Official Matchup Help Thread

[Maraphy]

I've been seeing a lot of these threads.... so we are now going to compile them all into this one single topic for accessability and convienience.

If you have any trouble with a certain character and want advice, post here.

Also, since getting a response from someone may take a while, in addition to making this a topic to ask for advice, I'm going to compile an organized list here of quotes that contain most of the information stated so that you can simply look it up withought having to ask. (Although, if you still need more tips I encourage you to ask) Eventually this will turn into a big hub of advice for anyone having trouble.

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Your strategy is to counter what the other Kirby is trying to counter onto what you're trying to counter that Kirby with...... (Campier Kirby wins... W00T)
-Cereal Rabbit

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As much as people say that he's one of the worst match ups for Marth, he really isn't >_>. In fact Marth mostly has the disadvantage cause your a really small target and most of Marth's knockback and power comes from tipping, which is hard since Kirby height and length wise isn't that big.

As Kirby, you'd really have to be a certain and almost an exact distance from where Marth is standing to get tipped by his forward smash which can kill at 50% on the first try if you aren't careful. Tipping from his forward air isn't that bad if you're on the ground and you could easily punish Marth by blocking since he has to use his f-air when he's about to hit the ground. Marth's recovery is easy to edge guard cause if you can get a back air on him when he's off the stage and he's already done his midair jump, there's a low chance he'll make it back on stage and you can just grab the edge at the right time to stop marth from grabbing the edge.
-Plasmaexe

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The tail on PK thunder is a lot bigger than it was in Melee and it goes faster than Lucas's so it's a bit harder to dodge. You could try rolling it and even if the tail hits you, you can go after Ness and hit him if he's still controlling the thunder. Fast falling while air-dodging also works if you're trying to get back on stage and Kirby has a good enough recovery to do that, plus multiple jumps which make it possible to air dodge many times in the air. An easier solution would be to guard it, but you probably won't be able to punish Ness after unless you're close enough to him, which I wouldn't see why he'd do that when you're up-close.

Though if you're talking about PK Bodyslam (lol that's what I call it ><), just guard it and punish him after that with a smash or grab. If he's not under the edge or in range of meteor smashing with Kirbys Down air or you are not next to him at all in the air, do NOT go after him cause he can easily kill you at 50% and he performs that a lot faster than he ever did in Melee, plus it's more deadly.
-Plasmaexe

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Man this guy is nuts, best camper in the game powerful etc. However Kirby can take advantge of the fact that most of his attacks are ranged, being the small target he is. However at the same time be careful and if you must keep your distance until you find an opening to attack. Olimar is powerful in many ways but close combat is his weakness keep the pressure on Olimar and don't give him a chance to attack. If you can try to Juggle Olimar and keep him in the air for that is where he is weakest, try to set it up so you can use your hammer on him to knock him over the edge and then just edgehog him so he can't get back on. However this does not put you at an advantage if you leave yourself open Olimar can chuck his pikmin at you to rack up damage, and if you're clumsy or predictable in your approach he can simply ken kombo you until your easy pikings to take out with a down or F-Smash. Just watch yourself keep track of what pikmin's next in line for him (as it could help you predict his pattern* of attack) and don't keep to close for too long.


*Red Pikmin usually are used for smash attacks and are dangeous.
Yellow Pikmin can paralize you and are deadly mid-air.
Blue Pikmin grant Olimar the strongest trows in the game bar none and are usually used to start up comobs.
Purple Pikmin are melons huge hitboxs and are very deadly when used for spiking and smashing generally used for down-smashes.
White Pikmin WATCH OUT FOR THESE if Olimar side-b's one of these at you dodge or kill them imediatly they deal a whopping 54% if they complete their attack despite this they are rare and are devastating when used mid air Dodge them at all costs.

Oh I forgot the pikmin rarity from most common to rarist goes like this Red>Blue>Yellow>Purple>White the average and troop of pikmin will consist of 1-2Blues/Reds, 1 Yellow, 1 Purple and 0-1 White Pikmin.
-Blade Knight

Just want to add a note about this, don't let your opponent onto the fact that you're trying to predict his attacks from the pikmen he has. A good Olimar player will try to switch things up (As in throwing red and yellow pikmen, grabbing with purple pikmen, etc), so always keep your guard up as to what he's going to do.

Also, Olimar's up-smash is one of the most ****-tastic smashes in the game. Don't attack him from above.
-Clai

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Squirtle: Nothing

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What you got to watch out with samus are a few things, Her screw ball attack, her down A in the air and of course her gun.

First of all, Kirby is a very aerial player. so you got to watch out for that screw ball attack. Though it doesnt have a gigantic knock back it will just layer damage on you fast. Especially when your edgegaurding, dont go in for the screw kick, its possible to pull it off but its most likely youll get hit with the screw attack unintentionally just but being in the wrong place. Samus isnt aiming for you, your just in the way of her recovery. Usually down B is pretty good off the map so make your self comfortable with falling fast off the map and getting out of Down B and recovering safetly.

Also, make note that her aerial down A has a meteor effect. even at 40% watch out for this off the map, hell even at 0% its quite a threat. Just make sure your not under her while off the map. the best way to handel this is either air dodge through her and try to Wall of pain her or anything else you think may work, just play around with it. Basicly the sides of samus are the best places to be.

Lastly, Her lazers can be a problem. dont be afraid to let her charge up. This could be quite her undoing, but you have an advantage, your very small. An uncharged lazer will go right above you if you duck. you can even dodge. But when she cracks off the big one, just roll through it (not away!) and go for a grab or antyhing you got in your arsenal. Dont be afraid to provoke her in doing so, cause a good samas is gonna hang onto the charge and hit you with it at the right moment, so be on your toes to roll through it.

thats all i cna think of right now. just remeber to be on the side of her in the air when you attack, make good use of the air dodge, be ware of her screw attack and down aerial A and dont be afraid to steal her power and use it against her!
~┼Syn┼~(Synerate)

The key to Samus is to not let her advancing tricks work on you. Most of the time, a good Samus will slowly advance with missles and charge shots. For this situation, just jump over them (Airdodging if you need to) and get right in there. Samus doesn't like to fight up close a lot, so she will try to run. Follow her again and use Kirby's better hand-to-hand combat.

