Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

As long as they keep it limited, I’m fine with it returning for characters who could benefit from it. The Pits, Charizard, even today’s nerfed Meta Knight could benefit from it without being broken. Unlimited gliding and abusing cheese that could never be patched out is what made it busted to begin with.

And also potentially being applied to Ridley, since Ridley was built off of Charizard as a base and has gliding code in him that points to nothing since they didn't make animations for it lol

 

[Will]

And also potentially being applied to Ridley, since Ridley was built off of Charizard as a base and has gliding code in him that points to nothing since they didn't make animations for it lol

I’m down for it. His recovery game is so linear he could really use that flexibility.

 

[Gengar84]

Nah. Just total games in the franchise.

Also, there's more than one FF7 game.

This rule makes sense but also means I can’t get Jena Anderson so I don’t approve .

 

[SPEN18]

Kid Icarus has three games, though?

Maybe you only want to half-count OMaM. But maybe you also only want to half-count Dark Pit.

(Not that I think the devs really place limits like this anyway)

 

[Will]

Kid Icarus has three games, though?

That’s the joke. We’re on the precipice of DarthEnderX’s approval. God forbid we ever get playable Hades or Viridi or a Medusa echo of Palutena (I think I’ve heard that idea tossed around before?)

 

[Louie G.]

I find it frustrating how much malice seems to be directed at Marx simply by virtue of being a character from Super Star. My affinity for him has very little to do with Sakurai's ownership of the character, he's been a pipe dream wish of mine since before he was even playable in Star Allies. I can only confidently speak for myself but I don't feel that Marx's worth is entirely superficial to Sakurai bias, the reason people talk about him at all is that he's also a very striking and fun character in his own right and left a quietly big impact on the series. Otherwise that conversation could easily be designated to Nightmare or something.

I don't really disagree that Bandana Dee or Magolor are more efficient choices. The former justifies itself and the latter is one of the more consistent supporting characters in the series outside of the main gang, and got even more emphasis and exploration from the RTDL remaster. But I would argue Marx and Magolor are similarly popular - both have a respectable amount of merchandise, which is the only way I can really begin to quantify that. And the question of moveset potential is a bit baffling to me, when not only does Star Allies prove that all of these characters have plenty to work with (not sure why I wouldn't factor that in, I'm not really concerned with Sakurai bias) and Magolor borrows a not-unsignificant amount of inspiration from Marx on the whole. As far as character theming goes as well, I think there's something to be said about Marx's very clear circus aesthetic and the way that informs a very clear character concept. I like Magolor's design but it isn't quite as immediately evocative, you look at Marx's big jester hat and already kinda get the idea.

I can't really think of a good reason why Marx would be playable next game. I think he's a great choice for a boss as well. But man sometimes I feel like he just gets **** flung at him for being this apparent encapsulation of fearmongering Sakurai bias when ever since I was young I just found him to be a very compelling and fresh character. I don't see people calling Adeleine or Susie an awful choice or anything. Feels like overcorrection to insist he's not worth his while.

Anyway, I actually agree with kirbstr about wanting updates to Meta Knight. I'm not sure specifically what I would suggest right now, but he's been given quite a lot more to do in the main series since Brawl and his moveset is a little barebones / sauceless right now. I feel like after they neutered him post-Brawl he's just struggled to come into his own again, I rarely see anyone play him and I personally struggle to do well playing him. I think the one thing Brawl MK really got right is MK should be that flashy and intimidating, just in a more measured way that makes him fun to play against too lol. I'd love to see him become a force to be reckoned with again, instead of a relative non-presence like he currently is. It's a bit sad.

 

[Gengar84]

I find it frustrating how much malice seems to be directed at Marx simply by virtue of being a character from Super Star. My affinity for him has very little to do with Sakurai's ownership of the character, he's been a pipe dream wish of mine since before he was even playable in Star Allies. I can only confidently speak for myself but I don't feel that Marx's worth is entirely superficial to Sakurai bias, the reason people talk about him at all is that he's also a very striking and fun character in his own right and left a quietly big impact on the series. Otherwise that conversation could easily be designated to Nightmare or something.

