Mii Gunner 1111 vs 1312. My personal experience and results with both Gunner sets.

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

Hello y'all! Wii Twerk Trainer here. Being one of the best Mii Gunner users in the world, I thought I'd share my thoughts and results of 1111 and 1312.

Why 1312? 1312 is pretty much the best Gunner set(in my opinion). I use to say 3312 was superior, but Charge Shot was just alot more reliable than Grenade for Guest Size Gunner.

I've collected alot of data with both 1111 and 1312 Gunner. Here goes.

What I'd do is I'd challenge strong and powerful players with both Gunner sets. To prevent jank or obscure MU wins, I would always teach them before battle with everything Gunner does, such as GunDashing, Smash attacks, aerials, etc. I told them what all of Gunners special moves do, such as Charge Shot, Flame Pillar, Lunar Launch, Reflector, Missile, and Bomb Drop. I want a great challenge and I want my opponents I challenge to know what to do, so I can add this to my Gunner research.

After many challenges with high and some top level players with both Gunner sets.

I noticed my win rate with 1111 was alot lower than my win rate with 1312. My chance of winning with 1312 was considerably high, compared to 1111. The stronger players I played with 1111, the worse my results were. However, when I used 1312 vs the people I lost badly as 1111. I was winning and doing way better. Missile and Bomb Drop made a huge difference in the battles. I had alot more to throw out and cover my landings. So much shield pressure and it was alot easier to score kills with missile(slow) and Bomb Drop. Having more options made all MU's easier for me.

I even would ask the people I played about which one was more difficult. They always said 1312 was alot harder to face, since I pressured them and walled them out badly. They said the missiles and Bomb Drop made the matches so stressful on them. They also said 1111 was very repetitive and it was way easier to deal with. Heck, I would get earlier kills thanks to missile set ups/follow ups and Bomb Drop lol The players were just shocked of how amazing 1312 makes Mii Gunner. I had comments of Gunner being a secret high tier with 1312 with the crazy stuff I was doing to them lol

I recently did get 5th place out of 520+ people with using mostly Mii Gunner(1111) at 2GG: Breakthrough. But remember, this was an Arcadian SoCal regional. If it was a regular SoCal regional, I wouldn't even make it that far with 1111 Gunner.

In conclusion, challenging SoCal PR and many other powerful players with both 1111 and 1312 Guest Gunner. I did superior with 1312 and my opponents would always say that one is definitely the best Gunner set, and/or is the most difficult Gunner set to play against.

Remember, this is my opinion. You are free to think whatever you want and use whatever set you want. I just personally believe 1312 is superior than others, due to me having the best and most consistent results with it vs high and top level players.

 

[Djmarcus44]

Hello y'all! Wii Twerk Trainer here. Being one of the best Mii Gunner users in the world, I thought I'd share my thoughts and results of 1111 and 1312.

Why 1312? 1312 is pretty much the best Gunner set(in my opinion). I use to say 3312 was superior, but Charge Shot was just alot more reliable than Grenade for Guest Size Gunner.

I've collected alot of data with both 1111 and 1312 Gunner. Here goes.

What I'd do is I'd challenge strong and powerful players with both Gunner sets. To prevent jank or obscure MU wins, I would always teach them before battle with everything Gunner does, such as GunDashing, Smash attacks, aerials, etc. I told them what all of Gunners special moves do, such as Charge Shot, Flame Pillar, Lunar Launch, Reflector, Missile, and Bomb Drop. I want a great challenge and I want my opponents I challenge to know what to do, so I can add this to my Gunner research.

After many challenges with high and some top level players with both Gunner sets.

I noticed my win rate with 1111 was alot lower than my win rate with 1312. My chance of winning with 1312 was considerably high, compared to 1111. The stronger players I played with 1111, the worse my results were. However, when I used 1312 vs the people I lost badly as 1111. I was winning and doing way better. Missile and Bomb Drop made a huge difference in the battles. I had alot more to throw out and cover my landings. So much shield pressure and it was alot easier to score kills with missile(slow) and Bomb Drop. Having more options made all MU's easier for me.