Also, there is a variation of this tactic, that you do NOT want to fall for. Samus will charge up her charge shot, and then use that missle-advancing technique I told you, and they'll use maybe 3-5 missles, and then throw a charge shot. WHAM! It's hard to see coming! So be on your toes, and always be aware if she has a charge shot when she is missle-advancing you. If you can evade it, then she will either be forced to redo the whole thing, or pick a different strategy.

Another kind of Samus likes to camp her missles at the side of the stage. She'll jump up and do that Triple-missle or whatever it's called. If this happens, do not jump into the air, because that is just giving her more influence over you. Instead, stay to the ground, because most of the time, they won't realize you aren't jumping, and they will continue jumping into the air sending missles to nowhere. So, just get in close, and dodge-roll the missles that come to you. Again, be wary of the charge shot. Once you get close to her, it's likely she'll either run, or try to rack up damage on you and then smash you to the other side of the stage. Just keep following her.

Also, one more note I have to make. Stay close to the ground during this fight, because Samus is tricky in the air. She has a nasty meteor smash that you want to avoid, and when you're above her she can rack up damage with the screw attack. Another thing, if you are coming at her from below with an attack, sometimes she will use a screw attack to avoid it. This is mainly for annoyance. If she does this, use your jumps and U-air the heck out of her.
-Maraphy

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I had trouble with sonic at first too, but he's actually pretty easy. If the user has a personal joy for spinning around stage nonstoped, inhale can take priority over the spin. Also, vs a soni player, shiled spam a bit more than dodgeing. It's more effective to just block against sonic when he spins all over the place. Kirby shines vs Sonic at close range, so when you get the chance, jump in there and let him have it! If he rolls into your inhale, and you see it fit, you can kirbycide, sonic has high jump ability though so I wouldn't sugjest trying to spit him out and recover, mash the jump button in case he escpaes though. (have to give credit to the other kirby mains that gave me this help vs sonic )
-Jester Kirby

The most dangerous kind of Sonic is a spazzy Sonic. By this, I mean the kind of Sonic that runs back and forth, run-attacking you on each pass-by. If you jump, he'll use side-B and jump out of it to smack you; if you stay on the ground you're pretty much dead. Inhaling him is utterly useless; yay you get a crappy attack with more startup lag than the Hammer OR the Stone! The only possible excuse for eating Sonic is to help recovery on stages like FD where Kirby can continually use the B move to stick to the bottom of the stage.

His only decent kill moves, even for the light Kirby, are his FSmash and his USmash right next to the edge. When fighting near an edge, AVOID HIS USMASH LIKE THE PLAGUE! It has little startup lag, covers his entire body in a hitbox, and can sometimes spike you over the edge. Sonic's FSmash has deceptive range, ESPECIALLY if your opponent knows how to stutter step - watch out for that.

Seems pretty bleak, right? Wrong. Sonic is, however good he may seem, inherently flawed. He has VERY low priority; and his hitboxes are for the most part very small since most of his attacks focus on his ball form. Aside from the two moves I mentioned; he has very little killing potential. His throws SUCK. Royally. His grab range, however, is huge thanks to his sliding - you're likely to get grabbed a lot.

If you get a "spazzy" Sonic, you have two options. You can use an aireal approach with liberal use of airdodging, or you can fsmash him out of his run attack. This is the best option - lands one of Kirby's kill moves with little risk, because it comes out fast and has decent priority. Hammer is best used after a Fthrow at the start of each stock; then never again - Sonic moves too fast to be hit by it. Same with stone, for that matter. Final Cutter is slightly more useful - if you miss with the swing the projectile is still useful; and at the least it'll force him into the air or into a shield, which will end his running temporarily and give you time to reach him.

Finally, a quick note - NEVER knock Sonic upwards diagonally if you can help it, and if you can't get a guaranteed kill. He'll recover every single time with a side-B to the stage. That thing moves REALLY far in the air.
-Trexxen

Toon Link is top tier. He is the best camper in this game, his aerials protect his body like a shield, and his smashes are quick and painful. I will be suggesting ways to fight him, but I want to reiterate that Toon Link has the advantage this battle and it will take some serious mindgames to overcome him.

First, there's the campy Toon Link that doesn't know how to fight up close, but makes up for it by guaranteeing that the other guy never gets to approach him. This type of fighter isn't too bad because Kirby is one of those characters that can get past the barrage of projectiles and get at him. Due to its tiny frame, Kirby only has to worry about the eight inches of roundness getting hit by projectiles, and fortunately that can be protected by aerials. Cancel out arrows and boomerangs with f-airs or b-airs, or simply spot-dodge them or short-hop air dodge. Jump and airdodge TL's bombs, and press A when you do so to try and catch them. Nothing throws off a camper's game more than getting attacked with projectiles.

When you're up close, take notice about what your enemy does. Down-smashes can be jumped over and follwed up with f-airs. Rolling can be beat by good reflexes and tech-chasing. Spot-dodging can be controlled by grabbing, any grab works at this point since you can't follow up your down throws before he has a chance to counter attack. Sheild the first hit of his foward smash and try to roll behind himbetween hits; this is the most punishable technique TL has and if you can catch him trying to use the second hit, smash him be all circumstances. If Toon Link is in the air, try to bait him into a d-air and then dodge to a side and try to punish the attack. Fighting him in the air is a dangerous ordeal, though, as all of his other aerials come out quickly and use that dang disjointed hitboxes of his. As in the Zelda match-up, fighting him from below is the best way to go, as TL users know that d-air can be punished, and they won't use it unless they think they will hit you.

I forgot to mention, you want to swallow Toon Link in this matchup. Get back at the projectile camper by shooting arrows right at him. And his recovery isn't too hard to edgeguard. If he has to use his up-B (after using the d-air recovery o_O), you can d-air him right above his head. It may take some tries to get him down, but the success of meteoring him is a sweet one. Of course, you can go, "the heck with this" and Kirbycide him after he used up his jumps. Then it just gets funny and throws off the match on unimaginable levels.
-Clai

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Wolf's lasers are the most broken attack in the game. They do at least 5% to you every time, they cannot be cancelled out by any of Kirby's attacks (Only bombs and such can cancel them), and the bayonet gun thing makes it even more damaging up close. The worst part of it- you won't have any help if you swallow Wolf and take his lasers because his reflector turns back lasers at twice the speed and twice the power. So in this matchup, save the inhalation for Kirbycides. Stay to the ground, spotdodge, roll, short-hop air dodge, do anything that can prevent you from getting hit by the lasers.