I don't really disagree that Bandana Dee or Magolor are more efficient choices. The former justifies itself and the latter is one of the more consistent supporting characters in the series outside of the main gang, and got even more emphasis and exploration from the RTDL remaster. But I would argue Marx and Magolor are similarly popular - both have a respectable amount of merchandise, which is the only way I can really begin to quantify that. And the question of moveset potential is a bit baffling to me, when not only does Star Allies prove that all of these characters have plenty to work with (not sure why I wouldn't factor that in, I'm not really concerned with Sakurai bias) and Magolor borrows a not-unsignificant amount of inspiration from Marx on the whole. As far as character theming goes as well, I think there's something to be said about Marx's very clear circus aesthetic and the way that informs a very clear character concept. I like Magolor's design but it isn't quite as immediately evocative, you look at Marx's big jester hat and already kinda get the idea.

I can't really think of a good reason why Marx would be playable next game. I think he's a great choice for a boss as well. But man sometimes I feel like he just gets **** flung at him for being this apparent encapsulation of fearmongering Sakurai bias when ever since I was young I just found him to be a very compelling and fresh character. I don't see people calling Adeleine or Susie an awful choice or anything.

Anyway, I actually agree with kirbstr about wanting updates to Meta Knight. I'm not sure specifically what I would suggest right now, but he's been given quite a lot more to do in the main series since Brawl and his moveset is a little barebones / sauceless right now. I feel like after they neutered him post-Brawl he's just struggled to come into his own again, I rarely see anyone play him and I personally struggle to do well playing him. I think the one thing Brawl MK really got right is MK should be that flashy and intimidating, just in a more measured way that makes him fun to play against too lol. I'd love to see him become a force to be reckoned with again, instead of a relative non-presence like he currently is. It's a bit sad.

I enjoyed both games but I always thought Marx had a cooler visual design than Magolor so I’d rather have Marx out of the two. Superstar was also one of my favorite SNES games and I have stronger nostalgia for it than Return to Dreamland so that helps.

 

[Will]

The #1 reason I like playing Meta Knight is the kickass voice lines and his victory theme. Pretty much the same reason I play Dark Pit over regular Pit. I’m not terribly good at footsies characters but it’s fun to execute his juggling loops and hear his sword SFX.

I care about every character getting voice updates except Meta Knight. It’s perfect.

 

[Ivander]

That’s the joke. We’re on the precipice of DarthEnderX’s approval. God forbid we ever get playable Hades or Viridi or a Medusa echo of Palutena (I think I’ve heard that idea tossed around before?)

If anything, Viridi would be the Semi-clone of Palutena, due to her being able to use all of the powers Palutena can use. The reason Semi-clone is because Viridi is obviously smaller than Palutena and arguably a bit smaller than Pit. And any light-based attacks from Palutena would become more nature-based with Viridi.

Granted, Medusa has a Warp spell(if you gave her Warp, you could give Palutena and Viridi Rocket Jump and Jump Glide respectively to represent all of Palutena's Up-B specials in Smash 4), but when you are fighting Medusa, besides mainly laser and darkness attacks, she has outright attacks with her bare hands and staff that have power and weight to them. Heck, she frickin' punched the head off of the God of the Dead in Uprising. Her attacks, especially her Smash attacks, should be more like Ganondorf and Bowsers' Smash attacks than Palutena's.
And people complain enough about Ganondorf playing like a slower, stronger version of Captain Falcon for the most part. Medusa should not simply be a darkness version of Palutena. Sure, she should have some trickery magic, but her magic should be what stuns her foes and make them vulnerable to her power and bare strength.

