Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[Guynamednelson]

Because Wario still hasn't lost a single pound.

She ain't leaving till he does

How does she know he's not getting buffer? Muscle weighs more than fat

and there's definitely muscle on those arms

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

The Wii Fit Trainer joke has ran its course. It's kinda the same deal as Piranha Plant. Yes, the character is important to Nintendo's history and super recognizable but the surprise wore off so it's like... why are you still here.

What's the joke?

She wasn't added to be a surprise, otherwise she wouldn't have been the third goddamn newcomer shown off for For.
The token surprise was Duck Hunt. Should Duck Hunt go because the "surprise" wore off?

 

[Laniv]

Okay guys.

Do you think that Wii Fit Trainer will return?

Or will she be seen as superfluous?

I think she, as a unique character representing a very unique part of Nintendo's history, is pretty safe. She's like the modern Mr. Game & Watch, she ought to stay.

 

[RileyXY1]

Wii Fit Trainer is fine.

Sure the Wii brand isn’t really a thing anymore, but it was huge back in the day. That makes her a significant part of Nintendo history. Not to mention that she’s weird, and the Smash team likes their weirdos.

Also, there’s no real reason to get rid of her. She’s not wrapped up in copyright issues or about to be replaced by a newer character from the same franchise. She’s good.

The Wii is notably the fifth best selling console of all time, and Nintendo's second best selling console, as it sold over 101 million units. It is only beaten by the original Playstation, which sits in fourth place, the PS4 in 3rd, the Nintendo Switch in 2nd, and the PS2 at number one. This list does not count handhelds.

 

[Ivander]

Okay guys.

Do you think that Wii Fit Trainer will return?

Or will she be seen as superfluous?

I don't see her getting cut. Besides the very simplistic moveset, they're probably one of the most easiest characters to model and bring back.

 

[Opossum]

The Wii Fit Trainer joke has ran its course. It's kinda the same deal as Piranha Plant. Yes, the character is important to Nintendo's history and super recognizable but the surprise wore off so it's like... why are you still here.

This is a really bad false equivalence. Wii Fit Trainer is the sole representative of a historically important franchise, has an incredibly unique but unorthodox playstyle, and...also has an actual personality.

Piranha Plant is fighter number nine for its series (a series which also features at least two of the current most wanted characters across the Smash fandom, no less), was the token Low Priority Addition in the game which had the gimmick of having everyone, and is a generic mook...while also having an oft-criticized-as-incohesive kit, to boot.

Wii Fit Trainer is far closer to being like R.O.B., Duck Hunt, or Game & Watch than being like Piranha Plant. I don't think she's absolutely safe, but I do think her odds are above the 50/50 threshold...which is MUCH better than how I view Plant's prospects.

 

[Sucumbio]

Okay guys.

Do you think that Wii Fit Trainer will return?

Or will she be seen as superfluous?

"Let's step up the intensity!""

(I think she's good to come back.)

 

[superprincess]

Maybe I'm biased because I find her visually boring.

Ultimate has such striking particle effects for everyone, and WFT just has nothing. It's strange and makes her feel unfinished.

If she does stay, give her a pink tank top. Maybe I'd pick her up once in a while if they did that.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

Let Smash have its silly characters.

 

[Louie G.]

I don’t like the sentiment that an inherently wacky character has a joke to run dry. Wii Fit Trainer is silly, but Smash is a silly game. I think she’s a clever implementation of a very important game and a very inspired decision to build a moveset around yoga. She’s a niche character who doesn’t get a lot of play, but she’s someone who offers a lot to the roster dynamically IMO.

Whether or not she’ll return is another question - I’m kind of on the fence about that. I think she has a better chance of returning than many give her credit for at least, I feel like some are moreso eager to do away with her and not thinking much about it. It’s a shame these kind of characters are seen as expendable, although I will admit certain “surprise” additions also offer the least in terms of supplemental content. So I guess it feels easier to cut a series like that loose compared to something more deeply engrained in the game, with multiple stages and items and such. I will say if anything I think Wii Fit Trainer may skew toward the more favorable end to keep around than some of the older picks with less to currently offer. I like to maintain as many unique universes as we can, but once we trim down the series with "fluff" (Mario, Pokemon, FE), cut certain derivatives and a number of third parties this is probably where the conversation lands.

