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Peach v P:M Sword Characters

Who do you think is Peach's hardest Sword Matchup


  • Total voters
    28

Garde Noir

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Since most of Peach's tech skills and basic Melee Matchups are covered pretty handily in the Melee Forum (which all of you should check and subscribe to) I wanted to start a thread of P:M matchups.

More specifically is Sword characters-- Link, Meta Knight, Roy, Ike and Pit (thanks to @ Angrycuban Angrycuban for the reminder)
These matchups are not present in Melee, and require different tactics than the only real sword character in Melee: Marth http://meleeiton.me/2014/08/24/armadas-matchup-guide-to-peach-vs-marth/

Because of the range of all of these characters, and their newfound speed, tactics like down and forward smash cannot be used as effectively. Float recovering is tricky, and unreliable. D-air is essentially useless, because by the time your hitboxes come out, you're in range of incredibly strong finishing moves for each character.

Float Canceled N-air and B-airs are essential, as is jabs. As Armada explains in his Marth Match-up thread, Dash attacks can be tricky, but I found their use against heavier characters at low percents before escaping.

The Turnip Game is especially strong here, but is less for damage than it is for proper time for spacing.

I have an especially hard time with Meta Knight and Link, for different reasons.

Post your strats for P:M Swords characters here, videos and experience welcome.

EDIT: This is not necessarily a match-up thread, but more meant to help a broad idea against range and improve approach tactics in P:M against characters with good close range that are not present in Melee
 
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TimeSmash

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Oooh Garde Noir I didn't know you were over here! I said Link was the hardest, but it's rteally between him and Marth for me. I'll respond later when I have time
 

Angrycuban

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i personally find link to be one peach peaches two or 3 hardest match ups in the entire game so my vote is definitely for link, all the characters give me a tough time though, also is pit not considered a sword character?
 

InfinityCollision

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Pit is considered annoying as ****. I have nothing else to say about that brat.

The Roy matchup isn't too different from the Marth matchup in overall mechanics. Ftilt range is gahlike, he combos hard and has plenty of kill options, but he's a bit slower (aside from being less floaty), does poorly offstage, lacks Marth's edgeguard game, and gets combo'd to hell and back. Basically you'll both kill each other a bit harder than in the Marth matchup, though I think the particulars favor Peach here.

Ike's approaches are really linear. Turnips 2stronk.

The Link matchup requires you to be really, really patient. Wolf v Peachkid is one of the only high-level vids I've seen of this matchup, and the two games went approximately five and six minutes each. That's pretty well in line with how my matches seem to go as well. Last stock high % both games, and I believe the stages were PS2 and Metal Cavern. Aerolink vs an appropriately skilled and patient Peach would probably go to time every game lol.

MK is just plain annoying. Small, fast, great recovery, disjoint, combos like woah. CCing does a number on him though.

Also there's actually a matchup thread already.
 
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Needsmorespin

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I speak from experience that Marth's range can be a damn nightmare for Peach, do Not challenge Marth on the ground, float and get an edge on him
 

InfinityCollision

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Floating limits your movement options and Marth can eat you alive in the air. Be very careful about floating anywhere in his vicinity when he's in a position to throw out hitboxes.

Frankly you shouldn't be trying to challenge Marth head-on regardless. Very few characters can do that. Peach is not one of them, especially if she's not holding a turnip.
 

TimeSmash

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Honestly, it's not really Link's sword that's the problem (except for the surprising priority of Dair and suprise 2nd hit FSmashes) but just his infinite projectiles and how much they destroy float and interrupt aerials. Meta Knight is just super fast and can recover about ten million ways currently, and he has a lot of good options if he reads your DI correctly since he's so fast. I don't think Pit is too bad, but arrows are annoying enough and again, great recovery. Note that Link's recovery is pretty decent right now, but hopefully tether nerfs help tone it down
 

Angrycuban

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the other day i left FD unbanned against a player i usually beat (he played sheilda) and he took me there and went link. It was literally a night mare, boomarang bombs and nairs all day with no platforms to use to avoid them -.- i was so frustrated. Think im gonna ban FD against everyone in the off chance they have a link
 