In hand-tp-hand combat, Wolf's f-smash outranges you, so keep an eye for it and try to roll behind it. Remember, nost attacks have no recovery in this game, and even if it misses/gets shielded, it can come right to an AAA combo (this is for further ranting). You want to create enough spacing that his foward smash can miss, while you can approach him with an aerial or your own f-smash. You can approach Wolf from above because unlike Zelda, Toon Link, Marth or Olimar, Wolf does not have a retardedly powerful upsmash. It actually is punishable, so try and bait him into an upsmash and then attack him. I'm not sure about his tilts or down-smash, but I think his down-smash is one of those sweeping ones, so just jump over it and aerial attack him. Wolf is also one of the fastest falling guys out there (that's not saying much in this game), so you can chaingrab him with your down throw or rack up damage with up-tilts.

I can't say how powerful Wolf's aerials are, but I know that uair kills at around 120%, while fair kills off the top at similar percents. However, the range of these attacks is short, so go get him in the air. It will be better for you to go either in front of him or below him, as Wolf's fair is really short and his dair takes some startup time. In regards of his b-side and b-up attacks, they are hard to punish initially, but once you take the time to find your sweetspot, Wolf will be easy pickings for edgeguarding. Added mention: short recoveries means easy Kirbycide
-Clai

Wolf's down smash comes out insanely quick and his forward smash could easily follow it up if you're still close enough to him. If you manage to block his F-smash, but he's ends up still in front of you, get away or shield grab him if you're able to. If he ends up behind you, immediately down smash.

Tripping wolf does help quite a bit if you can pull that off and if he's getting back on stage, predict where he's going to be when he uses his Forward-B and use rock, or meteor smash him with your drill kick if you can. The best way to approach a laser spamming/camping Wolf is to fly toward him while air dodging, but have your back faced towards him so you can back air and find the right time to back air him cause if he ends up block you, he'll pretty much get a free attack on you pretty much x_x. Clearly I think the hardest match up I've come across a little below Snake >__>.
-Plasmaexe

Yoshi isn't too bad, he has some lag after his B+Down move, so if you shield that, grab him or smash works well in my yoshi fights. Watch his tackle though, recovery is easy though b/c he can't really chase you in the air.
-Jester Kirby

Try and get a grab early for early chain grabbing damage. Then space your back airs and play hit and run(This works too well in this game). Just hit him with back air, then space far enough so he can't counter attack. He might try and grab when you land, so be sure to spot dodge a lot when you land. :O
when he double jumps, try and follow him through his double jump and hit him when it ends.
-Laijin

Zelda...my oh my zelda. To those who havent fought this char yet. Be warned. This will be by far one of your hardest challenges ever. T_T

Zelda seemed like crap compared to melee but be warned: she is gonna be a counter to everything kirby does. Be very careful of her U-smash. That takes priority over all but kirby's down-B attack. DO NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES TRY TO ATTACK HER FROM ABOVE. Also, her forward-B is a trap. Not only is it hard to dodge but will set you up for many different attacks once you land. The plan here is dodge dodge dodge. Wait for a moment to either grab, D-smash, or B-air. I extremely recommend making this a ground game as trying to fight in the air will get rack up an extraordinary amount of dmg to you. There will be a time where she will try a d-smash. That is your opportunity to attack. Either use a d-smash after dodging or a f-smash after blocking. Also, her F-smash is a counter to kirby's b-air and f-air. Also neutral-A is also a good way of racking up some dmg, but DONT spam this. There will be a time where you will dodge her U-smash and youll wanna hit. Dont try it. Either grab or move the hell out of the way. She can consecutively spam this attack and it will hit you if you try to attack her. Her U-smash is killer. It can hit you going toward her or trying to pre-emptively dodge. STAY AWAY FROM IT at all costs.
-SmileyStation

There are some pretty good Zelda players I've played out there and she is kinda hard for me, but she isn't the hardest ><. Don't forget Zelda's a light weight and she is a big enough target to land many hits in the air with Kirby when she's getting back on stage.

Rock, into back air or air dodge really helps cause they'll try going after you to grab you and you could back air them, though just don't get dins fired upon since that thing damages like crazy ><. You're just going to have to be good at dodging Dins fire, I really recommend just air dodging them and approach her by flying in the air, air dodging over and over since Kirby has so many jumps that he can continously do that and end with a back air.

If you're going to fight her in the air, just don't get sweet spotted and let her stay on top of you, but don't stay over her head either unless you're going to use rock on her. Primarily if you can, you should try KOing her with your F-smash or Down smash if they try rolling next to you or behind you since both of those can easily kill her at around 80% +.
-Plasmaexe

Din's Fire sucks. It has such a huge hitbox now and it has no startup time after Zelda pinpoints the location. If you're on the ground and she's using Din's Fire on you, I suggest running towards her and then rolling when the fire is almost at your body. It should avoid the massive hitrange and give you less distance to cover when you try to get in melee range. It's important to know where your opponent likes to taget these flameballs- most of the time they will try to aim it right at you, which you can airdodge to get past it. Be careful of mind games, though.

If you want to attack her in the air, you want to stay below Zelda. Her up-air is nastily fast and kills off the top extremely easy, and everyone knows what happens when you get a sweetspotted f-air or b-air in the face. Zelda's down-air does have a sweetspot now, but it's harder to connect with that than with her side-airs and your up-air outreaches her sweetspot. Try to chain up-airs together to get some combos on her, the stale-move negation will allow you to use it multiple times if you get the timing right.