I feel like the introduction of Ring Fit has polluted the conversation around Wii Fit Trainer also. This is a fair thing to bring up, but I don’t believe these two would fight all that similarly. Ring Fit Trainer doesn’t do yoga, and it has dynamic magic oriented attacks - there is a concern to be had about an overlap in general theming, but whether or not that’s a problem may boil down to how big the roster is. They could also just add the villain Dragaux for someone more visually distinct, which is also admittedly my preference. But I’m no expert on Ring Fit, I’m kinda just working with what I know.

 

[Opossum]

I don’t like the sentiment that an inherently wacky character has a joke to run dry. Wii Fit Trainer is silly, but Smash is a silly game. I think she’s a clever implementation of a very important game and a very inspired decision to build a moveset around yoga. She’s a niche character who doesn’t get a lot of play, but she’s someone who offers a lot to the roster dynamically IMO.

Whether or not she’ll return is another question - I’m kind of on the fence about that. I think she has a better chance of returning than many give her credit for at least, I feel like some are moreso eager to do away with her and not thinking much about it. It’s a shame these kind of characters are seen as expendable, although I will admit certain “surprise” additions also offer the least in terms of supplemental content. So I guess it feels easier to cut a series like that loose compared to something more deeply engrained in the game, with multiple stages and items and such. I will say if anything I think Wii Fit Trainer may skew toward the more favorable end to keep around than some of the older picks with less to currently offer. I like to maintain as many unique universes as we can, but once we trim down the series with "fluff" (Mario, Pokemon, FE), cut certain derivatives and a number of third parties this is probably where the conversation lands.

I feel like the introduction of Ring Fit has polluted the conversation around Wii Fit Trainer also. This is a fair thing to bring up, but I don’t believe these two would fight all that similarly. Ring Fit Trainer doesn’t do yoga, and it has dynamic magic oriented attacks - there is a concern to be had about an overlap in general theming, but whether or not that’s a problem may boil down to how big the roster is. They could also just add the villain Dragaux for someone more visually distinct, which is also admittedly my preference. But I’m no expert on Ring Fit, I’m kinda just working with what I know.

It's funny that you admit to not having like, expert-level knowledge on Ring Fit, and yet you also get the distinctions between Wii Fit Trainer and the Ring Fit Trainee from like, a playstyle perspective. SO MANY people act as though they're literally interchangeable when they fight completely differently. Like...Ring Fit Trainee can launch multiple long-ranged rapid fire wind blasts with Ring, literally has flaming hair which is absolutely something Sakurai would use for a few attacks (I could definitely see it being used for like, an up smash, similar to Squidward's Krakatoa move in NASB2), and can conjure a magical set of Construct Abs to absorb blows before shattering it for shrapnel damage. Wii Fit Trainer uses yoga that humorously acts as combat maneuvers. Ring Fit Trainee is inherently a combatant, and as such fights very differently.

Like...oh no, they both jog. And Wii Fit Trainer's crouch looks like she's doing pushups.

 

[Serix]

Never been a fan of having generic enemies as fighters, but I would rather have had a Goomba than Plant. I think the moveset could be equally as creative and it would honestly be funny being able to destroy people with a badass Goomba Shoe spike.

 

[chocolatejr9]

Let Smash have its silly characters.

The devs were too scared of the power he holds...

 

[Noipoi]

I’m actually really interested in who the oddball pick will be next time around.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

The devs were too scared of the power he holds...

Hatsune Miku endorses it, so they must obey now.

 

[Louie G.]

I’m actually really interested in who the oddball pick will be next time around.