TimeSmash

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the other day i left FD unbanned against a player i usually beat (he played sheilda) and he took me there and went link. It was literally a night mare, boomarang bombs and nairs all day with no platforms to use to avoid them -.- i was so frustrated. Think im gonna ban FD against everyone in the off chance they have a link
I usually ban it. Spacies and characters like Link just hold no quarter there
 

Angrycuban

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I usually ban it. Spacies and characters like Link just hold no quarter there
Well i kept it open because sheik isnt very good without platforms to move around on and against fast fallers i like it for the chain grabs and up throw combos, if id have known this man had a link i definitely would have banned it immediately -.-. Link players are scum bags IMO lol
 

Garde Noir

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Oooh Garde Noir I didn't know you were over here! I said Link was the hardest, but it's rteally between him and Marth for me. I'll respond later when I have time
i personally find link to be one peach peaches two or 3 hardest match ups in the entire game so my vote is definitely for link, all the characters give me a tough time though, also is pit not considered a sword character?
To be honest, I was thinking more about sword characters with Range-- and Pit is pretty close. Down Smash has a longer range than most of Pit's moves. However, you are correct, and I'll change that in the OP, and credit you.
Pit is considered annoying as ****. I have nothing else to say about that brat.

The Roy matchup isn't too different from the Marth matchup in overall mechanics. Ftilt range is gahlike, he combos hard and has plenty of kill options, but he's a bit slower (aside from being less floaty), does poorly offstage, lacks Marth's edgeguard game, and gets combo'd to hell and back. Basically you'll both kill each other a bit harder than in the Marth matchup, though I think the particulars favor Peach here.

Ike's approaches are really linear. Turnips 2stronk.

The Link matchup requires you to be really, really patient. Wolf v Peachkid is one of the only high-level vids I've seen of this matchup, and the two games went approximately five and six minutes each. That's pretty well in line with how my matches seem to go as well. Last stock high % both games, and I believe the stages were PS2 and Metal Cavern. Aerolink vs an appropriately skilled and patient Peach would probably go to time every game lol.

MK is just plain annoying. Small, fast, great recovery, disjoint, combos like woah. CCing does a number on him though.

Also there's actually a matchup thread already.
I didn't see one. My apologies. And this matchup thread is supposed to be more for how to deal with Sword Characters ridiculous range, less than a match-up thread. Sure, it's one thing to say "chuck turnips" but I wanted this thread to specifically be about what to do after that
 

Garde Noir

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Honestly, it's not really Link's sword that's the problem (except for the surprising priority of Dair and suprise 2nd hit FSmashes) but just his infinite projectiles and how much they destroy float and interrupt aerials. Meta Knight is just super fast and can recover about ten million ways currently, and he has a lot of good options if he reads your DI correctly since he's so fast. I don't think Pit is too bad, but arrows are annoying enough and again, great recovery. Note that Link's recovery is pretty decent right now, but hopefully tether nerfs help tone it down
the other day i left FD unbanned against a player i usually beat (he played sheilda) and he took me there and went link. It was literally a night mare, boomarang bombs and nairs all day with no platforms to use to avoid them -.- i was so frustrated. Think im gonna ban FD against everyone in the off chance they have a link
My friend and practice-partner is a Link Main. He's a lot more offensive which tends to throw people off, and he's surprisingly fast. What I've found with Link is that Turnips out prioritize and stick past all of his annoying projectiles, Toad (shockingly) helps, and Link is incredibly vulnerable from behind, and slow enough that Float Canceled B-air to roll will give you enough time to charge an F-smash a decent amount, so you can pull another turnip during his hitstun and proceed to get the advantage.

Take Link to the Air and he's crippled. All he can do is Up-B and D-air, since his bomb's have so much lag. Up-B leaves him crippled if you avoid it, and D-air leaves him open if you approach from an angle. Link's Bomb Jumping is also easily exploited off-stage if you're a pretty decent edge-guarder with floats, and is neutralized by turnips.