I even would ask the people I played about which one was more difficult. They always said 1312 was alot harder to face, since I pressured them and walled them out badly. They said the missiles and Bomb Drop made the matches so stressful on them. They also said 1111 was very repetitive and it was way easier to deal with. Heck, I would get earlier kills thanks to missile set ups/follow ups and Bomb Drop lol The players were just shocked of how amazing 1312 makes Mii Gunner. I had comments of Gunner being a secret high tier with 1312 with the crazy stuff I was doing to them lol

I recently did get 5th place out of 520+ people with using mostly Mii Gunner(1111) at 2GG: Breakthrough. But remember, this was an Arcadian SoCal regional. If it was a regular SoCal regional, I wouldn't even make it that far with 1111 Gunner.

In conclusion, challenging SoCal PR and many other powerful players with both 1111 and 1312 Guest Gunner. I did superior with 1312 and my opponents would always say that one is definitely the best Gunner set, and/or is the most difficult Gunner set to play against.

Remember, this is my opinion. You are free to think whatever you want and use whatever set you want. I just personally believe 1312 is superior than others, due to me having the best and most consistent results with it vs high and top level players.

First, I want to congratulate you on your performance at 2GG: Breakthrough. I had no idea that the tournament was that large. Do you know the top 16 for that tournament? (@Das Koopa is gathering the results of tournaments with 80+ participants and notable players)

While I agree that 1312 is a better moveset for Gunner than 1111, I think that part of the difference in results between the movesets could be attributed to 1312 fitting your skillset better than 1111. From what I've seen in your tournament sets, it seems that your ability to zone and condition opponents with projectiles is one of your greatest strengths. 1312 gives you more projectiles for accomplishing that purpose. Even though I think that 1312 is the better moveset, I perform better with 1111 because I am more accustomed to the simpler zoning and higher priority of the 1111 moveset.

From what I've seen out of Mii Gunner players in tournament and my personal experience, I think that the predictability of 1111 Gunner might be more of a player issue than a character issue. When I was playing a North Louisiana power ranked player in friendlies, My Gunner got two-stocked twice by his main, King Dedede. After the second loss, I realized that I was being predictable with my fair (He knew that I was going to start the match with short hop fair, so he perfect shielded the move easily. Since I didn't know at the time that close range fair was safe enough on perfect shield to avoid getting punished, I ended up getting hit by dash attack), so I ended up reading his counter to my predictable play (dash into shield) and using this knowledge to beat him in the third game. In addition, I have seen some variations of playing Gunner's neutral in competitive play. For example, AEMehr mainly uses fair for gundashing, while I mainly use fair for getting combos, follow ups, and setting up for kills with charge blast. In addition, I use Gunner's jab pretty often for damaging mixups and setting up for kills with smash attacks, down tilt, up tilt, and charge blast, while I have seen players such as RougePenguin go a full match without using Gunner's jab.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

First, I want to congratulate you on your performance at 2GG: Breakthrough. I had no idea that the tournament was that large. Do you know the top 16 for that tournament? (@Das Koopa is gathering the results of tournaments with 80+ participants and notable players)

While I agree that 1312 is a better moveset for Gunner than 1111, I think that part of the difference in results between the movesets could be attributed to 1312 fitting your skillset better than 1111. From what I've seen in your tournament sets, it seems that your ability to zone and condition opponents with projectiles is one of your greatest strengths. 1312 gives you more projectiles for accomplishing that purpose. Even though I think that 1312 is the better moveset, I perform better with 1111 because I am more accustomed to the simpler zoning and higher priority of the 1111 moveset.

From what I've seen out of Mii Gunner players in tournament and my personal experience, I think that the predictability of 1111 Gunner might be more of a player issue than a character issue. When I was playing a North Louisiana power ranked player in friendlies, My Gunner got two-stocked twice by his main, King Dedede. After the second loss, I realized that I was being predictable with my fair (He knew that I was going to start the match with short hop fair, so he perfect shielded the move easily. Since I didn't know at the time that close range fair was safe enough on perfect shield to avoid getting punished, I ended up getting hit by dash attack), so I ended up reading his counter to my predictable play (dash into shield) and using this knowledge to beat him in the third game. In addition, I have seen some variations of playing Gunner's neutral in competitive play. For example, AEMehr mainly uses fair for gundashing, while I mainly use fair for getting combos, follow ups, and setting up for kills with charge blast. In addition, I use Gunner's jab pretty often for damaging mixups and setting up for kills with smash attacks, down tilt, up tilt, and charge blast, while I have seen players such as RougePenguin go a full match without using Gunner's jab.