Does anyone have some good suggestions? I used to hear these tossed around all the time during Smash 4 speculation, it feels like we've collectively lost the passion... or I guess more accurately, we haven't needed to talk about it in a while. Ultimate's roster didn't have a ton of room for any weirdo retro or "hardware" oriented characters like we would have in the past. And now I guess Piranha Plant qualifies? So the gates are swung wide open on what it could be.

An idea I've always loved is Diskun. I just think he's adorable and I imagine him waddling around the stage, unable to bend his limbs too much so he uses his whole energy to swing one foot forward and follow suit. So I've got this whole visual identity in mind, but I don't quite know what he would end up doing... also uncertain if Sakurai would wanna take the plunge on a character we were never introduced to overseas. If Takamaru was a problem, Diskun certainly would be too. But he does feel right at home alongside other NES accessory-oriented characters such as ROB and Duck Hunt.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Does anyone have some good suggestions?

Takamaru from Mysterious Musume Ninja Castle, Stylist from Style Savvy, Famicom Detective Club or Another Code rep, maybe a Rhythm Heaven pick could count at this point?

 

[Swamp Sensei]

It is worth noting that Smash seems to avoid cutting franchises.

The only franchises to ever be cut were Ice Climber and Metal Gear. We know Ice Climber was only cut due to technical difficulties. And Metal Gear has third party baggage to complicate it's inclusion.

I don't think they'll willingly cut a first party franchise.

 

[DarthEnderX]

Does anyone have some good suggestions?

Bernard from Maniac Mansion.

 

[chocolatejr9]

Does anyone have some good suggestions? I used to hear these tossed around all the time during Smash 4 speculation, it feels like we've collectively lost the passion... or I guess more accurately, we haven't needed to talk about it in a while. Ultimate's roster didn't have a ton of room for any weirdo retro or "hardware" oriented characters like we would have in the past. And now I guess Piranha Plant qualifies? So the gates are swung wide open on what it could be.

An idea I've always loved is Diskun. I just think he's adorable and I imagine him waddling around the stage, unable to bend his limbs too much so he uses his whole energy to swing one foot forward and follow suit. So I've got this whole visual identity in mind, but I don't quite know what he would end up doing... also uncertain if Sakurai would wanna take the plunge on a character we were never introduced to overseas. If Takamaru was a problem, Diskun certainly would be too. But he does feel right at home alongside other NES accessory-oriented characters such as ROB and Duck Hunt.

It'll never happen in this life (or the next life, or even the life after that...), but hear me out: Parabo and Satebo, the mascots of the Satelliview.

 

[CannonStreak]

Bernard from Maniac Mansion.
View attachment 384026

Maybe for his Final Smash, have his two friends come in and have them turn into this before attacking opponents.

 

[Noipoi]

Does anyone have some good suggestions? I used to hear these tossed around all the time during Smash 4 speculation, it feels like we've collectively lost the passion... or I guess more accurately, we haven't needed to talk about it in a while. Ultimate's roster didn't have a ton of room for any weirdo retro or "hardware" oriented characters like we would have in the past. And now I guess Piranha Plant qualifies? So the gates are swung wide open on what it could be.

An idea I've always loved is Diskun. I just think he's adorable and I imagine him waddling around the stage, unable to bend his limbs too much so he uses his whole energy to swing one foot forward and follow suit. So I've got this whole visual identity in mind, but I don't quite know what he would end up doing... also uncertain if Sakurai would wanna take the plunge on a character we were never introduced to overseas. If Takamaru was a problem, Diskun certainly would be too. But he does feel right at home alongside other NES accessory-oriented characters such as ROB and Duck Hunt.

GENTLEMEN...BEHOLD

 

[superprincess]

I know Mario got a surprise oddball character already with Piranha Plant, but I've been thinking about this for a while and I genuinely feel like it'd be a hilarious WTF character to include.

...

Toadette and Peachette as a transforming character. No, Toad isn't involved at all. I thought of a concept for this and I'm feeling wild enough to share it right now so here goes nothing I guess!

Toadette acts as the base. She's on the weaker side, and is also stubby and very light. She has decent (but not exceptional) ground movement but horrendous jump height and air movement (a bit better than Steve, but not by much).

