Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[Geno Boost]

Meh it helps Rayman's chances. I don't think there's really any disputing that. Congrats to Rayman fans. I enjoyed the old games back in the day and hen I was kid I was acutely aware that it was a VERY challenging set of games hahaha. I remember frustratingly turning my PS1 off to go outside and cool off hahaha.

I shall remain on team Sukapon though. Way better limbless choice I think. Represents the first Nintendo fighting game. Formerly held the world record for largest video game roster which would make an appearance in Smash very fitting. Both a retro and WTF/Left-Field type of character. Also first party. Using the Dark Samus philosophy of justifying an echo with a simple idle/movement change you could incorporate a whole litany of cast members from Joy Mech Fight to the point where you'd basically have a spiritual Joy Mech Fight 2 within Smash itself.

I want to live in an alternative timeline where both revealed in the same trailer
I do want both playable in smash as someone who played Rayman games and Joy Mech Fight it’s a dream come true for me and I don’t think 1 will stop the other from getting in
I feel the addition of Rayman would line up with the non Japanese audience while Sukapon would line up with the Japanese audience it’s perfect combo for the limbless bros

 

[fogbadge]

I want to live in an alternative timeline where both revealed in the same trailer

I get that. I’d like to live in the timeline where toad and chibi-robo got in

And where Chris chibnal didn’t break the dr who canon

 

[Sucumbio]

And where Chris chibnal didn’t break the dr who canon

Russell T Davies will right the ship!

 

[Laniv]

Not sure if this goes here, but I feel like it's worth a mention: Splatoon 3 has sold 3.45 million copies in Japan alone within the first three days of release, breaking the record previously held by Animal Crossing New Horizons:

News Release : Sep. 12, 2022 "Domestic sales of Splatoon 3 for Nintendo Switch surpass 3.45 million in first three days"

www.nintendo.co.jp

Pretty impressive, I'd say.

 

[fogbadge]

Russell T Davies will right the ship!

Let’s hope so

 

[chocolatejr9]

Not sure if this goes here, but I feel like it's worth a mention: Splatoon 3 has sold 3.45 million copies in Japan alone within the first three days of release, breaking the record previously held by Animal Crossing New Horizons:

News Release : Sep. 12, 2022 "Domestic sales of Splatoon 3 for Nintendo Switch surpass 3.45 million in first three days"

www.nintendo.co.jp

Pretty impressive, I'd say.

And they say Splatoon isn't a big deal...

 

[fogbadge]

And they say Splatoon isn't a big deal...

Who says that?

 

[osby]

Who says that?

Smash fans who stopped playing video games after Brawl, which feels like a surprisingly large group sometimes.

 

[chocolatejr9]

Who says that?

People who complain about Splatoon doing a lot of the same thing, but being perfectly fine with games like COD doing a lot of thd same thing. Though I'd rather not bring that debate here, as it's a bit off-topic (unless you wanna use the opportunity to talk COD in Smash)...

 

[fogbadge]

Smash fans who stopped playing video games after Brawl, which feels like a surprisingly large group sometimes.

Oh them

People who complain about Splatoon doing a lot of the same thing, but being perfectly fine with games like COD doing a lot of thd same thing. Though I'd rather not bring that debate here, as it's a bit off-topic (unless you wanna use the opportunity to talk COD in Smash)...

And to think there some series they say trying something new is the problem

 

[Diddy Kong]

Meh it helps Rayman's chances. I don't think there's really any disputing that. Congrats to Rayman fans. I enjoyed the old games back in the day and hen I was kid I was acutely aware that it was a VERY challenging set of games hahaha. I remember frustratingly turning my PS1 off to go outside and cool off hahaha.

I shall remain on team Sukapon though. Way better limbless choice I think. Represents the first Nintendo fighting game. Formerly held the world record for largest video game roster which would make an appearance in Smash very fitting. Both a retro and WTF/Left-Field type of character. Also first party. Using the Dark Samus philosophy of justifying an echo with a simple idle/movement change you could incorporate a whole litany of cast members from Joy Mech Fight to the point where you'd basically have a spiritual Joy Mech Fight 2 within Smash itself.

