Olimar. I have to say, I'm far from dissapointed.

[True Fool]

I was dreading this character for a long time. The whole time I was thinking "This stupid character is going to be in, and he's going to be boring and gimmicky." But I think I was way off. He looks like a very fun character to play as, and potentially a strong character. I love the way his Up-B works, and using those things for attacks looks really fun and good.

Was anyone else way off on their Olimar predictions?

 

[Itakio]

I never really thought about him, and now that I've seen him I'm disappointed. First of all, his Pikmin can be attacked, which is a very big deal, and I'm pretty sure you aren't going to just be able to pluck more Pikmin out. Why? Because a skilled opponent will be keeping the pressure on and using attacks that have hitboxes out for a while (neutral air anyone?) to hit Olimar and his Pikmin. In Melee, you never see a good Peach player pull out turnips when the other player is close, because the Peach player knows he/she will get attacked or grabbed or whatever. I think it'll be the same with Olimar, unless Brawl is a lot slower than Melee's advanced metagame.

Another thing about Olimar I don't like is that his other B-moves look really bad. First there's the Pikmin throw: I really don't think this will be very good. It doesn't sound like it has much range (like maybe half of the distance of FD or less), unless you're throwing a yellow one, but the chances of having one of those in the lead at the time is unlikely, and there isn't much you can do about it once you've realized that it isn't there. Anyway, if I were far enough away that you could throw one and have no consequence for the lag time, I think I'd have plenty of time just to hit jump and evade it. Any closer and I'd be able to jump regularly, and maybe even short hop and/or hit you afterward. Oh, and if you miss, I'm pretty sure that means those Pikmin won't be as much use to you as they probably won't be able to assist you in your up B recovery since they will be wandering around (now that I've jumped over it I'm close to you again, so calling them would get me a free hit). It really looks like one of those B moves that won't ever get used later on when the metagame evolves, like DK's down and side B, Fox's side B (not for recovery).

Speaking of recovery, I REALLY don't like Olimar's recovery from the way it's looking. First of all, let's just face it: you probably won't have 6 Pikmin at all times (if you need to recover, it probably means you are taking a beating anyway). Secondly, and most importantly, is what I made my own thread for. If your Pikmin can be attacked while in the chain, then Olimar will have some serious problems against edgeguarders. I can camp on the ledge and then drop down, double jump and attack your Pikmin and then use up B to get back to the ledge again. Even if you can't attack the Pikmin while the chain is there, it seems like it'd almost as easy to just go for Olimar who won't be that far away from the stage since you probably don't have six Pikmin.

The whistle move is a waste of space. Olimar is already at a disadvantage by having his Pikmin be able to be "unbound" from him at all.

My last concern is fighting without Pikmin. It looks like if Olimar runs out of Pikmin, he is completely screwed over. As in, he doesn't even have a fighting chance to survive. Just look at his limbs, they're so short and stubby! I'm gonna go ahead an guess that his range will suck without Pikmin. That means that now pretty much every other medium-fast character will be able to keep a barrage of attacks going, and as long as they don't stop for too long, Olimar won't really do anything about it.

There's one more thing I'd like to point out about Olimar.

Everybody looked at this image and thought their problems were gone. However, I look at it like this: sure, Olimar may pluck fast, but look how long it takes them to touch the ground (thus be usable)! If somehow you get away from my relentless strikes and pull out a Pikmin, you still have the same dilemma for about another whole second or two, which is just enough time for me to get you into the air again so I can finish you off, or continue to combo you.

 

[Xarias]

Olimar seems like he'll be a very offense-minded character. Why? Because his defensive game looks like it sucks, so his best defense would HAVE to be a good offense.

You'd have to knock your opponent away, pull some more Pikmin, and keep the pressure on. If they manage to turn the tide back on you, that might be a stock right there.

 

[Cranberry Rogue]

I don't see Olimar being an offensive character at all. He's going to have to utilize his small stature like crazy in order to duck and dodge between attacks. Even if he finds an opening in the enemy's defense, chances are that he is going to use that time to pluck out another Pikmin or two instead of attacking. I'm thinking that he'll most likely attack in bits and pieces, as opposed to fighting aggressively.

But yeah, back on topic; I figured Olimar would be an awesome character from the start. I didn't, however, realize how complex he would be.