This mindgame I recommend on all levels, but it can be incredibly effective against Zelda: Approach her and then... stand there. Dodge her Din's fires, but don't attack. Zelda is one of the most defensive-oriented fighters in this game, any aggressive approach will be swallowed up by her smashes. Let her come to you, and take advantage of any recovery time that she has to use after her attacks. Then you can follow up and get aggressive again, but make sure to get her airborne because her smash attacks are so much more dangerous than her aerials (but even those present problems... I don't understand how she got so good.)
-Clai

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FILL IT UP! >=D

 

[Rass1618]

kirbies perfect and i have no problems vs any char, LOLOLOL alright ill go ahead and start the thread off, i got a slight problem i'll ask about, when i play my friend who uses ness alot, i like to use aerials alot, in fact im practicly never on the ground, but whenever i give him a chance he uses up b and is very good with it, even if i air dodge he still gets me, and if i stone it just hits me, then he gets out of the up b lag, normally i try to do my up b, but alot of time he hits me anyways, any suggestions, besides stay out of the air lol

 

[Plasmaexe]

kirbies perfect and i have no problems vs any char, LOLOLOL alright ill go ahead and start the thread off, i got a slight problem i'll ask about, when i play my friend who uses ness alot, i like to use aerials alot, in fact im practicly never on the ground, but whenever i give him a chance he uses up b and is very good with it, even if i air dodge he still gets me, and if i stone it just hits me, then he gets out of the up b lag, normally i try to do my up b, but alot of time he hits me anyways, any suggestions, besides stay out of the air lol

The tail on PK thunder is a lot bigger than it was in Melee and it goes faster than Lucas's so it's a bit harder to dodge. You could try rolling it and even if the tail hits you, you can go after Ness and hit him if he's still controlling the thunder. Fast falling while air-dodging also works if you're trying to get back on stage and Kirby has a good enough recovery to do that, plus multiple jumps which make it possible to air dodge many times in the air. An easier solution would be to guard it, but you probably won't be able to punish Ness after unless you're close enough to him, which I wouldn't see why he'd do that when you're up-close.

Though if you're talking about PK Bodyslam (lol that's what I call it ><), just guard it and punish him after that with a smash or grab. If he's not under the edge or in range of meteor smashing with Kirbys Down air or you are not next to him at all in the air, do NOT go after him cause he can easily kill you at 50% and he performs that a lot faster than he ever did in Melee, plus it's more deadly.

 

[Jester Kirby]

First rule of battle is know thy enemy. My friend from school and I want to play against each other in a competitive match. I'v never played him before, but as far as I know he wasnt a torny player. He uses Olimar, and I'v never really played against Olimar. So can anyone give me some info about how to fight him with Kirby and how well the odds are in this matchup?

 

[Laijin]

yoshi....
huh?
sonic

 

[Plasmaexe]

ahh I'm quoted as Ninten ><. (oh that guy from Mother 0) =o

 

[Jester Kirby]

yoshi....
huh?
sonic

I had trouble with sonic at first too, but he's actually pretty easy. If the user has a personal joy for spinning around stage nonstoped, inhale can take priority over the spin. Also, vs a soni player, shiled spam a bit more than dodgeing. It's more effective to just block against sonic when he spins all over the place. Kirby shines vs Sonic at close range, so when you get the chance, jump in there and let him have it! If he rolls into your inhale, and you see it fit, you can kirbycide, sonic has high jump ability though so I wouldn't sugjest trying to spit him out and recover, mash the jump button in case he escpaes though. (have to give credit to the other kirby mains that gave me this help vs sonic )

Yoshi isn't too bad, he has some lag after his B+Down move, so if you shield that, grab him or smash works well in my yoshi fights. Watch his tackle though, recovery is easy though b/c he can't really chase you in the air.

hope that helps

 

[SmileyStation]

Zelda...my oh my zelda. To those who havent fought this char yet. Be warned. This will be by far one of your hardest challenges ever. T_T

Zelda seemed like crap compared to melee but be warned: she is gonna be a counter to everything kirby does. Be very careful of her U-smash. That takes priority over all but kirby's down-B attack. DO NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES TRY TO ATTACK HER FROM ABOVE. Also, her forward-B is a trap. Not only is it hard to dodge but will set you up for many different attacks once you land. The plan here is dodge dodge dodge. Wait for a moment to either grab, D-smash, or B-air. I extremely recommend making this a ground game as trying to fight in the air will get rack up an extraordinary amount of dmg to you. There will be a time where she will try a d-smash. That is your opportunity to attack. Either use a d-smash after dodging or a f-smash after blocking. Also, her F-smash is a counter to kirby's b-air and f-air. Also neutral-A is also a good way of racking up some dmg, but DONT spam this. There will be a time where you will dodge her U-smash and youll wanna hit. Dont try it. Either grab or move the hell out of the way. She can consecutively spam this attack and it will hit you if you try to attack her. Her U-smash is killer. It can hit you going toward her or trying to pre-emptively dodge. STAY AWAY FROM IT at all costs.

 

[Plasmaexe]

There are some pretty good Zelda players I've played out there and she is kinda hard for me, but she isn't the hardest ><. Don't forget Zelda's a light weight and she is a big enough target to land many hits in the air with Kirby when she's getting back on stage.

Rock, into back air or air dodge really helps cause they'll try going after you to grab you and you could back air them, though just don't get dins fired upon since that thing damages like crazy ><. You're just going to have to be good at dodging Dins fire, I really recommend just air dodging them and approach her by flying in the air, air dodging over and over since Kirby has so many jumps that he can continously do that and end with a back air.

If you're going to fight her in the air, just don't get sweet spotted and let her stay on top of you, but don't stay over her head either unless you're going to use rock on her. Primarily if you can, you should try KOing her with your F-smash or Down smash if they try rolling next to you or behind you since both of those can easily kill her at around 80% +.

 

[Clai]

Zelda is a pain

I wanted to add my own points about Zelda:
Din's Fire sucks. It has such a huge hitbox now and it has no startup time after Zelda pinpoints the location. If you're on the ground and she's using Din's Fire on you, I suggest running towards her and then rolling when the fire is almost at your body. It should avoid the massive hitrange and give you less distance to cover when you try to get in melee range. It's important to know where your opponent likes to taget these flameballs- most of the time they will try to aim it right at you, which you can airdodge to get past it. Be careful of mind games, though.

If you want to attack her in the air, you want to stay below Zelda. Her up-air is nastily fast and kills off the top extremely easy, and everyone knows what happens when you get a sweetspotted f-air or b-air in the face. Zelda's down-air does have a sweetspot now, but it's harder to connect with that than with her side-airs and your up-air outreaches her sweetspot. Try to chain up-airs together to get some combos on her, the stale-move negation will allow you to use it multiple times if you get the timing right.