Her "gimmick" is that, ~35 seconds into the match, Toadette gets access to the Super Crown. By pressing Shield + B, she transforms into the super-powered Peachette! The catch is, unlike other "transform" characters, she cannot go back to her Toadette form.

You wouldn't really need to either. Peachette is almost a straight upgrade from Toadette, the only flaws being her bigger size (making her more susceptible to being hit) and a bit less ground acceleration. Her air movement, like in the game, is exceptional. Her moves are souped up versions of Toadette's, mixed with some funny twists on Peach's moves. For example, Dash attack is Peachette's attempt at Peach Bomber, but she ends up falling flat on her rear.

If she doesn't transform back though, how does Peachette's OPness balance out? Well, like a Powerup in the Mario series, opponents will have to beat it out of her. Suffering more than 50% damage as Peachette knocks the Super Crown right off her head, transforming her back to the mediocre Toadette. And she's stuck with it until next stock. The Super Crown can only be accessed once per stock, so be strategic.

That's it I guess..! Wow. That was way too long of a tangent for a character nobody freaking likes I do however feel like this pair is just a perfect WTF addition that would drive the Internet absolutely crazy, and I kinda love that.

 

[Speed Weed]

Does anyone have some good suggestions? I used to hear these tossed around all the time during Smash 4 speculation, it feels like we've collectively lost the passion... or I guess more accurately, we haven't needed to talk about it in a while. Ultimate's roster didn't have a ton of room for any weirdo retro or "hardware" oriented characters like we would have in the past. And now I guess Piranha Plant qualifies? So the gates are swung wide open on what it could be.

An idea I've always loved is Diskun. I just think he's adorable and I imagine him waddling around the stage, unable to bend his limbs too much so he uses his whole energy to swing one foot forward and follow suit. So I've got this whole visual identity in mind, but I don't quite know what he would end up doing... also uncertain if Sakurai would wanna take the plunge on a character we were never introduced to overseas. If Takamaru was a problem, Diskun certainly would be too. But he does feel right at home alongside other NES accessory-oriented characters such as ROB and Duck Hunt.

The big one I've been pushing for that I think would make sense and be a ton of fun is the Stylist from Style Savvy, but SynSophia leaving Nintendo to make their own off-brand Style Savvy has me a bit more uncertain about the possibility. Still would love to see it though

 

[NintenRob]

It'll never happen in this life (or the next life, or even the life after that...), but hear me out: Parabo and Satebo, the mascots of the Satelliview.

Hoo boy, that takes me back. I was THEE biggest advocate for those two back in the day

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I know Mario got a surprise oddball character already with Piranha Plant, but I've been thinking about this for a while and I genuinely feel like it'd be a hilarious WTF character to include.

...

Toadette and Peachette as a transforming character. No, Toad isn't involved at all. I thought of a concept for this and I'm feeling wild enough to share it right now so here goes nothing I guess!

Toadette acts as the base. She's on the weaker side, and is also stubby and very light. She has decent (but not exceptional) ground movement but horrendous jump height and air movement (a bit better than Steve, but not by much).

Her "gimmick" is that, ~35 seconds into the match, Toadette gets access to the Super Crown. By pressing Shield + B, she transforms into the super-powered Peachette! The catch is, unlike other "transform" characters, she cannot go back to her Toadette form.

You wouldn't really need to either. Peachette is almost a straight upgrade from Toadette, the only flaws being her bigger size (making her more susceptible to being hit) and a bit less ground acceleration. Her air movement, like in the game, is exceptional. Her moves are souped up versions of Toadette's, mixed with some funny twists on Peach's moves. For example, Dash attack is Peachette's attempt at Peach Bomber, but she ends up falling flat on her rear.

If she doesn't transform back though, how does Peachette's OPness balance out? Well, like a Powerup in the Mario series, opponents will have to beat it out of her. Suffering more than 50% damage as Peachette knocks the Super Crown right off her head, transforming her back to the mediocre Toadette. And she's stuck with it until next stock. The Super Crown can only be accessed once per stock, so be strategic.