 

[SharkLord]

If anything, Viridi would be the Semi-clone of Palutena, due to her being able to use all of the powers Palutena can use. The reason Semi-clone is because Viridi is obviously smaller than Palutena and arguably a bit smaller than Pit. And any light-based attacks from Palutena would become more nature-based with Viridi.

Granted, Medusa has a Warp spell(if you gave her Warp, you could give Palutena and Viridi Rocket Jump and Jump Glide respectively to represent all of Palutena's Up-B specials in Smash 4), but when you are fighting Medusa, besides mainly laser and darkness attacks, she has outright attacks with her bare hands and staff that have power and weight to them. Heck, she frickin' punched the head off of the God of the Dead in Uprising. Her attacks, especially her Smash attacks, should be more like Ganondorf and Bowsers' Smash attacks than Palutena's.
And people complain enough about Ganondorf playing like a slower, stronger version of Captain Falcon for the most part. Medusa should not simply be a darkness version of Palutena. Sure, she should have some trickery magic, but her magic should be what stuns her foes and make them vulnerable to her power and bare strength.

Ah, so what you're saying is we should declone Ganondorf and give the Falcondorf kit to Medusa

 

[Thegameandwatch]

Does this apply to specific games? Because I kinda wanna make a joke about how both Final Fantasy reps are from VII...

FF7 is basically treated as a separate series from regular FF at this point with its own spin-offs and even had its own movie that is referenced in Smash.

Ifrit's design and one of Sora's victory animations are the only direct references to stuff after FF7 if it's about mainline games. Both are FF8 references.

 

[Ivander]

Ah, so what you're saying is we should declone Ganondorf and give the Falcondorf kit to Medusa

Medusa does Up-A

 

[SharkLord]

Medusa does Up-A

Instead of turning into Pig Ganon she just chucks her head at you

 

[kirbstr]

I find it frustrating how much malice seems to be directed at Marx simply by virtue of being a character from Super Star. My affinity for him has very little to do with Sakurai's ownership of the character, he's been a pipe dream wish of mine since before he was even playable in Star Allies. I can only confidently speak for myself but I don't feel that Marx's worth is entirely superficial to Sakurai bias, the reason people talk about him at all is that he's also a very striking and fun character in his own right and left a quietly big impact on the series. Otherwise that conversation could easily be designated to Nightmare or something.

I don't really disagree that Bandana Dee or Magolor are more efficient choices. The former justifies itself and the latter is one of the more consistent supporting characters in the series outside of the main gang, and got even more emphasis and exploration from the RTDL remaster. But I would argue Marx and Magolor are similarly popular - both have a respectable amount of merchandise, which is the only way I can really begin to quantify that. And the question of moveset potential is a bit baffling to me, when not only does Star Allies prove that all of these characters have plenty to work with (not sure why I wouldn't factor that in, I'm not really concerned with Sakurai bias) and Magolor borrows a not-unsignificant amount of inspiration from Marx on the whole. As far as character theming goes as well, I think there's something to be said about Marx's very clear circus aesthetic and the way that informs a very clear character concept. I like Magolor's design but it isn't quite as immediately evocative, you look at Marx's big jester hat and already kinda get the idea.

I can't really think of a good reason why Marx would be playable next game. I think he's a great choice for a boss as well. But man sometimes I feel like he just gets **** flung at him for being this apparent encapsulation of fearmongering Sakurai bias when ever since I was young I just found him to be a very compelling and fresh character. I don't see people calling Adeleine or Susie an awful choice or anything. Feels like overcorrection to insist he's not worth his while.

Anyway, I actually agree with kirbstr about wanting updates to Meta Knight. I'm not sure specifically what I would suggest right now, but he's been given quite a lot more to do in the main series since Brawl and his moveset is a little barebones / sauceless right now. I feel like after they neutered him post-Brawl he's just struggled to come into his own again, I rarely see anyone play him and I personally struggle to do well playing him. I think the one thing Brawl MK really got right is MK should be that flashy and intimidating, just in a more measured way that makes him fun to play against too lol. I'd love to see him become a force to be reckoned with again, instead of a relative non-presence like he currently is. It's a bit sad.