This mindgame I recommend on all levels, but it can be incredibly effective against Zelda: Approach her and then... stand there. Dodge her Din's fires, but don't attack. Zelda is one of the most defensive-oriented fighters in this game, any aggressive approach will be swallowed up by her smashes. Let her come to you, and take advantage of any recovery time that she has to use after her attacks. Then you can follow up and get aggressive again, but make sure to get her airborne because her smash attacks are so much more dangerous than her aerials (but even those present problems... I don't understand how she got so good.)

I will be posting a matchup on Toon Link in the next post.

 

[-Knux-]

Great stuff Clai. Very informative. ^^

Uh... Anyone have some juicy stuff on Pit? He's a pain. >_<

 

[Clai]

Toon Link is also a pain

Toon Link is top tier. He is the best camper in this game, his aerials protect his body like a shield, and his smashes are quick and painful. I will be suggesting ways to fight him, but I want to reiterate that Toon Link has the advantage this battle and it will take some serious mindgames to overcome him.

First, there's the campy Toon Link that doesn't know how to fight up close, but makes up for it by guaranteeing that the other guy never gets to approach him. This type of fighter isn't too bad because Kirby is one of those characters that can get past the barrage of projectiles and get at him. Due to its tiny frame, Kirby only has to worry about the eight inches of roundness getting hit by projectiles, and fortunately that can be protected by aerials. Cancel out arrows and boomerangs with f-airs or b-airs, or simply spot-dodge them or short-hop air dodge. Jump and airdodge TL's bombs, and press A when you do so to try and catch them. Nothing throws off a camper's game more than getting attacked with projectiles.

When you're up close, take notice about what your enemy does. Down-smashes can be jumped over and follwed up with f-airs. Rolling can be beat by good reflexes and tech-chasing. Spot-dodging can be controlled by grabbing, any grab works at this point since you can't follow up your down throws before he has a chance to counter attack. Sheild the first hit of his foward smash and try to roll behind himbetween hits; this is the most punishable technique TL has and if you can catch him trying to use the second hit, smash him be all circumstances. If Toon Link is in the air, try to bait him into a d-air and then dodge to a side and try to punish the attack. Fighting him in the air is a dangerous ordeal, though, as all of his other aerials come out quickly and use that dang disjointed hitboxes of his. As in the Zelda match-up, fighting him from below is the best way to go, as TL users know that d-air can be punished, and they won't use it unless they think they will hit you.

**EDIT** I forgot to mention, you want to swallow Toon Link in this matchup. Get back at the projectile camper by shooting arrows right at him. And his recovery isn't too hard to edgeguard. If he has to use his up-B (after using the d-air recovery o_O), you can d-air him right above his head. It may take some tries to get him down, but the success of meteoring him is a sweet one. Of course, you can go, "the heck with this" and Kirbycide him after he used up his jumps. Then it just gets funny and throws off the match on unimaginable levels. **/EDIT**

Now, just sone general things about Kirby matchups themselves. Smashes are usually a no-go because recovery times are non-existant in this game, and opponents will just chain one attack into another when you think you can punish something with a smash attack. Kirby's tilts don't have reach by any means, but they are quick and Kirby can appoach very easily compared to other characters. Down-tilt trips opponents, allowing you to follow up with your tech-chasing. Up-tilt is amazing- it comes insanely fast and allows you to chain multiple hits when your opponent thinks he can attack you with an aerial. Lastly, don't forget to just stand there at times. Changing the pace of the game is an excellent mindgame, and your opopnent will get so bewildered that he will either try to match your mindgame by standing or forget his strategy and get aggressive on you. Either way, you'll get more open opportunities to attach than just attacking all the time.

 

[Blade Knight]

If I may Post for Captain Olimar I'd give an In depth disscription on their standings.

 

[Maraphy]

Great stuff guys. After we get a whole bunch of stuff, I will slowly stop putting information in the quotes.

 

[Plasmaexe]

Marth

I'll post about Marth. As much as people say that he's one of the worst match ups for Marth, he really isn't >_>. In fact Marth mostly has the disadvantage cause your a really small target and most of Marth's knockback and power comes from tipping, which is hard since Kirby height and length wise isn't that big.

As Kirby, you'd really have to be a certain and almost an exact distance from where Marth is standing to get tipped by his forward smash which can kill at 50% on the first try if you aren't careful. Tipping from his forward air isn't that bad if you're on the ground and you could easily punish Marth by blocking since he has to use his f-air when he's about to hit the ground. Marth's recovery is easy to edge guard cause if you can get a back air on him when he's off the stage and he's already done his midair jump, there's a low chance he'll make it back on stage and you can just grab the edge at the right time to stop marth from grabbing the edge.

 

[Blade Knight]

Pikmin & Olimar

Man this guy is nuts, best camper in the game powerful etc. However Kirby can take advantge of the fact that most of his attacks are ranged, being the small target he is. However at the same time be careful and if you must keep your distance until you find an opening to attack. Olimar is powerful in many ways but close combat is his weakness keep the pressure on Olimar and don't give him a chance to attack. If you can try to Juggle Olimar and keep him in the air for that is where he is weakest, try to set it up so you can use your hammer on him to knock him over the edge and then just edgehog him so he can't get back on. However this does not put you at an advantage if you leave yourself open Olimar can chuck his pikmin at you to rack up damage, and if you're clumsy or predictable in your approach he can simply ken kombo you until your easy pikings to take out with a down or F-Smash. Just watch yourself keep track of what pikmin's next in line for him (as it could help you predict his pattern* of attack) and don't keep to close for too long.


*Red Pikmin usually are used for smash attacks and are dangeous.
Yellow Pikmin can paralize you and are deadly mid-air.
Blue Pikmin grant Olimar the strongest trows in the game bar none and are usually used to start up comobs.
Purple Pikmin are melons huge hitboxs and are very deadly when used for spiking and smashing generally used for down-smashes.
White Pikmin WATCH OUT FOR THESE if Olimar side-b's one of these at you dodge or kill them imediatly they deal a whopping 54% if they complete their attack despite this they are rare and are devastating when used mid air Dodge them at all costs.

 

[Clai]

Wolf matchup + notes

Just watch yourself keep track of what pikmin's next in line for him (as it could help you predict his pattern of attack) and don't keep to close for too long.

Just want to add a note about this, don't let your opponent onto the fact that you're trying to predict his attacks from the pikmen he has. A good Olimar player will try to switch things up (As in throwing red and yellow pikmen, grabbing with purple pikmen, etc), so always keep your guard up as to what he's going to do.

