Chip.
you know what to do
Sup everyone,
I've come here to share my thoughts, critiques, and strategies with Toon Link since I played him.
I already posted this thread in the Brawl boards but I decided to post one here too. I noticed Jash already posted a thread much like this, so if you would like a second opinion well then here it is!
I just got 9th at my first tournament going all Toon Link for my first time playing the game around last week. Granted, that's not spectacular or anything but I did do my best playing as a new charachter my first time. I understand that Brawl is coming out in 3 days (well 2 now lol) but for the many people who are going to main toon Link I feel that you should read what I have to say about him and all of his moves. This is so you can know what moves are great, what moves are not so great, see when to use certain moves at certain times, etc. I put some time into making this so I hope you read all of it. If you have any questions about anything concerining toon Link I'd be happy to answer them. Enjoy!
Overview
Well, after playing toon Link for awhile I'll give you my thoughts: I'm impressed. He seems like a solid, well-balanced charachter that possesses long strings of combos that is uncommonly seen in Brawl. Yes, to all the young Link players in Melee this is Toon Link: the new Young Link. In fact it is Young Link still lol. He's young still. . . and he's Link . Toon Link got just a little bit Luigified, but for the better. Anyway, you can't JUST play toon Link like you played young Link in Melee; you have to play him like you'd play Marth AND Young Link. He has a great spam game with well designed close combat moves. He's really different from Young Link. Anyway, I enjoyed and had a lot of fun playing as toon Link so I hope you do too!
If you want some specific critiques over his moves well here they are:
Specifics
Projectiles
His projectiles got nerfed in the long run, but are still very useful in certain matchups.
Bow- Yeah the bow doesn't have fire arrows anymore *sigh* lol. but that's not too bad. The bad thing is that the speed of the arrows are much much slower than adult Link's or Pit's arrows. The good thing is that me and Silent Wolf discovered how to shoot too arrows in a quick consectutive manner in one short hop (think of SHDL with Fox or Falco). Once you master how to do double bow spamming, then arrows become very useful assets for toon Link's arsenel.
Boomerang- Visually, the boomerang isn't very impressive. It looks a lot like Link's boomerang from smash 64 in how it spins in the air. Unfortunately, there is no more point-blank boomerang 19% damage thing anymore. . . or at least I don't think there is? I'm not sure. It's also pretty slow as well. BUT, the boomerang is still very useful for spamming at enemies and racking up some quick damage when you need it.
Bombs- Bombs got nerfed big time. Sorry guys, but you won't be busy using bombs anymore but instead shooting lots of arrows lol. Anyway, bombs don't have that juicy combo stun that allowed young Link from Melee to always get a free hit. In Brawl, they're a lot like Melee adult Link's bombs: puny stun time with almost no comboabiltity XD. On top of that, people catch bombs here and there like it's nothing. That's because you don't have to press ANYTHING to catch a bomb; the game catches it for you! It's kind've hard to explain. But yeah, bombs aren't that good anymore. Use them sparingly.
Arials
Dang! Toon Link rapez yo shiz with arials! Toon Link did get a tad bit Luigified but for the better. He has Marth arials now lolz. check it out.
Nair- Nair is awesome and is a great kill move. It's identical to Marth's Nair and is used the same way as well. When you use it, however, make sure you start it up right away and then fast-fall so you garuntee yourself an auto-cancel.
Bair- His Bair is Mega-Broken (is that a word? Well it is now anyway lol). This is, imo, his best arial. You can combo the crap out of charachters with this attack like there's no tomarrow. Use toon Link's bair like you would with Marth's Fair from Melee (or Brawl lolz) because it has HUGE combo potential as you all very well may know. At low percents you can unleash this juicy combo of Bair->Bair (in 1 short-hop)->double forward smash = a 40%ish combo. At higher % you can basically just follow up bair after bair and get hella damage when it's needed.
Fair- His Fair. . . meh *shrug*. It's alright, I guess. It could be better let's say. I thought toon Link's Fair was going to be identical to his Bair from what I heard and the videos that I saw of him but it's not. I mean,it has it's uses but it comes out reeeally slow compared to his Bair so it's harder to Auto-cancel. Not to mention it's landing lag is enormous as well if you don't happen to Auto-cancel (which throws the idea of double Fairs in a short-hop out the window). And on top of all that: it's not comboable -_-. The good news about it is that it's a great kill move, so that should be it's main purpose NOT for spacing and comboing stuff.
Uair- His Uair is still exactly the same as in Melee, but slightly better. The longer it stays out, the bigger the knockback (I THINK, so don't quote me on that =]). This is also a really great kill move; easily his best arial for off the top ko's. You can also string this move into a combo like Bair-> double jump Uair or something and get a kill with it. A great move overall.
