Olimar not practical for competitive play?

[Coselm]

Well, we know that Olimar can not do a whole lot without his pikmin. And you have to pull the pikmin from the ground right?

Well when you are in a tournament, most people will not give you the chance to pull out a few pikmin, so you may be stuck with just one, or none, until you can pull off a KO or at least get your opponent out of your face for a little while.

I'm sure we will find ways around this, but what are your thoughts on how this may handicap Olimar as a character in competitive play?

 

[Itakio]

I'm pretty sure everyone else will disagree with you, but personally I don't think Olimar will be that great. You can see in the dojo that his Pikmin take a LONG time to reach the ground and be of use, so in the beginning of a match, you could pretty much dash over there and attack Olimar and he won't really be able to do anything about it until his Pikmin falls to the ground. This is assuming that he starts with no Pikmin, however.

I also don't like that his recovery is based on the number of Pikmin he has. You probably won't have 6 Pikmin at all times, and depending on the time there is before Olimar can boost himself up, it could very well be an easy recovery to edgeguard.

 

[Camera_Guy]

I don't believe Olimar's dependency on Pikmin will be real disadvantage. The Pikmin Pluck looks pretty fast. In the picture, there were two other Pikmin that were falling as he was pulling out another. And we can always use the attacks that don't need pikmin to gains some breathing space and pluck more pikmin. Attacks like his back throw.

 

[JonBeBonanza]

this is stupid. we don't know the rate of how fast he pulls out a pikmin, until then nothing can be said

 

[Cinder]

I'm pretty sure everyone else will disagree with you, but personally I don't think Olimar will be that great. You can see in the dojo that his Pikmin take a LONG time to reach the ground and be of use, so in the beginning of a match, you could pretty much dash over there and attack Olimar and he won't really be able to do anything about it until his Pikmin falls to the ground. This is assuming that he starts with no Pikmin, however.

I also don't like that his recovery is based on the number of Pikmin he has. You probably won't have 6 Pikmin at all times, and depending on the time there is before Olimar can boost himself up, it could very well be an easy recovery to edgeguard.

Idk...I would pluck one or two, smash the opponent, pluck a couple more, etc.

And as for the recovery...he can airdodge, DJ, up-b...the airdodge no longer taking your third jump is very helpful...

 

[Coselm]

Idk...I would pluck one or two, smash the opponent, pluck a couple more, etc.

And as for the recovery...he can airdodge, DJ, up-b...the airdodge no longer taking your third jump is very helpful...

Yeah, but an air dodge won't help you recover because it doesn't affect your momentum.

And I'm sure you will be able to pull out at least one Pikmin before you get attacked by your opponent on most stages, but then they can counter-pick a small stage and you are boned for your first stock.

And it is not like your pikmin last forever.. they CAN be killed.

I speculate that if Olimar starts with no Pikmin, that will be a major flaw in competitive 1v1.

 

[JonBeBonanza]

And as for the recovery...he can airdodge, DJ, up-b...the airdodge no longer taking your third jump is very helpful...

i heard that you can't Directional dodge

 

[Camera_Guy]

There are still moves that don't use Pikmin. Those particular moves can be used to get some time to harvest. We already know his back throw doesn't need Pikmin, and that can be very helpful.

When I first get Olimar, I'm gonna practice without Pikmin so I can find out what moves to rely on in a pinch.

 

[Itakio]

Cinder - You make it sound so easy. I'm pretty sure the opponent will be going at you as fast as he can because if you don't start with more than one or two Pikmin, it's pretty obvious that you will have to start to plucking immediately. Even if you do manage to get two by the time your opponent reaches you, your Pikmin will still be spinning in the air as we saw on the dojo for a little bit, which is enough time to disturb your plucking.

The air dodge doesn't improve your recovery (I don't know if you meant distance-wise), it's momentum based. That leaves only DJ and up B, which I really, really don't like, especially because his up B isn't very reliable.

More replies to come for you other guys. Smashboards is going really slow for me.

 

[Itakio]

There are still moves that don't use Pikmin. Those particular moves can be used to get some time to harvest. We already know his back throw doesn't need Pikmin, and that can be very helpful.

No, in the video, the blue Pikmin is in line first, when the throw ends, there is a blue Pikmin in the back but not the front. We can't decide if the blue Pikmin is "consumed" but you can be certain that you NEED Pikmin for throws. Sakurai even said so. Maybe it's not every throw, but it could be.