Also, Olimar's up-smash is one of the most ****-tastic smashes in the game. Don't attack him from above.

Now, to put the matchup with Wolf in a word: LLLLLLAAAAAZZZZ3333333RRRRZZZZ! LHIUHIBSUEFKULSBEGIB!

Now to be serious: Wolf's lasers are the most broken attack in the game. They do at least 5% to you every time, they cannot be cancelled out by any of Kirby's attacks (Only bombs and such can cancel them), and the bayonet gun thing makes it even more damaging up close. The worst part of it- you won't have any help if you swallow Wolf and take his lasers because his reflector turns back lasers at twice the speed and twice the power. So in this matchup, save the inhalation for Kirbycides. Stay to the ground, spotdodge, roll, short-hop air dodge, do anything that can prevent you from getting hit by the lasers.

In hand-tp-hand combat, Wolf's f-smash outranges you, so keep an eye for it and try to roll behind it. Remember, nost attacks have no recovery in this game, and even if it misses/gets shielded, it can come right to an AAA combo (this is for further ranting). You want to create enough spacing that his foward smash can miss, while you can approach him with an aerial or your own f-smash. You can approach Wolf from above because unlike Zelda, Toon Link, Marth or Olimar, Wolf does not have a retardedly powerful upsmash. It actually is punishable, so try and bait him into an upsmash and then attack him. I'm not sure about his tilts or down-smash, but I think his down-smash is one of those sweeping ones, so just jump over it and aerial attack him. Wolf is also one of the fastest falling guys out there (that's not saying much in this game), so you can chaingrab him with your down throw or rack up damage with up-tilts.

I can't say how powerful Wolf's aerials are, but I know that uair kills at around 120%, while fair kills off the top at similar percents. However, the range of these attacks is short, so go get him in the air. It will be better for you to go either in front of him or below him, as Wolf's fair is really short and his dair takes some startup time. In regards of his b-side and b-up attacks, they are hard to punish initially, but once you take the time to find your sweetspot, Wolf will be easy pickings for edgeguarding. Added mention: short recoveries means easy Kirbycide (Yes, I am a devoted kamikaze user).

I am also knowledgeable on Ike, Captain Falcon, Zamus, Ganondorf and ROB matchups, so expect me to fill in my ideas about them soon.

 

[Plasmaexe]

Just would like to add (XD) Wolf's down smash comes out insanely quick and his forward smash could easily follow it up if you're still close enough to him. If you manage to block his F-smash, but he's ends up still in front of you, get away or shield grab him if you're able to. If he ends up behind you, immediately down smash.

Tripping wolf does help quite a bit if you can pull that off and if he's getting back on stage, predict where he's going to be when he uses his Forward-B and use rock, or meteor smash him with your drill kick if you can. The best way to approach a laser spamming/camping Wolf is to fly toward him while air dodging, but have your back faced towards him so you can back air and find the right time to back air him cause if he ends up block you, he'll pretty much get a free attack on you pretty much x_x. Clearly I think the hardest match up I've come across a little below Snake >__>.

 

[Blade Knight]

Sooo when do these things get added on?

 

[Plasmaexe]

Sooo when do these things get added on?

whenever he get's on D:

 

[Blade Knight]

darn and this is my first time 'helping' on one of these threads now you think I did well? (I have paranoia and think I did poorly until I hear otherwise usually)

 

[Plasmaexe]

darn and this is my first time 'helping' on one of these threads now you think I did well? (I have paranoia and think I did poorly until I hear otherwise usually)

It's pretty useful since not many people know exactly how the different colored pikmen work. For example, the blue one having a lot of grab power. I wouldn't say though that close range is Olimar's weakness though because his Down smash comes out extremely fast and faster than any of Kirby's smash attacks. In the air though when he's getting back on stage, he's incredibly easy to back air and he doesn't have much hope in recovering unless he's above the stage.

On a random note, I should really make a match-up guide if there isn't too many of those out there ><.

 

[Synerate]

My buddy and I have been playing since 64. Ive always been Kirby and hes always been Samus.
I know samus pretty well with Kirby.

What you got to watch out with samus are a few things, Her screw ball attack, her down A in the air and of course her gun.

First of all, Kirby is a very aerial player. so you got to watch out for that screw ball attack. Though it doesnt have a gigantic knock back it will just layer damage on you fast. Especially when your edgegaurding, dont go in for the screw kick, its possible to pull it off but its most likely youll get hit with the screw attack unintentionally just but being in the wrong place. Samus isnt aiming for you, your just in the way of her recovery. Usually down B is pretty good off the map so make your self comfortable with falling fast off the map and getting out of Down B and recovering safetly.

Also, make note that her aerial down A has a meteor effect. even at 40% watch out for this off the map, hell even at 0% its quite a threat. Just make sure your not under her while off the map. the best way to handel this is either air dodge through her and try to Wall of pain her or anything else you think may work, just play around with it. Basicly the sides of samus are the best places to be.

Lastly, Her lazers can be a problem. dont be afraid to let her charge up. This could be quite her undoing, but you have an advantage, your very small. An uncharged lazer will go right above you if you duck. you can even dodge. But when she cracks off the big one, just roll through it (not away!) and go for a grab or antyhing you got in your arsenal. Dont be afraid to provoke her in doing so, cause a good samas is gonna hang onto the charge and hit you with it at the right moment, so be on your toes to roll through it.

thats all i cna think of right now. just remeber to be on the side of her in the air when you attack, make good use of the air dodge, be ware of her screw attack and down aerial A and dont be afraid to steal her power and use it against her!

~┼Syn┼~

 

[Trexxen]

Well, I'm not THAT good with Sonic; but I consider myself decent with him - since Kirby's my main, though, here's some tips.

The most dangerous kind of Sonic is a spazzy Sonic. By this, I mean the kind of Sonic that runs back and forth, run-attacking you on each pass-by. If you jump, he'll use side-B and jump out of it to smack you; if you stay on the ground you're pretty much dead. Inhaling him is utterly useless; yay you get a crappy attack with more startup lag than the Hammer OR the Stone! The only possible excuse for eating Sonic is to help recovery on stages like FD where Kirby can continually use the B move to stick to the bottom of the stage.