Dair- His Dair is visually the same, but has been altered a little bit. The cool thing that strikes you the most is the automatic fast-fall properities that comes with it. Because toon Link is so floaty, this attack will really throw opponents off the first few times when toon Link falls at them like a rock and you can score some satisfying damage. Dair also has AMAZING spacing against opponents sheilds. If you hit their sheild, then toon Link will bounce a few times in the air with the hitbox still below him, but HE is still above them which means the guy your fighting can jump right into you again lol. Yeah it's cool. It's got spiking properties on it so that's always a plus.
Hookshot (arial)- Ah yes. The arial hookshot. This move is superb. The hookshot comes out fairly fast and hits the oppoenent straight in the face. It has way more range than toon Link's fair too so I believe this should replace toon Link's fair for face-to-face combat. Not to mention the best part: it has NO lag after landing. Not a bit. It's different from auto-canceling b/c auto-cancelling has 4 frames of lag but after landing with the arial hookshot you don't even have that 4 frames. You immediately go back to your standing animation as if you never left the ground. It's so good! I really don't think I was abusing this move as much as I should've been when I played.
Ground moves
Let's see. . .
Jabs- Jabs are really good. They have a lot of good range and you can do cool stuff like jab->jab->Dsmash/Usmash/whatever.
Utilt- is still the same good ol' Utilt. You can combo with it like you did in Melee. Probably still the same speed as it was in Melee too.
Dtilt- seems way faster and way less lagier than the Melee dtilt. But I did not find myself using it much; partly because I forgot the move existed every once and a while ;]. I think this could potentially have some good sheild pressure but I'm not positive.
Ftilt- Ftilt is exactly the same. Use it for spacing or a back-up kill move in case you've wasted your other kill moves by using it too much (the new stale move deterioration system thingy).
Dsmash- Aahhhhh no. Dsmash is way different now =(. It looks the same but it's trajectory is now all poopy. The first strike pulls the opponent behind Link and then the back end of the second slash hits them up and diagonal away from you. It's not a horizontal kill move anymore, but it definetly has some ko power left in it except for vertical ko's now. It's still a really good move.
Usmash- this is completely different now/Luigified. It's now one, single, clean stroke of his sword (Looks like his Utilt, except it's more profound and Link unleashes a hella battle cry). This move is really good for killing, so expect to use it out of your sheild to finish your opponent.
Fsmash- the Fsmash got buffed up. This is probably the strongest move toon Link posseses (same in Melee). It's still the exact same move as in Melee: the first strike keeps the opponent stunned while the second strike blasts them away into oblivion. The great news is that on Brawl, the first strike has much, much more stun time than young Link's Fsmash. So yeah, it *****.
Dash attack- got nerfed HARD. It's ********. I would go out as far as to say it's toon Link's worst move but I'm not sure since I have only played the game for roughly less than 24 hrs. But seriously it does nothing >_>. Well not really, but like when you hit with it,. . . it hits the opponent on their butt as if they just tripped. And they sit there. I really don't see much potential in this move, but just using the move for the sake of hitting an enemy with something rather than nothing; like if the guy is floating a little aways from you and all you can hit them with is a dash attack, then go for it. It doesn't have the neat horizontal, killing trajectory like in Melee sadly.
UpB- is really cool. It has the multiple hits on it like his spin attack did in Melee BUT it has some punch behind it too! The knockback almost rivals Link's now! UpB out of sheild is pretty useful: use the move to get the opponent away from you when your in your sheild so they leave you alone and you can spam them. You can also charge the UpB (despite it's not really that useful) it's still cool to see. It still won't kill ppl but that's okay. Although, his arial upB does actually kill pretty well. You can combo with full hop Bair->double jump->Bair->arial UpB and you can sometimes finish them off with it. This is one of my personal favorite moves.
Grabs
I love toon Link's grab. It seems about the same as in Melee (crappy grab range in comparison to adult Link) but I think the initial grab itself is a lot faster. Or at least, that's what my brother, Deva, kept telling me (he's an amazing Link player. Go check his and my vids out!). So yeah, sheild grabs seem better with toon Link maybe b/c of it's faster grab speed, but maybe not.
Dthrow is the same except is not as comboable
same with Uthrow
Fthrow seems no different either
Bthrow is the only one a bit different, but better. It ACTUALLY has knockback when you use it lol. I found myself using this move a lot more than a thought for some reason.
Recovery
Toon Link's recovery is AMAZING in this game! Man, you will never die because of how good toon Link's double jump and upB are for gaining distance toward the stage. Hookshot is kinda dumb but it could be used for mindgames. Soo yeah nothimg much else to say. His recovery is broken nuff said lol.
Well there you have it. I hope that if you read all that that you learned something only if you haven't played the game yet. If you got any questions I'll be happy to answer them. Later in time, I would like to add charachter specific matchups to the thread and other stuff. So yeah, that's about it. Ask anything you got! =)
I've come here to share my thoughts, critiques, and strategies with Toon Link since I played him.