 

[Coselm]

It said you even need pikmin for smash attacks. If you can't throw (idk if you can or not w/o pikmin) without pikmin then olimar seems to be boned. He would have to have some sick tilt/neutral a/aerial attacks to compensate.

All we can do is speculate...

I am not saying he will be unplayable, but deffinetly a unique character.

If Falco came back with short hop laser (which he won't, but jsut saying) Olimar would be practically useless.

 

[Camera_Guy]

If so, then it's even more important to find out what moves don't require Pikmin.

 

[Qbuilderz]

these threads are pointless...

Mr.game and watch was a character like tihs, he was considered top suck and that no one would use him, low and behold if you master him he kicks ***, couldn't that ve the same for olimar?

ANd recycle old threads insted of making new ones...

 

[Itakio]

Well, he could have super armor during the pluck. And Falco wouldn't need to short hop, just firing on the ground would make Olimar unable to pluck Pikmin, unless it was an uneven stage or had platforms.

Qbuilderz - Uh, GaW IS bottom tier. Not the lowest, but bottom tier is pretty bad. And you can't say "master him and he'll be unstoppable" because against a master of a better character, chances are you will lose.

 

[Camera_Guy]

I don't think he would have super armor. (that would be good though)
He's a lightweight.

 

[Qbuilderz]

plus we don't know how much damage is needed to kill the pikmin, again, nothing can be said about it UNTIL we know that...

so firing along the bottom of the stage probably wouldn't kill them, if anything, the pikmin (if possible) would latch onto him. especially the red pikmin.

your argument has been renered practically useless.

 

[Itakio]

Firing along the bottom of the stage? Are you talking about Falco's lasers? We meant the stun would keep Olimar from plucking anything because he would be stopped every time by the lasers coming at him.

 

[Qbuilderz]

ooo

i thought you were talkin' about his up b aimed along the ground...never mind XD

 

[Coselm]

QBuilderz: Of course we don't know if Olimar's dependency on Pikmin will be a disadvantage. The point of this is jsut speculation. Don't flame in my thread when there are about 100 threads a day started in general brawl discussion about leakers and the sort.

On a side note, do you think there will be a cap as to how many pikmin you can have?

What if you have so many pikmin that when you do your tether recovery, you hang so low that you go below the stage's boundaries and die. That would be pretty funny.

More to the point, I am assuming that when you die, your Pikmin do not stick around. If I am incorrect, then Olimar would be a lot better than I am thinking. If I am right, then the best idea would probably be to either use your invincibility to score a KO, so you can pull out some pikmin, or just pull out some pikmin.

Do you guys think that Olimar's pluck will be as fast as peach's turnip thing, slower, or faster?

 

[Camera_Guy]

Way faster!

 

[Pyr0]

Coselm, PLEASE do some research before you say stupid random CRaAP!

We already have evidence that Pikmin Pluck and Throw are really fast and (throw at least) has little lag.

 

[Pkaz01]

It's not like he can't move without pikmin. It might be hard in tournaments but you can always jump pluck run jump pluck and repeat until you have enough to fight.

 

[Z1Pp]

maybe he isn't interrupted whilst plucking. But if he is you could pluck one throw it and pluck some more. On that video we saw it looked like donkey was binded in place as the pikmin were latched onto him. But saying that all Donkey Kong could do there is a simple down B.

 

[IllidR]

Wow. This is too early of speculation of already saying Olimar sucks. We don't know all of the properties of his attacks just yet. And yes, in competitive play most foes will be trying their best to keep Olimar at minimal Pikmin, but Olimar will most likely have ways to get out some more Pikmin while avoiding his foe. Olimar will be fine.

On a side note, do you think there will be a cap as to how many pikmin you can have?

Yes... it's six.

 

[Dragnil]

There probably are some moves that can gain olimar at least one or two pikmin, after that you should be able to get around five or six. Also what do you think will happen when the pikmin latch on to the person attacking you?: Will they get stunned every few seconds or so?If so then it would buy you time to pluck some more pikmin.

 

[Glinth]

If you look at the first picture in his special moves update, he's already plucking
a third pikmin before the other 2 hit the ground, so as you can see, he
plucks incredibly fast, so no worries <_<

 

[The Noob Legend]

He plucks them like Fox shoots his lasers.

Olimar will be a threat in competitive play because of his depth.

 

[AtticusFinch]

Olmar is going to be one of the most tactical charecters in Brawl. He's not going to be some pluck and chuck charecter. Your going to have to have a tactic for every charecter you face. And Im sure when you die, you pikmin will just stay there and it'll be hell getting back to them. So you'll do something like keep four out at a time, and when you die, pull out two to get to the others and so on. You'll have to make the most complex mind games, and have to time everything.