That's it I guess..! Wow. That was way too long of a tangent for a character nobody freaking likes I do however feel like this pair is just a perfect WTF addition that would drive the Internet absolutely crazy, and I kinda love that.

Honestly, I don't think Toadette is surprising enough to be a surprise pick.

She's already established as a major Mario character and unlike Piranha Plant, she has a name and defined characterization. People unironically ask for her whether it be by herself, or with Toad / Captain Toad in tow. She's a playable character in several Mario platformers. I don't think she's likely, but she's an understood possibility.


Neat idea for a Toadette gimmick though.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

A 3rd Party off the wall pick....

 

[Louie G.]

I don't think they'll willingly cut a first party franchise.

Up until now I wholeheartedly agreed, but I'm still trying to make heads or tails of how they may approach this roster and it does leave me a bit concerned for some of the lesser series with only one character and minimal content. I have to imagine there isn't a deliberate intention to do so but if push came to shove I wonder if Sakurai would look at like... ROB's (sorry, I just needed an example - I love ROB) lack of supplemental content, or lack of potential to expand on any further, and put him in a lower priority position over series that can still be expanded on or have more of a presence across the board.

I don't think that would happen before we prune the bigger series, lower priority and less original characters and so forth but if the roster dips to this extent then I fear that some of the retro / surprise picks start to brush with danger. In their case I would hope their unique gameplay roles and novelties are enough to save them - like, Ice Climbers' duo mechanic feels like something you'd want to keep around. So it's difficult to figure that out, I don't know.

It'll never happen in this life (or the next life, or even the life after that...), but hear me out: Parabo and Satebo, the mascots of the Satelliview.

You win, that's my favorite suggestion. These guys rule.

 

[CannonStreak]

A 3rd Party off the wall pick....

I’d love to see that guy fight Ryu in Smash!

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Up until now I wholeheartedly agreed, but I'm still trying to make heads or tails of how they may approach this roster and it does leave me a bit concerned for some of the lesser series with only one character and minimal content. I have to imagine there isn't a deliberate intention to do so but if push came to shove I wonder if Sakurai would look at like... ROB's (sorry, I just needed an example - I love ROB) lack of supplemental content, or lack of potential to expand on any further, and put him in a lower priority position over series that can still be expanded on or have more of a presence across the board.

I don't think that would happen before we prune the bigger series, lower priority and less original characters and so forth but if the roster dips to this extent then I fear that some of the retro / surprise picks start to brush with danger. In their case I would hope their unique gameplay roles and novelties are enough to save them - like, Ice Climbers' duo mechanic feels like something you'd want to keep around. So it's difficult to figure that out, I don't know.

It really depends on just how big the roster will be.

For what it's worth though, I think the majority of cuts will be from third party franchises.

 

[Laniv]

Does anyone have some good suggestions? I used to hear these tossed around all the time during Smash 4 speculation, it feels like we've collectively lost the passion... or I guess more accurately, we haven't needed to talk about it in a while. Ultimate's roster didn't have a ton of room for any weirdo retro or "hardware" oriented characters like we would have in the past. And now I guess Piranha Plant qualifies? So the gates are swung wide open on what it could be.

An idea I've always loved is Diskun. I just think he's adorable and I imagine him waddling around the stage, unable to bend his limbs too much so he uses his whole energy to swing one foot forward and follow suit. So I've got this whole visual identity in mind, but I don't quite know what he would end up doing... also uncertain if Sakurai would wanna take the plunge on a character we were never introduced to overseas. If Takamaru was a problem, Diskun certainly would be too. But he does feel right at home alongside other NES accessory-oriented characters such as ROB and Duck Hunt.

Excitebiker? The Tap Trial girl from Rhythm Heaven? (As an aside, remember when the Chorus Kids were talked about? Good times.) The stylist from Style Savvy? Ayumi Tachibana? I'm pretty sure I brainstormed a moveset for a Nintendo DS back in the day. Ooh, or maybe Muddy Mole?