I already posted this thread in the Brawl boards but I decided to post one here too. I noticed Jash already posted a thread much like this, so if you would like a second opinion well then here it is!
I just got 9th at my first tournament going all Toon Link for my first time playing the game around last week. Granted, that's not spectacular or anything but I did do my best playing as a new charachter my first time. I understand that Brawl is coming out in 3 days (well 2 now lol) but for the many people who are going to main toon Link I feel that you should read what I have to say about him and all of his moves. This is so you can know what moves are great, what moves are not so great, see when to use certain moves at certain times, etc. I put some time into making this so I hope you read all of it. If you have any questions about anything concerining toon Link I'd be happy to answer them. Enjoy!
Overview
Well, after playing toon Link for awhile I'll give you my thoughts: I'm impressed. He seems like a solid, well-balanced charachter that possesses long strings of combos that is uncommonly seen in Brawl. Yes, to all the young Link players in Melee this is Toon Link: the new Young Link. In fact it is Young Link still lol. He's young still. . . and he's Link . Toon Link got just a little bit Luigified, but for the better. Anyway, you can't JUST play toon Link like you played young Link in Melee; you have to play him like you'd play Marth AND Young Link. He has a great spam game with well designed close combat moves. He's really different from Young Link. Anyway, I enjoyed and had a lot of fun playing as toon Link so I hope you do too!
If you want some specific critiques over his moves well here they are:
Specifics
Projectiles
His projectiles got nerfed in the long run, but are still very useful in certain matchups.
Bow- Yeah the bow doesn't have fire arrows anymore *sigh* lol. but that's not too bad. The bad thing is that the speed of the arrows are much much slower than adult Link's or Pit's arrows. The good thing is that me and Silent Wolf discovered how to shoot too arrows in a quick consectutive manner in one short hop (think of SHDL with Fox or Falco). Once you master how to do double bow spamming, then arrows become very useful assets for toon Link's arsenel.
Boomerang- Visually, the boomerang isn't very impressive. It looks a lot like Link's boomerang from smash 64 in how it spins in the air. Unfortunately, there is no more point-blank boomerang 19% damage thing anymore. . . or at least I don't think there is? I'm not sure. It's also pretty slow as well. BUT, the boomerang is still very useful for spamming at enemies and racking up some quick damage when you need it.
Bombs- Bombs got nerfed big time. Sorry guys, but you won't be busy using bombs anymore but instead shooting lots of arrows lol. Anyway, bombs don't have that juicy combo stun that allowed young Link from Melee to always get a free hit. In Brawl, they're a lot like Melee adult Link's bombs: puny stun time with almost no comboabiltity XD. On top of that, people catch bombs here and there like it's nothing. That's because you don't have to press ANYTHING to catch a bomb; the game catches it for you! It's kind've hard to explain. But yeah, bombs aren't that good anymore. Use them sparingly.
Arials
Dang! Toon Link rapez yo shiz with arials! Toon Link did get a tad bit Luigified but for the better. He has Marth arials now lolz. check it out.
Nair- Nair is awesome and is a great kill move. It's identical to Marth's Nair and is used the same way as well. When you use it, however, make sure you start it up right away and then fast-fall so you garuntee yourself an auto-cancel.
Bair- His Bair is Mega-Broken (is that a word? Well it is now anyway lol). This is, imo, his best arial. You can combo the crap out of charachters with this attack like there's no tomarrow. Use toon Link's bair like you would with Marth's Fair from Melee (or Brawl lolz) because it has HUGE combo potential as you all very well may know. At low percents you can unleash this juicy combo of Bair->Bair (in 1 short-hop)->double forward smash = a 40%ish combo. At higher % you can basically just follow up bair after bair and get hella damage when it's needed.
Fair- His Fair. . . meh *shrug*. It's alright, I guess. It could be better let's say. I thought toon Link's Fair was going to be identical to his Bair from what I heard and the videos that I saw of him but it's not. I mean,it has it's uses but it comes out reeeally slow compared to his Bair so it's harder to Auto-cancel. Not to mention it's landing lag is enormous as well if you don't happen to Auto-cancel (which throws the idea of double Fairs in a short-hop out the window). And on top of all that: it's not comboable -_-. The good news about it is that it's a great kill move, so that should be it's main purpose NOT for spacing and comboing stuff.
Uair- His Uair is still exactly the same as in Melee, but slightly better. The longer it stays out, the bigger the knockback (I THINK, so don't quote me on that =]). This is also a really great kill move; easily his best arial for off the top ko's. You can also string this move into a combo like Bair-> double jump Uair or something and get a kill with it. A great move overall.