Sorry if my post came across as insulting or **** flinging to people like you who actually do want Marx in the game. I still stand by him being a poor choice even without the context of sakurai being biased or not towards his own games.

I think the biggest difference between him and Nightmare is him having a memorable boss battle and design. In terms of actual impact on the series I would argue Nightmare's is certainly bigger, however you are right that something about him resonates with people. I recall him being a fairly highly requested character in the Smash 4 speculation before modern Kirby was really established.

That said, Marx and Magolor are not similarly popular. Anecdotally among online Kirby fans Marx probably wouldn't even be in the top 10 most popular characters while Magolor is easily the 5th most popular character after the main 4. Maybe Elfillin could pass him in time if he appears in more games. Polling from the Smash Ballot and Ultimate DLC wishlists suggests Magolor is genuinely a highly requested character for Smash while Marx is pretty niche.

I question his move set potential as a playable character insofar as the kind of character he is. Maybe I have a different philosophy on move set potential compared to other people, but I do not really consider what a character could be made into in smash over what they do in their games and how that can translate into smash (people really hated this take before when I've made it here about Waluigi, so maybe I'm off base). The essence of Marx, as a character to me, is this nutty over the top boss with huge screen clearing attacks. Thats kind of what his appearance in Star Allies went for as well. Thats what I mean by him fitting better as a boss character in WoL than being a playable character. Though, I felt the same way about Ridley and yet people were happy with the neutered and lame version of him we got in Ultimate so idk.

While Magolor shares a lot of similarities with Marx as a boss character, I feel like there is equally as much of him that is this silly, deceitful, greedy ship captain. To the point where toned down versions of his boss moves still feel very much like him as a character. His appearances in Kirby's Dream Collection and RtDLDX are evidence of this. Marx on the other hand is basically JUST a boss character, the Nightmare comparison you made is apt given I would never advocate for Nightmare to be playable either for similar reasons regardless of him being a Sakurai character.

I also don't put much weight into either Magolor or Marx's appearances in Star Allies as Dream Friends for move set potential, since both make you feel more like you are using a playable boss character than anything else.

And for the record, Susie and Adeline would also be terrible picks for different reasons. Honestly, every Dream Friend from Star Allies aside from BanDee and Magolor would be bad choices for Smash. I think Marx is unique in that he used to be popular in his own right in newcomer speculation prior to the modern era of Kirby, as well as the inevitable comparisons drawn between him and Magolor that paints them as interchangeable from non-fans of the series. To be honest though, in terms of Kirby villains, and not even including Magolor, he would still be pretty far down my list. He's not even really a main antagonist of a Kirby game. He's just the main antagonist of the Milky Way Wishes Sub-Game, which also happens to make him the final boss of Super Star. He's closer to Dyna Blade than Dark Matter, Daroach, Drawcia, Yin-Yarn, Sectonia, Haltman, or Fecto Elfilis

 

[Laniv]

While Magolor shares a lot of similarities with Marx as a boss character, I feel like there is equally as much of him that is this silly, deceitful, greedy ship captain. To the point where toned down versions of his boss moves still feel very much like him as a character. His appearances in Kirby's Dream Collection and RtDLDX are evidence of this. Marx on the other hand is basically JUST a boss character, the Nightmare comparison you made is apt given I would never advocate for Nightmare to be playable either for similar reasons regardless of him being a Sakurai character.

Y'know, incidentally, I recently finished the Magolor Epilogue in RtDLDX, and holy cow I think that made me want Magolor that much more. I want that play style in Smash Bros like yesterday

And for the record, Susie and Adeline would also be terrible picks for different reasons. Honestly, every Dream Friend from Star Allies aside from BanDee and Magolor would be bad choices for Smash

Hold on, let's not get too carried away now

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

I'll advocate Rick/Kine/Coo as a wacky combination fighter till my dying day:

 

[CosmicEternity44]

I'll advocate Rick/Kine/Coo as a wacky combination fighter till my dying day:

You know, I thought of Rambo, Squawks and Enguarde from Donkey Kong as a playable character in Smash based on that idea once.