Sukapon, I remember it being a very popular choice during the Brawl era of speculation, or at least learned of it's existence back then. Was surprised to see it turn into a Assist Trophy in Ultimate, never expected that. But I also would rather see Sukapon than Rayman, only for the WTF factor.

 

[fogbadge]

Heads up everyone a direct got announced

https://twitter.com/NintendoUK/status/1569326012156059649?cxt=HHwWgoC9tbDsrscrAAAA

 

[Perkilator]

Heads up everyone a direct got announced

Right here:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

 

[fogbadge]

Right here:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

According to Nintendo uk, out of respect for national mourning they’ll be publishing the video rather than live stream

 

[chocolatejr9]

Right here:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Final bets, everybody: what're we getting?

 

[Nabbitfan730]

No, I extrapolated your post to the factors that may actually affect inclusion, because "knowing Mario" is certainly not one of them, as if Mario himself is the one handing out invitations. It's a simplistic view of what these collaborations really are: business deals. It doesn't matter if the characters know each other previously, they're not real, Rayman isn't calling Mario up to get him included.

What matters is the relationship between the companies. To that end, not only is the relationship between Ubisoft and Nintendo good, but I think this is the fifth time the Rayman/Rabbid IP and the Mario IP have crossed over (counting Smash). This may be the first time Rayman and Mario actually meet face to face, but it isn't actually breaking new ground in terms of company cooperation. The pieces in play have been in play for a long time.

Once again, you not actually addressing what's being said. When i did say "knowing Mario" was enough for him get in? When was that phrase or the notion Rayman knowing Mario even mentioned in my reply?

The point is having Rayman crossing over with Nintendo's games especially with their mascot bodes well to strengthen their Nintendo-Ubisoft relationship even further, most so than other characters whilst elevating Rayman to the spotlight + the possibility introducing to a new audience who might not have been familiar before like the Japanese Market.

Doesn't have to break "new ground" to increase his chances and business deals don't just end abruptly either with each one exist in a vaccum. Lot of talks through deals can open other ventures of more deals like crossovers with Nintendo or Ubisoft franchises

Also other than Smash, when are the other 4 times Mario and Rayman crossed over?

And why do put Rayman and Rabbids together as if they are the same ip despite being split into different things for almost a decade now?

And that's where the fact that they're different teams of course matters. If you had picked a different bunch of executives even just within Nintendo, Smash's DLC would likely look different, let alone a team at the Italian branch of Ubisoft. Different people have different values and bring different agendas to the table. Ubisoft putting Rayman in their crossover, and Nintendo not vetoing that addition has no bearing on the decisions of the Smash team. They're unrelated. If and when Ubisoft Milan gets to choose Smash's roster, I'd say we'd really be on to something.

"Nintendo not vetoing that addition has no bearing on the decisions of the Smash team" Despite the fact Nintendo was the ones who chose the roster for the most part with DLC. Even if executives do bring different ideas to the table, they still all have to come with to an agreement unanimously that ultimately represents the companies regardless so different values don't affect the possibilities as much as you think

Again, you addressing a point that wasn't made. Where did say that this crossover = Ubisoft Milan potentially choosing the roster? I'm the talking the chances of Nintendo themselves choosing Rayman for the next game, Milan getting involved or not with fighter selection is irrelevant to my point.

Btw, Ubisoft helms the M+R games, not Nintendo. They're the dev and the publisher. It's their sub-series. Nintendo just covers Japanese publishing duties and provides oversight. Nintendo doesn't run point here, so their acceptance of Rayman is passive.

That doesn't change the fact Nintendo is who had to give the permission to this crossover in the first place which is anything but passive.

I'm certainly not saying this hurts Rayman's odds. Ultimately, it's a boon. It's just not... as meaningful as people think. Like I said, the connections, the popularity, they were already in play. This is a feather in the cap of a character who already has merit. But it also doesn't remedy his shortcomings.

Being brought back into spotlight after a long hiatus, in featured in a Major Mario title + the potential to be introduced the Japanese market will do a lot more popularity and chances than he had before and while aren't the connection are new, it only just strengthens them.

