question. There wouldn't really be any targeting. The accuracy of the attack affects random variables that determine whether or not you miss. Basically accuracy would be the same as it is in the games now. No targeting whatsoever, remember, you're the trainer, you tell the pokemon where to be and what move to use, but you don't aim for it.

This is hard to explain, and I will do more when I have had more time to think about it. Basically Paralysis makes you slow, and sometimes attacks fail. Sleep makes the pokemon sleep, but they wake up after being hit once, and their life goes up bit by bit while sleeping. Ingrain would limit mobility but enhance attacks. Basically every attack would have to be thought over to work with this system, so I won't go over them all right now (and I doubt ever, unless nintendo sees this and is interested and I seriously doubt that).

I already went over protect, and jumping. So I'll skip to the next question. Now this is a problem I didn't think about. Physical attacks would have to get some kind of advantage to make them more balanced. Hmmm. I don't really know, maybe hit stun or the ability to hit through special attacks. I'm sure there's something that could make them even, anyone have ideas?

Now this is also a problem. Wailord is simply so huge that I think it wouldn't fit on the screen. So basically this is a disadvantage for it. The screen wouldn't rescale enough to fit a Wailord, and it wouldn't be able to move as freely as the Pikachu. But it would have an advantage, in that it is so huge, physical attacks would always be in range. This probably also needs some reworking, and I am also open to some suggestions here.

Basically everything would have to be reworked to be balanced.

Oh yeah, I totally forgot. I posted this back before I had an account on my friend's (hairbrother) account. It's my idea, and I'll try to go on hairbrother's account to update the first post every now and then.

 

[TombStone]

I don't think a lot of you get this. In battles between 2 players, no matter what the lvl of the pokemon is thier stats get balanced. Check the PvP section. Basically what I'm trying to say is that infinite lvl wouldn't effect player matches at all. A lvl 1000000 Tyranitar could go up against a lvl 2 Cleffa in PvP and the cleffa could still win.

To be honest, I seriously doubt that any Cleffa could beat a Tyranitar. The only reason it "doesn't matter" is because WiFi has an auto-leveling feature. And it doesn't balance the stats out, just the levels. A Tyranitar would still have a monstrous advantage at equal levels.

For others, mechanics would need to be reworked. Like with protect, or detect, maybe you auto dodge the next attack if it is within 10 seconds of when you used protect, then the lag for getting out of a dodge is shorter, and you can attack more easily.

That's an interesting idea, but in the end, Protect and Detect are still useless. Or broken.
Useless: Using Protect/Detect would basically lock you down in a defensive state until you're opponent attacks. So you can't do anything but wait. Why do that when you can simply time a dodge?
Broken: If you're not locked into a defensive stance, then you basically have an auto-Protect feature while you move in to attack. Translation--I can attack ruthlessly, and any possible counter will be negated by the auto-Protect feature. Rinse and Repeat for a spam sandwich victory.

When I think of this "dodging," I imagine something equivalent to SSBM's Sidestep Dodge. If you're thinking of something else, it might be good for you to clarify.

Flying pokemon would have the appearance of being off the ground, but the game would still be 2d. You would have to jump to hit them with physical attacks. They would be immune to ground attacks and thats it, just like in the game now.

That only furthers the gap between Physical and Special.

Now this is a good question. There wouldn't really be any targeting. The accuracy of the attack affects random variables that determine whether or not you miss. Basically accuracy would be the same as it is in the games now. No targeting whatsoever, remember, you're the trainer, you tell the pokemon where to be and what move to use, but you don't aim for it.

I'm sorry, but I have a real issue with this proposition. This game is supposed to be a free-movement stylized battle. Why do we want free movement? Because spacing affects accuracy and evasion. What is the point of being able to move around if position doesn't affect the accuracy of moves? If positioning doesn't grant you any advantage/disadvantage, what's the point?

I think you need to reconsider the targeting system. I'm guessing this is a theoretical DS game, so why not have some touch-screen controls for accuracy. Lower percentages just make aiming harder somehow.

Physical attacks would have to get some kind of advantage to make them more balanced. Hmmm. I don't really know, maybe hit stun or the ability to hit through special attacks. I'm sure there's something that could make them even, anyone have ideas?

I don't have any real idea, but I don't like the idea of priority or abusable hit lag. Both are extremely abusable by fast pokemon.

Now this is also a problem. Wailord is simply so huge that I think it wouldn't fit on the screen. So basically this is a disadvantage for it. The screen wouldn't rescale enough to fit a Wailord, and it wouldn't be able to move as freely as the Pikachu. But it would have an advantage, in that it is so huge, physical attacks would always be in range. This probably also needs some reworking, and I am also open to some suggestions here.

This is, of course, assuming scaled sizes. Then again, even if there is huge scaling distortion, you'll never see a Diglett and a Wailord on the same screen.

 

[plasmid]

Wow, you found about every problem that I didn't think of. Nice work. Well... I guess I'll just start.

The leveling system I guess has it's problems. I don't know I'm just really trying to think of a way that instead of pokemon being crippled by what pokemon species they are, they are all equal. Basically I wan't to balance all the pokemon. I guess I think that it would just be better to have pokemon EV's based upon what moves they use, and how they battle (defensively vs offensively). I suppose that there could be a max lvl, although I am opposed to it, and would rather prefer some kind of level equaling system for PvP. Whatever, I give up on this front, just give all the pokemans equal stats, and make it easier to lvl thier good stats (i.e. a shuckle's defense).

I guess I should point out that by dodge I just mean move out of the way, not be invincible. Protect/Detect would make you invisible, but for one attack, yours or thiers. Basically just a good approach. Also there would be start up lag that you could be canceled out of.

You're right. It does. But then again, I can't honestly see why it shouldn't be a gap, considering range usually is better than close combat (i.e. guns). But just so that no-one is pissed off by this, I guess I have to come up with some way to balance them. How about instead of approaching this by means of strengthening physical, special gets nerfed. Like special attacks are easier to dodge , or have some kind of usage bar that needs to recharge(makes sense right). For the air problem, yeah. No having to jump, simple fix.

Well if you can figure out how to hold down a d-pad, 4 buttons, and a stylus at the same time be my guest to figure out. Maybe an exclusive version for 3 handed people. Otherwise, I think accuracy should just be affected by range as well (as it usually is). Keep in mind that I'm trying to make the game like you're commanding the pokemon, not being it. I honestly thought about stylus controlling movement and targeting, but decided that you wouldn't always want to run towards your opponent while attacking. This would kind of leave a gap for the jump control though. L to dodge, tap to jump, d-pad for attacks, just wouldn't really work. The only real fix for that would be my system. So I guess you'll have to come up with something. You've been incredibly good at finding problems I'm sure you should have no problem seeing an answer.

I believe I already attempted to cover this. Although you'll probably find a problem...

Yeah. Well ****ing wailord. I don't know. I guess the only solution would be to have Wailord be partially off screen. It's the only pokemon that would really have that problem. So I'm not really that worried about it. I'm more focused on fixing the actual fighting mechanics than Wailord. Sorry Wailord fans, if you even exist...