 

[Gerudo Warrior]

cool! good for you!

 

[Cranberry Rogue]

Thank you.

 

[Tatanga4Brawl]

Olimar rox! So does Tatanga!!!!
I want to try him. 20 more updates...

 

[Smashbros_7]

I never really thought about him, and now that I've seen him I'm disappointed. First of all, his Pikmin can be attacked, which is a very big deal, and I'm pretty sure you aren't going to just be able to pluck more Pikmin out. Why? Because a skilled opponent will be keeping the pressure on and using attacks that have hitboxes out for a while (neutral air anyone?) to hit Olimar and his Pikmin. In Melee, you never see a good Peach player pull out turnips when the other player is close, because the Peach player knows he/she will get attacked or grabbed or whatever. I think it'll be the same with Olimar, unless Brawl is a lot slower than Melee's advanced metagame.

Another thing about Olimar I don't like is that his other B-moves look really bad. First there's the Pikmin throw: I really don't think this will be very good. It doesn't sound like it has much range (like maybe half of the distance of FD or less), unless you're throwing a yellow one, but the chances of having one of those in the lead at the time is unlikely, and there isn't much you can do about it once you've realized that it isn't there. Anyway, if I were far enough away that you could throw one and have no consequence for the lag time, I think I'd have plenty of time just to hit jump and evade it. Any closer and I'd be able to jump regularly, and maybe even short hop and/or hit you afterward. Oh, and if you miss, I'm pretty sure that means those Pikmin won't be as much use to you as they probably won't be able to assist you in your up B recovery since they will be wandering around (now that I've jumped over it I'm close to you again, so calling them would get me a free hit). It really looks like one of those B moves that won't ever get used later on when the metagame evolves, like DK's down and side B, Fox's side B (not for recovery).

Speaking of recovery, I REALLY don't like Olimar's recovery from the way it's looking. First of all, let's just face it: you probably won't have 6 Pikmin at all times (if you need to recover, it probably means you are taking a beating anyway). Secondly, and most importantly, is what I made my own thread for. If your Pikmin can be attacked while in the chain, then Olimar will have some serious problems against edgeguarders. I can camp on the ledge and then drop down, double jump and attack your Pikmin and then use up B to get back to the ledge again. Even if you can't attack the Pikmin while the chain is there, it seems like it'd almost as easy to just go for Olimar who won't be that far away from the stage since you probably don't have six Pikmin.

The whistle move is a waste of space. Olimar is already at a disadvantage by having his Pikmin be able to be "unbound" from him at all.

My last concern is fighting without Pikmin. It looks like if Olimar runs out of Pikmin, he is completely screwed over. As in, he doesn't even have a fighting chance to survive. Just look at his limbs, they're so short and stubby! I'm gonna go ahead an guess that his range will suck without Pikmin. That means that now pretty much every other medium-fast character will be able to keep a barrage of attacks going, and as long as they don't stop for too long, Olimar won't really do anything about it.

There's one more thing I'd like to point out about Olimar.

Everybody looked at this image and thought their problems were gone. However, I look at it like this: sure, Olimar may pluck fast, but look how long it takes them to touch the ground (thus be usable)! If somehow you get away from my relentless strikes and pull out a Pikmin, you still have the same dilemma for about another whole second or two, which is just enough time for me to get you into the air again so I can finish you off, or continue to combo you.

You really don't like pikmin do you? And if you played any pikmin game you'd know that pikmin go FAR(this is adjustable) and FAST(with NO lag time) when thrown and attack the person they're on relentlessly until they're attacked off. Of course while your opponent is concentrating on that Olimar can pluck and throw even more pikmin(Pikmin defend Olimar as he's plucking). So I suggest that you should stop trolling and go play Pikmin 1 AND 2.

 

[Wiseguy]

I was dreading this character for a long time. The whole time I was thinking "This stupid character is going to be in, and he's going to be boring and gimmicky." But I think I was way off. He looks like a very fun character to play as, and potentially a strong character. I love the way his Up-B works, and using those things for attacks looks really fun and good.

Was anyone else way off on their Olimar predictions?

Having read Vali's eerily accurate Olimar moveset (it was on the first page of the Olimar support thread for a long while) I wasn't so much surpruised as awestruck by his sheer awesome.