His only decent kill moves, even for the light Kirby, are his FSmash and his USmash right next to the edge. When fighting near an edge, AVOID HIS USMASH LIKE THE PLAGUE! It has little startup lag, covers his entire body in a hitbox, and can sometimes spike you over the edge. Sonic's FSmash has deceptive range, ESPECIALLY if your opponent knows how to stutter step - watch out for that.

Seems pretty bleak, right? Wrong. Sonic is, however good he may seem, inherently flawed. He has VERY low priority; and his hitboxes are for the most part very small since most of his attacks focus on his ball form. Aside from the two moves I mentioned; he has very little killing potential. His throws SUCK. Royally. His grab range, however, is huge thanks to his sliding - you're likely to get grabbed a lot.

If you get a "spazzy" Sonic, you have two options. You can use an aireal approach with liberal use of airdodging, or you can fsmash him out of his run attack. This is the best option - lands one of Kirby's kill moves with little risk, because it comes out fast and has decent priority. Hammer is best used after a Fthrow at the start of each stock; then never again - Sonic moves too fast to be hit by it. Same with stone, for that matter. Final Cutter is slightly more useful - if you miss with the swing the projectile is still useful; and at the least it'll force him into the air or into a shield, which will end his running temporarily and give you time to reach him.

Finally, a quick note - NEVER knock Sonic upwards diagonally if you can help it, and if you can't get a guaranteed kill. He'll recover every single time with a side-B to the stage. That thing moves REALLY far in the air.

~Trexxen

 

[Maraphy]

whenever he get's on D:

lul he's right

Actually, I really learned something from your advice Blade Knight. I had almost no knowledge on what the different pikmin are used for. xD I just learned to watch out when I saw purple or white ones. Now I will keep these things in mind for when I fight my Olimar-abusing friend <_<

Also, I have something to add on to Samus, I have experience as two of my friends use her a LOT:

The key to Samus is to not let her advancing tricks work on you. Most of the time, a good Samus will slowly advance with missles and charge shots. For this situation, just jump over them (Airdodging if you need to) and get right in there. Samus doesn't like to fight up close a lot, so she will try to run. Follow her again and use Kirby's better hand-to-hand combat.

Also, there is a variation of this tactic, that you do NOT want to fall for. Samus will charge up her charge shot, and then use that missle-advancing technique I told you, and they'll use maybe 3-5 missles, and then throw a charge shot. WHAM! It's hard to see coming! So be on your toes, and always be aware if she has a charge shot when she is missle-advancing you. If you can evade it, then she will either be forced to redo the whole thing, or pick a different strategy.

Another kind of Samus likes to camp her missles at the side of the stage. She'll jump up and do that Triple-missle or whatever it's called. If this happens, do not jump into the air, because that is just giving her more influence over you. Instead, stay to the ground, because most of the time, they won't realize you aren't jumping, and they will continue jumping into the air sending missles to nowhere. So, just get in close, and dodge-roll the missles that come to you. Again, be wary of the charge shot. Once you get close to her, it's likely she'll either run, or try to rack up damage on you and then smash you to the other side of the stage. Just keep following her.

Also, one more note I have to make. Stay close to the ground during this fight, because Samus is tricky in the air. She has a nasty meteor smash that you want to avoid, and when you're above her she can rack up damage with the screw attack. Another thing, if you are coming at her from below with an attack, sometimes she will use a screw attack to avoid it. This is mainly for annoyance. If she does this, use your jumps and U-air the heck out of her.

 

[Blade Knight]

Well I AM an Olimar main so I just threw out what I knew glad I helped!

Oh I forgot the pikmin rarity from most common to rarist goes like this Red>Blue>Yellow>Purple>White the average and troop of pikmin will consist of 1-2Blues/Reds, 1 Yellow, 1 Purple and 0-1 White Pikmin.

 

[Cereal Rabbit]

Maaaybe I should **** this thread.

EDIT: Kirby on Kirby help?

Your strategy is to counter what the other Kirby is trying to counter onto what you're trying to counter that Kirby with...... (Campier Kirby wins... W00T)

 

[Maraphy]

^ I'm putting that in >_>

 

[Jester Kirby]

lol, Kirby dittos are alot of fun actually IMO. You can learn alot if your opponent is a pro.

 

[Cereal Rabbit]

Personally to me, Kirby dittos are boring. I don't mean I don't like them, but the pace is just so bleeeeeh. He has all your neat tricks and possibly something you don't have.

Kirby getting final cutter spammed? OH NOEZ!!!!

 

[Blade Knight]

brrrr kirby geting FC'd man anywho I'm throwing I thing out for Pit. THE ROCK IS YOUR FRIEND Pit is the Only person Kirby can spam the rock against and hit frequently seriously and if you get him with a hammer out of the rock well that helps too. Oh and copy Pit so you can spam arrows against him.

 

[Clai]

Kirby on Ike!

Sorry to interrupt the league of Kirby countering and OH NOEZ proclaiming, but I'll put up another matchup now.

My friend plays a very smart Ike. When I say smart I mean he's a spammer and knows exactly what to spam with. The combined mega reach of his sword, the jaw-dropping power and one or two instant attacks (ugh... instant...) makes Ike a formidable opponent indeed.

Ike likes to play close to the ground, because all of his aerials (except one) take a considerable amount of time to start. You won't have any luck trying to take him out with ground attacks, because he outprioritizes you and has a longer range. The key thing to this matchup is shorthop aerials. Thankfully, Ike is tall enough that you can shorthop and hit him with aerials without too much of a problem. B-air, F-air, and U-air work wonders on Ike, so use those attacks and combo as much as you can, as you're working with an attack strength and damage ratio of 1:2 (one of his hits equals two of yours) against a guy like Ike. Final Cutter Projectile spamming isn't a bad idea in this matchup, since Ike is not very manuverable.

My friend pulls off his approach perfectly with Ike. What he does is that he spaces himself enough and sends out Quick Draw so he's right next to you without hitting you. Usually, I will try to shield or spot dodge the Quick Draw and punish the ending lag, but it he doesn't hit you, he'll go right into a grab or an AAA combo (Yeah, seriously, the first time he does this, it does 16% damage with all hits. SIXTEEN!). You should probably try to roll behind Ike when he does this and try and grab him. He can't do an AAA combo when you're behind him. Try to get the timing of his Fsmash down if he uses it. I tend to spot dodge a little too early and then take a giant sword heave to the face. Either roll behind him or spot dodge when his sword is above his head. Don't let any of his smashes eat your shield, as you will be effectively be without a shield for a good amount of time afterwards.