Thanks! I only entered out of boredom with 1111 Gunner at that regional. Didn't expect to get a top placing lol

I play both Gunner sets the same tho. I juat charge my charge shot and hold it, to cause pressure and anxiety to the opponent and release when the time is right. I do a constant fair spacing with both. I'll gundash and be sneaky and apply the same techs with both 1111 and 1312.

My biggest issue with 1111 was just the lack of "extra projectiles". All I can do with 1111 is just spam fair, Nair when right, jab to keep rushdown at bay, and throw them off stage with throws and attempt to get a flame pillar ledge thing started. It's the same repetitive style over and over. There is really no ways to make 1111 Gunner unique, since his strategy is very telegraphed. Which is why they told me that 1312 was full of more surprises and wasn't as predictable and boring as 1111 and I sadly have to agree with them on that.

I just get so creative with the extra tools 1312 provides. I can do so much crazy stuff that I would never be able to do with 1111.

-Missile on non power shielded shield at close range = Free Grab.

-Slow Missile can do the following:
*Can create traps
*You can get a Smash conform from a slow missile.
*Charge Shot is easy to land with an active missile.
*Makes landing on stage hard for an airborn opponent.
*Can cause a reset if it hits a person who just hit the ground
*Can be used to edgegaurd
*Can be used to gimp bad recoveries
*Slow movimg projectile that you can move alongside with.
*Causes opponents to block, which equals a free grab.
*Anti air support
*Baits out reflectors

-Fast Missile has many uses as well
*Safe on shield(non power shield)
*Little to no lag when shot
*Very fast and has long range
*Does 10%
*Very spammy
*Amazing Anti air
*Great ledge tool. Spam it near the ledge and you can force an opponent to do a specific ledge option. Ex)Spamming a short hop missile near the ledge will force an opponent to do a get up attack, get up, or roll. Punish it asap with a full charge shot of smash attack. If they live, repeat the process.
*Missile into jump charge shot is a cute kill confirm(situational).

-Both Missile types are godsends for Mii Gunner! Easily the best projectile in the game, with how versatile it is with the traps and harrassment it causes and creates.

-Bomb Drop is just so freakin amazing!
*Massive Shield stun
*BD+Full Charge = Shield Break
*Gives Gunner a free land in most situations
*Eats through almost all attacks in the game.
*Becomes a solid Kill move with rage. Kills around 130-145% on the whole cast with rage(When Gunner has 100%-149%). Kills earlier with Max Rage(When Gunner has 150%+).

The addition of Missile and Bomb Drop just allow Gunner to be super creative amd scary. He can do so many crazy things! His potential becomes untapped and it's so fun to create so many walls and traps. Every thing I do with 1111, I just transfer it over to 1312 and I get even more options now, since there ia so much more to do with Missiles and Bomb Drop, than Flame Pillar and Reflector.

If I wanted to, I could easily use 1111 Gunner and become power ranked in SoCal if I wanted to. I don't, cause 1111 is just so boring and repetitive. 1312 at least allows me to do so many unique things, than to just spam fair, roll, grab, and jab the whole entire game.

Edit: I know Top 8 for 2GG Break through was
1)AC(Falco/Marth)
2)Pitbull(Lucario/Lucina)
3)EonWave(Fox/Marth)
4)Jingen(Captain Falcon)
5)Dynamo(Sheik)
6)Wii Twerk Trainer aka Me lol(1111 Gunner/WiiFit)
7)Razo(Peach/Fox)
8)Athena(Robin)

Besides this event being a 500+Man Arcadian. It was still stacked, since alot of powerful players live in SoCal. Players who made Top 32 here have a history of causing an upset vs Power Ranked players in SoCal or out of state. Everyone in Top 8 is from SoCal, except Athena. She's from NorCal. Many out of state peeps came to this event. $1000 for 1st place was the prize haha. You still get money for making Top 8 at least.