It'll never happen in this life (or the next life, or even the life after that...), but hear me out: Parabo and Satebo, the mascots of the Satelliview.

Or those guys, they'd be fun!

 

[superprincess]

We can't really make a good guess on if the next game will cut entire first party franchises, because there hasn't been enough of a precedent for it.

We didn't lose any from Melee to Brawl, but that's because there weren't even that many cuts in that game. And there weren't many "cut worthy" franchises to remove, because there weren't that many franchises that were added in Melee period. Only FE and G&W were, and both of those are staying around forever.

From Brawl to Smash 4, we did actually lose Ice Climbers, but that was because of technical issues. However, it still isn't like there were many "cut worthy" series added in Brawl. All the new series added either had a huge legacy (R.O.B., even though he doesn't have a series) or found themselves in a very fortunate position post-Brawl (Kid Icarus). And Pikmin was a bit of both.

Now, from SSB4-Ultimate to the next one, we've got lone first party characters that, if push comes to shove, could be seen as expendable. For example, Punch Out and the aforementioned Wii Fit have huge legacies, but not much of a future ahead of them.

However, we don't have much prior experience with cuts like this so we can't exactly tell either way, but I feel like saying Nintendo/Sakurai would avoid cutting whole one-fighter universes is a blanket statement at this point.

 

[smashkirby]

Okay guys.

Do you think that Wii Fit Trainer will return?

Or will she be seen as superfluous?

Well... I wouldn't say the Wii Fit Trainers are 100% cleared to return, but I see them having a better shot at returning than most characters.

I don’t like the sentiment that an inherently wacky character has a joke to run dry. Wii Fit Trainer is silly, but Smash is a silly game. I think she’s a clever implementation of a very important game and a very inspired decision to build a moveset around yoga. She’s a niche character who doesn’t get a lot of play, but she’s someone who offers a lot to the roster dynamically IMO.

Whether or not she’ll return is another question - I’m kind of on the fence about that. I think she has a better chance of returning than many give her credit for at least, I feel like some are moreso eager to do away with her and not thinking much about it. It’s a shame these kind of characters are seen as expendable, although I will admit certain “surprise” additions also offer the least in terms of supplemental content. So I guess it feels easier to cut a series like that loose compared to something more deeply engrained in the game, with multiple stages and items and such. I will say if anything I think Wii Fit Trainer may skew toward the more favorable end to keep around than some of the older picks with less to currently offer. I like to maintain as many unique universes as we can, but once we trim down the series with "fluff" (Mario, Pokemon, FE), cut certain derivatives and a number of third parties this is probably where the conversation lands.

I feel like the introduction of Ring Fit has polluted the conversation around Wii Fit Trainer also. This is a fair thing to bring up, but I don’t believe these two would fight all that similarly. Ring Fit Trainer doesn’t do yoga, and it has dynamic magic oriented attacks - there is a concern to be had about an overlap in general theming, but whether or not that’s a problem may boil down to how big the roster is. They could also just add the villain Dragaux for someone more visually distinct, which is also admittedly my preference. But I’m no expert on Ring Fit, I’m kinda just working with what I know.

It's funny that you admit to not having like, expert-level knowledge on Ring Fit, and yet you also get the distinctions between Wii Fit Trainer and the Ring Fit Trainee from like, a playstyle perspective. SO MANY people act as though they're literally interchangeable when they fight completely differently. Like...Ring Fit Trainee can launch multiple long-ranged rapid fire wind blasts with Ring, literally has flaming hair which is absolutely something Sakurai would use for a few attacks (I could definitely see it being used for like, an up smash, similar to Squidward's Krakatoa move in NASB2), and can conjure a magical set of Construct Abs to absorb blows before shattering it for shrapnel damage. Wii Fit Trainer uses yoga that humorously acts as combat maneuvers. Ring Fit Trainee is inherently a combatant, and as such fights very differently.

Like...oh no, they both jog. And Wii Fit Trainer's crouch looks like she's doing pushups.