However, Link is still very obnoxious because he's a campy player vs our very defensive player.
 
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TimeSmash

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My friend and practice-partner is a Link Main. He's a lot more offensive which tends to throw people off, and he's surprisingly fast. What I've found with Link is that Turnips out prioritize and stick past all of his annoying projectiles, Toad (shockingly) helps, and Link is incredibly vulnerable from behind, and slow enough that Float Canceled B-air to roll will give you enough time to charge an F-smash a decent amount, so you can pull another turnip during his hitstun and proceed to get the advantage.

Take Link to the Air and he's crippled. All he can do is Up-B and D-air, since his bomb's have so much lag. Up-B leaves him crippled if you avoid it, and D-air leaves him open if you approach from an angle. Link's Bomb Jumping is also easily exploited off-stage if you're a pretty decent edge-guarder with floats, and is neutralized by turnips.

However, Link is still very obnoxious because he's a campy player vs our very defensive player.
Forward Air from Link is a decent kill move though. But you're definitely right about Turnips, they basically destroy Bomb Jumps. The Fact that Link just casually has a shield while standing/walking kind of pisses me off haha. Gotta get creative with turnips. I always throw some directly up for anti-air stuff, but I don't know what to do after that. I'm also like that with Ivysaur, though you can angle her Seed Bombs quite a bit.

If they gave Peach a little more speed in 3.5 I'd be so happy
 

Angrycuban

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Forward Air from Link is a decent kill move though. But you're definitely right about Turnips, they basically destroy Bomb Jumps. The Fact that Link just casually has a shield while standing/walking kind of pisses me off haha. Gotta get creative with turnips. I always throw some directly up for anti-air stuff, but I don't know what to do after that. I'm also like that with Ivysaur, though you can angle her Seed Bombs quite a bit.

If they gave Peach a little more speed in 3.5 I'd be so happy
i dunno if you should always throw turnips up, the problem is that a smart link will never approach you (cause link is stupid) so you have to force him to approach or approach yourself by pressuring him with turnips from afar :/. That aside throwing a turnip up is a super good option, against another melee vet the other day in tournament i got this sick combo on his fox. I threw a turnip up, dash attacked the fox, he got knocked down, the turnip landed on him before he teched and reset him, i grabbed him and did my BnB up throw combo on spacies (up throw, up air up air Fair) and then edge guarded him for the kill, last stock last game. :3 Peachy ftw <3
 

Angrycuban

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http://meleeiton.me/2014/08/24/armadas-matchup-guide-to-peach-vs-marth/

i read this a couple days ago and found it to be pretty insightful (its written by our lord and holy god armada so of course it is). I figured it was extremely relevent to this thread so i decided to dig it up :3 Enjoy! <3

Note: this guide is written for the peach marth match up in melee but the match up is almost the exact same In PM aside from the fact that peach can now glide toss turnips which is pretty important, basically when armada talks about throwing turnips on the ground replace that with glide tossing turnips cause its generally always better than just throwing one normally (not always true but for the most part)
 
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Garde Noir

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http://meleeiton.me/2014/08/24/armadas-matchup-guide-to-peach-vs-marth/

i read this a couple days ago and found it to be pretty insightful (its written by our lord and holy god armada so of course it is). I figured it was extremely relevent to this thread so i decided to dig it up :3 Enjoy! <3

Note: this guide is written for the peach marth match up in melee but the match up is almost the exact same In PM aside from the fact that peach can now glide toss turnips which is pretty important, basically when armada talks about throwing turnips on the ground replace that with glide tossing turnips cause its generally always better than just throwing one normally (not always true but for the most part)
I have this in the OP :]

Forward Air from Link is a decent kill move though. But you're definitely right about Turnips, they basically destroy Bomb Jumps. The Fact that Link just casually has a shield while standing/walking kind of pisses me off haha. Gotta get creative with turnips. I always throw some directly up for anti-air stuff, but I don't know what to do after that. I'm also like that with Ivysaur, though you can angle her Seed Bombs quite a bit.