The aerials you want to watch out for are his N-air, his F-air and his B-air. The F-air takes the sword all the way through the front side of his body, and can even hit below him. The neutral air is more of a protective aerial and covers his entire body. The back-air, goodness gracious, he takes the sword with one arm and instantly whooshes across his backside. Come on now, it's a two-handed sword he's wielding and he's using one arm and swiping it that fast? I need to know what arm and shoulder magazines this guy is reading. Fortunately, he can't shorthop approach with it because you can just duck under it. When you're behind him, ground tilts or grabbing will work better for you than an aerial approach.

Ike's recovery is very predictable, but it's difficult to edgegaurd, at the least. Horizontally, he has Quick Draw, which will beat out any attack you have unless you have impeccable spacing and timing. Vertically, he has Aether, which does around 20% damage and wrecks you priority-wise. Just don't try and get near that thing. At all. If anything, what you want to do is drop down off the stage and b-air him before he gets to the right spacing, horizontally, to pull off an Aether recovery.

Another note, DO NOT APPROACH THIS GUY FROM ABOVE! EVER! If he wants to put on damage, he'll throw his sword up and Aether you. With Kirby, it's a little easier to airdodge out of and protect yourself from the worst of the damage, but you will never get past it. U-Smash goes from in front of him and arcs over him to the backside of his body. No matter where you get hit, this will have a major knockback and will kill poor Kirby at low percentages.

Oh...

_(*)_ (Kirby art skills for the loss) <-QD​

_(*)_ :::::: <-HYAH!!!!​

<-WTF? _(*)_​

_(*)_ HIIII!!!!!!​

>_< Ike

 

[Jester Kirby]

Antoher note on Pit, copying the arrow is a good idea, b/c pit isnt exactly kirbycidible. Wall of pain works quite well on pit, the thing to rememebr though, is to keep pit off the stage, he can only fly for so long and once he uses B-up, if you hit him and he doesnt land....he can't use B-Up again....bye bye pit.

 

[Reioumu]

Wolf strategy is messed up. Gonzo combo is better for racking up damage at 0%. F-throw u-air F-throw u-air D-tilt trip to F-smash. deals around 57% damage and ***** hardcore.

 

[KonoK]

Does anyone have anything for Diddy? There's this guy at my school who everyone says is a master with him. It's probably not true, but whatever. The only Diddy I have ever played was my friend who just got the game one week ago.

 

[TwilightKirby]

Does anyone have anything for Diddy? There's this guy at my school who everyone says is a master with him. It's probably not true, but whatever. The only Diddy I have ever played was my friend who just got the game one week ago.

hm personally ive never really had difficulty with diddy... it seems like kirby pretty easily outprioritizes him in the air and inhale also seems to outprioritize a lot of his attacks so kirbycide is really easy if you hit him while he charges his upb he will most likely die so he isnt extremely difficult to gimp and his bananas arent as much of an issue for kirby as other characters since you can float over them and eat them if you have the oppurtunity

 

[RushHour1049]

Well I play against Snake a lot of the time, a friend of mine is really good at Snake. First of all you should aim to inhale him so you can get his grenades, it helps tremendously against a camping Snake. That in mind, there are several things you have to watch out for. Snake is slow so most likely he will try to keep you back with grenades and missles, you and air dodge the grenades or throw them back at him if he throws them too early, and you back and forward airs do a good job at deflecting missles. When you get somewhat close, short jump to f-air or b-air, anything else he can out prioritize with his fast f-tilt combo. Occasionally land and crouch, because he may unexpectedly do a fast mortar slide at you, and you can counter that by d-tilting. (You can also counter that by f-smash but that's much more risky.) Your main goal is to get him in the air, when his slow aerials will be helpless against your u-air, b-air, and an unexpected aerial hammer to finish him off.

 

[Jester Kirby]

I might as well giv out my wario strats. My frined mains him and we play quite a bit.

Here's what you do, when fighting Wario, if he jumps around alot, he can be intimidating. You can't really tell what he will do next when he is in the air. If you have good ground game with Kirby, you need to use it here. Use the final cutter and you can safely chop him down to the ground, where you can f smash or whatever you please to follow up. Wario is easily comboed from forward throw, so abuse that at low percents. Wario's up air is deadly when you have alot of damage, if they abuse that B+Down and catch him off guard. Kirbycide is an option if you're ahead in lives but behind in damage.

Main rule vs Wario, is passive agressivness. His priority is insane! So rushing him is a horrid option, shield grab, spot dodge and then attack, whatever you please, but you have to play tactically.


I'm surprised there is nothing on Pokemon trainer, kirby can easily throw off each of the pokemon.
Charizard's flamethrower easily stops squirtle's rush, traps ivysaur, and keeps distance with Charizard. So it is definitly the best one ot use if you're into copy abilities. Other than that, you shouldn't find the moveset too hard to overcome.

 

[Kiwikomix]

Pikachu vs. Kirby
Pikachu ***** Kirby in so many ways. The only thing Kirby can do against Pikachu's thunderbolt spam is dodge, jump, or hold down A and cancel the bolt with his everlasting jab, which eventually pushes him back to the edge anyway, at which point Pikachu can spam thunder and thunderbolt. This makes it hard for even Kirby to get back to the stage. When he recovers from above, he can only airdodge thunder, since his stone has too much lag to be effective. When he recovers from the edge, it's only useful to roll past Pikachu. Even if this second alternative is successful, Pika will likely just Dsmash Kirby straight up, which means more thunder. Pikachu has around the same range as Kirby, but the disjoint on his f-smash will counter a lot of what Kirby throws at him. Finally, Kirby can't even edgeguard Pikachu's stellar recovery, which is quite a shame as it provides Kirby with a lot of his kills. The best way to survive is to keep toward the middle and, when you hit Pikachu to the side, hit him with a bair instead of a spike. Also, inhaling Pikachu is the best way to stop his thunderbolt spamming.

 

[Flipstar]

When I play pikachu I usually copy his ability and do this:

jump to thunder bolt to final cutter. I find it quite effective