Gotta see who the other 8 in top 16 were. Don't rememember sadly. Sorry about that.

 

[AEMehr]

I feel that this thread's existence is kinda unnecessary because such an exclamation goes without saying, lol.

I mean it's a good read, but the whole point of this thread is already common knowledge :U

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

I feel that this thread's existence is kinda unnecessary because such an exclamation goes without saying, lol.

I mean it's a good read, but the whole point of this thread is already common knowledge :U

This board ia dead and it saddens me greatly. Just wanted to make a post, cause I had to kill time on the cycling machine lmao

 

[Ridel]

I feel that this thread's existence is kinda unnecessary because such an exclamation goes without saying, lol.

I mean it's a good read, but the whole point of this thread is already common knowledge :U

Yeah I agree, the only reason that people are favoring 1111 over 1312 right now is mostly because of the restriction to Mii specials at most tournaments. There are only and handful of players out there that play 1111 Gunner just because of preference.

That being said, do you have any recent tourney VODs of both your 1111 Gunner and 1312 Gunner that I could observe Wii Twerk Trainer ?

 

[Djmarcus44]

Thanks! I only entered out of boredom with 1111 Gunner at that regional. Didn't expect to get a top placing lol

I play both Gunner sets the same tho. I juat charge my charge shot and hold it, to cause pressure and anxiety to the opponent and release when the time is right. I do a constant fair spacing with both. I'll gundash and be sneaky and apply the same techs with both 1111 and 1312.

My biggest issue with 1111 was just the lack of "extra projectiles". All I can do with 1111 is just spam fair, Nair when right, jab to keep rushdown at bay, and throw them off stage with throws and attempt to get a flame pillar ledge thing started. It's the same repetitive style over and over. There is really no ways to make 1111 Gunner unique, since his strategy is very telegraphed. Which is why they told me that 1312 was full of more surprises and wasn't as predictable and boring as 1111 and I sadly have to agree with them on that.

I just get so creative with the extra tools 1312 provides. I can do so much crazy stuff that I would never be able to do with 1111.

-Missile on non power shielded shield at close range = Free Grab.

-Slow Missile can do the following:
*Can create traps
*You can get a Smash conform from a slow missile.
*Charge Shot is easy to land with an active missile.
*Makes landing on stage hard for an airborn opponent.
*Can cause a reset if it hits a person who just hit the ground
*Can be used to edgegaurd
*Can be used to gimp bad recoveries
*Slow movimg projectile that you can move alongside with.
*Causes opponents to block, which equals a free grab.
*Anti air support
*Baits out reflectors

-Fast Missile has many uses as well
*Safe on shield(non power shield)
*Little to no lag when shot
*Very fast and has long range
*Does 10%
*Very spammy
*Amazing Anti air
*Great ledge tool. Spam it near the ledge and you can force an opponent to do a specific ledge option. Ex)Spamming a short hop missile near the ledge will force an opponent to do a get up attack, get up, or roll. Punish it asap with a full charge shot of smash attack. If they live, repeat the process.
*Missile into jump charge shot is a cute kill confirm(situational).

-Both Missile types are godsends for Mii Gunner! Easily the best projectile in the game, with how versatile it is with the traps and harrassment it causes and creates.

-Bomb Drop is just so freakin amazing!
*Massive Shield stun
*BD+Full Charge = Shield Break
*Gives Gunner a free land in most situations
*Eats through almost all attacks in the game.
*Becomes a solid Kill move with rage. Kills around 130-145% on the whole cast with rage(When Gunner has 100%-149%). Kills earlier with Max Rage(When Gunner has 150%+).

The addition of Missile and Bomb Drop just allow Gunner to be super creative amd scary. He can do so many crazy things! His potential becomes untapped and it's so fun to create so many walls and traps. Every thing I do with 1111, I just transfer it over to 1312 and I get even more options now, since there ia so much more to do with Missiles and Bomb Drop, than Flame Pillar and Reflector.

