New Fox 50 50?

[TrashWizard]

I'm not too sure on whether this is common knowledge among fox mains or not, but i thought I would share it with you guys as I thought it might be helpful if it hasn't been pointed out yet

Kill Percents (on the definitive light medium and heavy characters):

Jigglypuff can be killed as early as 90%

Link can be killed at approximately 105%

Bowser can be killed at about 115%

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O-n-wnLpido
For Video reference

Quick description of how to perform this, You basically dair at the apex of a shorthop or fullhop and then follow through with an upsmash like one would with the pit Dthrow to Usmash.

Incredibly sorry if this is common knowledge or has been posted on this forum, I wasn't aware of this as I only started messing about with Fox yesterday.

Checked other DIs and found that downwards DI has a very tiny window to perform the Usmash on heavies and midweights, So I titled it as a 50 50 as you could read the DI and then 'tech check' before punishing your opponent.

EDIT: Probably also common knowledge but in the lower percents (below 50) If the dair launches the opponent behind him he can utilt to nair to dash attack OR if the opponent DIs backwards or gets launched backwards then you can nair to another aerial.

 

[luke_atyeo]

yeah this is common knowledge and has been around since the start of the game, you can get a very similar thing by using light/sourspot nair, at the right percents it'll pop people up in such a way that you can combo a running usmash.

 

[Top Boss]

Jigglypuff looked like she could've air dodged in that video. But yeah, down air to up smash is a good kill set up out of shield(with a short hop down air). It would probably kill jiggs about 20% earlier than what you demonstrated as well.

 

[TrashWizard]

Jigglypuff looked like she could've air dodged in that video.

Not sure whether she could, I'll test it and look further into the stuff you can do out of the dair, quite an interesting move to be honest.

EDIT: Just tested, turns out she cannot airdodge at mid 80s percent, so I guess if you want a more guarranteed kill go for the 90% kill, also tested, you can kill jiggs at about 75 percent but she can airdodge out of it

 

[Nubber]

Yes it's common kill set up. Also Nair into a followed up usmash. There are ones that are less known like down throw to rar bair that's percentage specific or utilit edge gaurd into uair that people that don't main fox don't know of.
But the Nair or dair into usmash is well known by mains of different character mains so they usually see it coming and tech it. The Nair and dair set up requires them to miss the tech is the biggest thing.

 

[luke_atyeo]

down throw to rar bair that's percentage specific.

Also very DI specific

 

[Nubber]

All throw set ups are di specific hence the 50/50 . Come on Luke your just nit picking now.

 

[TrashWizard]

How about catching them in a fair so that they dont expect it, that way they dont tech it and you get a 'free' usmash without any DI problems?
I guess there still would be problems against longer ranged characters as approaching in air is very dependent on whether they have a long range aerial.
Also not sure if this is commonly used, havent seen many fox fights.

 

[Nubber]

Down throw fair never connects on a competent player and the fair can be teched.

The down throw rar bair set up is di specific to ppl that di away. If they di towards you a sh uair we'll catch them. But the percentage is before uair kill range unfortunately.

 

[TrashWizard]

Err... I never said downthrow fair neither did I say it couldn't be teched, I was saying you could use fair like people use metaknights bair to get people to miss techs, so you basically bring them downwards, and because the timing for it is strange when you are being pulled down by a fast faller, they might miss the tech, leaving you able to punish with an usmash.

 

[Nubber]

Sorry thought you said down throw fair. But dair and Nair work better for a upsmash set ups. Catching them in a fair missed tech is usually near ledges so downsmash would be optimal.

 

[TrashWizard]

Sorry thought you said down throw fair. But dair and Nair work better for a upsmash set ups. Catching them in a fair missed tech is usually near ledges so downsmash would be optimal.

Definitely, I just kinda went along with the thread theme of usmash setups, but pretty much any move would work, and because of the almost completely horizontal knockback of the downsmash it would be very effective at getting an early kill too.
Also would like to mention the tech check capabilities of the downsmash, which means that even if they do tech the fair and roll behind you to get a cross up you can still downsmash.

 

[Top Boss]

Down throw to down air is pretty great, esp vs fast fallers or fatties.

 

[Kofeezy]

Yes it's common kill set up. Also Nair into a followed up usmash. There are ones that are less known like down throw to rar bair that's percentage specific or utilit edge gaurd into uair that people that don't main fox don't know of.
But the Nair or dair into usmash is well known by mains of different character mains so they usually see it coming and tech it. The Nair and dair set up requires them to miss the tech is the biggest thing.

If you're confident in your opponent's teching abilities, you can read the tech and still have them eat an up smash, I've done it before. The safest way to tech the dair/nair setup are towards Fox but I've never once had someone who doesn't use Fox regularly do that.

 

[Nubber]

If you're confident in your opponent's teching abilities, you can read the tech and still have them eat an up smash, I've done it before. The safest way to tech the dair/nair setup are towards Fox but I've never once had someone who doesn't use Fox regularly do that.

Me either they alway tech roll back it seems.
And top I love doing downthrow dairs it catches air dodge spammers but it's a bad habit of mine too because a lot of their options if they don't airdodge beat that frame 9 active hit box. I think it's frame 9 not sure. Usually I do down throw nairs until I'm almost certain of their di habits .