 

[Among Waddle Dees]

And for the record, Susie and Adeline would also be terrible picks for different reasons. Honestly, every Dream Friend from Star Allies aside from BanDee and Magolor would be bad choices for Smash.

You might want to explain yourself, since that's not really a statement I find true in the slightest!

 

[smashkirby]

What characters would you love to see in Smash even if they aren’t the most logical first or next choice for their respective series? I’ve got a ton of them but here’s a few I’d be personally hyped by series that aren’t the obvious choice:

Mario - Pauline (I mean, I don't THINK she counts as someone people are looking as the NEXT Mario rep, right?)
Donkey Kong - Stanley
The Legend of Zelda - Linkle, Toon Zelda/Toon Sheik (Tetra) (Honestly, this would partially be for the lulz to see if Smash would really be THAT dead-set on keeping TLoZ playable representation to JUST the Triforce Trio)
Metroid - Anthony Higgs
Yoshi - Poochy
Pokémon - Plusle and Minun, Cynthia
F-Zero - Jody Summer
Fire Emblem - Anna, Lyn, Tiki, Caeda, Elincia, Itsuki, Tsubasa, Micaiah
Wario - Mona (Like Pauline, I'm pretty sure Mona isn't looked at as the NEXT Wario rep as much as Ashley, right?)
Xenoblade - Fiora, Rex, Eunie
Mega Man - Roll
Street Fighter - Sakura Kasugano, Akira Kazama, Batsu Ichimonji (I know Batsu isn't playable in a MAINLINE Street Fighter game, but I figured I'd throw him in to cover my bases)
Shin Megami Tensei - Jack Frost
Persona - Yu Narukami, Rise Kujikawa
Fatal Fury/King of Fighters/SNK in general - Mai Shiranui, Rock Howard, Bonne Jenet
Tekken - Ling Xiaoyu (with Miharu as an Alph-styled alt. skin), Kuma/Panda, Christie Monteiro, Mokujin (and its various "-Jin alts)/Combot

Thinking about it more, I kind of wonder if the Nintendogs are actually a bad pick for representing their series anyway. Like, the series is all about how caring for your pets, so how do you get that across with just the pet? Duck Hunt has a 4th wall shooter to reference light guns sure, but having a 4th wall pet owner seems much less effective at conveying the idea of the game, especially when compared to someone like Rosalina & Luma, who have a similar dynamic going on.

Perhaps a Mii Fighter would be better. Make a Mii Petowner variant that acts as a puppet and/or trap character where they give their pet commands or play with them using toys, or something. This would actually make the animal abuse angle worse, so I would make it so at worst the character's opponents could scare the animal rather than actually hitting them.

I was actually going to suggest a Mii or generic human character as well. Make the Nintendogs completely invincible with the Mii/human being the one that gets hit and KO'd. Like a reverse Pokemon Trainer.

Like, you could throw a ball for the Nintendog to fetch. The ball being thrown is treated like a proper projectile and the pup simply retrieves it after it hits the ground. Then you could have a special where it barks to draw an opponents attention or something. The dog can interact with the match to a degree but can't be interacted with by opponents.

I kid you not, this right here has been my general thoughts on how to handle the idea of a Nintendog/Nintencat character, where the pet itself wouldn't be interacted with. In fact, whatever would constitute as a K.O. for the character would result in the pet simply laying down, all bummed out that they "suffered a K.O.".

SMAASH! Puppy , you even came up with that idea that's been floating around in my head regarding the pet's "damage" being how scared they are rather than ACTUALLY getting hit.
Although, when I put it like that it STILL sounds pretty bad...