If I wanted to, I could easily use 1111 Gunner and become power ranked in SoCal if I wanted to. I don't, cause 1111 is just so boring and repetitive. 1312 at least allows me to do so many unique things, than to just spam fair, roll, grab, and jab the whole entire game.

Edit: I know Top 8 for 2GG Break through was
1)AC(Falco/Marth)
2)Pitbull(Lucario/Lucina)
3)EonWave(Fox/Marth)
4)Jingen(Captain Falcon)
5)Dynamo(Sheik)
6)Wii Twerk Trainer aka Me lol(1111 Gunner/WiiFit)
7)Razo(Peach/Fox)
8)Athena(Robin)

Besides this event being a 500+Man Arcadian. It was still stacked, since alot of powerful players live in SoCal. Players who made Top 32 here have a history of causing an upset vs Power Ranked players in SoCal or out of state. Everyone in Top 8 is from SoCal, except Athena. She's from NorCal. Many out of state peeps came to this event. $1000 for 1st place was the prize haha. You still get money for making Top 8 at least.

Gotta see who the other 8 in top 16 were. Don't rememember sadly. Sorry about that.

Thanks for the information. I managed to find the bracket for 2GG Breakthrough online, and I found the characters they used by finding the tournament on YouTube.

While 1312 definitely offers more options than 1111 Gunner, you are forgetting some of the options for 1111 Gunner. Bair is a good option to use since it is safe on shield when spaced properly (-3 on shield drop), and it has a chance of tripping the opponent at low percents (Gunner can get up to 43% from a combo if the Bair trips an opponent). In addition, it is good for setting up tech chases at mid to high percents. The weak hit of flame pillar is really good for combos. It can true combo into dash attack, and charge blast at a wide percent range (It should be able to true combo into rar Bair, but I haven't tested it out yet). Gunner also has decent spacing tools out of a pivot such as ftilt, flame pillar, and fsmash.

Most of the fun that 1111 Gunner has to offer comes from optimizing the character's tools. Taking advantage of Gunner's grab combos and mixups from grab and jab adds an interesting, semi-aggresive playstyle to Gunner. Landing the fair to charge blast 50-50 is also a very fun way to mitigate the biggest weakness of Mii Gunner ( SR-71 has some good information about taking advantage of fair to charge blast in the Mii Gunner kill setups and killing options thread).

 

[SR-71]

I agree mostly with Djmarcus44 who said that you prefer 1312 because it fits your playstyle more, and 1111 is more about optimizing your tools in varied situations. 1312 is not a better moveset overall, they are different.

We are basically only talking about Flame Pillar and Reflector vs. Missiles and Bomb Drop. The first style is more precise and gives better edgeguarding and recovery. The second is more campy but I made this point elsewhere and I must do it again: Missiles and Bomb Drop don't really do anything which Fair and Charge Shot can't do already. The zoning in front of you is much better covered with Fair and CS, and landing options are better with gundashing combined with turnaround shine. That's just my opinion but I still don't see why anyone would pick Missiles over Flame Pillar after seeing the things Flama and others can do with Flame Pillar. The edgeguarding game for Gunner becomes high tier because of that move, and it also covers the downward angle in a more useful way than Bomb Drop. And Flame Pillar combos into Charge Shot, and more, as Djmarcus44 points out.

I would argue more people use 1111 competitively, not just because it is more legal on Anther's and elsewhere but because it is more useful. You have more tools. I disagree that 1312 has more options. Reflector is essential in my book, for recovery and combo-breaking and out-camping other campers. Flame pillar is jank heaven but you have to practice the spacing a lot. The bottom line is both sets are great, but it comes down to your own playstyle and preference. Missiles and Bombs are easy but I personally prefer more tools and option coverage provided by 1111. And I love getting out of Mario's uptilts with Reflector and gundashing all over the place with it. That looks and feels hype. I have personally never enjoyed watching gunner reduced to a bomb-throwing camp-fest, I think the community also hates to see that.

 

[Ridel]

I agree mostly with Djmarcus44 who said that you prefer 1312 because it fits your playstyle more, and 1111 is more about optimizing your tools in varied situations. 1312 is not a better moveset overall, they are different.