This definitely does a lot more for his chances so i disagree saying the just a boon. The only real shortcomings is how Ubisoft is going to capitalise on all this. Do they keep the momentum going with more Rayman content or do they go to another hiatus again.

So I recently got NSO again. I used to have it for the first year of release but decided against it after that initial run. I did it so so that I could more easily transfer my game data over using cloud saves because I decided to upgrade my Switch's storage.

I don't even really see a point of Sakurai working so hard to get 60 FPS on this pathetic little device if this is what we get from the online. Oh well back to games with actual online instead of the facade of online like Ultimate has.

Why would you do that? NSO is an absolute waste of money and scam.

Also 60fps is how most action/fighting games should be at as its the most responsive and smooth, local or online so i don't get really get that remark. Framerate has nothing to do with a poor online experience.

I feel like Geno probably isn’t quite as popular with the general casual Smash fanbase as he is among hardcore fans here. He’s definitely popular enough to have gotten a Mii outfit in two games so he’s not out of the question but I’d personally put a few other characters above him in terms of general appeal and hype.

The more people move away from the notion that fighter's appeal and chances should revolve on just hype, the better this community will forever be

 

[Gengar84]

Once again, you not actually addressing what's being said. When i did say "knowing Mario" was enough for him get in? When was that phrase or the notion Rayman knowing Mario even mentioned in my reply?

The point is having Rayman crossing over with Nintendo's games especially with their mascot bodes well to strengthen their Nintendo-Ubisoft relationship even further, most so than other characters whilst elevating Rayman to the spotlight + the possibility introducing to a new audience who might not have been familiar before like the Japanese Market.

Doesn't have to break "new ground" to increase his chances and business deals don't just end abruptly either with each one exist in a vaccum. Lot of talks through deals can open other ventures of more deals like crossovers with Nintendo or Ubisoft franchises

Also other than Smash, when are the other 4 times Mario and Rayman crossed over?

And why do put Rayman and Rabbids together as if they are the same ip despite being split into different things for almost a decade now?




"Nintendo not vetoing that addition has no bearing on the decisions of the Smash team" Despite the fact Nintendo was the ones who chose the roster for the most part with DLC. Even if executives do bring different ideas to the table, they still all have to come with to an agreement unanimously that ultimately represents the companies regardless so different values don't affect the possibilities as much as you think

Again, you addressing a point that wasn't made. Where did say that this crossover = Ubisoft Milan potentially choosing the roster? I'm the talking the chances of Nintendo themselves choosing Rayman for the next game, Milan getting involved or not with fighter selection is irrelevant to my point.



That doesn't change the fact Nintendo is who had to give the permission to this crossover in the first place which is anything but passive.



Being brought back into spotlight after a long hiatus, in featured in a Major Mario title + the potential to be introduced the Japanese market will do a lot more popularity and chances than he had before and while aren't the connection are new, it only just strengthens them.

This definitely does a lot more for his chances so i disagree saying the just a boon. The only real shortcomings is how Ubisoft is going to capitalise on all this. Do they keep the momentum going with more Rayman content or do they go to another hiatus again.




Why would you do that? NSO is an absolute waste of money and scam.

Also 60fps is how most action/fighting games should be at as its the most responsive and smooth, local or online so i don't get really get that remark. Framerate has nothing to do with a poor online experience.



The more people move away from the notion that fighter's appeal and chances should revolve on just hype, the better this community will forever be

Hey, I’m not saying my most wanted characters are necessarily the most hyped characters. My top three most wanted are the Battletoads, Magus, and Zegram Ghart. I’m guessing the only reason that any of you might have any clue at all who Zegram is is because I talk about him. Magus and the Toads aren’t exactly the most popular choices either.

I was just taking a guess on who I felt was likely due to how relevant the characters were in the mainstream and Zero’s history with an Assist plus Mii outfit. My feeling that Geno isn’t as likely as some other characters doesn’t mean I’m against his inclusion. I loved Super Mario RPG. He still does have a decent enough chance since he did get a Mii outfit but I just wouldn’t say he’s near the top of most likely characters personally.