If they gave Peach a little more speed in 3.5 I'd be so happy
I tend to jump and throw the turnip. That way he's gotta get out of the way, and you're already approaching
 

TimeSmash

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http://meleeiton.me/2014/08/24/armadas-matchup-guide-to-peach-vs-marth/

i read this a couple days ago and found it to be pretty insightful (its written by our lord and holy god armada so of course it is). I figured it was extremely relevent to this thread so i decided to dig it up :3 Enjoy! <3

Note: this guide is written for the peach marth match up in melee but the match up is almost the exact same In PM aside from the fact that peach can now glide toss turnips which is pretty important, basically when armada talks about throwing turnips on the ground replace that with glide tossing turnips cause its generally always better than just throwing one normally (not always true but for the most part)
SIMPLY AMAZING
 

MTL Kyle

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Meta Knight by far.

Link and Tink have punishable moves/moments, Marth and Roy are kinda the same flow and I have this bizarre theory where Peach-Ike is a 50-50.
 

Garde Noir

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Meta Knight by far.

Link and Tink have punishable moves/moments, Marth and Roy are kinda the same flow and I have this bizarre theory where Peach-Ike is a 50-50.
The problem with Roy is the flaming sword. the continuous damage on hit-stun is obnoxious. I'd agree with the Ike theory on anyone who doesn't use Turnips properly.

What are link's punishable moves? This is curiosity, not hostility.
The problem with MK is simply his stupid speed and lack of lag. His amazing Recovery doesn't help either, but Turnips hitting during recovery does but a decent stop to that. You just have to be lucky. I hate games relying on luck.
 

Angrycuban

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The problem with Roy is the flaming sword. the continuous damage on hit-stun is obnoxious. I'd agree with the Ike theory on anyone who doesn't use Turnips properly.

What are link's punishable moves? This is curiosity, not hostility.
The problem with MK is simply his stupid speed and lack of lag. His amazing Recovery doesn't help either, but Turnips hitting during recovery does but a decent stop to that. You just have to be lucky. I hate games relying on luck.
Huge post incoming

Link has very punishable moves yes (Dair, Uair, Fsmash Ftilt Up B grab etc), but good links generally don't use them in punishable situations which makes it really hard if the link just stays safe and spams jab, boomarng and nair walls :/

stay on the ground more against meta knight, as long as you can stop his grabs you can win although the match up is still pretty hard for poor peachy :/. Just crouch cancel a lot and space fairs low to the ground etc, smart meta knights will use a lot of Fair though and then its really hard cause that move out right beats everything peach has in the game basically, also always recover high against meta knight, aim for plat forms with your parasol etc. Remember you can combo him really hard cause he falls fast, (Up throw up air up air up air up air up air up air up air for daysssssss :D) Still a really rough match up though.

Now on the topic of Ike...I play against lordy pretty much every day (hes considered the 4th best ike in the world right now according to the best player by character thread), and I've played Ally bit too ( he is undeniably the best ike in the world) and id say my record is about 35-65 against lordy and 25-75 (maybe worse) against Ally (in friendlies of course he would body me in tournament) so i have a lot of insight on that match up, as its one of the characters i have the most experience with, not including the melee characters of course. I personally think Ike wins slightly (maybe 55-45 ikes favor or maybe its even). Basically if you have a turnip in your hand you can beat any of his approaches by throwing a grounded turnip and punishing his reaction (which often times involves ike just taking the vegetable to the face :3). However its hard to pull turnips against ike, and when peach doesnt have a turnip in hand its much more difficult to stop Ike from coming in on you. The most important part of the match up (in my opinion) revolves around Ikes mix up game. Peach has a way to beat all of ikes approaches with out a turnip, but because of Ikes ability to approach with a grab, an aerial or a ground attack very quickly if forces you to stay on your toes, always reading/reacting to him. I'll go into detail about his mix up game here:

1. If he approaches with quick draw Fair or short hop Fair (which many Ikes do) you have to respect it, none of your moves stand a chance in hell of beating ikes fair. Luckily its got slow start up and enough end lag for you to work with, if you see the fair coming (which you should be able to do on reaction as its pretty slow) your best option is to run forward and shield, you need to space it so that when he lands he is close to you (place your shield on the hilt of his sword for the best results). If done properly you can shield grab him as he lands and up throw at low % for a full combo or at higher % you can down throw for a potential combo or forward/back throw for stage position. (note that if he lands behind you after fairing his shield you can BAir out of shield, this doesn't happen often but keep it in mind)

2 The other aerial ikes love to approach with is Nair, the run up shield strategy can work here but its not as guaranteed as it is against Fair because Nair is much faster and safer upon landing. Its not impossible to shield grab but its not easy either. However a well spaced Nair, Bair or dash attack can trade with his Nair and that can be beneficial for you. Its also possible to dash dance grab his nair, although this is pretty tough too. Nair is really hard to deal with but just remember the hitbox doesn't actually extend that far forawrd so you can outright beat it or trade with it using your Fair, Nair or Bair. When your at low % the best way to deal with Ikes nair is Crouch cancel, despite how scary the move looks its actually pretty CCable.

3 The last aerial to watch out for is a quick draw-reverse Bair. This is insanely scary and if lordy or ally used it more i probably would never take a game off of them. The main way I've dealt with it is hitting him as he turns around from the quick draw with a dash attack or just shielding it and then choosing an option after, either nair out of shield, shield grab or wave dash out of shield to saftey. Remember if Ike Bairs your shield he will land with his back to you, meaning he needs to do a turn around jab to beat you shield grab or a spot dodge. Basically, Bair is tough to deal with but like his other aerials shielding is usually your best option in my experience. Remember not to get stuck in your shield though because getting grabbed by ike basically means death at any % assuming the Ike is pretty good.

4 Ike can also approach is with a grab. THIS IS THE REASON THE MATCH UP IS SO DAMN HARD SOMETIMES. As I've been saying the best way to beat ikes approach is with a well spaced shield, unfortunately Grab beats shielding (obviously). What is even more unfortunate is that Ike gets so much out of a grab its ridiculous, Forward throw to forward throw to forward throw to Fair Fair Fair FAIR FAIR FAIR, Bam! There goes your stock. The best way to beat this is to watch ike as he comes in carefully, as soon as you see him jump prepare to shield his aerial, if he doesn't jump out of quick draw then it becomes a 50/50 guessing game between grab or quick draw attack (ill talk about the quick draw attack next. Also keep in mind Ike can do a few other things out of quick draw such as wave dash of course but they generally aren't as threatening as his other options and most ikes don't really implement them that much). If you predict Ike to grab you can beat his grab with just about any attack, I usually go for dash attack or a quick float Bair just because i can get a fairly heavy punish of either of those attacks landing. Jabbing is also an option because its insanely fast which means you have more time to decide whether you should shield or attack. Until you get a good handle on the match up id recommend dash attack though over anything anything else.

5 The quick draw attack is the final piece to Ikes insanely powerful mix up game. Basically if Ike quick draws at you and you expect a grab and you try to beat it with an attack, ike can counter that with the quick draw attack and go into a full combo. However QD attack is supppper laggy so if you shield you can punish with pretty much whatever you like (I usually just grab). The hard part is because grab and QD attack are both really fast you cant actually react and punish accordingly, it pretty much has to be a read. One thing to note is that peaches dash attack can actually be your saving grace here, I already mentioned that it outright beats QD grab, and if you space the dash attack well you can actually beat his QD attack too! Sometimes you will trade with him but in general thats a great trade for you. However peachs dash attack is pretty punishable so don't just start spamming dash attack every time he QD's. Ike can start his QD attack early and straight up beat your dash attack, he can also jump over it, or wave dash out and shield. All of which completely beat dash attack and will probably lead to peaches death.