I'll advocate Rick/Kine/Coo as a wacky combination fighter till my dying day:

If I may, I'd like to throw in Nago, Chuchu, and Pitch in here, and make this a 6-in-1 character. Just really embrace the chaos of playing as a bunch of animals with special powers.

 

[SharkLord]

My personal take on Kirby reps is that why are there so many guests

Ah, sorry, anyways. My personal take on Kirby reps is that it's hard to go wrong with anyone, and there aren't any bad choices. That said, in terms of likelihood, Bandana Dee is undeniably a main character at this point. While Magolor isn't quite part of the core cast, he shows up fairly often in a series where most characters get relegated to cameos outside of Star Allies, and he even got his own Extra Mode dedicated to him, so after Bandana Dee I'd say he's the next most important character.

Marx is interesting, because while his legacy can be seen in the Soul bosses and their shared moves, he himself doesn't really show up often. He was the final boss of Super Star, died, and disappeared until the remake. There, he was revived as the secret final boss of The True Arena, and then died again. He then disappeared from the series once again until 2018, where he joined almost everyone else in Star Allies and also became a boss in Smash Ultimate. He's a pretty well-known figure as a boss, but his appearances are actually quite scarce. I'd argue that he's a step below Magolor on that basis.

...Man, I gotta replay the Kirby games. It's been years since I've cracked them open.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

My personal take on Kirby reps is that why are there so many guests

Haltmann is sending all the robobots

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

I admit it's part of my silly tendency to invent Smash character duos via flimsy reasoning, but I don't think I'd mind a Marx/Magalor combination fighter. You could essentially get the best elements from both characters and in a way pay off the hints in the Kirby games that the two were once associated. Plus the novelty of a now canon good guy teaming up with a (likely still) bad guy would be something different.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I mean I love Bandana Dee. A lot.

But let's not slam the other dream friends. They're awesome.

 

[AreJay25]

What I'm learning from this conversation is that we need a dedicated Kirby fighting ga-

oh

 

[DragonRobotKing26]

is that real?

edit: i'm dumb,this is a real Kirby game

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Marx is interesting, because while his legacy can be seen in the Soul bosses and their shared moves, he himself doesn't really show up often. He was the final boss of Super Star, died, and disappeared until the remake. There, he was revived as the secret final boss of The True Arena, and then died again. He then disappeared from the series once again until 2018, where he joined almost everyone else in Star Allies and also became a boss in Smash Ultimate. He's a pretty well-known figure as a boss, but his appearances are actually quite scarce. I'd argue that he's a step below Magolor on that basis.

This doesn't really change your point but I can't help myself but point out that while Marx probably did popularize the idea, technically that legacy belongs to Drawcia as the original Soul boss, and that's why bosses like Sectonia Soul and Chaos Elfilis have the "turn into a giant fireball and rush at Kirby" attack, and is also why one of Marx Soul's new attacks is splitting in half and sputtering into a bunch of paint balls lol

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

This doesn't really change your point but I can't help myself but point out that while Marx probably did popularize the idea, technically that legacy belongs to Drawcia as the original Soul boss, and that's why bosses like Sectonia Soul and Chaos Elfilis have the "turn into a giant fireball and rush at Kirby" attack, and is also why one of Marx Soul's new attacks is splitting in half and sputtering into a bunch of paint balls lol

Drawcia Soul is the original Soul boss, but Marx is the first Soul boss to be a True Arena final boss which is what every Soul boss since has been

Either way, you're still technically correct

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Drawcia Soul is the original Soul boss, but Marx is the first Soul boss to be a True Arena final boss which is what every Soul boss since has been

Either way, you're still technically correct

Very true, and a lot of them do also take moves from Marx, like the crescent cutters and teleportation.

