PM Underground and Reslived Present: Project M v3.6 Tier List

With the PMDT disbanded and Project M v3.6 as its final release, many players have been wondering where the characters will end up falling on a tier list now that the game will have time to settle. The folks at PM Underground have worked with Reslived to publish a tier list voted on by 50 Project players across various countries and show the findings from this poll. Ready to see the tier list? Give it a look!

Note: Tiers Are In Order​

Many things were factored into the tier list such as the results spread, specific character placements, and more. The full data on the entire list and its forming is available on PM Underground in its official release article. Agree or disagree with the list? Do some characters need shuffling? Tell us in the comments below and be sure to check out the official release article on PM Underground for more information!

 

Also, ew at 3.6. Bring us 3.61 instead with all of the bug fixes and new alts!

3.6 is the version that the vast majority of streamers and tournaments are using right now. It's been said a few times on /r/SSBPM that moving to 3.61 would require a big impetus to change, like a major PM tournament declaring they'll be running that version; I doubt it's going to happen for a while, if it ever does.

 

Sorry for the stupid question, but, what's the difference between Competitive and Viable? I always thought viable mean't they could be used competitively but isn't that what the competitive tier would mean too? What's the difference?

 

Sorry for the stupid question, but, what's the difference between Competitive and Viable? I always thought viable mean't they could be used competitively but isn't that what the competitive tier would mean too? What's the difference?

I don't think it means much other then the "competitive" tier has an easier time placing higher in tournament because they have more tools then the "viable" tier. But I could be wrong saying this so correct if you like.

(Note that as the meta evolves over time some of these fighters could have a MUCH different place on the tier list so don't treat this tier list as a fact but rather a tool/reference point we can use too help push the meta game even further)

 

I don't know why Roy is so low when he's always been top 10. Happy to see Lucario get some love though.

 

why does the tier list look so drastically different? so shiek isnt the top spot anymore?and my main man ike is up!

 

Poor 'Dorf, always the evil bridesmaid, never the...evil bride.

Great list though, it's nice that the community's still going strong.

 

Marth should not be that high
Marth is anything but exceptional in PM

 

Pit really is the fallen angel.

 

I only dabble in pm but do most people think that lucas would be above ness and what would be the reasoning? Just curious.

 

Seeing Fox in that spot kinda feels like the balancing part of this project has failed.

I feel the opposite. They've done a great job at finding nerfs that make him still feel like fox. Do you realize how much you would have to **** with this character to bump him down to even a mid-tier placement? (In a game that is ment to be akin to melee) Its the gaps between the characters thats important and their matchups that imo have improved significantly from melee.

 

I have been waiting for a new tier list. RIP PM.

 

Where's Knuckles?
Oh...right.
;_;

Well...It'd be nice if we could have them implemented in tourney..there's nothing glitchy or wrong with him atm. Lyn has also been fixed up in community complete. While I know they werent meant to be put out, id still love to see them get tourney play. Im having way too much fun with lyn to not pick that up =c

lyn even recieved balancing.

I dont have much hope for isaac but lyn and knux are still probably viable D: its not like they're crazy op at all in community complete..and they're not touching any other characters but the 3 "leaked" ones. i heard talk of sami but...i dont see that ahving any priority

 

Well...It'd be nice if we could have them implemented in tourney..there's nothing glitchy or wrong with him atm. Lyn has also been fixed up in community complete. While I know they werent meant to be put out, id still love to see them get tourney play. Im having way too much fun with lyn to not pick that up =c

lyn even recieved balancing.

I dont have much hope for isaac but lyn and knux are still probably viable D: its not like they're crazy op at all in community complete..and they're not touching any other characters but the 3 "leaked" ones. i heard talk of sami but...i dont see that ahving any priority

Yeah, I've heard Knux was most-complete of the three.

 

Sure is nice to see Samus and zero suit both being competitively viable in the same game.

*cough*

 

Lol this is funny
Even if i did agree with this order, does it really matter when everyone is so close?

 

Marth should not be that high
Marth is anything but exceptional in PM

Huh?
He is practically identical to melee where he is top 5

 

Huh?
He is practically identical to melee where he is top 5

Actually, l've heard that he's worse because almost everyone else is better. That and he has to deal with some characters with more range than Melee has. Plus there are more big stages you can take him to.

 

Pokemon differs a lot from Smash, Smogon tier lists are decided by usage.
(PU doesn't mean Partially Used, PU has no meaning)

Fighting game tier lists are decided by matchups/viability/and tools and not by usage in tournaments, though influenced.

Do not get confused by this.

That's the thing though. Project M's balance is the closest we have gotten to perfection that any one of these characters can win at top level play. The problem is that a lot of these characters don't get enough representation because player would rather pick up characters that doesn't require a playstyle other than rush down, aggressive spacing, has metric tons of advantageous frames that require the hands of Mew2King to master, or just fall back on a Melee character that they can be easily grandfathered into like Fox, Marth, or Peach. Therefore, the Smogon tier list can be relevant with PM's current state.

 

................How the F**K is Bowser the worst?

 

Plus there are more big stages you can take him to.

Ill give you that. He does struggle with the new stagelist. Also without fd the space-animal matchup is tougher.

Having said that, marth is still marth and all of his offensive and neutral game tools are still here.

For sure though, it isnt as clear cut as melee.

 

Fox may or may not change, doubt he will budge much if at all.

