Notes on Greninja's Substitute

[TheRealBlueBlur]

I was doing some testing on Greninja's Substitute, and I made this thread to see the community's opinion, as well as checking if I missed anything. Here are the notes:

It does a set damage value, 14% if aimed up or down, and 11% if aimed left or right (I suggest aiming up, as it does the most damage and comes out very fast on the ground). It deals 13% if aimed in any diagonal direction.

I'm not sure if it instantly breaks shields, but I know it deals very high shield damage.

Greninja appears to be impervious to grabs and Bowser's Side special while he is flashing.

He will occasionally make a log instead of a substitute doll. They appear to function the same.

The dolls/logs themselves can block projectiles, such as Fox's blaster shots or Mario's fireballs. This provides Greninja with some sort of defensive wall (although the doll/log can be knocked away easily by anybody, even including Greninja).

Did I miss anything?

 

[YouReadMyName]

Does the log have a set HP value like Luma and villy's tree?

 

[Galaxeon]

You can actually use dolls and logs to bounce off in the air with Greninja's Dair. I found it amusing as a mix-up approach, though very situational (since Dair removes his double jump... sure we can still bair or fair).
And @ YouReadMyName > nop I think it lasts for about 10 seconds, log or doll, whether you hit it or not.

I don't think his counter is as bad as most people say it is. That said I never break any shield with it. I think it's power shielding that is actually pretty simple ? Or just the timing. Most opponents got it. You really have to know on which moves you can use it...

 

[AlexAnthonyD]

I have really been enjoying using the Up Counter as well. Even if you don't KO your opponent it can set up for a nice UAir or DAir depending on where the opponent is left hanging. If it's really high up you can even finish them with a hydro pump aimed upwards. The main point of counter I would say is to make sure you are very close to your opponent, don't really use it against projectiles as its so slow to come out it is very easy to dodge. Also, don't be afraid to use it in the air, typically not when falling into an opponent but more when coming back on the stage recovering.