Like I said, it doesn't change the point at all and Marx definitely had an impact on the implementation that can't be ignored, just making sure Drawcia gets her dues because I'm a Kirby nerd (as if my username doesn't make that obvious) and can't help myself lmao

 

[Among Waddle Dees]

What I'm learning from this conversation is that we need a dedicated Kirby fighting ga-

oh

Why can't this have gotten an upgrade like Forgotten Land did? The original was extremely underwhelming.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Why can't this have gotten an upgrade like Forgotten Land did? The original was extremely underwhelming.

Because after Air Riders, Sakurai will work on Kirby Fighters 3

 

[Guynamednelson]

Because after Air Riders, Sakurai will work on Kirby Fighter 3

Guest starring a bunch of non-Kirby characters

 

[Laniv]

Guest starring a bunch of non-Kirby characters

Qbby's gonna be S tier, trust me

 

[HyperSomari64]

Genesis NSO got updated!!!

Streets of Rage for Smash

 

[Ivander]

Really great to see the first Streets of Rage on the NSO finally. Also really nice to see the Sega Genesis NSO get updated again. And it didn't take as long as the gap between the last update and the one before that. The gap on that was between June 27 2023 and Nov 26 2024. Meanwhile, the gap between this update and the last was only around 4 months.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Personally I would want them to just get rid of Mach tornado all together or make it his final smash like how it works in Meta-Knightmare. Just replace it with a different move like Sword Beam or something.

Bring back gliding (why did they ever remove it? it fits him so well) or give him an up-b that actually lets him fly around.

You could give him a move that summons those massive tornados that move around on the ground since he can do that as a boss in nearly every game.

Let him use some of his Meta-Knightmare abilities like Meta-Quick, Summon Helper, of Heal.



There is a certain logic and criteria to the kind of character that gets in to or works in smash, and just choosing random side characters because you like them is a boring way to discuss roster picks unless you justify it beyond yourself.

If you are predicting or wanting characters like Elfillin over more established and popular picks for Smash like BanDee, it is inherently to be a contrarian. Thats not necessarily a bad thing, but you should own it and justify it. I feel like you should understand that as the Gengar for smash guy.

For example, when people were discussing the possibility of a Tekken character in Smash in Ult, most people were in consensus about Heihachi, with contrarian minorities speculating Kazuya or Jin. The contrarians in that case were correct, and possibly for similar reasons that the Smash team chose Kazuya over Heihachi.

I think Meta Knight's special moves work very well for the intended niche of showing off his power and skill because they look so impressive...well, they did in Brawl. Mach Tornado's visuals have sucked hard since then. Comparing them to his normals, I'd say his special moves are kinda the least of his problems. Most of them are just him flailing his sword around (they're probably supposed to be quick strikes, but that doesn't quite read when your arms are less than an inch long and your wrists don't exist), and they're super unwieldy to use due to how high his skill floor is. And actually, it's not just that his skill floor is high, he's just bad at neutral in the way a traditional swordfighter would be, so if you try to play him anywhere in that realm, he just feels bad.

As far as why they got rid of gliding...

Let's just say the mechanic was so broken they weren't confident they could make it fair until Steve.


Also, being contrarian is having a differing opinion for the sake of having a differing opinion. Wanting a character that isn't one of the ones that people find likely isn't contrarian since there's not really a way for your motivation to be directly opposed to the common opinion of likelihood. At most you're just being a hipster and wanting something that isn't popular.

Right but Noah’s Forward Tilt probably won’t be saving everyone from pointless lies

Thinking about it, Smash is technically Noah and Mio's biggest nightmare. lol

 

[Kirby Dragons]

I never cared much for Magolor or Marx as playable characters. I feel Marx in particular works best in a big boss role. Meanwhile, I think Bugzzy and Adeleine would be interesting fighters; the former being a grappler, and the latter being a summoner (who can ride her summons).

There's also Bonkers. He has several appearances in the series, and while Dedede uses a hammer, Bonkers would whip out tricks Dedede doesn't have. I've also been calling for Kirby to get a new side special, and that would make it so most of the Kirby cast doesn't have the same weapon.