Still think the names of the tiers are misplaced but not a big deal. Better to go with S/A/B/C etc. since it keeps it more honest with a list.

No big deal though. Nice to see it made though.

Well all of these characters really lie between A-B tier so doing that wouldn't show much info. Besides this is a very shallow tier list with PM being by far the most balanced smash game.

 

Well all of these characters really lie between A-B tier so doing that wouldn't show much info. Besides this is a very shallow tier list with PM being by far the most balanced smash game.

Well opinionated on this front of course but more or less, I'm of the thought to keep that out of a tier list and just listing based on power then listing it as S/A/B/C etc.

Both work just I got a preference for one.

 

will they continue the pm development build that's out? (the one with Lyn, Knuckles, and Isaac in the game)

I doubt it. And even if they do somehow finished the characters, don't never be tournament legal in the standard built.

 

I don't think I've seen a single PM tier list I've agreed with more than this one. There are definitely some things that I disagree with, but everything except for a few characters are basically close enough. Really, really like this one.

 

THIS IS GREAT!!!
everybody is viable, stop waiting for lyn, knuckles or issac just make our meta growth!

ths mod life is going to be great, now i can decide for myself to main bowser until i beat every fox!

hyyyyyyyyyyyyyypeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed!!!!!!!!!!

 

Once upon a time, PM Zelda was very good, perhaps even worthy of high tier. But then people bi*ched and moaned that she was too annoying so they nerfed her back down to where she "belongs."

The end.

QFT. 3.5 Forever

 

................How the F**K is Bowser the worst?

I know... I hate Bowser, but he deserves to be better than what he is now.

 

you are all either delusional or brainwashed if you think pm is balanced

 

you are all either delusional or brainwashed if you think pm is balanced

Care to elaborate for the sake of informed discussion?

 

Care to elaborate for the sake of informed discussion?

I could try mine if that would be more productive.

I don't think it is the most balanced because the bias balancing that has kept Fox near the top and how warping he is to the game.

I don't think he would get worse like people implied rather I think he would stay at the top.

He centers a lot of the game on himself and while he is far more fair than his melee counterpart he still has a lot I understand why he lost his ability to SH laser or jump cancel his shine, because both were problems in the past. Love taps at him didn't change this.

The game overall is more balanced but Fox himself still is and has been a balancing problem for all of PMs dev history.

I think smash 4 is more balanced in my eyes because it tries to set up clear strengths and weaknesses, where as PM ported a lot of characters but didn't address this fairly to the cast where characters got special treatment like Fox and have big kit problems.

 

Can anybody tell me why Pit is low? I always thought he was really good.

 

................How the F**K is Bowser the worst?

They determined that the previous versions of Bowser had polarizing matchups, so for 3.6 they gave him like a dozen nerfs (taking away his super armor was a major one for me) and maybe buffed a few things iirc, and made him the worst character in the game. I play a version with 3.5 Bowser in it instead lol

 

well i agree with a fair amount of it though it is definitely too early to have a set in stone tier list, but its nice to have a start that can be improved upon. i do feel like diddy will drop a few spots and i think rob and metaknight are too high. i could see GnW dropping a little as well and marth going up a spot or two. i think falco and wolf are going to go up at least a couple spots eventually. id also personally put lucario just above captain falcon. i definitely think snake and ike will drop a few spots as people start learning how to deal with those mu's more effectively and wario i think will drop a bit. im unsure about lucas but i could see him moving a little. ive got roy bias so i think he could move up 3 or so spots. im not sure about the exact placement of the rest but i more or less agree with where everyone else is.

 

They determined that the previous versions of Bowser had polarizing matchups, so for 3.6 they gave him like a dozen nerfs (taking away his super armor was a major one for me) and maybe buffed a few things iirc, and made him the worst character in the game. I play a version with 3.5 Bowser in it instead lol

Darn. Guess I'll still play Game and Watch.

 

if and when I get a Wii that reads SD cards I am customizing the heck out of my PM lol, having my friend copy his copy with the last good Bowser in it for me. idc about the tournament standard, I want the actually viable Bowser (plus the new stages, Bowser's Castle is gorgeous and I like the alt. stages idea)

 

Personally, I disagree with a few things on this list. First off, I believe Snake, Ike, and Lucas should all be top-tier characters, with Snake and Ike being low-top, and Lucas being mid-top. I also feel that Ivysaur is far too low, and should be up a tier higher. I also think Mario should be higher in his own tier.
I disagree with a LOT of this list, honestly, but this is just the bigger stuff that I feel is wrong. Peace.

 

We can't have a very accurate tier list when 9 or so characters have over 12 years of development put into them compared to a few months for most of the cast.



At this point, l think this one is too.

Why would fox be at top then...?

-snip-

What is with all this Fox hate? They literally nerfed fox already and everybody got mad and said they were ruining the game now everybody says they're biased towards Fox because currently he seems to be the best (not by a very big amount, I might add). I see they get no break.

 

This tier list looks really messed up. But then again, PM's scene is pretty messed up nowadays, so I can't expect too much I guess.

 

This tier list looks really messed up. But then again, PM's scene is pretty messed up nowadays, so I can't expect too much I guess.

You've got to consider: This tier list was released four months ago, and the stable metagame isn't a lot older than that. My guess is that we'll start getting more sensible PM tier lists as the meta develops.

 

The Puff still to high.