Dair- His Dair is visually the same, but has been altered a little bit. The cool thing that strikes you the most is the automatic fast-fall properities that comes with it. Because toon Link is so floaty, this attack will really throw opponents off the first few times when toon Link falls at them like a rock and you can score some satisfying damage. Dair also has AMAZING spacing against opponents sheilds. If you hit their sheild, then toon Link will bounce a few times in the air with the hitbox still below him, but HE is still above them which means the guy your fighting can jump right into you again lol. Yeah it's cool. It's got spiking properties on it so that's always a plus.
Hookshot (arial)- Ah yes. The arial hookshot. This move is superb. The hookshot comes out fairly fast and hits the oppoenent straight in the face. It has way more range than toon Link's fair too so I believe this should replace toon Link's fair for face-to-face combat. Not to mention the best part: it has NO lag after landing. Not a bit. It's different from auto-canceling b/c auto-cancelling has 4 frames of lag but after landing with the arial hookshot you don't even have that 4 frames. You immediately go back to your standing animation as if you never left the ground. It's so good! I really don't think I was abusing this move as much as I should've been when I played.
Ground moves
Let's see. . .
Jabs- Jabs are really good. They have a lot of good range and you can do cool stuff like jab->jab->Dsmash/Usmash/whatever.
Utilt- is still the same good ol' Utilt. You can combo with it like you did in Melee. Probably still the same speed as it was in Melee too.
Dtilt- seems way faster and way less lagier than the Melee dtilt. But I did not find myself using it much; partly because I forgot the move existed every once and a while ;]. I think this could potentially have some good sheild pressure but I'm not positive.
Ftilt- Ftilt is exactly the same. Use it for spacing or a back-up kill move in case you've wasted your other kill moves by using it too much (the new stale move deterioration system thingy).
Dsmash- Aahhhhh no. Dsmash is way different now =(. It looks the same but it's trajectory is now all poopy. The first strike pulls the opponent behind Link and then the back end of the second slash hits them up and diagonal away from you. It's not a horizontal kill move anymore, but it definetly has some ko power left in it except for vertical ko's now. It's still a really good move.
Usmash- this is completely different now/Luigified. It's now one, single, clean stroke of his sword (Looks like his Utilt, except it's more profound and Link unleashes a hella battle cry). This move is really good for killing, so expect to use it out of your sheild to finish your opponent.
Fsmash- the Fsmash got buffed up. This is probably the strongest move toon Link posseses (same in Melee). It's still the exact same move as in Melee: the first strike keeps the opponent stunned while the second strike blasts them away into oblivion. The great news is that on Brawl, the first strike has much, much more stun time than young Link's Fsmash. So yeah, it *****.
Dash attack- got nerfed HARD. It's ********. I would go out as far as to say it's toon Link's worst move but I'm not sure since I have only played the game for roughly less than 24 hrs. But seriously it does nothing >_>. Well not really, but like when you hit with it,. . . it hits the opponent on their butt as if they just tripped. And they sit there. I really don't see much potential in this move, but just using the move for the sake of hitting an enemy with something rather than nothing; like if the guy is floating a little aways from you and all you can hit them with is a dash attack, then go for it. It doesn't have the neat horizontal, killing trajectory like in Melee sadly.
UpB- is really cool. It has the multiple hits on it like his spin attack did in Melee BUT it has some punch behind it too! The knockback almost rivals Link's now! UpB out of sheild is pretty useful: use the move to get the opponent away from you when your in your sheild so they leave you alone and you can spam them. You can also charge the UpB (despite it's not really that useful) it's still cool to see. It still won't kill ppl but that's okay. Although, his arial upB does actually kill pretty well. You can combo with full hop Bair->double jump->Bair->arial UpB and you can sometimes finish them off with it. This is one of my personal favorite moves.
Grabs
I love toon Link's grab. It seems about the same as in Melee (crappy grab range in comparison to adult Link) but I think the initial grab itself is a lot faster. Or at least, that's what my brother, Deva, kept telling me (he's an amazing Link player. Go check his and my vids out!). So yeah, sheild grabs seem better with toon Link maybe b/c of it's faster grab speed, but maybe not.
Dthrow is the same except is not as comboable
same with Uthrow
Fthrow seems no different either
Bthrow is the only one a bit different, but better. It ACTUALLY has knockback when you use it lol. I found myself using this move a lot more than a thought for some reason.
Recovery
Toon Link's recovery is AMAZING in this game! Man, you will never die because of how good toon Link's double jump and upB are for gaining distance toward the stage. Hookshot is kinda dumb but it could be used for mindgames. Soo yeah nothimg much else to say. His recovery is broken nuff said lol.
Well there you have it. I hope that if you read all that that you learned something only if you haven't played the game yet. If you got any questions I'll be happy to answer them. Later in time, I would like to add charachter specific matchups to the thread and other stuff. So yeah, that's about it. Ask anything you got! =)