As far as who I think they would choose after Dee? I honestly don't know. A lot of Kirby characters are important in one game, and then have minor appearances in the rest of the series, so nobody really stands out. It might just be hard to get a new Kirby character after Dee, and I'm prepared to accept that.

 

[kirbstr]

You might want to explain yourself, since that's not really a statement I find true in the slightest!

Not in terms of them not being interesting characters, that their move sets wouldn't be inspired, or that they couldn't work. Its just that, for being chosen to be in smash, neither really represent the series that well nor are they relevant characters to any recent Kirby releases. Hell, I love Susie and would be overjoyed if she made it into smash. I also recognize that she's just not a great roster choice for Kirby given the competition from other franchises for roster spots.

Most of the Star Allies dream friends are like that. Side characters or bosses from 1 or 2 Kirby games that got fun move sets in Star Allies as fan service. Not really characters I think should be taken seriously for Smash. Outside of MK, Dedede, and BanDee, only Goey and Magolor even got to appear in Kirby Fighters 2 lol.

If we could have 10 Kirby characters in the next Smash game then hell yea give me Susie, Adeline, Marx ect. The issue is that Kirby is long overdue for its 4th character and 5 would be a dream.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Not in terms of them not being interesting characters, that their move sets wouldn't be inspired, or that they couldn't work. Its just that, for being chosen to be in smash, neither really represent the series that well nor are they relevant characters to any recent Kirby releases. Hell, I love Susie and would be overjoyed if she made it into smash. I also recognize that she's just not a great roster choice for Kirby given the competition from other franchises for roster spots.

Most of the Star Allies dream friends are like that. Side characters or bosses from 1 or 2 Kirby games that got fun move sets in Star Allies as fan service. Not really characters I think should be taken seriously for Smash. Outside of MK, Dedede, and BanDee, only Goey and Magolor even got to appear in Kirby Fighters 2 lol.

If we could have 10 Kirby characters in the next Smash game then hell yea give me Susie, Adeline, Marx ect. The issue is that Kirby is long overdue for its 4th character and 5 would be a dream.

Tbh I kind of agree with this, including the bit about how I would love Susie (Robobot is like my favorite Kirby game) but don't think she's really a viable candidate because of the nature of Kirby allies USUALLY being one-and-done scenarios outside of Star Allies.

The only one I think doesn't really fall into this category is Magolor, but that's mostly because even though RtDLDX is a remake/remaster, they did add an entire new sub-story for him, something even Bandana Dee hasn't had yet.

I'm honestly kind of expecting Smash to hopefully add Bandana Dee next game and then just go without a new character for like another 15 years like we have ever since Brawl lol

 

[Ivander]

I'd be good with Bandana Dee and Magolor, but I still have my wish for the first non-Dedede/MetaKnight Recurring Kirby antagonist to be playable in Smash Bros.

 

[SPEN18]

I'm not gonna say he should necessarily be prioritized over Dee or Magolor at this point (unless he as well starts appearing in more stuff), but for me Marx is the Kirby villain. He's about every bit of the cosmic chaos wrapped in an unassuming outer package that one would ask for out of that role. I think he would translate extremely well to Smash, too.

The other thing to keep in mind is that until the Switch era, Magolor was still pretty much a one-off outside of the cameo-esque stuff that other Kirby characters like Marx also get. Though he did have some Smash Ballot performance to point to. It's kind of like w Bandana Dee arguably not really breaking out in proper until FL, despite the pre-existing popularity (though Magolor's is a much smaller "breakout" overall, if that's what you would wanna call it).

Anyway to be clear I would also be happy to see Magolor in Smash. Though I do think Marx was a better Kirby villain by pure opinion. Even if not actually true, Magolor does kind of give off the vibe though of like HAL's post-Sakurai version of Marx that fits with their tonal tendencies a little bit more, if that makes sense at all.