 

[TCT~Phantom]

Right here:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

I told yall to wait until next week. Doing a direct right when Splatoon 3 was about to launch was just not a great idea.

Anywho, onto Rayman. So for the little series I am working on (Update on that, expect the first part out soon), I have done a good chunk of write ups for some sections ahead of time. Right now for example the entire next section outside of the community poll results is written out for its first draft. I actually had typed up Rayman's early despite from what my plan is rn him being in the last section of the entire series. I redid it because honestly getting even a nod like this is more than he had got in ages. I still think most people here hit the nail on the head onto what I would say. Rayman is popular, but honestly compared to his peak in Smash 4 he is not as much of a top dog. The fact the Rayman series is basically a non starter in Japan is his biggest issue. The ball is entirely in Nintendo's court and I feel that that will end up hurting Rayman's odds. Let's just say if I had to bet on a platforming character whose company is already intertwined with Smash and had their big success on the PS1, I would not bet on Rayman. All that being said, I would love Rayman to be in and he is gonna get good marks in want. I just think that bombing in Japan is gonna end up being his death knell.

 

[Sucumbio]

Final bets, everybody: what're we getting?

From what I've read it's very likely we'll get some announcement on Wind Waker coming to Switch. Probably some talk about Metroid Prime too. Beyond those two things I'm really not sure.

 

[Perkilator]

Final bets, everybody: what're we getting?

Predictions:

• Quick shout-outs to games already released (namely Splatoon 3)
• 3rd party sizzle reel
• Some new game that nobody thought of but makes perfect sense
• Mario Movie trailer
• Some more ports

Hopes

• SSBU rerelease
• Project X Zone 3
• BOTW 2 gameplay
• Kid Icarus Uprising
• Tomato Adventure remake
• New 3D Mario (sneak peek)
• FE4 remake
• New Donkey Kong

 

[Gengar84]

Predictions:

• Quick shout-outs to games already released (namely Splatoon 3)
• 3rd party sizzle reel
• Some new game that nobody thought of but makes perfect sense
• Mario Movie trailer
• Some more ports

Hopes

• SSBU rerelease
• Project X Zone 3
• BOTW 2 gameplay
• Kid Icarus Uprising
• Tomato Adventure remake
• New 3D Mario (sneak peek)
• FE4 remake
• New Donkey Kong

What exactly would a SSBU rerelease entail? Isn’t it still being sold in stores? Would DLC passes start up again?

 

[Stratos]

I know it's been five years since Metroid Prime 4 was mentioned, but who knows? It may mention something in tomorrow's Nintendo Direct, not that this is certain of course but I want to hope, as well as for Pikmin 4 and maybe some new Pokémon from Pokémon Scarlet and Violet.

 

[Perkilator]

What exactly would a SSBU rerelease entail? Isn’t it still being sold in stores? Would DLC passes start up again?

Basically, an updated rerelease with all the DLC on the cartridge from the get-go.

 

[Gengar84]

Basically, an updated rerelease with all the DLC on the cartridge from the get-go.

Oh, so basically a complete edition. That’s not a bad idea. I already own the game so I wouldn’t personally be interested but it would be great for anyone that hasn’t bought it yet. I’d totally buy any future DLC passes they ever made if a complete edition renewed interest in the game enough to warrant continued DLC.

 

[fogbadge]

I predict Nintendo uk are never going to hear the end of this one

 

[Opossum]

Let's just say if I had to bet on a platforming character whose company is already intertwined with Smash and had their big success on the PS1, I would not bet on Rayman.

I just think it's funny that, now that Crash is owned by Microsoft, this statement applies to at least two platforming mascot animals lol. Both the Whoa and the Wahoo.

 

[fogbadge]

so how different are the US directs from the UK?

 

[chocolatejr9]

Oh yeah, now Directs can feel like Directs again:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

(Okay, I'll admit, I was starting to miss these, even though their reaction to Byleth was genuinely upsetting to me)...

 

[CannonStreak]

So, what are you guys expecting from the Direct anyway?