Basically if you can get a read on what ike will do out of quick draw, and you pick the correct option to deal with it peach can win this match up, just remember to pluck turnips whenever you possibly can, combo him hard (hes a pretty good weight for peach to juggle) and if you do get grabbed HOLD UP AND AWAY AND PRAY FOR YOUR LIFE. If you DI in your just gonna eat 5 forward airs and die but if you DI up and away you stand a chance of surviving. <3
 
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Angrycuban

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I have this in the OP :]


I tend to jump and throw the turnip. That way he's gotta get out of the way, and you're already approaching
Oops didn't see it sorry :3.

the problem with jumping and throwing a turnip against marth is that it doesn't force marth off the ground, he can just dash back or dash forward and dodge it. Also being in the air is super scary against marth as peach. Air turnips aren't bad and they should be used of course, but in this particular match up i throw probably 70% of my turnips from the ground.

Edit: Sorry for double post and double sorry for my previous post being a million words long, smash tends to get me over excited :3
 
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Garde Noir

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Oops didn't see it sorry :3.

the problem with jumping and throwing a turnip against marth is that it doesn't force marth off the ground, he can just dash back or dash forward and dodge it. Also being in the air is super scary against marth as peach. Air turnips aren't bad and they should be used of course, but in this particular match up i throw probably 70% of my turnips from the ground.

Edit: Sorry for double post and double sorry for my previous post being a million words long, smash tends to get me over excited :3
Don't apologize. That was the single best thing I've ever read about Ike.

ANYONE WITH TROUBLE AGAINST IKE SHOULD READ ANGRYCUBAN's POST.
That's what I want in this thread :D

The goal is to try and get this kind of guide to translate to other characters, because it can. In the end, Ike, Marth, Roy and Link have similar tactics in the close range, just different moves. They all have different subtleties (Link's projectiles, Marth and Roy's tipper, and Ike's ungodly strength and approach game) but I've found we all say basically the same thing: Use turnips, B-air, Down Smash.
But that's too damn broad for me. I can't just do that. Armada's thread about Marth helped me immensely in the Roy matchup, but your post on Ike reminds me a lot of what Link does when he goes aggro, which he has to do eventually. Link can't kill with projectiles, and that's what everyone forgets. Sure, he's sub-par without them, but everyone focuses on them. WATCH THE LINK, NOT THE PROJECTILES. He acts like an Ike. Sure his moves are different, but you can see the translation.

Meta Knight and Pit act almost identical as well, fundamentally. They can be punished the same way.
The reason I wanted this thread is because it would be almost impossible to learn the match-up against 41 characters. You'd have to do nothing but Smash, and that's not considering the different options that players put into it. There are no two Kirbys that play alike, there are no two Lucas's. But Sword characters are different because they follow a fundamental pattern, and typically play somewhat consistently. Add the fact that Peach tends to suffer against them.

They all suffer in recovery (minus Pit and Meta Knight) So How do we punish the recovery game consistently without being put in a situation where we can get spiked. They all rely on their range-- so spacing becomes a problem. They all have somewhat decent approach games. How do we see and punish the approach. Most of them suffer in the air. How can we get them in the air, and finish them off?
 

KunchieMunchie

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I find the Marth matchup to be in Peach's favor. As long as they don't know proper spacing, Peach can crouch cancel all of Marths attacks. Spot dodge down smash works if the grab a lot. To avoid Marth's bread & butter combo: (foreward throw into foreward throw into foreward throw until you are offstage then side smash.) DI down and away. If you are offstage when you do so, the Side smash will miss. If you are onstage, you will be too far away to grab. But the onstage DI can be risky. If Marth reads it, he can side smash punish. Try to apply so much pressure that Marth loses all of his stage control. OR play the baiting game and float camp just out of reach. Turnips help if they are being runaway-dashdancy. Maybe try float camp into falling Nair punish into downsmash. But I haven't played any of the really good Marths before, so this stuff might not work. Hopefully I helped...
 

MTL Kyle

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Precisely.

My little brother could tell you with some honesty that peach bomber is a reliable finish and a kill move.