While I don't know THAT much about the Ring Fit Trainees, what I HAVE seen about them definitely doesn't give off vibes of them even being potential semi-clones of WFT. Well, maybe they could be that at worst, but otherwise...

Heck, I'd say that on that front? Being a 3rd party IP aside, the Ring Fit Trainees are definitely in a better spot than ANYONE from something like the Fitness Boxing games, all of whom almost certainly would be clones/echoes of WFT, right down to borrowing animations from them, wholesale.

 

[Louie G.]

Now, from SSB4-Ultimate to the next one, we've got lone first party characters that, if push comes to shove, could be seen as expendable. For example, Punch Out and the aforementioned Wii Fit have huge legacies, but not much of a future ahead of them.

I would say Little Mac has at least the clout of established mainstays like Ness or Captain Falcon. Maybe less of a legacy internally, I'm certainly not claiming he's "Original 12 status" and I do believe the aforementioned two are kind of untouchable. But Punch-Out has about as much a future as F-Zero, or Kid Icarus, or arguably Star Fox. Which is to say, a state of indefinite limbo but not an impossibility. The last Punch-Out game was some time ago by now, but still on the more current end of otherwise "dead" or lesser utilized IPs and is a more substantial franchise than people recognize, technically having about five games. The home releases of Punch-Out and Super Punch-Out show very little resemblance to their arcade counterparts, at least.

Granted, he's also one of my most beloved characters and I have a strong personal attachment to the series. I have fears about it being treated as expendable, but by all means I don't think it should be by the metrics of other series that have been treated fairly up to this point. He's sitting much more within that weirdo dormant series ballpark than he is the Ice Climber and ROB club... even if the lack of substance to Punch-Out's representation implies otherwise.

I want to say if Little Mac was introduced a bit sooner, this wouldn't even be a question. We definitely tend to hold some esteem toward the characters who have been here the longest - if he was in Melee or Brawl with a similarly bleak future I assume we'd all just think he's coming back by default.

 

[Noipoi]

Little Mac is safe purely because they clearly love the boxing ring stage

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

We definitely tend to hold some esteem toward the characters who have been here the longest

For better or worse.

 

[Louie G.]

For better or worse.

Yeah, definitely not endorsing the mindset because I think it's the source of a lot of misconceptions and favoritism.

Like seeing rosters that cut Isabelle or Pyra / Mythra, characters who are otherwise completely obvious returnees just because they haven't technically established themselves as mainstays yet. Or Ike in the past, or Lucario or Greninja. I have to imagine they'd like to find a good balance of the old and the new, which means some characters who have been here since Melee or Brawl may be in danger of cycling out in favor of characters who have seen less opportunities, or characters who offer new opportunities.

I don't think this extends to the aforementioned Ness or Captain Falcon at least, or Pit who is practically adopted into that clique. But it's something we should probably have in mind since... I dunno, maybe they'll consider some of the older characters stale at this point? If we gotta make room then something has to give and it's not as easy as just booting the new guys. Admittedly I'm bad at this, I love traditions and I love Smash's history, but I'm trying to prepare myself for the inevitability of losing some of it down the line.

 

[smashkirby]

I’m actually really interested in who the oddball pick will be next time around.

I mean, if anyone here has been paying attention the posts I sometimes... well, post, that's one of my biggest sources of excitement when it comes to the release of a new Smash Bros. game.

Does anyone have some good suggestions? I used to hear these tossed around all the time during Smash 4 speculation, it feels like we've collectively lost the passion... or I guess more accurately, we haven't needed to talk about it in a while. Ultimate's roster didn't have a ton of room for any weirdo retro or "hardware" oriented characters like we would have in the past. And now I guess Piranha Plant qualifies? So the gates are swung wide open on what it could be.

An idea I've always loved is Diskun. I just think he's adorable and I imagine him waddling around the stage, unable to bend his limbs too much so he uses his whole energy to swing one foot forward and follow suit. So I've got this whole visual identity in mind, but I don't quite know what he would end up doing... also uncertain if Sakurai would wanna take the plunge on a character we were never introduced to overseas. If Takamaru was a problem, Diskun certainly would be too. But he does feel right at home alongside other NES accessory-oriented characters such as ROB and Duck Hunt.

