Percentage/Knockback

[nicktron3000]

Something else occurred to me tonight. It doesn't change the game at all, but I was wondering what's calculated first after an attack connects: the change in percentage or the resulting knockback?

For example, say I'm Jigglypuff battling Kirby. Kirby has 63% and I use an fsmash, raising his percentage to 79%. What I'm asking is if the distance that Kirby flies backward is relative to the initial 63% or the final 79%? Sorry if it seems like a pointlessquestion, but it's just something that popped into my head.

 

[Dash_Fox]

The final 79% I'm pretty sure.

 

[craiigg]

correct .

 

[TheREALShadowChaos]

Heh You could test it in Brawl by hitting Kirby while he's in his rock with a strong attack and when he isn't. :-P

Ah well it's not needed in Brawl it's probably the same anyway. :-P

 

[House]

Heh You could test it in Brawl by hitting Kirby while he's in his rock with a strong attack and when he isn't. :-P

Ah well it's not needed in Brawl it's probably the same anyway. :-P

Brawl? You are in the Smash 64 forums for god sake.

 

[nicktron3000]

The final 79% I'm pretty sure.

correct .

That's what I figured too, but I could somewhat convince myself of the other.

Say an attack didn't make a character fly out of the blastzone. So the character survived, but not without consequence. That consequence would be the increase in percentage.

A little farfetched, but it makes sense.

 

[Nybb]

Something else occurred to me tonight. It doesn't change the game at all, but I was wondering what's calculated first after an attack connects: the change in percentage or the resulting knockback?

Well, it doesn't particularly matter. It's just an issue of how the game engine calculates things; the end result is the same for the players. The knockback given is still the knockback given, regardless of how the game computes it, if that makes any sense.

But for the record, I remember reading from a reputable source that Brawl calculates knockback after damage. I would imagine that all the smash games would work the same, since there's no real need to change damage formulas.

I can't see how it would be testable though (unless the others who have responded in this thread know of some test that has already been done). You would have to hit somebody with the same attack at the same percentage in two separate trials, but one of the trials would have to have the attack deal a different amount of damage. I don't know of any attack in 64 that has varying damage in the same hitbox, and without an intense debug mode like in Melee I don't think there's any real way to find one.

So yeah, craigg, how do you know? I'm not trying to argue, just curious

 

[Seala]

I would say it's the other way around actually, based on the fact that a shield grab (which does half damage) has the same knockback as a non shield grab (well, I think atleast, I didn't check it frame by frame or anything)

 

[captain smashie01]

in melee damage is definitely calculated first, then knockback from that resultant percentage, that's how the slight stale- moves effect works
so i'd assume it's the same

 

[craiigg]

knockback happens after the last frame of being hit, where damage happens at the very first frames.

if knockback was calculated before the final percentage was calculated, multi hit attacks (samus' upsmash) would cause knockback after the first hit, therefore the second hit wouldn't be able to hit at high percentages