This is because he plays casualler than casual.
I mean, there is stuff that is not supposed to work and it works, because people have to adapt in the middle of the set. Down-throw shenanigans are an example. This is why fighting games are really cool. After a certain level, execution stops being a barrier and you have to start to learn how to play your opponent.

____

Regarding Marth, well, in casual/ low levels, it might be in Peach favor, because if you just do the DADS (dash-attack, down-smash), you will get a lot of mileage. Also, if you decide to play super campy, low level players don't know how to deal with
projectiles in general.

After low level, no, Marth always win. He has better priority, he is not comboable like Fox, he wins neutral by a lot and he can control the pace of the matchup. Fortunately Marth has a lot of laggy moves that Peach can punish, so the match-up is not impossible, but even so, it's pretty hard and you have to be on point.
 

KunchieMunchie

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Counting on stuff that shouldn't happen is not very good theorycraft.
Don't twist my words. I was saying you can crouch cancel every one of Marth's attacks if they don't space. Or if you space yourself into them. That works too.
 

TimeSmash

Smash Champion
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Aug 23, 2006
Messages
2,669
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Inside a cheesecake
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nintend64
My practice partner would reassure you in this regard

"lol yes he still tries that

Keeps me honest"

I can see him saying it now
It really is good for a surprise. It's just sad with sword characters, where it can literally be beat out by like, Math's jab haha
 

MTL Kyle

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Aug 26, 2014
Messages
269
The only decent use I've ever seen of Peach bomber was used by a non-Peach main, Bidoof/Nephiros, whenever he wants to cover all the options on the ledge, he uses Side B.


I thought it was interesting lolol
 

InfinityCollision

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 9, 2014
Messages
1,245
I find the Marth matchup to be in Peach's favor. As long as they don't know proper spacing
Don't twist my words. I was saying you can crouch cancel every one of Marth's attacks if they don't space. Or if you space yourself into them. That works too.
Marth main checking in, MTLKyle is 100% correct in his criticism. Marth is fundamentally reliant on good spacing, expecting Marth not to space properly is equivalent to relying on your opponent to suck. If that's the case, you should be destroying them regardless of who they're playing. A good Marth will space for tippers in any situation where he wants a tipper. Don't count on your opponent being bad, it doesn't end well.
 

KunchieMunchie

Smash Cadet
Joined
Aug 2, 2014
Messages
29
Marth main checking in, MTLKyle is 100% correct in his criticism. Marth is fundamentally reliant on good spacing, expecting Marth not to space properly is equivalent to relying on your opponent to suck. If that's the case, you should be destroying them regardless of who they're playing. A good Marth will space for tippers in any situation where he wants a tipper. Don't count on your opponent being bad, it doesn't end well.
You guys don't get it. I didn't say the entire matchup relies on Marth not spacing!!!!! Just the crouch cancel every move part. Sheesh.
 

InfinityCollision

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 9, 2014
Messages
1,245
We get it, you don't. There is no point trying to capitalize on something that is not going to happen in the first place. If you go in with even the slightest hope of CCing a sourspot against a competent Marth, you will be disappointed. Clear enough, or do we need to do this again?
 
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Garde Noir

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Feb 3, 2014
Messages
261
Location
West Chester, PA
It really is good for a surprise. It's just sad with sword characters, where it can literally be beat out by like, Math's jab haha
It's a good surprise recovery. Instead of Float, I'll often lead with this as I'm by the edge. It's a really good surprise, has decent knockback as well-- enough so that I can recover all I need to. For a few seconds. No one expects it-- like Up-air. It's a decent move, but requires preciseness and a little luck.

The only decent use I've ever seen of Peach bomber was used by a non-Peach main, Bidoof/Nephiros, whenever he wants to cover all the options on the ledge, he uses Side B.


I thought it was interesting lolol
Similar to this. It covers a lot of options, it just has a lot of starting lag-- so opponents can see it coming. No one is going to miss Peach scream HUMP-CHAAAA
 
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