We are basically only talking about Flame Pillar and Reflector vs. Missiles and Bomb Drop. The first style is more precise and gives better edgeguarding and recovery. The second is more campy but I made this point elsewhere and I must do it again: Missiles and Bomb Drop don't really do anything which Fair and Charge Shot can't do already. The zoning in front of you is much better covered with Fair and CS, and landing options are better with gundashing combined with turnaround shine. That's just my opinion but I still don't see why anyone would pick Missiles over Flame Pillar after seeing the things Flama and others can do with Flame Pillar. The edgeguarding game for Gunner becomes high tier because of that move, and it also covers the downward angle in a more useful way than Bomb Drop. And Flame Pillar combos into Charge Shot, and more, as Djmarcus44 points out.

I would argue more people use 1111 competitively, not just because it is more legal on Anther's and elsewhere but because it is more useful. You have more tools. I disagree that 1312 has more options. Reflector is essential in my book, for recovery and combo-breaking and out-camping other campers. Flame pillar is jank heaven but you have to practice the spacing a lot. The bottom line is both sets are great, but it comes down to your own playstyle and preference. Missiles and Bombs are easy but I personally prefer more tools and option coverage provided by 1111. And I love getting out of Mario's uptilts with Reflector and gundashing all over the place with it. That looks and feels hype. I have personally never enjoyed watching gunner reduced to a bomb-throwing camp-fest, I think the community also hates to see that.

I personally prefer 1111 because it's way more interesting to play as and imo is a better jack of all trades set. Sure it doesn't win some MUs that 1312 beats but I feel it is much better equipped for MUs that become more polarizing with 1312. Reflector is very very helpful against other zoners, Villy in particular as that MU is much worse for 1312. I do feel you may slightly exaggerate Flame Pillars ledge coverage abilities. Imo I feel people don't know how to deal with it rn which is why it feels so strong. We will just have to see how people adapt to it is all. Overall though I see 1312 as only very slightly better, but that is mostly because of potential.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

Just posting on here to inform that I will no longer be apart of the Mii Gunner or Mii Community anymore. So I won't be posting on here anymore(hooray for everyone here).

I just butt heads with way too many Mii users. So I'll just keep in contact with Chibo, Rom, and Dapuffster only. I'll just keep any gunner and Mii tricks to myself, since everyone here either throws my knowledge to the side or doesn't take what I say seriously, despite me being the one of the very few Mii user to have the privilege of actually challenging many powerful players and variety of characters and styles in a super stacked region.

Goodbye for good. I'll just keep to myself for now on, since the Mii community never wants to cooperate and learn. I can now see why we are seen As a joke from Mii haters.

See ya!

 

[AEMehr]

Just posting on here to inform that I will no longer be apart of the Mii Gunner or Mii Community anymore. So I won't be posting on here anymore(hooray for everyone here).

I just butt heads with way too many Mii users. So I'll just keep in contact with Chibo, Rom, and Dapuffster only. I'll just keep any gunner and Mii tricks to myself, since everyone here either throws my knowledge to the side or doesn't take what I say seriously, despite me being the one of the very few Mii user to have the privilege of actually challenging many powerful players and variety of characters and styles in a super stacked region.

Goodbye for good. I'll just keep to myself for now on, since the Mii community never wants to cooperate and learn. I can now see why we are seen As a joke from Mii haters.

See ya!

Why are you suprised about butting heads with other players of a character that is customized to their preference...?

Either way I guess I'll see you around locals or whatnot then.

 

[Ridel]

Why are you suprised about butting heads with other players of a character that is customized to their preference...?

Either way I guess I'll see you around locals or whatnot then.

Butting heads was a very extreme generalization imo. I think he took what D Djmarcus44 and SR-71 said too much to heart, they were simply giving their own opinions on the matter which is completely normal and doesn't have ill intent.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

Mii Community has always annoyed and irked me, it wasn't just those 2 people.

I'm leaving this community for good now. Can't believe I wasted so much time with this group and fighting to get these characters legal in SoCal and elsewhere. Oh well.

Peace.