Mental problems of Brawl

[The Mechanic]

Why do these matches take a long time? I think everyone who plays this game to some degree (some more than others) still think (subconsciously) they are playing a SSBM match!!!!

Basically I think that subconsciously most people get freaked out by the high HP and staying on the map without getting knocked out. At some level they don't realize that they can survive much easier in SSBB with high HP. I see this as a SSBM mental block that will erode over time. Much like a dog that has been on a short leash for a long time, then you give him a longer one. The dog still stops at the length of the old leash until the owner pushes the dog past the old limit.

Veteran players need time to explore the new space of SSBB and push themselves past old techniques and strategies this will be the future challenge!

1) What mentalities will veteran SSBM need to change in their heads to better adapt?

2) Will future matches be much closer in terms of HP and stock(meaning each player will have to fight till the very end)?

3) Will we see more use of both offense and defense, unlike in SSBM where offense dominated.

 

[Lecto2007]

Why do these matches take a long time? I think everyone who plays this game to some degree (some more than others) still think (subconsciously) they are playing a SSBM match!!!!

Basically I think that subconsciously most people get freaked out by the high HP and staying on the map without getting knocked out. At some level they don't realize that they can survive much easier in SSBB with high HP. I see this as a SSBM mental block that will erode over time. Much like a dog that has been on a short leash for a long time, then you give him a longer one. The dog still stops at the length of the old leash until the owner pushes the dog past the old limit.

Veteran players need time to explore the new space of SSBB and push themselves past old techniques and strategies this will be the future challenge!

1) What mentalities will veteran SSBM need to change in their heads to better adapt?

2) Will future matches be much closer in terms of HP and stock(meaning each player will have to fight till the very end)?

3) Will we see more use of both offense and defense, unlike in SSBM where offense dominated.

110% Agree with everything you just said but i doubt this is for every new brawl player, some people will adapt quicker than others

 

[XtremeCJ]

1) I don't think so. After all, it's just beating the other one to a pulp. It's just taking a bit longer.
2) That would be awesome! *droolz*
3) Depends on your definition of "defense and offense". If defense is shielding and offense is hitting, then you won't see that much of a difference. If defense is dodging and countering [not Marth's I-can-hit-you-back-counter], and offense is hitting the enemy at a wall and hitting him again as he bounces back, you might see some more combos since the movements of the chars got slowed down [imho] and - as you said - they don't fly so well then in Melée.

So I come to the conclusion that it's much better this way. In SSBM you could kick the other one out with a bit of luck. There were combos which you couldn't escape so easily, making you an easy target. SSBB gives everyone a few more chances to dodge or avoid hits.

But in the end, this is just my opinion.

 

[PanzerOceania]

it is going to be different, it is second nature for a lot of people to play the same, but over time we'll start o break into brawl like an old baseball glove.

 

[MorpheusVGX]

I finally had the chance to play the game... and.. I HAD SEVERE MENTAL AND ADAPTATION PROBLEMS!! The game movement and response was so different that I was completely lost even when the game moves slower than Melee (in some aspects). I fell and lost like garbage. And yeah, it is harder to kill people. It ihas different mechanics. But I like it. Now strong smashes are very important to give the final blow to your enemies. Light and medium characters (Metaknight, Pit) have a difficult time finishing their enemies, but heavy hitters like DK, Bowser can send you to hell easier. Also, it is interesting, because many strong ground an air smashes are laggy, so if you miss, you are punished, but often, the lag is not enough so you can be punished with a strong attack, because movement is slower in Brawl. Melee had fast movement and many laggy moves people hated to use over time. You missed, you were punished with a powerful attack. In Brawl, movement is slower and attacks are faster, so punishment is not so easy and not so powerful. It is balanced that way. The heavy hitter miss (or a lightweight or mediumweight char with a strong smash), you punish him with a light or medium attack. If you hit with a strong attack, it pays off. So the risk is worth it.

 

[Mic_128]

It is literally imposible to play as fast as Melee.