Let's just say that it would be REALLY difficult for Sakurai to disappoint me on this front, ESPECIALLY if such a character is a 1st party character.

Spoiler

Lark (or any Pilotwings character for that matter)
A Wave Race character (preferably Ryota Hayami)
A 1080° character (preferably Akari Hayami, Kensuke Kimachi, or Ricky Winterborn)
A Nintendo LABO character
Sakura Samurai
Trax
Monita
A Rhythm Heaven character (preferably Yuka)
Dr. Lobe
Dr. Kawashima
Dr. Wright
Vince
Harry (Teleroboxer)
Icarus (Glory of Heracles)
Frey and Freya
Kyle Hyde
Ashley Mizuki Robbins
Raymond Bryce
A Nintendo Wars character (preferably Andy)
Qbby
Eddy (Fluidity)
Sukapon
Nikki (I guess she's technically in via Miis, but still)
Wonder-Red
A Magical Vacation/Starsign character
Zael
Aeron
Tamagon
Barbara the Bat
Mallo
Prince Sable
A Baiten Kaitos character
An Odama character
A Fossil Fighters character
A Kurikin character
Dillon
Mach Rider
F-Type
Kageshina Kurabe
Excitebiker
Balloon Fighter
Alice
Bubbles
Ayumi Tachibana
DeMille
Kururin
Chibi-Robo
Hakkun
The Marvelous trio (Dion, Max, and Jack)
Sheriff
Starfy
Muddy Mole
Mike Jones
Michael Anderson
Fighter Hayabusa
A sports character (the Volleyball Girl, the Ice Hockey team, etc.)
Ouendan and/or Elite Beat Agents (w/ their female counterparts)
Mr. Stevenson
Takamaru
Isaac
Ray (Custom Robo)
Alexandra Roivas
Jonathan Raimi
Jasmine Callsign (from Jet Impulse)
Hiro and/or Satoru (from Card Hero)
Sato Amatsubo (from Project H.A.C.K.E.R.)
Captain Rainbow
Goku and Chao
Donbe and Hikari
Lip
Saki Amamiya
A Style Savvy character
A Hanafuda character
Mini-Kangaroo (w/ various Nintendo toys from back in the day)
Ando Kensaku
Arcade Bunny
Grace and Savannah (from Tokyo Crash Mobs)
A Pop-Up Pursuit character
Orville (Takt of Magic)
A Cubivore character
Doshin/Jashin
Cupid
Aisya
Diskun
Jill
Tempo
Welt
Warrior Mech Gauss
Parabo and Satebo
Tin Star

and MANY more that I'm sure I probably forgot...

 

[Serix]

Does anyone have some good suggestions? I used to hear these tossed around all the time during Smash 4 speculation, it feels like we've collectively lost the passion... or I guess more accurately, we haven't needed to talk about it in a while. Ultimate's roster didn't have a ton of room for any weirdo retro or "hardware" oriented characters like we would have in the past. And now I guess Piranha Plant qualifies? So the gates are swung wide open on what it could be.

An idea I've always loved is Diskun. I just think he's adorable and I imagine him waddling around the stage, unable to bend his limbs too much so he uses his whole energy to swing one foot forward and follow suit. So I've got this whole visual identity in mind, but I don't quite know what he would end up doing... also uncertain if Sakurai would wanna take the plunge on a character we were never introduced to overseas. If Takamaru was a problem, Diskun certainly would be too. But he does feel right at home alongside other NES accessory-oriented characters such as ROB and Duck Hunt.

If Diskun gets in, they should make his unlock criteria ridiculously difficult to represent how hard his trophy was to get in Melee.

 

[SPEN18]

I feel like a lot of people are forgetting how demanded Mac was before getting in? Seems like a lot of people are stuck talking about him as "just another dead franchise," with not enough substance beyond that.