Out of shield options?

[Rango the Mercenary]

I always find myself going for his slide, even though it's not the safest option, especially on disjointed characters like Shulk who thrive on baiting retreat landing Nairs into Dtilt cancels.

Looking for something a bit more reliable and safer than Climhazzard.

 

[Conn1496]

Jab is basically your only good OoS option unless you count U-tilt or Limit Cross Slash (Which are both actually kinda slow(?) (Frame 6 isn't too bad, I guess.) and situational.), grab is pretty good too, I suppose, since you don't have to use frames putting the shield down, but obviously Cloud's grabs are lacking so that one is really pretty situational too.

Overall, Cloud has slightly lacking frame data and OoS as a result. You can see his frame data here, and this will basically show you why his OoS is bad but also show you which of his moves are faster. Honestly, you probably just want to be jabbing or moving away OoS since his options are so bad, but hopefully some of the data and tips I've given help!

 

[Rango the Mercenary]

Jab is basically your only good OoS option unless you count U-tilt or Limit Cross Slash (Which are both actually kinda slow(?) (Frame 6 isn't too bad, I guess.) and situational.), grab is pretty good too, I suppose, since you don't have to use frames putting the shield down, but obviously Cloud's grabs are lacking so that one is really pretty situational too.

Overall, Cloud has slightly lacking frame data and OoS as a result. You can see his frame data here, and this will basically show you why his OoS is bad but also show you which of his moves are faster. Honestly, you probably just want to be jabbing or moving away OoS since his options are so bad, but hopefully some of the data and tips I've given help!

And people said Cloud has great frame data, to the point that Japanese players put him in top tier. It seems to really be a mix.

 

[Conn1496]

And people said Cloud has great frame data, to the point that Japanese players put him in top tier. It seems to really be a mix.

Oh, he does when you take range and disjoints (even damage, really) into account... But when range isn't the issue? lol, no, he's... Pretty bad.

[Edit]: I should have also mentioned short-hop N-air since it's frame 5 and can hit behind you on start-up, but again, situational, so... *shrug*

 

[Denjinpachi]

Basically, its pick an option and pray its right. Doesn't seem to be a consistent option for OoS with cloud. Everything is situational with him in this subject of options.

 

[Conn1496]

Basically, its pick an option and pray its right. Doesn't seem to be a consistent option for OoS with cloud. Everything is situational with him in this subject of options.

Jab is frame 4, so I guess it's consistent(?). Atleast against some/most characters. -and it's not like you can't turn around Jab either, it just takes more skill, which is why I argue escaping to neutral is just overall better sometimes since it's where Cloud works best and you're not taking said risks that your OoS isn't enough.

That being said, Bowser's Whirling Fortress is frame 6, and that works OoS 9/10 completely fine (-and is Bowser's only reliable OoS option, let's note), so Cloud's frame 4 Jab, for example, can't be that bad.

 

[Joaco]

Depends on the situation. All of our aerials, except fair are good options. Jab, climhazzard are also very good options. Usmash is a decent option too.

 

[Eureka]

Climhazzard is a great out of shield option in my opinion. It's fast, has long range, and can be reversed to cover both sides. Now of course, the problem with it is that people can air dodge out of it at lower percents and it won't always connect if it's landed at it's max range or point blank. I think an option that works when Climhazzard doesn't is jumping Cross Slash. It's 14 frames when taking jumpsquat into account, has more range, and doesn't leave Cloud as vulnerable. For example, go into training mode on FD against Mario and push him slightly away from the ledge at his starting point, then roll to the ledge and try to hit Mario with Climhazzard. It will miss every time, but jumping Cross Slash will still hit him. It's trickier to connect all the hits at higher percents, but it's still possible if you delay the second and third hits so Cloud lands on the ground instead of floating past the opponent. It also will get Roy zoned at point-blank range (which looks pretty funny honestly) but at that range you should just shield grab them.

So in my opinion Cloud's out of shield options go like this

• Long range: jumping Cross Slash
• Mid range: Climhazzard
• Close range: shield grab

 

[Garde Noir]

Depends on the situation. All of our aerials, except fair are good options. Jab, climhazzard are also very good options. Usmash is a decent option too.

Fair is still fine if you're hitting with the edge within the auto-cancel range. It hits shield harder, and has a slightly longer range. I use it as a mix-up, and it's not 100% safe, but it's safe more often than I expect.

 

[Eureka]

Fair is still fine if you're hitting with the edge within the auto-cancel range. It hits shield harder, and has a slightly longer range. I use it as a mix-up, and it's not 100% safe, but it's safe more often than I expect.

Fair doesn't autocancel out of a short hop, and while the move actually is safe on shield if spaced right and if it hits right before landing, that's not the problem with using it out of shield. The problem is its startup (22 frames accounting for jumpsquat) so if you're trying to use it out of shield to relieve pressure you're probably just going to get smacked before the move can come out.

 

[HFlash]

Dtilt imo is god like to use OOS. So is dsmash if your expecting them to try to immediately attack again after hitting your shield, and you need a good kill option. OOS LB Climhazzard is so underated imo. Also: I never have been punished for using Climhazzard OOS except for at really low percentages. At around 0-20% or so, not enough hit stun is generated, leaving a window for the opponent to be able to airdodge the second part, leaving you open to punishment.

 

[Migeta]

1. Short/Full/Double hop dair. Hitting shield on the way up from a full or double can be punish. Climhazzard is cexy tho