*stuff*

We can't tell how good or bad a character is by still screens, so I think you should reserve judgment. He does, however, look like an EXTREMELY fun character to use, which is all I really care about.

 

[Itakio]

You really don't like pikmin do you? And if you played any pikmin game you'd know that pikmin go FAR(this is adjustable) and FAST(with NO lag time) when thrown and attack the person they're on relentlessly until they're attacked off. Of course while your opponent is concentrating on that Olimar can pluck and throw even more pikmin(Pikmin defend Olimar as he's plucking). So I suggest that you should stop trolling and go play Pikmin 1 AND 2.

I don't hate Olimar as a character, I just really don't think he'll do as good as everyone thinks, and I felt a detailed post would convince people more than a few lines.

You can't compare small details like those to the actual game. Look at Link's spin attack, for example. In the game, his spin attack lasted for about half of a second, but in Melee, it lasted well over one. I'm sure there are many other things that shared the same.

 

[Neiteio]

Don't worry about Pikmin & Olimar

Itakio, there are some unknown factors that may render your concerns null and void:

- Olimar might have invincibility frames while plucking Pikmin, similar to how Ike is flinch-proof during Aether's start-up. Thus, an opponent couldn't hit Olimar to stop him from plucking Pikmin.

- Olimar's short and stubby limbs might swell up in size when punching and kicking, similar to Mario, Wario and other cartoony characters, thus solving the attack-range issue.

- The Pikmin may be more durable and aggressive than we think, and while there's no hard rule that Brawl's dynamics have to match that of the source game, chances are the Pikmin are thrown far and fast.

- The Pikmin Chain might have invincibility frames for the Pikmin.

Trust Sakurai to make the character work. Olimar was by far the most obvious addition to Brawl -- he's the star of the only major new Miyamoto franchise since Melee's release -- and as such he was likely one of the first newcomers conceived by Sakurai at the start of Brawl's development. It's conjecture, of course, but chances are they've been working on Olimar for a while.

- N

 

[Smash Ninja]

Itakio, there are some unknown factors that may render your concerns null and void:

- Olimar might have invincibility frames while plucking Pikmin, similar to how Ike is flinch-proof during Aether's start-up. Thus, an opponent couldn't hit Olimar to stop him from plucking Pikmin.

- Olimar's short and stubby limbs might swell up in size when punching and kicking, similar to Mario, Wario and other cartoony characters, thus solving the attack-range issue.

- The Pikmin may be more durable and aggressive than we think, and while there's no hard rule that Brawl's dynamics have to match that of the source game, chances are the Pikmin are thrown far and fast.

- The Pikmin Chain might have invincibility frames for the Pikmin.

Trust Sakurai to make the character work. Olimar was by far the most obvious addition to Brawl -- he's the star of the only major new Miyamoto franchise since Melee's release -- and as such he was likely one of the first newcomers conceived by Sakurai at the start of Brawl's development. It's conjecture, of course, but chances are they've been working on Olimar for a while.

- N

I agree with everyhting here. Sakurai wants balance, so this is the way to do it. Its logical, its not broken (well, maybe the invincibility frames whilst plucking ), and it would just WORK.

Have faith!

 

[Itakio]

- Olimar might have invincibility frames while plucking Pikmin, similar to how Ike is flinch-proof during Aether's start-up. Thus, an opponent couldn't hit Olimar to stop him from plucking Pikmin.
I didn't think about that. It could be very helpful to Olimar if this is true. However, it doesn't stop opponents from grabbing him out of it.

- Olimar's short and stubby limbs might swell up in size when punching and kicking, similar to Mario, Wario and other cartoony characters, thus solving the attack-range issue.
Maybe. I'd think they would only get wider, not longer. Look at these two images of Mario, one with a leg swelled up, fully extended, and the other extended, but not swelled up. They look roughly the same length (the swelled one is only a bit longer).
Swelled
Not swelled

- The Pikmin may be more durable and aggressive than we think, and while there's no hard rule that Brawl's dynamics have to match that of the source game, chances are the Pikmin are thrown far and fast.
I was thinking the Pikmin would be similar to the Goombas and Koopas in Melee's adventure mode. Only a few health points but can attack you if you let them. Of course, nobody knows for sure.