I have NOTHING to back that up, but Im sure it'll be something like that lol

 

[IllidR]

Olmar is going to be one of the most tactical charecters in Brawl. He's not going to be some pluck and chuck charecter. Your going to have to have a tactic for every charecter you face. And Im sure when you die, you pikmin will just stay there and it'll be hell getting back to them. So you'll do something like keep four out at a time, and when you die, pull out two to get to the others and so on. You'll have to make the most complex mind games, and have to time everything.

I have NOTHING to back that up, but Im sure it'll be something like that lol

I just had to say you have the best name ever! Can i be Scout? No no, Boo Radley.. I'm Boo Radley!

Anyway, continue with the discussion!

 

[Banjodorf]

Has it yet occured to anyone that while he plucks, he might have invincibility frames? Or possibly the pluck is yet faster than we think.

Saying he wont have any opportunity to pluck Pikmin that dont seem to take any time at all to pluck is naive.

Even in tournaments, the opponent is not attacking every minute of the fight, infact, an attack is laid down occasionally during fights, the majority of it is dodging and moving, but thats not the point. The point is that plucking wont be a problem. For a few reasons.

1. Sakurai knows about torunaments lol. Im also fairly certain he would design characters this time around, after witnessing various character flaws in Melee that made one better than the other. Im sure that he would not put Olimar in just as a "novel" character for show, that would be utterly stomped by someone like Sonic in the competitive scene.

2. It was stated that Olimar has some attacks that can be used without Pikmin. A skilled player, hell even a learning player, could figure out that if they needed to distance themsevles from foes to pluck Pikmin, they needed to make full use of Olimar's non-pikmin reliant attacks to gain the distance needed for plucking.

There you have it. Olimar is NOT completely helpless on his own, and will thusly not be a joke character in tourneys, because like I said, skilled Olimar players will be able to use his non-Pikmin attacks to their advantage.

I dislike threads like this. Why dont we leave things like this until Jan. 31st hmm? Is not time for this kind of useless speculation yet.

 

[kirkut]

what are your thoughts on how this may handicap Olimar as a character in competitive play?

Why not? maybe he starts whit him pikmins, and he can do atacks, not smash atacks or special atacks, but he can do atacks

 

[KingDaniel]

You can probably pull up 6 pikmin in 1 second. just pop pop pop pop pop pop. Also, the pikmin chain is not only for recovery, did you see the one picture where he is using it while on the stage. which can be REALLY handy as for it can shoot a huge length of whip at a enemy while they are in the air. You can make assumptions. They wouldn't make a mistake like that.

 

[HYRULESHERO42]

There is a good Olimar respawns with three Pikmin. It's like in his Dojo Profile 1 Red, 1 Blue, and 1 Yellow.

 

[Doomflame]

Hopefully his Pikmin pluck out superfast. I'm guessing you might start out with atleast 1. Just always leave atleast 1 pikmin with you so you can do smash attaks and stuff.

 

[joeysmash]

how can you idiots even think about this when no one has even played him yet.... shut up

 

[SirPainsalot]

Well, what HAS been confirmed is that his Pikmin pluck and throw is REALLY fast. Really fast. As shown in the commercial.

 

[spacemanspiff]

Well, we know that Olimar can not do a whole lot without his pikmin. And you have to pull the pikmin from the ground right?

Well when you are in a tournament, most people will not give you the chance to pull out a few pikmin, so you may be stuck with just one, or none, until you can pull off a KO or at least get your opponent out of your face for a little while.

I'm sure we will find ways around this, but what are your thoughts on how this may handicap Olimar as a character in competitive play?

i dunno man. i can see olimer having a whole bunch of glitches for some reason causing infinites. seems like too complex of a character to be flaw free. but i see where your coming from..if he pulls out pikmen at the same rate as he did in pikmen he'll be screwed

 

[Quarter]

He seems that he plucks his pikmen VERY fast.
So I don't really see that big of a problem.

 

[okor]

If yo uwatch a vid of a match starting with Olimar, he plucks his pikmin BEFORE it says go, so he gets his pikmin out before the match even starts.

If you watch this video http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=v2RB7Fj9g6U you can see that.

Also, he spawns fro ma KO with no pikmin, but his plucking IS very fast, it shows him plucking at 1:33.

 

[Coselm]

Ok... I just watched the vid. He pulls out pikmin really fast, and starts with 3 pikmin to boot.

That is intense...