 

[chocolatejr9]

So, what are you guys expecting from the Direct anyway?

If rumors are true, then we're getting a bunch of Zelda at least. Also a Switch port of It Takes Two.

Also, it turns out Playstation is having another State of Play tomorrow, for anybody interested. They also acknowledged the Direct, but I can't tell if they were joking about the timing, or if it was a hint at something Playstation coming to Switch (as unlikely as that is)...

 

[CannonStreak]

If rumors are true, then we're getting a bunch of Zelda at least. Also a Switch port of It Takes Two.

Also, it turns out Playstation is having another State of Play tomorrow, for anybody interested. They also acknowledged the Direct, but I can't tell if they were joking about the timing, or if it was a hint at something Playstation coming to Switch (as unlikely as that is)...

Yeah, I know about the State of Play. I can't tell though if it is a coincidence or if they really are trying to compete with Nintendo.

 

[Perkilator]

So, what are you guys expecting from the Direct anyway?

Here’s mine:

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

I'll divide mine into predictions and hopes:

Predictions
DLC for Forgotten Land, Strikers, & Mario Kart 8 Deluxe.
GB/GBC for NSO, GBA for Expansion Pass
Suikoden Ports/Remasters
Devil May Cry 4 Special Edition
Fatal Frame 4
Panzer Dragoon II Zwei Remake
Lara Croft and the Guardian of Light/Temple of Osiris

Hopes
Sports Story
Tunic
Half Life 1 & 2 Ports
Castlevania DS Collection
Wind Waker & Twilight Princess HD Ports
Any sort of Metroid Prime News
A New Donkey Kong Country (please let us have this if nothing else)

 

[Laniv]

If rumors are true, then we're getting a bunch of Zelda at least. Also a Switch port of It Takes Two.

Also, it turns out Playstation is having another State of Play tomorrow, for anybody interested. They also acknowledged the Direct, but I can't tell if they were joking about the timing, or if it was a hint at something Playstation coming to Switch (as unlikely as that is)...

This is how we get a new PlayStation All-Stars.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Predictions:

• BotW 2, title and new trailer, 2024 release.
• Wind Waker / Twilight Princess port, or possibly OoT remake
• DLC for Fire Emblem Warriors Three Hopes
• Mario Kart 8 stuff
• GBA emulator

Wants:

- Donkey Kong

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Damn, that was a good Direct. Lots of great announcements.

 

[CannonStreak]

Well, Goldeneye for the Nintendo 64 has been announced for the Switch Online Expansion Pass. Maybe Sakurai can reconsider adding James Bond to the next Smash Bros game.

I am just kidding, please don't hurt me.

 

[Chuderz]

Yep that sucked. Oh well. Can't really expect anything halfway decent with Nintendo's leadership.

 

[Sucumbio]

Hypest moment for me was Goldeneye. Online multiplayer! Actually the N64 releases all sound great.

Resident Evil was probably the second hypest. Looking forward to the updated games and I've yet to play Village so that'll be cool. Not sure Cloud versions was the best choice but it may have been a necessary evil considering the switch's hardware limitations.

Square Enix had a lot of stuff. Octopath Traveler 2 especially seemed interesting.

Fire Emblem Engage looks interesting!

And of course the new Zelda is going to be ridiculous hype but we'll need more to really see what it's all about.

Overall a decent direct, I'm looking forward to some of these titles.

 

[CannonStreak]

Hypest moment for me was Goldeneye. Online multiplayer! Actually the N64 releases all sound great.

Resident Evil was probably the second hypest. Looking forward to the updated games and I've yet to play Village so that'll be cool. Not sure Cloud versions was the best choice but it may have been a necessary evil considering the switch's hardware limitations.

Square Enix had a lot of stuff. Octopath Traveler 2 especially seemed interesting.

Fire Emblem Engage looks interesting!

And of course the new Zelda is going to be ridiculous hype but we'll need more to really see what it's all about.

Overall a decent direct, I'm looking forward to some of these titles.

So, Goldeneye will have online multiplayer? Missed that part.