 

[Storm Eagle]

I agree. I always forget that you can now move after an air dodge. ^^

 

[Zeyeth]

Why do these matches take a long time? I think everyone who plays this game to some degree (some more than others) still think (subconsciously) they are playing a SSBM match!!!!

Basically I think that subconsciously most people get freaked out by the high HP and staying on the map without getting knocked out. At some level they don't realize that they can survive much easier in SSBB with high HP. I see this as a SSBM mental block that will erode over time. Much like a dog that has been on a short leash for a long time, then you give him a longer one. The dog still stops at the length of the old leash until the owner pushes the dog past the old limit.

Veteran players need time to explore the new space of SSBB and push themselves past old techniques and strategies this will be the future challenge!

1) What mentalities will veteran SSBM need to change in their heads to better adapt?

2) Will future matches be much closer in terms of HP and stock(meaning each player will have to fight till the very end)?

3) Will we see more use of both offense and defense, unlike in SSBM where offense dominated.

You're 100% correct! It'll take a considerable amount of time for truly dedicated Smashers to erase the aforementioned gaming style.

1) I think we'll need to release that we're working with a new engine and a new feel. Where things that were beat into us as impossible are possibilities now. And the oh-so possibles are now impossible.

2) Hmmm... Honestly, I think that'll still remain more or less the same because each HP/stock match was directly proportional the said player's skill. The REAL question is will the gap between one players skill and another grow, shrink, or remain the same.

3) Most definitely. We're already seeing this in regards to character preference and speculative mains (for those who haven't actually played the game) We see a lot of Ikes and DDDs and fewer Foxs and Shiek. It seems Sakurai didn't want the big boys to be excluded in this run and from what I see, he did a hell of a job.

 

[Dyna]

The Melee syndrome is real.

 

[Mario77]

Duuuude, Mario can't KO Sonic at 175% with his back throw even if he is near the edge of the stage... gonna take a while to get used that Mario has to wait until the opponent is 140%+ to KO them....

 

[chAvo]

After getting used to the new "gameplay mechanics" my matches r still under 3 mins, just like in melee, so maybe adaptation is the key here.

 

[Whiteface]

Adaptation is inevitable... Just like with 64 to melee.... Old habits do die hard however..... And i'm not worried for pit or meta because its much much easier to chase and finish your opponents with those two due to recovery.

 

[The Mechanic]

wow my threads are more popular than I thought!

Wow its really great to see everyone's comments! What I think is interesting here in this thread is that half the people "get" what I am trying to get at, and the other half is still thinking about the game. I especially liked the way Dyna put it when he called this "The Melee Syndrome" I agree with that label.

I would like to be doubley clear and say I am not talking so much about game mechanics as I am the players mindset.

I would like to quote ZEYETH

You're 100% correct! It'll take a considerable amount of time for truly dedicated Smashers to erase the aforementioned gaming style.

1) I think we'll need to release that we're working with a new engine and a new feel. Where things that were beat into us as impossible are possibilities now. And the oh-so possibles are now impossible.

He said exactly what I was looking for... which is:

playing a certain way for a long time ingrains that way of playing into your brain. You get to the point where your not even focusing on what buttons your pressing is Automatic! To undo that automatic process I think will take a little less time as it did to create it.

I think even if you know you are playing a totally new game your hands are still doing the same old same old and this is the tough part for all Melee smashers to accept. This is what really interests me about the wiimote+nun-chuck or custom CGcntlr. I think using a new control scheme will FORCE old players to change!!


I also see a benefit to having to ingrain playing a new game. When we all started to play melee I think most people started off playing casually and wound up ingraining bad habits like a friend of mine who "button Mashes." I see the plus side to a new game is now we can learn from our mistakes and ingrain a new playing style that we have more control over.

The old barriers/limits are gone!!

So

1) Do you all think that using a new controller set up or control scheme will FORCE veteran players to change?? Don't just say yes/no I want to hear your reasons for saying yes/no.

2) Do all of you think that now that you have a "new canvas" to work with will you try to ingrain new "good" habits, and learn from your past mistakes?? Or do you think that in your exploration of Brawl that you will make bad habits that you won't notice till a year from now?