- The Pikmin Chain might have invincibility frames for the Pikmin.
I know the Pikmin may have them, but I'm almost certain Olimar will be attackable.

 

[Pyr0]

@ Itakio

You THINK but really know nothing.

So how can you even affirm he will suck...

Please get some hardcore evidence before you go posting random guesses, otherwise you just look like a noob who doesn't have a clue about what he is talking about.

 

[Meta_Sonic64]

I don't hate Olimar as a character, I just really don't think he'll do as good as everyone thinks, and I felt a detailed post would convince people more than a few lines.

You can't compare small details like those to the actual game. Look at Link's spin attack, for example. In the game, his spin attack lasted for about half of a second, but in Melee, it lasted well over one. I'm sure there are many other things that shared the same.

You post doesn't convince me at all. Seeing as Olimar's playing style is a "strategic mastermind", you'll have to develop strategies while on the run from your opponent. You'll evade your opponent, while attacking at the same time. You put this to perfection and you should honestly have no problem.

 

[Itakio]

"Just be perfect and you won't have a problem." XP

I think you're focusing too much on what Olimar can be doing and not enough on what your opponent can be doing to stop you. If you're making a comparison where the Olimar player has great strategical thinking, then you also need to assume that your opponent has quite a bit of knowledge and strategical ability as well.

I don't expect anyone to agree with me, but what I have posted is just a prediction of how Olimar will play.

 

[Meta_Sonic64]

"Just be perfect and you won't have a problem." XP

I think you're focusing too much on what Olimar can be doing and not enough on what your opponent can be doing to stop you. If you're making a comparison where the Olimar player has great strategical thinking, then you also need to assume that your opponent has quite a bit of knowledge and strategical ability as well.

I don't expect anyone to agree with me, but what I have posted is just a prediction of how Olimar will play.

The point of being a strategic mastermind is to know/figure out your opponent and develop a quick and easy strategy while on the run from them. By doing this you can then switch to attack mode. Throw Pikmin that can latch onto opponents, then move in with standard and smash attacks. Whith that not, only are you doing dmg, but the Pikmin attached are doing dmg while your opponent is flying away from you. There's many things that can happen. You assuming Olimar will be bad, based on screenshots and simple words, isn't really convincing in my mind.

 

[Weruop]

Itakio, i think your problem is that you are only looking at what you THINK are flaws.

 

[Meta_Sonic64]

He's not looking at the possible advantages or any good points. He just assumes the opponent will always have an edge which I highly disagree with.

 

[freetyme]

I have to say I am not dissapointed either (especially with the move update) Only one of his B moves does damage--the side B I believe-- but its mentioned that he can't even do Smash attacks without Pikmin. A lot of strategies will come of Olimar, especially with varyying probability of pikmin depending on stage, and the advantage/disadvantage system.
I'm very interested in finding out if Olimar respawns, or starts out, with any Pikmin with him. Maybe starting with 3 would allow him to come out swinging but allow you to pick more Pikmin if you choose.
With the two updates I've seen on Captain Olimar he's one of my favorite new comers (my other obviously being Sonic, my two favorite veterans are Mario and Kirby). We'll see what his final Smash is like soon enough I hope. Strategic play will defenetly be a must with Olimar. As a moderately casual player, no tournaments or anything here, it should be really interesting playing with friends using him.

 

[GildedPunch]

can't wait to play olimar!

nice sig pyro!

 

[Davy Jones]

In these sitiuations, we need a demo or a trailer.

 

[courte]

i knew/know i was/am going to enjoy it regardless
------------------------------
new JP commercial up on youtube search for the poster AnimeEater2
yes it has olimar action

 

[Pluvia's other account]

He didn't look bad in the advert, infact, he actually looked quite good.

 

[Meta_Sonic64]

In these sitiuations, we need a demo or a trailer.

Even if we get a demo, Olimar won't be in it. Now trailer is another story

 

[Khopstix]

Olimar is going to be much better than most people are thinking. First off when you have a pikmin on somebody they lose health over time which gives Olimar the time to move around with damage still building. Secondly we dont even know how fast he moves and that would make a big difference in the pikmin plucking. As for his A moves we know nothing about them so we cant say how strong he is without the pikmin.

Pikmin and Olimar Ftw